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targetpractice

(4,919 posts)
Fri Jul 3, 2020, 09:07 AM Jul 2020

Some thoughts about the cognitive test that Trump "aced"...

My mother was a malignant narcissist. Not sadistic like Trump, but I can predict Trump's behavior by reflecting on my mother's behavior. His body language, his constant need to blame others, only listening to thing that reinforce his world view are all too familiar to me.

Anyways, my grandmother had Alzheimer's and my mother was her caregiver until the end. She lived in fear of Alzheimer's. I moved in with her when she was exhibiting early signs of dementia... She would not or could not admit she was having problems. Her narcissism prevented that. I watched my Mom slip away slowly... She knew what was happening, but she was determined to not let anyone know, because of the crippling insecurity narcissists suffer. I remember almost crying in a grocery store when she quietly picked up one of those puzzle books in the checkout ailse... She was clandestine about it, because she didn't want me to see. I remember her rage if I brought her car/house keys that she'd left in the door... It was a rough time.

She had a neurologist and had several appointments... She never let me accompany her, despite the fact she got lost several times on her way to the appointments. She would call me, and I'd redirect her to the proper route home. After each of these appointments, she would return home and make fantastical claims about getting through a basic neuro test like Trump claims he "aced"... She would say things, like the neurologist had never seen such great results for someone her age. Of course, I knew she was lying, and the tests must have been challenging for her. Her biggest fear was not being perfect and being "discovered". She went to great lengths to hide her symptoms... She was a partner in two daycare centers, and her partner was complaining to me about her slipping performance. My Mom eventually "dropped the mic" and quit just before a confrontational meeting with her partner. She did this to protect her ego.

Why am I writing this... Because Donald Trump claimed he "aced" a basic neurological test. We'll never know if he did (they are simple) or did not... I suspect he did, and that reinforced his reality that everything is okay, when he knows deep down it is not. He could not bear the shame of an imperfect test. Also, it wouldn't surprise me at all if he dropped out of the race, claim he was the best president in histor... rather the suffer the shame of a landslide defeat.

Thanks for reading.

17 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Some thoughts about the cognitive test that Trump "aced"... (Original Post) targetpractice Jul 2020 OP
Why anyone would boast about "acing" that test amazes me. The test is akin Raven Jul 2020 #1
You can't believe anything that Trump claims Chainfire Jul 2020 #2
It is clear to me that you know what you are talking about. Laelth Jul 2020 #3
Thank you, Laelth... targetpractice Jul 2020 #6
So picking up a Puzzle book is a sign of dementia ... GeorgeGist Jul 2020 #4
It was a book of games to "strengthen your brain" targetpractice Jul 2020 #7
My father wasn't a narcissist. Just had dementia. blueinredohio Jul 2020 #5
Sad... Alacritous Crier Jul 2020 #8
The whole world is being used, not Trump. Boomerproud Jul 2020 #9
Could we ask the tester to spell "stupid" backwards? LiberalFighter Jul 2020 #16
Having a Parent or Wellstone ruled Jul 2020 #10
The real way that test works to identify dementia, Ms. Toad Jul 2020 #11
I get that... targetpractice Jul 2020 #12
Yes and no Ms. Toad Jul 2020 #14
This is the yearly test that my doctor gives once his patients reach 65 peggysue2 Jul 2020 #13
Paragraphs 2 and 3 are right on target. JohnnyLib2 Jul 2020 #15
He's still bragging about it... targetpractice Jul 2020 #17

Raven

(13,887 posts)
1. Why anyone would boast about "acing" that test amazes me. The test is akin
Fri Jul 3, 2020, 09:17 AM
Jul 2020

to being asked to count from 10 to 1. They never change the clock test and the first time I took it there was a clock on the wall above where my tester was sitting. Trump's insecurity is showing.

Chainfire

(17,527 posts)
2. You can't believe anything that Trump claims
Fri Jul 3, 2020, 09:18 AM
Jul 2020

simply based upon the knowledge of his frequency of being caught out in lies. Trump does not even recognize the difference in the truth and a lie and is unashamed that people know that he is a pathological liar.

Trump's cognitive abilities are on display daily; test results are unnecessary and test results showing that he had high cognitive function has to be dismissed as an obvious lie.

Laelth

(32,017 posts)
3. It is clear to me that you know what you are talking about.
Fri Jul 3, 2020, 09:23 AM
Jul 2020

I have been surrounded by Cluster B disordered persons all my life, and it appears that you have too.

I wish you a healthy, emotionally-normal recovery, and I am glad that you now have the necessary insight to identify people with Cluster B disorders so that you may keep them out of your life.

-Laelth

targetpractice

(4,919 posts)
6. Thank you, Laelth...
Fri Jul 3, 2020, 10:00 AM
Jul 2020

I didn't even know what narcissism was until I moved in with my mother in my mid 40s... It was such an awakening to re-evaluate my childhood through adult lenses.

I appreciate your thoughts, and it seems like you've come out on the other side. Good for you!

targetpractice

(4,919 posts)
7. It was a book of games to "strengthen your brain"
Fri Jul 3, 2020, 10:02 AM
Jul 2020

I didn't mean to infer that was a sign of dementia... I read the situation that she thought the book would help her. She never did a single game or puzzle though.

blueinredohio

(6,797 posts)
5. My father wasn't a narcissist. Just had dementia.
Fri Jul 3, 2020, 09:30 AM
Jul 2020

The doctor asked him to spell "world" backwards but he couldn't do it. It's so sad to watch them slip away. Don't get me wrong I can't stand Trump and hope he loses big time but it's sad he is being used instead of getting help.

Alacritous Crier

(3,815 posts)
8. Sad...
Fri Jul 3, 2020, 10:10 AM
Jul 2020

"...it's sad he is being used instead of getting help."

Sigh...

It's the Trump family tradition!




GOTV.

 

Wellstone ruled

(34,661 posts)
10. Having a Parent or
Fri Jul 3, 2020, 12:12 PM
Jul 2020

a acquaintance that suffers from any Mental Health Issues is a total bitch. Narcissistic behavior coupled with Bi-Polarism was the diagnoses of a one of my Parents. Fully understand what your daily routine would be.

Medication was a wonderful calming effect for that Person. No more egg shell worries except if they did not take their Meds. Then,all bets were off.

Ms. Toad

(34,060 posts)
11. The real way that test works to identify dementia,
Fri Jul 3, 2020, 12:26 PM
Jul 2020

Is that no one without dementia would dream of bragging that they aced a test any 4th grader should be able to ace.

targetpractice

(4,919 posts)
12. I get that...
Fri Jul 3, 2020, 01:07 PM
Jul 2020

... For someone with dementia, the test is probably a real challenge... If they "ace" it, then they must feel proud of their accomplishment.

Ms. Toad

(34,060 posts)
14. Yes and no
Fri Jul 3, 2020, 03:04 PM
Jul 2020

My spouse is completely unaware of what she has lost. Easier on her (if I can play along) and harder on both of us when I can't.

In a more sophisticated version of the test, they have you look at a picture adn draw it from memory. I was amazed to see in testing what I had observed in real life: She creates memories that are very bit as real as if they had actually happened.

She has sgnificant reproduction errors in the first copy. Every one thereafter was identical to the first (messed up) copy. In real life, how this manfests is that she makes up things that have happened from bits and pieces of real life. Often exaggerated to make a better story - and once embedded she cannot be convinced she made the first error.

I have heard conversations I had with people recited by her in the first pesron (as if she, rather than I, had the conversation).

The most spectacular one comes from when our daughter was under 2 (she's 30 this month). The ER needed a urine sample - it was the first fo July when you want to avoid all hospitals if you can. Our daughter peed on the examining table. The (brand new baby doctor) attempted to collect a sample from the table by using tubing with a squeeze bulb attached. That would not have created a useful sample becasue of the contamination by hitting the examining table (so yes, there was error by the doctor).

The story she tells is that the doctor grabbed a straw and used it to suck up a sample using his mouth to provide the suction. It makes a good story - but it never happened. I've tried to correct her - but she is absolutely convinced it happened the way she really truly remembers it.

I banged my head against the wall for several years watching this happen. I kept trying to make her see what was going on - so we could get treatment if early treatment made a difference. She finally relented, has a diagnosis, is taking two Alzheimer's meds but still insists I'm the one with memory issues. Once I saw that her most significant deficit was in executive reasoning, it was crystal clear that she wasn't faking it - the lack of exective reasoing prevents her from understanding. Trump has signficiantly less executive reasoning abilty, from anything I can see. So he might be completely unaware that there was no challenge at all to the test. (And since that test doesn't test executive reasoning, it might not be a challenge.)

peggysue2

(10,828 posts)
13. This is the yearly test that my doctor gives once his patients reach 65
Fri Jul 3, 2020, 02:21 PM
Jul 2020

It is basic, basic, basic. Five words at the start of the test that you're required to repeat back after 3-5 minutes. Drawing a clock with the hands positioned to a particular time. The sort of thing a grade school kid would ace. Why Trump is bragging about taking the test, acing it is beyond me.There's also a mobility part--walking in a straight line, sitting in a chair and rising from a chair without difficulty. This was something my mother-in-law had problems with at the end of life. She was 89 years old at that point.

Come on! Trump lives in a Universe of his own.

JohnnyLib2

(11,211 posts)
15. Paragraphs 2 and 3 are right on target.
Fri Jul 3, 2020, 09:34 PM
Jul 2020

Thank you for this painful story. I believe many who work in memory care units or otherwise with patients with dementia are very familiar with this combination of personality and cognitive deficits. In fact, new staff sometimes receive training in "difficult, "hard to manage" patients.

Your description is much appreciated. I wish folks who deal with Trump every day would acknowledge and take action on his slippage.
(polite version)

targetpractice

(4,919 posts)
17. He's still bragging about it...
Thu Jul 9, 2020, 11:01 PM
Jul 2020

Last edited Fri Jul 10, 2020, 08:37 AM - Edit history (4)

Just like I wrote in the OP... My mother claimed exactly something like this, almost word for word... Malignant narcissism and dementia is a fun combo...




Trump on Cognitive Tests: I actually took one.. and I proved I was all there because I aced it... I took it at Walter Reed Medical Center in front of doctors and they were very surprised. They said that’s an unbelievable thing, rarely does anyone do what you just did
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