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writes3000

(4,734 posts)
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 01:35 PM Jun 2020

For Biden VP, Black Democrats are torn between Harris and Warren

The California senator represents the diversity and generational transition activists want, but polls suggest Black Democratic voters may prefer Warren.

WASHINGTON — Joe Biden is under pressure to pick a Black woman as his vice presidential running mate. But polls suggest the most popular prospect among Black Democrats is white.

Sen. Kamala Harris, D-Calif., and Sen. Elizabeth Warren, D-Mass., are widely seen by Democratic officials and activists close to the process as front-runners, though other candidates remain in the mix and a Biden aide told NBC News that "the process is dynamic and ongoing and no final decision has been made."

The two senators and former Biden presidential rivals have reached an advanced vetting stage that suggests they are formidable contenders, according to multiple people familiar with the process. Both women held fundraisers with Biden this month, with Warren’s event raising $6 million and Harris’s event $3.5 million.

In a CBS News poll last month, Warren topped the list of prospects that Democrats wanted Biden to consider, followed by Harris. Warren even led among Black Democrats — 72 percent said she should be considered, with 60 percent saying the same of Harris.

————————-

In a Morning Consult poll last month, 24 percent of Black voters said a Warren pick would make them more likely to vote for Biden, while 19 percent said the same of a Harris pick.

A Civiqs-Data For Progress poll this month found that Stacey Abrams, a former Georgia legislator and gubernatorial candidate, is the top preference of Black Democrats. (Abrams said two weeks ago she hadn’t heard from Biden's team.) Next was Warren, five points ahead of Harris.

Other women of color who have received attention include New Mexico Gov. Michelle Lujan Grisham; Rep. Val Demings, D-Fla.; Rep. Karen Bass, D-Calif.; and Atlanta Mayor Keisha Lance Bottoms...

——————————

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2020-election/biden-vp-black-democrats-are-torn-between-harris-warren-n1232312

(continued at link)

97 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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For Biden VP, Black Democrats are torn between Harris and Warren (Original Post) writes3000 Jun 2020 OP
What about Kamala as AG? nt Phoenix61 Jun 2020 #1
I believe she has said she's not interested in that role or the Supreme Court. writes3000 Jun 2020 #2
That was in 2014 when asked if she wanted Phoenix61 Jun 2020 #3
AG is kind of a dead-end job, politically tinrobot Jun 2020 #80
I doubt that Warren will be the VP nominee Gothmog Jun 2020 #4
Harris got even less support in the primaries JonLP24 Jun 2020 #6
So you are okay with losing a Senate seat? Gothmog Jun 2020 #11
In Massachusetts, the appointment is temporary until the next scheduled primary election, BComplex Jun 2020 #31
Another would be an all-white ticket, an obvious error... brush Jun 2020 #28
After Harris and Booker left Warren was the only still having conversation and reaching out to the LizBeth Jun 2020 #9
I saw no real support for her in Texas among African American voters Gothmog Jun 2020 #13
Regardless what you saw, she does have support from the AA community. And respect. LizBeth Jun 2020 #15
We will see Gothmog Jun 2020 #17
Biden wanted Warren in 2016 writes3000 Jun 2020 #18
Warren is the smartest, the strongest and can excite. Three one. LizBeth Jun 2020 #65
You've been against Warren forever. One reason or another. BComplex Jun 2020 #32
Why Trump's attempt to tag Biden as a tool of the radical left isn't working Gothmog Jul 2020 #90
Over one article? How about all the articles that say Elizabeth Warren is the one most democrats BComplex Jul 2020 #93
Harris has been incredibly proactive in the community as well as Lucinda Jul 2020 #96
Please don't spread the myth about Warren as VP costing Dems the senate majority Fiendish Thingy Jun 2020 #48
Have they taken the necessary steps yet? muriel_volestrangler Jun 2020 #55
The timing of the legislation is affected by the timing of Warren's resignation Fiendish Thingy Jun 2020 #58
Yes, that's the point - no one wants to wait for a special election muriel_volestrangler Jun 2020 #59
What the Democrats will NOT do, is screw up the Senate. If Biden chose Warren, I am confident beyond LizBeth Jun 2020 #66
This is not a myth Gothmog Jun 2020 #60
It's a myth perpetuated by the MSM Fiendish Thingy Jun 2020 #72
A lot of the myth carriers are Democrats that are rooting for a different VP because it serves their LizBeth Jun 2020 #76
Good luck with this theory Gothmog Jun 2020 #82
The poll in the OP is from May, here's a newer one from Economist/YouGov showing Harris in the lead PunkinPi Jun 2020 #51
I have seen this polling Gothmog Jun 2020 #61
I agree. nt PunkinPi Jun 2020 #64
You will like this polling Gothmog Jul 2020 #91
I do, and saw it earlier today. PunkinPi Jul 2020 #92
Yes they are jocking position of the #1 position serving under a VP that well has the confidence of LizBeth Jun 2020 #67
Wow. You mean all black voters don't think alike? StarfishSaver Jun 2020 #5
Mind-blowing, isn't it? writes3000 Jun 2020 #7
Do you believe this? EffieBlack Jun 2020 #40
IKR? StarfishSaver Jun 2020 #46
Some of Warren's most committed supporters were black men and women so blm Jun 2020 #43
That and the narrative also assumes that black people are so blinded by color that StarfishSaver Jun 2020 #47
Warren is one helluva policy details queen. Appreciative wonks come in ALL blm Jun 2020 #52
It always amazes me the way these articles are written.. HipChick Jun 2020 #78
It's pretty clear that there's a last-ditch effort afoot to get Biden to pick Warren StarfishSaver Jun 2020 #85
Harris would be great in AG. Warren compliments Biden weakness, we need her to go after Wallstreet LizBeth Jun 2020 #8
Warren would make sure the trump cabal didn't get away with their crimes. BComplex Jun 2020 #33
Warren just is not going to cow. But, Harris speaks up too. I love our women, lol. LizBeth Jun 2020 #68
I love Liz Warren but - AkFemDem Jun 2020 #10
How about Susan Rice? DinahMoeHum Jun 2020 #12
I really like Susan Rice Gothmog Jun 2020 #14
I favor Susan Rice As Well colsohlibgal Jun 2020 #21
Number one on my list. Most qualified, too. demosincebirth Jun 2020 #27
Rice is not on voters' Radar, and would help the ticket about as much as Tim Kaine did nt Fiendish Thingy Jun 2020 #49
Will she help flip any swing states? Trumpocalypse Jul 2020 #94
I am not telling any woman that it is their time to sit down and be quiet. We have been told that LizBeth Jun 2020 #20
I'm with you ace3csusm Jun 2020 #22
70 IS NOT OLD!!! I'm sick of people saying that. BComplex Jun 2020 #34
she would be 80 years old if Biden gets 2 terms ace3csusm Jun 2020 #54
I strongly disagree. Both Biden and Warren are sharp Qutzupalotl Jun 2020 #30
Great post! Thank you!!! BComplex Jun 2020 #36
Another reason I really like Warren is she excites our young people. I am around lots of 20 somethin LizBeth Jun 2020 #69
:) She's an iconoclast, with very big but achievable goals. Hortensis Jun 2020 #81
That's great for a presidential candidate, but it's irrelevant and even a demerit for a VP nom EffieBlack Jun 2020 #87
Sorry I confused you, Effie. Frances Perkins carried out ONLY Hortensis Jun 2020 #88
Exactly. I agree with it all. LizBeth Jul 2020 #97
This! unitedwethrive Jun 2020 #42
IOW, either one would be fine! ananda Jun 2020 #16
✔️ blm Jun 2020 #44
Rice zipplewrath Jun 2020 #19
I think Biden secretly has her tabbed as his future Secreatry of State Seasider Jun 2020 #25
Makes sense since she's a former US Ambassador to the UN. . . DinahMoeHum Jun 2020 #38
In my opinion it's Kamala's gig to lose. She just ticks too many boxes to be passed over. Seasider Jun 2020 #23
Kamala's just not that popular. I'm glad she's on our side, but I don't care for her. BComplex Jun 2020 #37
All these "Dems are divided" stories are getting kind of boring... Wounded Bear Jun 2020 #24
I think in this time space, any pick that is not a black woman... Happy Hoosier Jun 2020 #26
Yep, an all-white ticket would not be smart with all the BLM... brush Jun 2020 #35
Warren checks all the boxes Calculating Jun 2020 #29
Where will the Bernie supporters go if he doesn't choose Warren? Budi Jun 2020 #41
Some black voters wanting one candidate and some wanting another is only a story EffieBlack Jun 2020 #39
✔️✔️✔️ blm Jun 2020 #45
It absolutely should be a given. Imagine my surprise when I was listening to a lot of people LizBeth Jun 2020 #70
The number one job of VP is to help the ticket win, period. Follow the data, folks Fiendish Thingy Jun 2020 #50
How many of those voters who prefer Warren would not vote for Biden if someone else is the VP nom? StarfishSaver Jun 2020 #53
Ask the same question in reverse Fiendish Thingy Jun 2020 #56
You obviously didn't read my post StarfishSaver Jun 2020 #62
I read every word of your post, and disagreed with your non-evidence based opinion Fiendish Thingy Jun 2020 #73
What is this ""available data" of which you keep speaking? StarfishSaver Jun 2020 #79
Numerous polls taken in the past 6-8 weeks consistently have Warren as voters 1st choice for VP Fiendish Thingy Jun 2020 #83
Your data either fail to refute what I said, don't say what you claim they do or are inconsistent StarfishSaver Jun 2020 #84
Warren is strongest with young people. And the same X factor applies... writes3000 Jun 2020 #57
Biden does NOT have the black vote locked up StarfishSaver Jun 2020 #74
I think Warren and Biden will bring out the black vote and I think neither Warren or Biden is needed LizBeth Jun 2020 #71
Seriously? StarfishSaver Jun 2020 #75
I have listened to the vocal black community and I have confidence and faith in their strength. LizBeth Jun 2020 #77
Those are *my* top two choices, and *I* can't decide. Reader Rabbit Jun 2020 #63
I wouldn't want either one of them. DFW Jun 2020 #86
72% of Democrats say it's important Biden choose a woman of color as VP. Gothmog Jul 2020 #89
ok, either/or TeamPooka Jul 2020 #95

writes3000

(4,734 posts)
2. I believe she has said she's not interested in that role or the Supreme Court.
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 01:43 PM
Jun 2020

I could be wrong about that.

I do love the idea of her as AG.

Phoenix61

(16,999 posts)
3. That was in 2014 when asked if she wanted
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 01:48 PM
Jun 2020

Eric Holders job. She was running for Senate when the Supreme Court question was asked.

tinrobot

(10,890 posts)
80. AG is kind of a dead-end job, politically
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 07:45 PM
Jun 2020

How many AGs have subsequently run for President or other higher office? Outside of Bobby Kennedy, I can't think of any.

Besides, the AG job would be over in a few years.

Kamala has much more political freedom and longevity as Senator.

Gothmog

(145,046 posts)
4. I doubt that Warren will be the VP nominee
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 01:48 PM
Jun 2020

I am not sure about the poll cited in the OP but I note that Warren got little support from African American voters in the primaries.

I personally like Senator Warren and I would hate to lose Warren's senate seat (Mass. has a GOP governor). I believe that Senator Harris is the better nominee

JonLP24

(29,322 posts)
6. Harris got even less support in the primaries
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 01:50 PM
Jun 2020

This is consistent with other polls that also show she is the top choice for Latino-Hispanic voters.

The only real reason to oppose Warren as VP would ideological be reasons.

BComplex

(8,029 posts)
31. In Massachusetts, the appointment is temporary until the next scheduled primary election,
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 03:16 PM
Jun 2020

at which time the senate seat appears on the ballot.

"145-160 days after vacancy occurs. If a vacancy occurs after April 10 but on or before the 70th day before the regular state primary, the office shall appear on the regular state primary ballot. If a vacancy occurs after that time, the office shall appear on the state election ballot that November."

https://www.ncsl.org/research/elections-and-campaigns/vacancies-in-the-united-states-senate.aspx

For this seat, I'm sure the governor would be heavily pressured to fill the seat with a democrat. We are going to be gaining seats on the democratic side of the senate anyway.

Elizabeth Warren is leading Kamala Harris AMONG BLACK VOTERS, just like she did in the primary. They want Elizabeth Warren. So do I!

If not Elizabeth Warren, either Susan Rice or Stacey Abrams.

brush

(53,758 posts)
28. Another would be an all-white ticket, an obvious error...
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 03:15 PM
Jun 2020

That, IMO, would be a glaring embarrassment for the party with all the talented and YOUNG POC choices available in this BLM protest era.

LizBeth

(9,952 posts)
9. After Harris and Booker left Warren was the only still having conversation and reaching out to the
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 01:54 PM
Jun 2020

black community and actively speaking out about social injustice. She worked hard to gain POC respect.

Gothmog

(145,046 posts)
13. I saw no real support for her in Texas among African American voters
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 02:40 PM
Jun 2020

My three kids liked her but we are not African American voters.

I prefer Harris over Warren

Gothmog

(145,046 posts)
17. We will see
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 02:48 PM
Jun 2020

Harris would give trump a great target to run his socialism attacks. In addition, trump would get to re use his racial slurs on Warren if she is the nominee.

I really doubt that Warren will be the nominee.

Gothmog

(145,046 posts)
90. Why Trump's attempt to tag Biden as a tool of the radical left isn't working
Wed Jul 1, 2020, 03:52 PM
Jul 2020

Picking Warren would hurt Joe https://www.politico.com/news/2020/07/01/trump-biden-radical-345949




President Donald Trump’s campaign has been trying to paint Joe Biden as a stooge for the far left. A new poll shows why it’s not working.

Only 17 percent of registered voters perceive the former vice president as more liberal than most Democrats, according to a POLITICO/Morning Consult survey, while nearly two-thirds see him as in line with or more conservative than the party at large. The survey also found that a larger proportion of the electorate views Biden as moderate (23 percent) than sees Trump that way (9 percent).

The findings underscore the difficulty of turning Biden, the presumptive Democratic presidential nominee, into an unacceptable choice for independent and suburban voters by tying him to the most progressive figures in the Democratic Party. After eight years as vice president and dozens more as a split-the-difference senator, Biden has a well-formed reputation among many voters.

BComplex

(8,029 posts)
93. Over one article? How about all the articles that say Elizabeth Warren is the one most democrats
Wed Jul 1, 2020, 06:13 PM
Jul 2020

want on the ticket?

Lucinda

(31,170 posts)
96. Harris has been incredibly proactive in the community as well as
Wed Jul 1, 2020, 07:10 PM
Jul 2020

working on legislation. I haven't seen much of Booker, but the last time I looked he was also front and center.

Fiendish Thingy

(15,568 posts)
48. Please don't spread the myth about Warren as VP costing Dems the senate majority
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 03:52 PM
Jun 2020

MA has a Dem supermajority legislature, and can force the gov to appoint a Dem to replace Warren’s vacancy (they’ve done it before).

muriel_volestrangler

(101,294 posts)
55. Have they taken the necessary steps yet?
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 04:32 PM
Jun 2020

From April:

For the Massachusetts state legislature to then enact the nuclear option – forcing Governor Baker to fill any interim vacancy with a Democrat – one key rules change would have to be enacted by July 31 of this year: that of extending the legislative session (which annually ends on that date but is usually extended by agreement of both houses) and of placing the matter of US senate vacancies on the list of agreed-to docket items. Both houses already plan on extending the session through the end of the year to be able to respond to the Covid-19 public health crisis.

Thus, the only consideration by Joe Biden and team surrounding the logistics of a Warren nomination for vice president is that of the calendar: They know he would have to announce his VP pick with enough time before July 31 so that Massachusetts Democrats could then queue up the nuclear option onto the docket if needed.

https://organizeandwin.com/bidens-vp-costs-benefits-part-i-warrens-successor-will-not-be-a-republican/

Fiendish Thingy

(15,568 posts)
58. The timing of the legislation is affected by the timing of Warren's resignation
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 04:43 PM
Jun 2020

The July 31 deadline is only if Dems want the November election to select her replacement, rather than a special election.

muriel_volestrangler

(101,294 posts)
59. Yes, that's the point - no one wants to wait for a special election
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 04:49 PM
Jun 2020

Even if it were only 150 days without control of the Senate, it'd still be bad. I presume that means they haven't yet got this sorted.

LizBeth

(9,952 posts)
66. What the Democrats will NOT do, is screw up the Senate. If Biden chose Warren, I am confident beyond
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 06:41 PM
Jun 2020

doubt they know what they are doing and they got this. Adults, thinkers, and the doers. I have all the faith that if Biden chose Warren, this will have been well thought out, planned and a for sure deal. Too many good choices.

Fiendish Thingy

(15,568 posts)
72. It's a myth perpetuated by the MSM
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 07:09 PM
Jun 2020

When the evidence exists to contradict the MSM’s narrative, but is ignored.

Fact: Democrats have a supermajority in the Massachusetts legislature

Fact: in the past, Democrats have passed laws requiring the governor to appoint someone from the same party to fill a senate vacancy.

All other speculation is anti-Warren hand wringing and pearl clutching.

LizBeth

(9,952 posts)
76. A lot of the myth carriers are Democrats that are rooting for a different VP because it serves their
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 07:31 PM
Jun 2020

purpose. Enough people do not know that the Democrats got this and when they hear that, they reject Warren. A little campaigning going on.

Gothmog

(145,046 posts)
82. Good luck with this theory
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 07:48 PM
Jun 2020

I really am glad that Warren will not be the VP nominee. I would not want to rely on this mechanism Warren is not worth the risk that a trump appointed judge would not support this theory

PunkinPi

(4,874 posts)
51. The poll in the OP is from May, here's a newer one from Economist/YouGov showing Harris in the lead
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 04:07 PM
Jun 2020


NEW: Latest Economist/YouGov poll is a BLOWOUT for @KamalaHarris
She is now the preferred VP pick of nearly every demographic including amongst all Democratic voters, and specifically black and Hispanic voters.


Link to entire poll - > https://docs.cdn.yougov.com/cjd35jrh5o/econTabReport.pdf

LizBeth

(9,952 posts)
67. Yes they are jocking position of the #1 position serving under a VP that well has the confidence of
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 06:45 PM
Jun 2020

the black vote. You probably are right that it goes back and forth. And the thinking person would say that like ALL us Democrats like Warren, Harris, Rice, and I can think of a few others.

We are good to go. Now, put in Sanders and you might have a lot of communities rebeling.

blm

(113,037 posts)
43. Some of Warren's most committed supporters were black men and women so
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 03:42 PM
Jun 2020

it’s no surprise to me. Most of the press just stuck with the narrative that the black community didn’t like her. That was never true.

 

StarfishSaver

(18,486 posts)
47. That and the narrative also assumes that black people are so blinded by color that
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 03:51 PM
Jun 2020

we we'll always vote for a black candidate over a white one - and if we don't, it's so unusual that it merits as story.

blm

(113,037 posts)
52. Warren is one helluva policy details queen. Appreciative wonks come in ALL
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 04:10 PM
Jun 2020

Colors, ages, and sizes. Heheh.

 

StarfishSaver

(18,486 posts)
85. It's pretty clear that there's a last-ditch effort afoot to get Biden to pick Warren
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 10:35 PM
Jun 2020

But I don't think that's going to happen.

LizBeth

(9,952 posts)
8. Harris would be great in AG. Warren compliments Biden weakness, we need her to go after Wallstreet
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 01:52 PM
Jun 2020

and corporations her strengths to Biden weakness. Harris compliments Biden in that they both have the same strengths and even in way, easy going personalities. I think Warren would rev up the youth and bring in excitement. And we can all use a little golden retriever antics along the way.

LizBeth

(9,952 posts)
68. Warren just is not going to cow. But, Harris speaks up too. I love our women, lol.
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 06:48 PM
Jun 2020

But that is a big one for me. Get Trump. I thought it a huge mistake they allowed it with Bushco. I understand why, I do. I really do. And still, the way they broke the law and pushed the line, it warranted at least call outs. Because then you get 8 years of republicans pushing it further that got us Trump. We watch him break the law real time on camera.

AkFemDem

(1,823 posts)
10. I love Liz Warren but -
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 02:00 PM
Jun 2020

Having two septuagenarians on a ticket is a mistake.

Not only does the next VP need to be a black woman, she needs to be younger than 70.

DinahMoeHum

(21,783 posts)
12. How about Susan Rice?
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 02:39 PM
Jun 2020

She's a former National Security Advisor and US ambassador to the UN under Obama's administration.

The way I see it, Biden as POTUS and Rice as VOPTUS can split up the duties of mending the fences among allies home and abroad, Biden on the domestic end, Rice on the international end.

And believe me, there's a real Herculean task of cleaning up the stables ahead of them.

She would not be giving up a legislative seat like others would have to.

Plus, she's 55 years old.

Just sayin'





#newrostrong

Gothmog

(145,046 posts)
14. I really like Susan Rice
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 02:41 PM
Jun 2020

Given the damage that trump has done with our relations with our allies, Rice may make sense

colsohlibgal

(5,275 posts)
21. I favor Susan Rice As Well
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 02:54 PM
Jun 2020

I think she, along with Kamala Harris, would be the best picks and both would be capable of taking over if need be.

 

Trumpocalypse

(6,143 posts)
94. Will she help flip any swing states?
Wed Jul 1, 2020, 06:19 PM
Jul 2020

Will she attract more progressives to vote for the ticket? Doubtful on both. Add to that she never ran for office before and gives the GOP an excuse to bring up Benghazi again. There are better choices.

LizBeth

(9,952 posts)
20. I am not telling any woman that it is their time to sit down and be quiet. We have been told that
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 02:52 PM
Jun 2020

forever.

ace3csusm

(969 posts)
22. I'm with you
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 02:54 PM
Jun 2020

I really like Warren too, but the age is concerning...also we need someone who can possibly run after Biden terms are done...I like would like Harris to be groomed to possible be the next President also dont want to lose Warren Senate Seat, California has a democratic governor..

BComplex

(8,029 posts)
34. 70 IS NOT OLD!!! I'm sick of people saying that.
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 03:20 PM
Jun 2020

She's awesome and in shape and sharp as ever. Some people are old at 50, some people are young at 80. Elizabeth Warren has many many good years ahead of her.

ace3csusm

(969 posts)
54. she would be 80 years old if Biden gets 2 terms
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 04:21 PM
Jun 2020

Harris would be 63...shell have 8 vp experience to prepare to run...I'm looking at long term this would benefit the country as a whole especially if Biden terms are positive...I'm sure e everyone at this point just looking for stability in our country

Qutzupalotl

(14,296 posts)
30. I strongly disagree. Both Biden and Warren are sharp
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 03:16 PM
Jun 2020

and Warren’s populist appeal will be a huge boost to the ticket. Choosing Warren would align with where our party is headed — towards a better deal for working people.

One seldom rises to high public office without putting in the work for years. Obama did it quickly, but he was an exception. Unless our candidates are showing age-related problems, let them run.

LizBeth

(9,952 posts)
69. Another reason I really like Warren is she excites our young people. I am around lots of 20 somethin
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 06:52 PM
Jun 2020

educated and they can connect to Warrens smart and the way she communicates to them. She was a professor, they are students. Lol. I think they would have a blast with her.

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
81. :) She's an iconoclast, with very big but achievable goals.
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 07:45 PM
Jun 2020

She's the one among all of them who makes me think of Frances Perkins, the amazing woman behind the New Deal.

Harris is very redoubtable and would also make a good complement to Biden in whatever ways he decided to use her abilities.

 

EffieBlack

(14,249 posts)
87. That's great for a presidential candidate, but it's irrelevant and even a demerit for a VP nom
Sun Jun 28, 2020, 09:21 AM
Jun 2020

A running mate’s only goal should be to carry out the goals and policies set by the top of the ticket. Being a VP isn’t the place for an iconoclast with great goals. I love Warren, but I don’t think she’s suited for a Number 2 position.

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
88. Sorry I confused you, Effie. Frances Perkins carried out ONLY
Sun Jun 28, 2020, 09:44 AM
Jun 2020

those goals great and small that FDR approved and told her to make happen. The power in the executive branch is the president's to delegate as he or she decides, and all the New Dealers he appointed had to sell him on their recommendations.

So no one's talking about a renegade VP who'd have to be escorted out of the WH and deposited on the nearest golf course.

Especially Warren, who's a big believer in using establishment power to the max, not blowing it up.

zipplewrath

(16,646 posts)
19. Rice
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 02:52 PM
Jun 2020

I guess I'm surprised that Susan Rice isn't higher on the list. Biden knows her, she has the kind of experience that one wants for the job, and you have to believe she already has connections in DC not to mention the world.

Seasider

(169 posts)
25. I think Biden secretly has her tabbed as his future Secreatry of State
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 03:00 PM
Jun 2020

Which would be poetic justice as Republicans threw such a hissy fit when Obama was reportedly considering her for the job for his 2nd term.

DinahMoeHum

(21,783 posts)
38. Makes sense since she's a former US Ambassador to the UN. . .
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 03:29 PM
Jun 2020

. . .as well as a former National Security Advisor.




#newrostrong

Seasider

(169 posts)
23. In my opinion it's Kamala's gig to lose. She just ticks too many boxes to be passed over.
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 02:56 PM
Jun 2020

I think the only way she doesn't get picked is if she turns the offer down or the VP committee finds some skeletons in the closet during the vetting process.

BComplex

(8,029 posts)
37. Kamala's just not that popular. I'm glad she's on our side, but I don't care for her.
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 03:22 PM
Jun 2020

I'm not alone, evidently. The polls show she's not that popular. Not popular enough with the democrats, and I can promise you she won't be that popular with independents.

Wounded Bear

(58,618 posts)
24. All these "Dems are divided" stories are getting kind of boring...
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 02:59 PM
Jun 2020

I know the media need to push the "competition" angle, but c'mon man.

I trust Joe's choice, and he could pick a dachshund puppy and I'd still vote for him.

brush

(53,758 posts)
35. Yep, an all-white ticket would not be smart with all the BLM...
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 03:20 PM
Jun 2020

protests against cop killings of black men.

 

Budi

(15,325 posts)
41. Where will the Bernie supporters go if he doesn't choose Warren?
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 03:39 PM
Jun 2020

He's not going to select Warren as his VP.

Considering the damage needing to be repaired, Biden will enlist the knowlege & experience of the best there is, to assess the damages & reinstate our govt to a functioning status.
Warren's passion & expertise is finance. That is where she belongs, in shaping America's financial policies, a most valued benefit for our nation's future.

The duty of that massive financial reconstruction belongs in the hands of Sen Warren.

My opinion given with absolute confidence in her ability to take it on & emerge successful.











 

EffieBlack

(14,249 posts)
39. Some black voters wanting one candidate and some wanting another is only a story
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 03:31 PM
Jun 2020

to observers who assume all black voters think alike or that we vote solely on the basis of race.

To everyone else, “Well, whattaya know?! Lots of black people prefer the white lady!” is a dumb and narrow-minded frame.

LizBeth

(9,952 posts)
70. It absolutely should be a given. Imagine my surprise when I was listening to a lot of people
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 06:55 PM
Jun 2020

stating otherwise. Hence, I guess a thread to clarify that the black community like both Harris and Warren. Harris and Warren get along really well. I love seeing the two together.

Fiendish Thingy

(15,568 posts)
50. The number one job of VP is to help the ticket win, period. Follow the data, folks
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 04:04 PM
Jun 2020

In 5 polls in the past two months, Warren is consistently the top VP choice of Dem voters, and with one exception (when Abrams was first choice) Warren was the top choice or tied with Harris for top choice of Black voters.

I don’t recall any other candidate having a specific, detailed plan for Black America.

Warren does:

https://elizabethwarren.com/plans/agenda-black-america

For too long, Black communities have been locked out of opportunity.

The path to economic security is steep and rocky for millions of working people in this country, and it is steeper and rockier for Black Americans. Over the years, America’s middle class has been deliberately hollowed out, and families of color have been systematically discriminated against and denied their chance to build real security. This economic squeeze has touched every community in America; and for Black communities that have stared down structural racism for generations, the squeeze has been even tighter.

Long before I got into politics, I wrote about how Black Americans are more likely to fall into bankruptcy than white Americans, and how payday and subprime lenders are basically legally sanctioned corporate swindlers who prey on families of color. And I’ve always come back to this one central question: who does government work for?

If we’re going to reshape our economy, restore our government and save our democracy we need bold, structural solutions to the problems we face as a nation. And that means tackling generations of racial injustice and systemic discrimination head on.

That’s exactly what my plans do. Here are a few examples:

My student debt cancellation plan will help close the wealth gap between Black and white families.
My criminal justice plan will end the practice of mass incarceration that has destroyed the lives of so many Black and brown men and their families.
My housing plan will help families living in formerly redlined areas buy a home and start building the kind of wealth that government-sponsored discrimination denied their parents and grandparents.
My plan for entrepreneurs of color will level the playing field by creating a new program with $7 billion in funding to provide grants to entrepreneurs of color.
My environmental justice plan includes justice for the Black and Brown communities that have struggled with the impact of pollution, and my plan respects the rights of Native Americans to protect their lands and be good stewards of this earth.
And on day one of my Administration, I will use my executive authority to start closing the pay gap between women of color and everyone else - because it’s about time we fully valued the work of women of color.
In our country, if you work hard, you ought to be able to take care of yourself and the people you love. That should be the fundamental promise of America. This is deeply personal to me because I got a real taste of opportunity: my father ended up as a janitor, but I got to be a public school teacher, law professor, a United States Senator, and a candidate for president. I’m deeply grateful, and I’m running for president because I want every kid to have a chance to build a future. For me, it all comes down to opportunity.

But here’s the thing, real opportunity requires honesty. We must recognize the systemic discrimination that infects our country, and we must work actively - and deliberately - to root it out and set us on a better path. This agenda is a work in progress and will continue to be updated based on input and insight from Black activists, community leaders, organizers, policy experts, and stakeholders. Here’s how we’ll do it:


Much, much more detail at link.
 

StarfishSaver

(18,486 posts)
53. How many of those voters who prefer Warren would not vote for Biden if someone else is the VP nom?
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 04:21 PM
Jun 2020

If helping the ticket win is the only purpose of the VP nominee, I don't think Warren brings much to the table, since I don't think she would necessarily bring any voters to the table who aren't already there.

On the other hand, I do think Kamala Harris, Stacey Abrams, Val Demmings and some of the other black women mentioned would bring out many voters - particularly black voters - who might not otherwise come out.

And they're not staying home because they don't care, but because for many of them, voting is just too damned hard. The suppression efforts aimed at them force them to jump through so many hoops and spend money they can barely apart to get registered and stay registered and then spend hours in line - often sacrificing desperately needed income. A black female on the ticket would be incentive for these folk to crawl across broken glass to vote for Biden and thereby increase turnout tremendously.

I don't see that kind of bump with Elizabeth Warren on the ticket since most of the people who would be energized by her presence are already going to vote no matter what

Fiendish Thingy

(15,568 posts)
56. Ask the same question in reverse
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 04:41 PM
Jun 2020

How many voters, especially voters of colour, would NOT vote for Biden if Warren WAS the VP?

The available data does not show a suppression of Black voter turnout with Warren on the ticket; in fact, the data shows that selecting Warren would generate increased enthusiasm and support from both Black voters and young voters, something no other potential VP choice does.

As we saw in the SC primary, Biden can count on overwhelming support from the Black community

For the record, I think Warren and Harris are the Only two Available (since Abrams and Michelle Obama are not options) choices that would help the ticket win, with the data supporting Warren as the strongest of the two choices. My position is based on the available data. If there is hard data that shows Warren as a liability, rather than an asset to the ticket, I haven’t seen it.

Again, I urge folks to go with the available data, and not gut feelings or hunches. Remember all the things that seemed logical that were disproven in 2016. I’m sure the Biden campaign is paying attention to all the published polls, as well gathering their own internal data during the vetting process.

Fiendish Thingy

(15,568 posts)
73. I read every word of your post, and disagreed with your non-evidence based opinion
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 07:11 PM
Jun 2020

Your opinions are not supported by the available data.

I don't think Warren brings much to the table, since I don't think she would necessarily bring any voters to the table who aren't already there.

On the other hand, I do think Kamala Harris, Stacey Abrams, Val Demmings and some of the other black women mentioned would bring out many voters - particularly black voters - who might not otherwise come out.


Those are opinions not supported by the available data, which shows that choosing Warren would increase support for the ticket, especially among Black voters and young voters, both of whom were less supportive of the Democratic ticket in 2016 than in 2012.

If you have data (not anecdotes or hunches) showing that Val Demings would generate more support for the ticket, especially in swing states/Rust Belt states, than Warren would, please share it. I would support Demings as VP if the data showed she generated the most support for the ticket, and gave the ticket the best chances of winning in November. So far, I have not seen it.
 

StarfishSaver

(18,486 posts)
79. What is this ""available data" of which you keep speaking?
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 07:37 PM
Jun 2020

You referenced "available data" more than a dozen times, but haven't presented or even cited to any.

Care to share this "available data"?

Fiendish Thingy

(15,568 posts)
83. Numerous polls taken in the past 6-8 weeks consistently have Warren as voters 1st choice for VP
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 08:46 PM
Jun 2020

The most recent Monmouth poll of a panel of Dem primary voters shows Harris in first place, Warren in second, and 59% support for a Woman of colour on the ticket.

https://www.monmouth.edu/polling-institute/documents/monmouthpoll_dempanel_061820.pdf/

June 23 Axios poll show Warren in first, Harris second, with college students strongly supporting Warren:

https://www.axios.com/college-students-biden-vp-pick-6a6d8743-378b-459d-a546-3200a2710556.html

6/23 College reaction poll has Warren first:

https://www.collegereaction.com/post/students-back-elizabeth-warren-for-biden-vp-pick

CBS poll from May 4 has Warren first Harris second:

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/elizabeth-warren-biden-vice-president-cbs-news-poll/

Civiqs/ Data for Progress poll from this week of 12 swing states showing Warren way in first place with 35%, and Harris in second with 19% (link to polling source in article):

https://www.motherjones.com/2020-elections/2020/06/elizabeth-warren-joe-biden-vice-president-poll/

And there’s a few other older polls that all had Warren as first choice for VP among Dem voters.

So, while there is some evidence that voters would support Biden choosing a woman of colour for VP, when asked to choose a candidate, with just 1-2 exceptions, voters consistently pick Warren over the others.

 

StarfishSaver

(18,486 posts)
84. Your data either fail to refute what I said, don't say what you claim they do or are inconsistent
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 10:33 PM
Jun 2020

with other available data. Some of it says just the opposite of what you're claiming. And, no, it's not just "1-2 exceptions." None of the polls you cited offered any proof of your claim that black voters would be more likely to vote for Biden if Warren were on the ticket than if Harris is his running mate nor do they refute my contention that a black woman on the ticket will energize black voters in a way an all-white ticket would not.

For example, nothing you cited supports your claim that "the data shows that selecting Warren would generate increased enthusiasm and support from both Black voters and young voters, something no other potential VP choice does." A voter saying they prefer one VP candidate over another in no way proves that either candidate makes it more or less likely they'll vote for the ticket than the other. But even if they did, there is also polling that shows just the opposite and that, in fact, a black woman on the ticket would "generate increased enthusiasm and support" among black voters.

For example:

Poll: Black VP pick could boost Biden

55 percent of African American voters said they would be more excited to turn out or vote for Biden if he were to pick a black woman to join his ticket, the poll showed.
https://www.politico.com/news/2020/04/14/poll-biden-black-vp-185043


Also, some studies show that black voters are more likely to vote for a ticket that includes a minority candidate. https://scholar.harvard.edu/files/rogowski/files/fairdosi_rogowski_2015.pdf

Moreover, you claimed that "the available data does not show a suppression of Black voter turnout with Warren on the ticket; in fact, the data shows that selecting Warren would generate increased enthusiasm and support from both Black voters and young voters, something no other potential VP choice does." But since I never claimed that Warren on the ticket would suppress Black voter turnout, that claim is pointless.

writes3000

(4,734 posts)
57. Warren is strongest with young people. And the same X factor applies...
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 04:42 PM
Jun 2020

Will they show up in strength if Warren isn’t on the ticket? Will they show up in strength if she is on the ticket?

The funny thing about Biden is how many sides assume that he has another constituency locked up.

Biden has the black vote locked up.
Biden has the rust state vote locked up.
Biden has the moderate vote locked up.

I’m sure the campaign is doing all of the math.

 

StarfishSaver

(18,486 posts)
74. Biden does NOT have the black vote locked up
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 07:22 PM
Jun 2020

Voter suppression makes it extremely difficult for many black people to vote. Assuming that voters - even those who support Biden when polled - are going to just bust their butts trying to vote when it's so damned hard is crazy. And it's a little insulting to expect them to come out no matter who his running mate is after a black woman was passed over for a white woman in order to appeal to a mostly white constituency.

LizBeth

(9,952 posts)
71. I think Warren and Biden will bring out the black vote and I think neither Warren or Biden is needed
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 07:03 PM
Jun 2020

to get out the black vote because I think the black vote has really got this.

They are ready. As are young educated across the nation. I think Warren will bring a lot of enthusiasm to the 20 somethings and energize to not only vote but aggressively participate. I think now is like no other time that we have had the opportunity to live. I feel the blue wave.

LizBeth

(9,952 posts)
77. I have listened to the vocal black community and I have confidence and faith in their strength.
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 07:34 PM
Jun 2020

We saw what they did in SC. Turned the election around. I feel the same with our youth though they historically are no shows. Again, this is a different time.

So yes. Seriously.

Reader Rabbit

(2,624 posts)
63. Those are *my* top two choices, and *I* can't decide.
Sat Jun 27, 2020, 05:49 PM
Jun 2020

Harris is younger, and as a Californian, that Senate seat would be safe. Warren is more progressive and has concrete, well-thought-out plans, but her Senate seat would be at risk.

DFW

(54,325 posts)
86. I wouldn't want either one of them.
Sun Jun 28, 2020, 05:01 AM
Jun 2020

Apparently, according to that poll, 57% of black voters agree.

Gothmog

(145,046 posts)
89. 72% of Democrats say it's important Biden choose a woman of color as VP.
Wed Jul 1, 2020, 03:41 PM
Jul 2020



Seven of 10 Democrats in the new USA TODAY/Suffolk Poll say it is important to them that presumptive nominee Joe Biden picks a woman of color as his running mate on the Democratic presidential ticket this fall.

A third of Democrats, among both Black and white Americans, call it "very important."
The potential contender who generates the most enthusiasm as a vice presidential nominee among those surveyed is California Sen. Kamala Harris, followed by former Georgia gubernatorial candidate Stacey Abrams and Massachusetts Sen. Elizabeth Warren. Many of the other possibilities reportedly being vetted by the Biden campaign aren't familiar enough to be rated by most of those surveyed.

The poll had some disheartening news for the current vice president, Mike Pence. Republicans by close to 2-1 wouldn't be concerned if President Donald Trump dumped Pence from the GOP ticket in favor of former U.N. Ambassador Nikki Haley: 11% would be "excited" and 35% would find that move "acceptable."

Just 21% said it would be "not acceptable," and 6% said they would be "angry." An additional 1 in 4 are undecided.
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