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Thu Aug 6, 2020, 12:44 PM

Did the NY ATTY Gen Just turn out millions of votes for Trump?

And increase the likelihood that there will not be a transition of power.

87 replies, 3310 views

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Reply Did the NY ATTY Gen Just turn out millions of votes for Trump? (Original post)
Edwcraig Aug 2020 OP
marybourg Aug 2020 #1
trueblue2007 Aug 2020 #76
whttevrr Aug 2020 #77
PJMcK Aug 2020 #2
Edwcraig Aug 2020 #8
Hortensis Aug 2020 #42
lagomorph777 Aug 2020 #68
GreenPartyVoter Aug 2020 #3
gratuitous Aug 2020 #4
hlthe2b Aug 2020 #5
sweetloukillbot Aug 2020 #22
hlthe2b Aug 2020 #24
DeeNice Aug 2020 #23
rzemanfl Aug 2020 #6
radical noodle Aug 2020 #7
wcmagumba Aug 2020 #9
demmiblue Aug 2020 #10
Thomas Hurt Aug 2020 #11
PTWB Aug 2020 #18
Thomas Hurt Aug 2020 #28
PTWB Aug 2020 #41
AleksS Aug 2020 #45
PTWB Aug 2020 #57
Kaleva Aug 2020 #56
PTWB Aug 2020 #58
Kaleva Aug 2020 #60
PTWB Aug 2020 #61
Kaleva Aug 2020 #62
LanternWaste Aug 2020 #70
Kaleva Aug 2020 #87
PTWB Aug 2020 #12
stopbush Aug 2020 #21
PTWB Aug 2020 #26
Ms. Toad Aug 2020 #67
PTWB Aug 2020 #69
LanternWaste Aug 2020 #71
PTWB Aug 2020 #72
Ms. Toad Aug 2020 #73
blm Aug 2020 #13
jorgevlorgan Aug 2020 #14
Hoyt Aug 2020 #15
still_one Aug 2020 #29
Hoyt Aug 2020 #33
malaise Aug 2020 #16
Frustratedlady Aug 2020 #17
Marcuse Aug 2020 #19
StarfishSaver Aug 2020 #20
budkin Aug 2020 #25
still_one Aug 2020 #27
SlogginThroughIt Aug 2020 #30
AleksS Aug 2020 #46
lunatica Aug 2020 #31
stonecutter357 Aug 2020 #32
Brainfodder Aug 2020 #34
Bleacher Creature Aug 2020 #35
GeorgiaPeanut Aug 2020 #36
Orangepeel Aug 2020 #37
C_U_L8R Aug 2020 #38
NightWatcher Aug 2020 #39
The Velveteen Ocelot Aug 2020 #40
Fullduplexxx Aug 2020 #43
Fullduplexxx Aug 2020 #44
Kaleva Aug 2020 #47
Happy Hoosier Aug 2020 #48
ProfessorGAC Aug 2020 #49
brush Aug 2020 #50
Gothmog Aug 2020 #51
sarisataka Aug 2020 #52
obamanut2012 Aug 2020 #53
SiliconValley_Dem Aug 2020 #54
grantcart Aug 2020 #55
Voltaire2 Aug 2020 #64
RhodeIslandOne Aug 2020 #74
grantcart Aug 2020 #83
RhodeIslandOne Aug 2020 #84
Devil Child Aug 2020 #59
Voltaire2 Aug 2020 #63
BamaRefugee Aug 2020 #65
RhodeIslandOne Aug 2020 #75
BamaRefugee Aug 2020 #82
lagomorph777 Aug 2020 #66
panader0 Aug 2020 #78
blueinredohio Aug 2020 #79
NYC Liberal Aug 2020 #80
LanternWaste Aug 2020 #81
SidDithers Aug 2020 #85
Demonaut Aug 2020 #86

Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 12:45 PM

1. No

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Response to marybourg (Reply #1)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 04:57 PM

76. 66. Your concern is noted. "Welcome" to DU. Sheesh.

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Response to trueblue2007 (Reply #76)


Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 12:46 PM

2. Explain your thinking, please

Thanks, in advance.

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Response to PJMcK (Reply #2)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 12:48 PM

8. Campaigns are won by GOTV. Increase your vote decrease theres.

This sure did not decrease it.

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Response to Edwcraig (Reply #8)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 01:36 PM

42. Are you somehow "empathizing" wobbly-conservative reactions in advance?

Or something?

I don't doubt for a moment that investigation into Trump's criminal activities is going to generate a great deal of anger among some and that they'll double down on votes that were already set in stone. If that's possible.

But as to your assumptions of its net effects on voting behavior, I think you should at least wait until it's actually, you know, happening and can be studied and measured. We know reactions to exposure of his business dealings won't be all one way.

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Response to Edwcraig (Reply #8)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 03:22 PM

68. This move increases enthusiasm on our side. We outnumber them 1.5:1.

So it helps us 50% more than it helps the MAGAts.

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 12:46 PM

3. Do you think there were millions of on the fence voters swayed by this? I don't.

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 12:46 PM

4. No.

Next question.

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 12:47 PM

5. WHat part about this NOT being a gun's right case, but a fraud against NRA member case

has escaped you?

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Response to hlthe2b (Reply #5)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 12:59 PM

22. That's not going to make a difference

The 2A voters aren't going to see the nuance. I also don't think there will be a significant uptick in voters from it, and it's certainly not going to draw voters from Biden.

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Response to sweetloukillbot (Reply #22)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 01:03 PM

24. MANY NRA members did line up behind North's attempt to dethrone Wayne LaPierre over this

so, among NRA members, they will know the difference. Among idiot RWers who can't read, think, or distinguish between a swastika and an American flag, probably not.

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Response to hlthe2b (Reply #5)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 01:00 PM

23. When your only tool is a hammer...

It doesn't matter that it's not a gun rights case. Was there ever a legit gun rights threat during Obama's presidency? No, and all they did was screech about "he's comin fer are gunz!" They see what they want to see.

That being said, like another poster said, I don't think anyone's coming off the fence about this.

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 12:48 PM

6. Hell no.

"Hey, your friend stole your money." Does not provoke a "What a great guy!" response.

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 12:48 PM

7. Nope

and nope.

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 12:49 PM

9. What, No...

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 12:50 PM

10. No.

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 12:50 PM

11. Not sure how many people who will be upset over this were not going to vote for Trump...

The screeching far right loons will swear this is a conspiracy against the NRA and Trump but they were going to vote for him anyway. Watch, they will be saying that the fix is in and NYAG has already won this civil case by that conspiracy.

If he wins the election there will not have to be a transition of power...he won.

We need to make sure he doesn't win.

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Response to Thomas Hurt (Reply #11)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 12:55 PM

18. You don't get it.

Every potential Trump voter who chooses to stay home because Trump is such an incompetent boob is essentially a vote for Biden. Motivating them to go vote when they otherwise wouldn't have is a huge problem.

Biden yesterday proclaimed he would ban assault weapons upon being elected President. Now the AG wants to dissolve the NRA - a fine position to take - but a position that should have been taken after the election.

When we are talking about margins of a few thousand voters in a few specific swing states, every action that motivates the opposition to vote is a negative for us. There are two main wedge issues right now - abortion and gun rights. We need to not fan the flames on either issue just prior to the election taking place!

RBG is almost certain to retire during the next term. Do we really want to gamble with that vacancy?

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Response to PTWB (Reply #18)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 01:06 PM

28. I get your point, but I don't think the cultists were ever not going to vote.

They don't give a rat's a$$ that he is an incompetent boob. They don't believe the evidence that he is an incompetent boob when it is put before them. Anything that disses their Supreme Leader is fake news to them.

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Response to Thomas Hurt (Reply #28)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 01:31 PM

41. That applies to his base. Not to the independents and moderates Trump flipped in 2016.

When the margins are as close as they were in 2016 - with mere tenths of a percent making the difference in some swing states - any tiny change to voter turnout can make or break our chances.

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Response to PTWB (Reply #41)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 01:43 PM

45. I do wonder if you're right esp. in a place like WI

People are gun nuts here, and I wonder if there were some folks who didnít want to vote for trump, and were just going to stay home, but might be convinced to actually vote Trump to ďprotect their gunz.Ē

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Response to AleksS (Reply #45)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 02:20 PM

57. Absolutely there will be some.

WI and MI were very close in 2016. This could easily make the difference, unfortunately. But with any luck there will be enough swing votes that have been appalled by Trump's behavior that it doesn't swing the states back his direction.

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Response to PTWB (Reply #18)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 02:20 PM

56. Gun enthusiasts are one demographic that votes in high percentages in every election.

That's what gives them such power. They vote.

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Response to Kaleva (Reply #56)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 02:21 PM

58. When mere tenths of one percent make the difference in a state like in 2016..

any wedge issues need to be handled carefully and appropriately.

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Response to PTWB (Reply #58)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 02:25 PM

60. If that close, automatic recounts go into effect and that didn't happen in 2016

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Response to Kaleva (Reply #60)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 02:34 PM

61. HRC lost Michigan by 10,704 votes - or 3 tenths of 1%.

HRC lost Wisconsin by 7 tenths of 1%.
HRC lost Pennsylvania by 7 tenths of 1%.

The simple fact is that we cannot afford to alienate voters by mishandling messaging on wedge issues prior to the election. It is crazy to pick this fight.

Joe Biden says he will ban assault weapons when he is elected President. But really, will he? That would require flipping the senate which is going to be very difficult to do against that type of messaging.

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Response to PTWB (Reply #61)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 02:47 PM

62. Ok.

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Response to Kaleva (Reply #62)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 03:38 PM

70. KO

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Response to LanternWaste (Reply #70)

Fri Aug 7, 2020, 04:22 AM

87. I made a flippant comment about automatic recounts without first fact checking.

Plus, I was too tired to debate as I was up since 4 and was babysitting. Take care!

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 12:50 PM

12. Between this and Joe's pledge yesterday to ban all assault weapons, yeah.

They've made it harder for Joe to win the swing states.

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Response to PTWB (Reply #12)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 12:59 PM

21. Yawn. The sky is falling. Whatever.

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Response to stopbush (Reply #21)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 01:05 PM

26. No one is saying the sky is falling. Except you, maybe.

But I wonder, are you saying you're incapable of seeing the difference between motivated and unmotivated voters?

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Response to PTWB (Reply #26)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 03:21 PM

67. I'd call this saying the sky is falling:

Did the NY ATTY Gen Just turn out millions of votes for Trump?

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Response to Ms. Toad (Reply #67)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 03:29 PM

69. Millions is likely an exaggeration.

But I donít think anyone could honestly argue that 1. this will not motivate pro-gun voters and 2. the margins in 2016 were so thin that a small change would have swung the election.

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Response to PTWB (Reply #69)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 03:41 PM

71. Can you provide an objective analysis

in regards to a civil lawsuit against a PAC which supports your allegation?

Bear in mind, the corollary is also true... this will (just as likely) motivate those who perceive the NRA as simply another corrupt PAC to vote as well.

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Response to LanternWaste (Reply #71)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 04:06 PM

72. I'm not sure...

that the type of person who may still consider voting for Trump is partial to objective analysis.

They'll hear that a Democrat in NY wants to disband the NRA and Joe Biden says he's going to take our guns, and they'll vote. All I'm saying is we need to be careful with wedge issues like this.

Look at 1994!

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Response to PTWB (Reply #69)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 04:17 PM

73. I was responding to your assertion that no one said the sky was falling

by quoting the OP, who - in essence - said the ky was falling.

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 12:51 PM

13. You think millions of NRA members WANTED to be defrauded?

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 12:52 PM

14. If this changed the odds of the election, we didnt have much going for us to begin with,

So, I hope to god it didn't.

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 12:52 PM

15. Gun-humpers have always voted. All the 66% who aren't into gunz, need to as well. Think this helps.

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #15)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 01:08 PM

29. Technically this is about fraud and corruption committed by the NRA, not on gun control

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Response to still_one (Reply #29)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 01:13 PM

33. Well, the NRA is not going to be spending big promoting trump, etc., even though their PAC is

supposedly separate.

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 12:53 PM

16. Sometimes it's just about the rule of law n/t

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 12:54 PM

17. After explaining some of the details of the NRA's big boys spending their members' contributions...

I rather doubt any members would be swayed by the law coming after these clowns and run with open arms to Trump.

Truth be known, Trump's hands probably have some NRA grime on them, as well. He doesn't kiss up to anyone unless there are dollars involved. I would imagine his two sons also benefitted.

I would guess there are a lot of "cancel my membership" letters going out, today.

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 12:57 PM

19. If so then they were already offended by the forced dissolution of Trump's charity and university.

These NRA guys were too crooked even for Oliver North. Buttina and the Russians arenít even mentioned.

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 12:57 PM

20. No

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 01:04 PM

25. Huh?

How?

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 01:06 PM

27. Who does the AG of NY speak for? New York

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 01:09 PM

30. I do think it may have hurt here in MN.

There are a lot of sportsman and gun owners here in northern MN that are also moderates and democrats. Just like there were a lot of union iron rangers here that went for trump last time I can see some that will get scared off by the threat of losing their guns. It doesn't matter that NYAG's announcement isn't about that. That's what it will be made out to be.

I do see this as a bit of a problem. If there isn't more tied to this story and it doesn't come to light sooner rather than later I can see this having an adverse effect on us. To what degree I am not sure.

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Response to SlogginThroughIt (Reply #30)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 01:45 PM

46. Agree. Story's the same here in WI.

Lots of gun enthusiasts who werenít Trump enthusiasts who might vote instead of staying home if they believe thereís a threat to their gunz.

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 01:12 PM

31. Do you think they were going to all stay home?

If anything she may have turned out millions who hope she succeeds.

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 01:13 PM

32. if you vote for a racist pig you are a racist pig !

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 01:15 PM

34. By Nov 3rd, I wouldn't be shocked if Death Count Donnie quits or loses all 50 states!

Meanwhile this crap about NRA/NYAG?

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 01:15 PM

35. No, hardcore NRA supporters were already turning out. NT

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 01:20 PM

36. NRA types were already going to vote for Trump

 

He gains nothing

On the other hand, many NRA members would be furious at the shenanigans of the NRA leadership.

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 01:21 PM

37. the people this would energize for trump were already energized for trump

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 01:23 PM

38. Conservatives are paralyzed in cognitive dissonance

On one hand they love their anti-liberal NRA and the so-called freedoms it claims.
On the other hand, they don't particularly like being ripped off by a bunch of crooks
stuffing their pockets and living high on their membership fees.

Oh, the dilemma facing their poor little minds.

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 01:23 PM

39. You mean by giving trump an ad that liberals are trying to shut down the nra? (and take their guns)

Yes, I thought about that too. But I'm to the point where nothing matters anywhoo, so why the F not go after the death merchants. If they steal it, they steal it... and we'll have to take it back by force.

But yes, they did give trump a low hanging fruit.

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 01:29 PM

40. What? That makes no sense at all.

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 01:40 PM

43. You can always count on some dem to do this . Something good happens

Then someone posts oh this good thing could be very bad .... oooo im so worried that this good thing will turn and bit us . Im troubled by this good thing cause it could be very bad ...

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 01:41 PM

44. You can always count on some dem to do this . Something good happens

Then someone posts oh this good thing could be very bad .... oooo im so worried that this good thing will turn and bit us . Im troubled by this good thing cause it could be very bad ...

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 01:47 PM

47. You mean millions of NRA supporters were planning on sitting out this election or voting for Biden?

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 01:50 PM

48. Anyone motivated by this was already a Trumpster. NT

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 01:51 PM

49. Have You Done Numbers To Support This Concern?

Just quick mental math suggests that anybody upset over a DA enforcing the law, because the target is the NRA was unlikely to vote D in the first place.
It's at most 5% (very generous). Likely closer to 2%.
2-5% of a double digit lead is still a commanding lead.
So, unless you've got numbers to back up this alert, then no; it won't matter.

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 01:53 PM

50. Get lost. You guys are working hard here lately but it's time get back to your bridge.

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 01:58 PM

51. No

There are not that many members of the NRA

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 01:59 PM

52. Millions? No

A couple tens of thousands maybe.

It does complete a trifecta of PR gold if the GOP has someone smart enough to put it effectively into an ad.

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 02:13 PM

53. your concern is noted

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 02:15 PM

54. thank you for your concern

 

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 02:16 PM

55. Probably cost us 3-4 Senate seats. Montana, AZ, Georgia


To bring this up 90 days before election is political malpractice.

January would have been perfect.

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Response to grantcart (Reply #55)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 03:16 PM

64. For some it is never the right time to act.

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Response to grantcart (Reply #55)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 04:47 PM

74. LOL

 

Mark Kelly is the biggest gun control candidate running and heís crushing the Rethug incumbent in all the polls.

Try again.

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Response to RhodeIslandOne (Reply #74)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 07:29 PM

83. Yes and he has successfully kept gun control and 2nd amendment out

Of the main discussion.

I can assure you from first hand contacts that the Kelly campaign is not happy with this.

Kelly is so strong a candidate and McSally so bad that he is likely to uout distance her.

Far from being the "biggest gun control" candidate he had a very nuanced message and when he talks about it says, "as a son of two police officers and a proud gun owner I value the right to bear arms BUT . . ."

The most liberal Protestant Church Congregation I know of (shelters migrants etc) has a gun club.

He has a 10 point lead now, we will see what happens in the nextc6 weeks, I expect it to get very close.

Talked with my niece in Missoula and they are much less hopeful. Today about asking a win there.

This action could have happened in Jan, no smart strategic reason go do it now.

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Response to grantcart (Reply #83)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 07:55 PM

84. It's sad that this many people are so concerned about con artists be prosecuted.

 

One of my best friends is a hunting legislative advocate who won't even mention the NRA anymore.

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 02:23 PM

59. This and Biden's promised "assault weapon" ban will increase GOP turnout

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 03:15 PM

63. There are approximately 0 nra voters for Biden.

But I empathize with your concern. Best not to do anything to stop the fascists.

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 03:18 PM

65. I say YES. Thousands of absolutely critical voters in the battleground states are going to hear

"THEY'RE TAKING OUR GUNS" nonstop every minute of every day until November 3rd now.
It doesn't have to be MILLIONS of votes, just enough fearful people to swing the electoral college again.

Shooting ourselves in the foot.
Pun intended.

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Response to BamaRefugee (Reply #65)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 04:52 PM

75. You mean like every election since 2000?

 

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Response to RhodeIslandOne (Reply #75)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 05:50 PM

82. Since before that! I cast my first vote in 1970!

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 03:19 PM

66. Your concern is noted. "Welcome" to DU.

Sheesh.

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 05:14 PM

78. trump, even in the extremely slim chance he has of winning,

could not stop the actions of the NY AG. Of course, trump supporters probably don't know that.

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 05:42 PM

79. My husband has been an NRA member for a long time.

But we are registered democrats and would never think of voting for a republican. So they're not all crazy white supremacists.

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 05:45 PM

80. Her job is to enforce the law. Not be a political operative like Barr.

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 05:49 PM

81. No. She is however, applying the rule of law.

Increasing the likelihood that a fraudulent PAC will be denied its ability to scam more people out of money.

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 08:48 PM

85. FFS...

No.



Sid

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Response to Edwcraig (Original post)

Thu Aug 6, 2020, 08:56 PM

86. it's possible

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