Please stop wringing your hands because the tax returns won't be released before the election!

[StarfishSaver]

Let's suppose the Supreme Court ordered the tax returns to be released tomorrow morning and - yes, this is clearly a hypothetical - let's suppose Trump and his accountants obeyed the Court and actually released them first thing tomorrow.

What do you think would happen?

Here's what I think would occur:

The press would go buck wild trying to get their hands on the records, picking through them, getting experts to pick through them with a fine-toothed comb and the airwaves would be saturated with everyone and their mother analyzing, discussing, dissecting and pontificating about what's in those documents. That's all anyone would be talking about. But most people would be so confused

Meanwhile, Trump and his cronies and enablers would be spinning like crazy, doing everything could to throw sand in everyone's faces, confusing and obfuscating and trying to gaslight everyone into believing that the entry on line 74 on Schedule A doesn't really mean what it says it means. And now let's look at page 215 of the Supplemental Schedule. That proves he did nothing wrong. "Nothing to see here!!!"

And while that's happening, some guy known as "Biden WHO?" would be trying to get some attention and coverage. But everyone would be too busy swimming around in Trump's tax returns to notice him, much less talk about anything he's saying or doing or plans to do for the country if he's elected president.

It would be a big mess with little light or air. We'd all be confused. But one thing would be certain. Not one single mind would be changed. The majority of the country that knows Trump is a crook will still know Trump is a crook. The dwindling minority of voters in Trump's cult either will still not believe Trump is a crook or think there's nothing wrong with him being a crook. And anyone who doesn't fall within those groups will likely be so frustrated and disgusted that no one is talking about any issues they care about, they'll just tune out.

In other words, releasing the tax returns before November won't have any positive effect on the outcome of the election and, in fact, could actually hurt us by distracting from the issues we need to be focusing on.

So, let's step back into the real world and look at where we are. The U.S. Supreme Court today UNANIMOUSLY smacked down Donald Trump, telling him, "No, dude. You are NOT above the law. Take that lame-assed argument out of here." The Court humiliated him today. And he realized today that he is going to have to release those documents. And whether he does it today, in September, in December, or next year, a state court prosecutor is waiting for him. And he can't delay or pardon or bully or shish-talk his way out of that. And that is scaring him to death.

Because here's the thing - Trump couldn't care less whether the voters see his tax returns. He knows that nothing in them is going to make any difference in the election. What he is REALLY afraid of are the prosecutors because he knows those documents are a petri dish of evidence of his decades of criminality. And they're going to take him down.

And, best of all, unreleased, they're just hanging over his head like the sword of Damocles, making them a much more effective weapon than they would be if they'd been spit into the public arena in a massive document dump. From now until November, we can add "What is he hiding?" to the repertoire of refrains that will eventually drum Donald Trump out of office.

[RhodeIslandOne]

1. A lot of people built up something in their minds and this wasn't it.

Like somehow the justices were going to walk out on the steps and hand out Trump's bank records.

[StarfishSaver]

2. IKR?

But I love the visual!

[MyOwnPeace]

3. And Joe can keep asking...........

"Mr. President, what ARE you HIDING?!"

EVERY single time they are together on a stage.

EVERY debate - let that be the first thing JOE says!

He's gone - he's toast - a BLUE SUNAMI!!!!!

GET OUT THE VOTE!!!!!!!

[la-trucker]

4. Cy Vance has the shortest path to those records and

if he files a criminal complaint in NY, the exhibits and the complaint will show what Trump did. It will be a limited disclosure but a very salient one where punditocracy, gaslighting and spinning will be relatively ineffective.

[StarfishSaver]

5. Yes

[empedocles]

6. 'UNANIMOUSLY' , 9 -0, 9-0. 9-0

The media went all over the lot today, all sorts of explanations, some 'both-siderism.

Don't think I saw a single chyron, or heard a single 'UNANIMOUS DECISION AGAINST PRESIDENT TRUMP', 9-0.

We need to repeat it over and over again.

[FM123]

7. By the time they are released

and the tax returns connect the dots to things like money laundering or tax evasion etc trump will be out of the White House and the statute of limitations will have not run out yet, sounds good to me. Popcorn!

[uponit7771]

8. Yep, Trump being crooked is a feature not a bug to his MAGA Cultist

[StarfishSaver]

9. It's coming

[uponit7771]

11. +1, changed my reply cause..."If he had sex with their dead bodies (mine)" is true, There's nothing

... that could come out right now that would change anyone's mind about Trump.

Right now we're at walk across broken glass factor at 2.1 for his detractors and the middle of the road looks like 1.1 were we'd like it as high as possible.

I'm thinking 250,000 dead people (1.2 million cases a month x 3% CFR x 3 months) would get them their hopefully.

[weaponeer]

10. In your scenario, how would the press

Get those tax returns in order to go thru them with a fine toothed comb? Weren’t they only supposed to be released to a grand jury and Congressional Committees?

[StarfishSaver]

12. The premise of my scenario is that the returns are released immediately.

[weaponeer]

13. To the public? Why would they do that?

What am I missing here?

[StarfishSaver]

14. It's a hypothetical to help demonstrate why the returns not coming out before November

is not a bad thing.

[weaponeer]

15. Ah. OK, I get it

Sorry for the questions.

[StarfishSaver]

16. No problem

Welcome to DU!

[USALiberal]

17. Very few are doing that!!! Lighten up! nt

[pnwmom]

18. I don't care if all the returns are released. But what if some things in the tax returns are all

that's needed to complete an indictment against Don Jr.?

Trump would care about that.

[former9thward]

19. The IRS has had his tax returns for decades.

And for 16 years his tax returns were looked at by the Clinton IRS and the Obama IRS. The state of NY has had his tax returns for 40 years -- most of those years under Democratic control. If there are crimes why did none of these agencies refer them for prosecution? Do you really think the IRS , state and federal, do not have lawyers and investigators who do this all the time?

[StarfishSaver]

20. The returns themselves don't necessarily reveal the crimes

Tax returns are pretty much self-reporting and backed up by documents provided by the taxpayer. Unless they are obviously fraudulent, the IRS doesn't go further. They accept them at face value and move on.

It is when the tax records and supporting documentation are compared to other documents that the IRS doesn't have access to - real estate loan applications, bank personal financial statements, insurance forms, etc. - that the fraud and illegality become apparent. For example, if Trump have the IRS one set of books but gave a bank another one, there is all kinds of criminal exposure.

THAT'S why a primary reason he doesn't want this information released. He doesn't want the various entities he's been doing business with to start comparing the documents with what he gave the IRS.

[former9thward]

21. No and No.

Wealthy people are audited by the IRS on a routine basis because that is where the money is. In audits the IRS does have the capability to get any document it needs. I predict Vance will be blasted as a sell out or incompetent in a few months by people who thought these tax returns were going to be a criminal gold mine.

[StarfishSaver]

22. Yes and yes

First of all, Vance isn't seeking only Trump's tax returns, but has subpoenaed an array of his financial records. And audits don't give the IRS "the capability to get any document it needs." Audits don't work that way and the IRS doesn't have the power to conduct fishing expeditions.

Not sure why you seem hell-bent on pushing the right-wing argument that Trump's tax returns won't reveal any wrongdoing because he was "under audit" for years. Surely you can't really believe that.

Or maybe you really do believe it and think his multi-year, several-front fight to keep anyone from seeing them that he's taken to the Supreme Court has nothing to do with any fear of legal jeopardy but has all been an elaborate ruse intended to "own the libs."

[former9thward]

26. I don't have the faintest idea what they will show.

But I made my prediction. We will see what happens.

[Lock him up.]

27. Vance is looking for how the payments to Stormy Daniels were reported.

As an illegal expense and if they were illegally deducted to save taxes, according to Cohen's interrogations.

LOCK HIM UP!

[former9thward]

28. Let's just say an illegal deduction was taken.

Trump did not prepare those returns. They were done by professional tax people. Trump just signed them. He is responsible for paying the proper taxes and a penalty but that is not criminal. If your taxes are prepared by professionals and you just sign them there is no intent present and there is no criminal case just a civil matter. That is how the system works.

[Lock him up.]

29. You forgot Cohen's tape(s?)...

The intent to defraud the New York State is clearly stated in the convos. He was identified as "Individual 1" for a reason.

LOCK HIM UP!

MAKE JUSTICE GREAT AGAIN

[mcar]

23. The media seemed to truly believe they'd have his tax returns by noon

if the ruling went against IMPOTUS. That's why they were so down on the decisions.

He lost. He's a loser - again. Given his tweets, he seems to understand how badly he lost in SCOTUS. A few media commentors seem to realize it too. The others had no idea what they were talking about.

[cbdo2007]

25. No, the media wanted the Repubes to believe his taxes would be released so they would freak out...

and the media wanted the Dems to believe his taxes wouldn't be released so they would freak out.

The media has one goal, always, ever - how can we frame an issue to get both sides worked up and elicit confrontation. The more confrontation the better, that is why they love a divisive President like Trump and disliked a calm and rational President like Obama. Still they manufactured scandals with Obama but they were just to get the Repubes worked up.

[MoonlitKnight]

24. Most people don't care

It’s all about jobs, the economy and the botched COVID response.