My opinion on the term "Karen".

[LuckyCharms]

Not that anyone should give a rat's ass about my opinion on this, but here it is.

I read Reddit a lot. That is where I first started seeing the term used once in awhile. In the beginning, when it would be used only occasionally, it struck me as bit humorous.

But here's thing...it's now overused.

Look at your own name.

Imagine it be used in just about everything you hear and read.

You would probably laugh about it at first, but you might not now.

I think many people in this country beat everything to death, and then beat it again for another few months to make sure it is really dead.

I dated a woman named Karen a long time ago for a few years. I wonder how she feels about hearing her name every 5 minutes? I mean...it's her name, after all, and I've always thought it is a pretty name.

Now, we'll beat the shit out of the name/word Karen, like we beat the shit out of everything, and pretty soon it will lose its effectiveness as a descriptor.

I've used the term once or twice. Just like I've said "OK Boomer" once or twice (even though I'm a Boomer). So, I'm not putting down anyone who uses the term. However, I do feel that it has gone quite overboard, and its usage will fade away like most fads do. Also, while some people named Karen might still be getting a chuckle over it, probably many owners of this name are starting to cringe.

[beachbumbob]

1. for PETE's sake

[LuckyCharms]

2. I don't hear that too much anymore.

[beachbumbob]

4. I do often enough and wonder who was the original "Pete"?

[lame54]

42. Add an R to it and you hear all the time

[delisen]

24. For pete's sake is not a perjorative. It means Christ

And was used so that people would not use the name of the lord in vain and thus commit a. supposedly grave sin by breaking one of the ten commandments.

A male name was used because god was perceived by the christian hierarchy to be a gendered male.

[fleur-de-lisa]

54. LOL!

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

3. What if you meet a karen on your way to the john

and she calls you a dick?

[LuckyCharms]

5. That actually happened to me once.

[tinrobot]

19. I guess I'd have to ask for the manager

And that would make me her... or something like that. These pejoratives are confusing.

[fleur-de-lisa]

55. Thread winner!

[lunasun]

6. Some people don't like the term black lives matter

[LuckyCharms]

7. True. But that's not some person's name.

[panader0]

10. My property borders a large area of BLM land.

Bureau of Land Management. Lot of that in the west.

[panader0]

8. We need an acronym like WRW for white racist woman, or WRM for a man.

I'm sure one our clever DUers can come up with a good one and put this "Karen" shit to rest.

[LuckyCharms]

9. I was actually just thinking the same thing.

[StarfishSaver]

11. You probably don't even see the irony in your comment

[gollygee]

12. Well it's all up to white people on DU, isn't it?

We'll just put this meme to rest.

[LuckyCharms]

14. What's the irony in that poster's comment?

To me, the issue is using a proper name as a descriptor of a person's actions...a name that was given to them by their parents. A name that they have responded to their entire life.

[StarfishSaver]

15. If I have to explain it, you will probably never get it

But, if in the midst of a sea-changing national reckoning on race, racism, police brutality, racial injustice and white privilege in America, you prefer to focus your attention and energy on the tragic heartbreak that some white women named Karen must endure because you think their "proper name" is being used improperly, that's on you.

[LuckyCharms]

18. OK then, pick a nice stereotypical name for a black woman...

and start calling black women that name, and see how that works out for you.

[JonLP24]

21. I think the poster you're replying to is a black woman

I could be wrong. Generally black women aren't upset at the term.

[LuckyCharms]

25. I understand that.

[StarfishSaver]

23. LOL

[gollygee]

26. Is that what you think Black women are most worried about?

White women appear to be most worried about being called Karen, but Black women are most concerned about things like their kids coming home alive. That difference is what makes this whole discussion pretty horrible.

[betsuni]

28. +1

[irisblue]

58. Yep

[StarfishSaver]

29. Exactly

The privilege on top of fragility on top of tone-deafness on top of entitlement would be mind-boggling if it weren't so familiar.

[LuckyCharms]

34. I have a good understanding of what black people are worried about.

I don't view this discussion as a race issue, nor did I ever imply that it is.

in my experience, the people that use this term frequently are generally not black, they are young white people who coined a term to describe other white people who view themselves as entitled, and perform actions against people of all races that indicate that they are entitled. Most of the "Karen" videos that I see are of white women screaming at some retail clerk or something because their coffee did not arrive on time. I understand that "Karens" perform racist acts of entitlement as well, but that does not seem to be the reason, generally, that the term was coined.

Now we can sit here and argue about that if you want, but I'm telling you that from my eyes, the term was not originated because of racially motivated entitlement. it was coined because of entitlement in general.

[gollygee]

45. That sounds like complaining about using class privilege rather than race privilege as a weapon

I suppose some people might use it that way as well.

[LuckyCharms]

47. That's the way I've always viewed it...

as a class issue.

And the dire social and economic situation of my life when I was younger has made me very familiar with the type of abuse the "Karen" meme is describing.

I view racial discrimination as something more harsh, more...I don't know...more rotten, more evil, than what this "Karen" meme is describing.

By my way of thinking, "Karen" is too mild to describe racial entitlement, or racial abuse. Thinking you are better than someone else because you have more money than someone and you have a perfect life vs. thinking you are privileged and hold authority over someone because they are of a different race than you and you view them as the "other" are two entirely different things, even though class discrimination may be one component of racial discrimination. But in its entirety, racial discrimination runs far, far deeper than just perceived differences in class.

[gollygee]

48. It's really just about using privilege as a weapon

And it's important not to "other" racism so much where we see it as an evil only evil people do. It's more insidious than that. It's a big part of the fabric of our society, and white women do use it as a weapon, sometimes without completely even realizing what they're doing.

[LuckyCharms]

51. Well, your statement is thought provoking...

"where we see it as an evil only evil people do".

I have been wrestling with this lately...

I know a lot of Trump supporters. I have been "friends" with plenty of Trump supporters.

For many of them, I never really knew their feelings about things in general until Trump came along. At this point, many of them have become vocal in their support of Trump.

And this is what I am wrestling with. These people...these people that you liked...these people you enjoyed...are they racists? Are they evil? Because they support a certain politician? My answer is yes...yes they are. And this realization is killing me.

It's like discovering that everything you have believed and trusted your entire life is a lie.

I view the actions of people, and the words that they used. as a representation of who they are. Evil actions = evil people. Most people are not stupid. Most people know if their actions are wrong. People who say "I was just joking" or "I'm not a racist", are probably racist.

I've gone "no contact" with several friends and siblings and other family members over this. It breaks my heart.

[Celerity]

37. +100000

[RhodeIslandOne]

41. Karen's biggest fear is her kids will be vaccinated.....

.....or see a couple of gay guys kissing. Or her kids be accused of tipping over a store display (which they did, but that doesn't matter to Karen).

[betsuni]

27. "The Tragedy of The Karens," by William Shakespeare.

It is very sad!

[StarfishSaver]

30. LOL

[sir pball]

59. Your mention of Shakespeare DID make me think of an alternative name..

Not that I personally mind Karen, having been on Reddit/Imgur/Twitter/Tumblr since the beginning of the whole term, but if it must be changed, and not to my preferred alternative which I will not even breathe the first letters of here, why not use "shrew"? I know it's not quite right, but given that it's such an archaic term, it could have the meaning bent a little and none would be the wiser.

Or Becky, aka BBQ Becky, but that runs into the specific name issue too.

[PTWB]

33. Amen!!

We are seeing countless examples of folks exploiting their white privilege at the expense of a minority and then the brigade shows up to change the topic to “but what about my great aunt named Karen!!”

Let’s keep our eye on the ball here.

[Hortensis]

32. We already have "racist," though. Applied honestly to

individuals who are racist, it's accurate.

An acronym applied to whole races would be intensely racist. The very epitome of racism.

An acronym applied to all women would be the very epitome of racism directed at women.

An acronym applied to all men would be the very epitome of racism directed at men.

So with that in mind, I'd say adopting acronyms to facilitate racist slurs would be a terrible idea.
The White Man's Party would be more than fine with it, of course, and already have favorite terms in use that they'd be happy to share.

My suggestion is that people who reject racism for themselves as well as others just call individuals out for their own actions.

[RhodeIslandOne]

39. That's not exactly what a Karen is

Karen is quite often outraged and wishes to speak to your manager. She may or may not be racist.

[tavernier]

13. I agree.

Several good friends named Karen, they don’t deserve that kind of notoriety. But to be honest, I only really see it here

[LakeArenal]

50. Nah. It's all over Twitter.

[tavernier]

52. Sure.

Luckily I’m not on Twitter nor are my friends. Of course, we are old.

[LakeArenal]

53. Same here. No Twitter. No Facebook.

But posts taken from twitters are posted other places a lot.

[tinrobot]

16. I prefer "self-entitled asshole" over "Karen"

It's not as catchy, but way more accurate because it describes the behavior, not the person.

And, yes, I've known some wonderful Karens in my life.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

22. I kind of like "Homeowners' Association Board Member" but that's a bit cumbersome.

By the way, have you ever noticed that the word "homeowner" contains "meow"? You'll never be able to unsee that again.

[Tommy_Carcetti]

17. Yup. It's a dead horse.

And it's boring now.

[gollygee]

20. This whole discussion is cringe-inducing

There is such a lack of self-awareness behind it. People on the receiving end of women using white privilege as a weapon came up with a meme, but white privileged people sit around discussing how "we" should do away with the meme. As if it's up to us. It's just weird and cringey.

[StarfishSaver]

31. Well said

It is bizarre. The lack of self-awareness is amazing.

[fleur-de-lisa]

56. Yes.

[mokawanis]

35. It's being used in all kinds of situations

like it's just another way to provoke and anger someone in an argument, which means it's being diluted and losing it's bite.

[Wawannabe]

36. Labels. Luckycharms. Labels.

I have marketing background.
Labels are huge in marketing. Called SEO tags now...But we are all labels. Or numbers. Or data. Or Demographics etc.

Names don’t mean shit.
Numbers mean a lot.
Data means a lot.
Labels mean a lot.

Names. No not anymore. A name is now a label. Data...

[edhopper]

38. Isn't complaining about using "Karen"

a very Karen thing to do?

[RhodeIslandOne]

44. I'd like to speak to the moderator!

[LuckyCharms]

49. Stop recording me.

You can't record me.

Why are you recording me?

It's illegal.

[egduj]

40. Not using the term seems to leave an unmanageable void in a lot of people's lives.

If it's imperative that you need to use the term, I say knock yourself out. But don't be disingenuous by what you mean when you say it. Own it.

[lame54]

43. I'll tell Dick about your concerns

[RhodeIslandOne]

46. Look, pal. Are you going to give me the sale price on the Hagen Das from two months ago or not?

You're doing a lot of talking for a guy who needs to go get the manager right now.

[Gidney N Cloyd]

57. It could be worse.

A person could have space hippies chanting his name.