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Risk factors in Covid 19 times - choose your risks (Original Post) packman Jul 2020 OP
I wonder wryter2000 Jul 2020 #1
my husband's dentist also does this nt yellowdogintexas Jul 2020 #15
Thank you for posting this. dewsgirl Jul 2020 #2
Man everything I love doing is in the high-risk category. Initech Jul 2020 #3
Thanks! Very useful. Newest Reality Jul 2020 #4
Typed up for ease of sending to friends and relatives Generic Other Jul 2020 #5
Thank You! Deuce Jul 2020 #9
They think enough stupid people equals herd immunity Generic Other Jul 2020 #11
you can't have herd immunity unless the virus results in lifelong individual immunity yellowdogintexas Jul 2020 #17
Mine is bumper sticker thinking Generic Other Jul 2020 #36
Thank you! nt USALiberal Jul 2020 #13
helpful... dhill926 Jul 2020 #6
same here. Grocery store, with masks, gloves and distancing yellowdogintexas Jul 2020 #19
500+ worshippers... dweller Jul 2020 #7
I wondered about that too. Maggiemayhem Jul 2020 #35
11 -- attending a MAGA rally nt eppur_se_muova Jul 2020 #8
So much of the risk is contingent on people wearing masks and distancing. Midnight Writer Jul 2020 #10
My hairdresser was open a week Generic Other Jul 2020 #12
Thx for sharing! A lot of people want their hair done...including me! I will wait Thekaspervote Jul 2020 #22
It is not that simple Scalded Nun Jul 2020 #14
Thanks for posting! Kingofalldems Jul 2020 #16
What about jury duty? shanti Jul 2020 #18
seriously NJCher Jul 2020 #29
No shanti Jul 2020 #31
So, Going to an Outdoor Protest March and Socially Distancing Is About Moderate Risk... TomCADem Jul 2020 #20
Looks like about everyone in that pic has a mask..... Bengus81 Jul 2020 #26
well, that's simple NJCher Jul 2020 #30
Notice what's not on there anywhere? "Attending Church services"... just sayin'... n/t TygrBright Jul 2020 #21
Did you miss a line? EllieBC Jul 2020 #23
Ah, thanks. The 500 people caveat seems to limit it. No risk in smaller services? n/t TygrBright Jul 2020 #24
I thought that was weird too. EllieBC Jul 2020 #27
Maybe the wedding or funeral covers smaller groups in churches? Generic Other Jul 2020 #37
11--being around Trump Jr's girlfriend in the last 7-8 days Bengus81 Jul 2020 #25
The most risky thing I do weaponeer Jul 2020 #28
I got my first haircut since March about a week ago. lpbk2713 Jul 2020 #32
who needs it? NJCher Jul 2020 #33
That sounds dreadful. BannonsLiver Jul 2020 #43
The most risky I have done are: mvd Jul 2020 #34
Uh-oh. I've been trimming my own wnylib Jul 2020 #38
Thank you for this; I've shared it with my family. n/t NNadir Jul 2020 #39
I asked them how they made the chart and got this reply Beringia Jul 2020 #40
I'm super jealous of people with big houses, yards, and home gyms IronLionZion Jul 2020 #41
I wonder how risky it is to use the restroom at a gas station during a trip? cayugafalls Jul 2020 #42

wryter2000

(46,037 posts)
1. I wonder
Mon Jul 6, 2020, 12:38 PM
Jul 2020

I was in my dentist's waiting room recently. They arranged to only have one patient at a time in there, though. I was alone with the staff.

Generic Other

(28,979 posts)
5. Typed up for ease of sending to friends and relatives
Mon Jul 6, 2020, 01:19 PM
Jul 2020

Risk factors for Covid (Texas Medical Association):
Lowest Risk (1): Opening Mail

Low Risk (2): Getting Restaurant Takeout
Pumping Gas
Playing Tennis
Camping

Moderate Low Risk (3): Grocery Shopping
Going For a walk, run or bike ride with
others
Playing Golf

Moderate Low Risk (4): Staying in a hotel for two nights
Sitting in a doctor’s waiting room
Going to a library or museum
Eating outside at a restaurant
Walking in a busy downtown
Spending an hour at a playground

Moderate Risk (5): Having dinner at someone else’s house
Attending a backyard BBQ
Going to the beach
Shopping at a mall

Moderate Risk (6): Sending kids to school, camp or daycare
Working a week n an office building
Swimming in a public pool
Visiting an elderly relative or friend in their
home

Moderate High (7): Going to a hair salon or a barbershop
Eating inside at a restaurant
Attending wedding or funeral
Travelling by plane
Playing basketball
Playing football
Hugging or Shaking hands when greeting
friends

High Risk (8): Eating at a buffet
Working out at a gym
Going to an amusement park
Going to a movie theater

Highest Risk (9): Attending a large music concert
Going to a sport stadium
Attending a religious service with 500+
worshippers
Going to a bar

yellowdogintexas

(22,250 posts)
17. you can't have herd immunity unless the virus results in lifelong individual immunity
Tue Jul 7, 2020, 01:37 PM
Jul 2020

whether from illness or immunization. It has been decades since smallpox was diagnosed here, as well as diphtheria. Those of us who are a certain age contracted all the so called "childhood" diseases or immunized for polio, diphtheria, whooping cough and smallpox and have permanent immunity. Now our children and grandchildren can be vaccinated. Our immunity protects the immunocompromised and those too young to be immunized.

Which is why we have a new flu vaccine annually, and why there are no 'cold' vaccines, and the fact that coronavirus morph into new strains very quickly. I firmly believe this the way things will go in the vaccine development. It would seem that developing a more specific antiviral would be our second line of defense (after mask/washing hands/staying home) This of course is just my humble opinion based on lots of reading and a fairly intense obsession with medical information.

Interestingly, coronaviruses include several strains of what we call the common cold. This helps explain why the immunities are so short term.

A very informative discussion of Coronavirus in general and COVID 19 in particular can be found at "This Podcast Will Kill You" . Episode 43 was a general overview of Coronavirus with some specific info on this new strain. Later on, a several part series began which features specialists in various aspects of the disease. I think it is up to 11 parts now.

Don't worry this is NOT a boring dry scientific lecture! Two very smart and engaging young women (pursueing graduate degrees in microbiology and biochemistry) are the hosts and they really present this in a very conversational manner. Incidentally, the very first episode was about Spanish Flu! With this series, one takes a tour of infectious disease and other illnesses.

So grab yourself a Quarantini, and tune in to the Two Erins!

Generic Other

(28,979 posts)
36. Mine is bumper sticker thinking
Wed Jul 8, 2020, 05:24 PM
Jul 2020

Yours is fact backed by knowledge, but I am only making a poster, not a vaccine.

Thanks for the link.

yellowdogintexas

(22,250 posts)
19. same here. Grocery store, with masks, gloves and distancing
Tue Jul 7, 2020, 01:42 PM
Jul 2020

then we wash all the produce and wipe down the containers of milk, cheese, jars, cans etc with sanitary wipes.

We stocked up on dry goods, rice beans and our favorite case lots from Costco early on, so we pretty much only buy produce and dairy.

This chart really made me realize I really do not need that haircut after all. I am just going to have to live with it. I think I am going to have to step down as an election judge on Election day for our run off election. We are taking heavy precautions, but you just never know.

dweller

(23,628 posts)
7. 500+ worshippers...
Mon Jul 6, 2020, 01:52 PM
Jul 2020

wonder why that was qualified ?
400+ is ok ?
but don't set foot in a bar ...


✌🏼

Midnight Writer

(21,745 posts)
10. So much of the risk is contingent on people wearing masks and distancing.
Mon Jul 6, 2020, 02:18 PM
Jul 2020

I felt fairly safe at my barber's because she insists everyone wear masks and she cleans with disinfectant between clients.

I do not feel safe at the grocery store where people are not wearing masks and not distancing.

Thekaspervote

(32,755 posts)
22. Thx for sharing! A lot of people want their hair done...including me! I will wait
Tue Jul 7, 2020, 04:11 PM
Jul 2020

Please people don’t risk it

Scalded Nun

(1,236 posts)
14. It is not that simple
Tue Jul 7, 2020, 11:54 AM
Jul 2020

Thanks for some of this information. Some of it is confusing.
Is "sending kids to school, camp or day care" that rating for just one school day, one trip to day care? I ask because we go to amusement parks once. We attend a religious service once. We send kids to school 5 days a week. What about riding the bus to school? Then when the students go to gym, does that count as yet another risk tacked on to the initial risk of attending school? If school districts use this information to decide their school calendars, staff and children will sicken quickly and spread this further. Does eating in the cafeteria for a single day equal eating at buffet? This is a complex issue, and many people, to include our Texas governor, will latch on to anything to throw students and staff under the COVID-19 bus.

Kingofalldems

(38,451 posts)
16. Thanks for posting!
Tue Jul 7, 2020, 01:23 PM
Jul 2020

My wife had a nail appointment today and I clipped her nails myself to keep her out of there.

NJCher

(35,658 posts)
29. seriously
Tue Jul 7, 2020, 11:20 PM
Jul 2020

that can be done by zoom. Ridiculous to ask you to expose yourself to jury selection.

Wrong, wrong, wrong. I'm guessing you must be in one of those Republican governor states.

TomCADem

(17,387 posts)
20. So, Going to an Outdoor Protest March and Socially Distancing Is About Moderate Risk...
Tue Jul 7, 2020, 02:20 PM
Jul 2020

...but going to a bar, indoor rally or indoor religious service is high risk.

Bengus81

(6,931 posts)
26. Looks like about everyone in that pic has a mask.....
Tue Jul 7, 2020, 05:57 PM
Jul 2020

Love to see how many RWer's at a Kansas mega church are wearing a mask. About NONE.

NJCher

(35,658 posts)
30. well, that's simple
Tue Jul 7, 2020, 11:24 PM
Jul 2020

outdoor is way safer than indoor. Any respiratory droplets, aerosols, etc., can dissipate in the wind or even a breeze.

I read an article that discussed a study of protesters. There was no bump in infections. It speaks to their wearing of masks and in some cases, social distancing.

EllieBC

(3,013 posts)
27. I thought that was weird too.
Tue Jul 7, 2020, 07:00 PM
Jul 2020

30 congregants in a small church/synagogue/mosque is as bad IMO as 500+ in a mega congregation.

Generic Other

(28,979 posts)
37. Maybe the wedding or funeral covers smaller groups in churches?
Wed Jul 8, 2020, 05:27 PM
Jul 2020

They just couldn't bring themselves to anger all the small-time fundie preachers.

NJCher

(35,658 posts)
33. who needs it?
Tue Jul 7, 2020, 11:59 PM
Jul 2020

After reading that list, I've decided that buying my property back in '98 turned out to be a good move for the way the world has gone.

I don't need a gym: I can pull weeds. I can dig in new plants. I can rake, sweep, trim branches, go up and down stairs and hills, etc.

I have a patio, so I can sit outside; don't need a park.

"Going to a beach or swimming in a public pool?" If I wanted to, I could open my pool which is in-ground and has a view of NYC skyline. However, I am too lazy to take care of it, so I'm not opening it. Instead, I tend raised beds that are around it. If I could give the damn thing away, I would, but it doesn't work that way.

My work is outdoors and I raise vegetables to give to food pantries. Not much of a risk there, as I do this with one other person and we have alternating schedules. We tend around 35 beds and I tend 14 of my own.

Not one item at the high end of the spectrum is of interest to me.

Oh and p.s., I cut my own hair for the first time and like it as much or more than what my hair stylist does.

mvd

(65,173 posts)
34. The most risky I have done are:
Tue Jul 7, 2020, 11:59 PM
Jul 2020

- sitting in a doctor’s waiting room (once - they say they don’t see patients that have COVID at the office)

- outdoor dining (once - even though indoor dining to a certain capacity is allowed in Montgomery County PA, not all businesses have to comply. Zoe’s Kitchen only allows outdoor dining)

wnylib

(21,432 posts)
38. Uh-oh. I've been trimming my own
Wed Jul 8, 2020, 10:57 PM
Jul 2020

hair but made an appt when I learned my hairdresser was open again. Now I am going to cancel the appt.

Another risk factor, though I don' know what level to rate it. Blood type. There was a thread on it a while back and I read another article on it today.

Type O blood is lower risk than other types for catching it and for having a serious case. Type A is higher risk for catching and for bad case.

I have Type A, wouldn't ya know. But since my father had type O, then I must have a recessive O gene. So do they cancel each other out? Or does it put me midway between A and O on vulnerability?

Don't know. Probably not. But I'm not gonna experiment to find out.

Beringia

(4,316 posts)
40. I asked them how they made the chart and got this reply
Thu Jul 9, 2020, 09:17 AM
Jul 2020


How We Made Our COVID-19 “Know Your Risk” Guide

Where Did This Idea Come From?
What Is This Not?
Exactly What Was Asked?
Who Are These Experts?
How Did You Gather the Physicians’ Opinions?
How Did You Analyze the Data?
Did the Experts Agree on their Rankings?
How Accurate Are These Numbers?
Why Didn’t You Rate ...?

More than 1 million people around the globe saw the Texas Medical Association’s “Know Your Risk During COVID-19” chart the past few days. The chart is intended as a guide, prepared by physician experts, to help people make smart and educated choices of activities to pursue amid the COVID-19 pandemic.

Over the holiday weekend, the chart appeared in media outlets from Ireland to India, from Ecuador to the Philippines. It has been unofficially translated into Arabic, Spanish, and Italian.

On Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, and via email, many people wrote TMA asking for specifics on how the guide was constructed. This document, undertaken with full transparency, is an attempt to answer those questions.

Where Did This Idea Come From?
During the June 26 meeting of the TMA COVID-19 Task Force one of the members shared a risk chart she had seen online. A Michigan news outlet created it sometime in May by asking four public health experts to rate 36 different activities from 1 (least risky) to 10 (riskiest). The Task Force (and later, the TMA Committee on Infectious Diseases) was tasked with providing their expert opinions to create a similar chart to guide Texans on how to assess their potential risk during daily activities.

The selected list of activities to rate was derived initially from the Michigan list, with modifications based on common summertime activities for Texans.

What Is This Not?
The chart is based on the expert opinions of 14 Texas physicians (more details below) of the relative risk of contracting COVID-19 from participating in various common activities.

This is not a study of the actual risk from participating in these activities based on data collected from individuals and their exposure to COVID-19. While such a study would prove extremely useful moving forward, that was not the intent of this project. TMA asked the physician experts to apply the current scientific understanding of how COVID-19 spreads to common activities Texans undertake every day. The association wanted something that could help Texans make informed choices now, when many parts of the state are seeing huge increases in confirmed COVID-19 cases and hospitalizations.

Exactly What Was Asked?
Below is the language in the email sent to the physician participants:

As per the discussions in the TMA COVID-19 Task Force and Committee on Infectious Diseases this week, I am asking you to help TMA create a “risk index” document for the general public.
To help Texans make informed choices of activities to undertake amid the COVID-19 pandemic, TMA is asking members of the task force and the committee – our infectious disease experts -- to rank the "riskiness" of a number of activities.

Please assign a risk of 1 (least risk) to 10 (riskiest) to each of these activities using the following criteria: Whether it’s inside or outside; proximity to others; exposure time; likelihood of compliance; and personal risk level. Please assume that participants in these activities are following currently recommended safety protocols when possible.

For any of these activities, if you have some insight about what would make it less risky or more risky, please leave it in the comments box.

(The underlined paragraph contains the specific directions the physicians were asked to follow in rating each of the 38 activities under consideration.)

Here is a screen shot of the beginning of the evaluation tool:



Who Are These Experts?
Members of the TMA COVID-19 Task Force and the TMA Committee on Infectious Diseases were invited to rate the activities. These are some of Texas’ leading experts in epidemiology, public health, and infectious diseases.

The Task Force members were appointed in March by the TMA Board of Trustees to “help Texas physicians prepare their practices to protect and treat their patients in the event of a community outbreak of the 2019 novel coronavirus.” The Task Force chair, Wendy Chung, MD, is chief epidemiologist at Dallas County Health and Human Services. The group includes a former commissioner of the Texas Department of State Health Services (Dr. Lakey), and a former medical director at the Dallas County Health Department and current member of the American Medical Association Council on Science and Public Health (Dr. Carlo).

The TMA Committee on Infectious Diseases is a 12-member group whose mission is to “educate the profession and public on the prevalence, detection, diagnosis, and treatment of infectious diseases, including HIV, tuberculosis, and sexually transmitted diseases, [and] monitor legislation regarding infectious diseases.” The committee chair is Thomas Kaspar, MD, a board-certified infectious disease specialist practicing in Victoria, Texas, who is also a member of the TMA COVID-19 Task Force. The committee members all have extensive training and experience in infectious diseases.

How Did You Gather the Physicians’ Opinions?
Using the Qualtrics survey platform, each of the activities was listed following the format shown in the screen shot above. The presentation of the activities was randomized to cancel out any effect order might have. The email shown above was sent to the 23 unique members of the TMA COVID-19 Task Force and the Committee on Infectious Diseases. Responses were collected from June 25-29, 2020. A total of 14 replies were received.

How Did You Analyze the Data?
Using Excel, the average rating was computed for each of the activities listed. The averages were rounded to the nearest whole number and sorted from lowest to highest.

Did the Experts Agree on their Rankings?
Although respondents were asked to assume participants were following all recommended precautions, the physician experts were clear that many factors influence the risk of each activity. While the average ranking is a helpful starting place to understand risk, as always, the reality is “it depends.”

On most activities, the experts’ rankings clustered together. More divergent rankings stemmed from varying assumptions made about the activity, which are reflected in the comments the participants made concerning those activities. For example:

• Visiting an elderly friend or relative in their home:
o The risk all depends on where they have been.
o You may be more risk to them than they to you.
o Wear a mask and maintain social distance.
• Spending an hour at a playground:
o If others are there, this is risky.
o 3 if masked and distanced; otherwise 8.

How Accurate Are These Numbers?
This is not a scientific study and the rankings should not be interpreted as absolute risk of participating in an activity. More weight should be put on the groupings and an activity’s relative position on the chart than on the numbers. The closer together two activities are, the more similar their risk is; the further apart, the more different.

This chart shows that certain activities are different in risk, but it does not tell us precisely how much. Something rated a “5” – like having dinner at someone else’s house – is not necessarily five times as risky as the lone item rated a “1” – opening the mail but it is a riskier activity in general.

Why Didn’t You Rate ...?
TMA received many such questions on social media. Some were driven by current events (riots and protests), some by mere curiosity or profession (massages), and some by geography (cricket).

In general, TMA selected activities that many Texans might commonly be engaged in during the summer. To approximate the relative risk of an activity that is not on the list, one could select a rated activity that is similar in terms of the criteria the physician experts used:
• Whether it’s inside or outside;
• Proximity to others;
• Exposure time;
• Likelihood of compliance with public health recommendations; and
• Personal risk level.

Also, please assume that participants in these activities are following currently recommended safety protocols such as wearing a face covering and social distancing at least six feet when appropriate.

IronLionZion

(45,427 posts)
41. I'm super jealous of people with big houses, yards, and home gyms
Thu Jul 9, 2020, 10:08 AM
Jul 2020

Many of whom have enjoyed rubbing it in when the stay at home orders have started and letting me know about their big chest freezers full of delicious groceries.

Part of city living is spending less time in our small apartments and doing more outside. My only salvation here is being surrounded by masked liberals to help insulate me from the MAGA COVIDiots out in the suburbs. At least I have a decent kitchen and know how to cook. There are folks out there who don't. And I like social distance walks. Some other folks are used to weights or indoor group classes.

It would be interesting to have more outdoor gyms and classes open up.

cayugafalls

(5,640 posts)
42. I wonder how risky it is to use the restroom at a gas station during a trip?
Thu Jul 9, 2020, 11:38 AM
Jul 2020

We have a trip coming up and that is one of our biggest concerns.

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