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Sun Aug 9, 2020, 08:56 AM

Payroll Tax Cut Most horrifying decision ever

Worse than Bush tax cuts. Worse than McConnell tax cuts.

Iím an employer. It hurts twice a month to pay payroll taxes. It hurts even more to defund Social Security.

Iím absolutely sick to my stomach.

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Arrow 68 replies Author Time Post
Reply Payroll Tax Cut Most horrifying decision ever (Original post)
MaryMagdaline Aug 2020 OP
SheltieLover Aug 2020 #1
MaryMagdaline Aug 2020 #3
SheltieLover Aug 2020 #7
not fooled Aug 2020 #35
SheltieLover Aug 2020 #49
BKDem Aug 2020 #2
MaryMagdaline Aug 2020 #4
SheltieLover Aug 2020 #8
True Blue American Aug 2020 #40
Iliyah Aug 2020 #5
MaryMagdaline Aug 2020 #6
SheltieLover Aug 2020 #9
MaryMagdaline Aug 2020 #27
DownriverDem Aug 2020 #41
SheltieLover Aug 2020 #53
SheltieLover Aug 2020 #51
mucifer Aug 2020 #10
MaryMagdaline Aug 2020 #11
Squinch Aug 2020 #12
MaryMagdaline Aug 2020 #13
LisaL Aug 2020 #18
MaryMagdaline Aug 2020 #23
yellowdogintexas Aug 2020 #34
MaryMagdaline Aug 2020 #37
Ms. Toad Aug 2020 #52
not fooled Aug 2020 #59
Ms. Toad Aug 2020 #60
MaryMagdaline Aug 2020 #65
LiberalArkie Aug 2020 #20
MaryMagdaline Aug 2020 #24
whopis01 Aug 2020 #63
CousinIT Aug 2020 #67
fescuerescue Aug 2020 #19
Squinch Aug 2020 #56
CaptainTruth Aug 2020 #14
MaryMagdaline Aug 2020 #30
duforsure Aug 2020 #15
MaryMagdaline Aug 2020 #31
gordianot Aug 2020 #16
MrModerate Aug 2020 #17
Scarsdale Aug 2020 #21
MaryMagdaline Aug 2020 #25
yellowdogintexas Aug 2020 #36
Scarsdale Aug 2020 #46
Hoyt Aug 2020 #22
Lonestarblue Aug 2020 #26
MaryMagdaline Aug 2020 #28
durablend Aug 2020 #33
shanti Aug 2020 #68
Fla Dem Aug 2020 #29
MaryMagdaline Aug 2020 #32
Fla Dem Aug 2020 #66
SiliconValley_Dem Aug 2020 #38
Tommymac Aug 2020 #39
True Blue American Aug 2020 #42
AllaN01Bear Aug 2020 #43
MaryMagdaline Aug 2020 #61
roamer65 Aug 2020 #44
MaryMagdaline Aug 2020 #50
roamer65 Aug 2020 #45
MaryMagdaline Aug 2020 #47
MaryMagdaline Aug 2020 #48
Big Blue Marble Aug 2020 #54
MaryMagdaline Aug 2020 #55
Baked Potato Aug 2020 #57
MaryMagdaline Aug 2020 #58
ecstatic Aug 2020 #62
MaryMagdaline Aug 2020 #64

Response to MaryMagdaline (Original post)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 08:58 AM

1. Yup

Repukes have that effect on rational people.

I sure hope Dems challenge this! And I hope & trust Joe will campaign against this. He has already spoken out against gutting SS & Medicare. I hope he continues to address this!

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Response to SheltieLover (Reply #1)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 09:07 AM

3. Yes. Biden camp needs to jump on this with Trump Defunds

Social Security ads

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Response to MaryMagdaline (Reply #3)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 09:14 AM

7. Absolutely!

Beat it like a drum!

Of course, repuke seniors will think it's a good idea because, you know, services grow on trees & taxes are bad.

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Response to SheltieLover (Reply #7)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 10:59 AM

35. And they earned it

and they deserve it, so their beloved pukes will never make cuts that hurt THEM, only those other, undeserving people.



How dumb can these people be? Dumb enough to not realize that the same people who decades ago started cutting programs that helped poor people are now coming for programs that help the middle class.


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Response to not fooled (Reply #35)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 11:53 AM

49. Right!

All the while lining their own pockets with funds from cut programs! 🤬

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Response to MaryMagdaline (Original post)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 09:00 AM

2. Republicans have been working toward this for 85 years.

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Response to BKDem (Reply #2)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 09:07 AM

4. Yes they have. They finally got a president evil enough and stupid enough to do it

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Response to BKDem (Reply #2)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 09:15 AM

8. They sure have!

🤬

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Response to BKDem (Reply #2)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 11:29 AM

40. They fought FDR

When Social Security was enacted. He said he welcomed their hate!

Let us see Mitch and Lindsey embrace this. Ben Sasse has already called the EOís slop!

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Response to MaryMagdaline (Original post)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 09:09 AM

5. On live TV shithole told the world that he will . . . .

rid SS taxes if re-elected . Ö.

In other words, he will dismantle SS, Medicare and Medicaid (Medi-Cal).

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Response to Iliyah (Reply #5)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 09:11 AM

6. Unbelievable

Age warfare

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Response to MaryMagdaline (Reply #6)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 09:16 AM

9. And class warfare!

Many seniors live on SS! And depend on Medicare!

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Response to SheltieLover (Reply #9)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 10:34 AM

27. Yes! Social security is all most people have

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Response to MaryMagdaline (Reply #27)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 11:29 AM

41. Sadly yes

40% of Seniors rely solely on Social Security to survive.

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Response to DownriverDem (Reply #41)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 11:55 AM

53. Sure do!

Then all the folks on SSDI, too!

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Response to MaryMagdaline (Reply #27)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 11:54 AM

51. Right!

Very inadequate, but it's something to eek by on.

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Response to MaryMagdaline (Original post)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 09:19 AM

10. How does most of the media respond? "trump acts because congress didn't people will get checks!"

No big social security headlines.

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Response to mucifer (Reply #10)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 09:21 AM

11. Unbelievable

But I keep saying that

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Response to MaryMagdaline (Original post)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 09:26 AM

12. It's not a tax cut. It's a tax postponement. And they'll undoubtedly charge all of us interest.

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Response to Squinch (Reply #12)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 09:43 AM

13. How long is the postponement or do we know?

Iíve been reading all morning and if you have the source handy I would greatly appreciate your giving me a link.

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Response to MaryMagdaline (Reply #13)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 10:15 AM

18. I presume until you go file your taxes.

Instead of a refund you might owe the government. Because Trump's order didn't change the tax laws, only that taxes are temporarily not being paid by you.

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Response to LisaL (Reply #18)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 10:30 AM

23. Got it. Thanks!

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Response to MaryMagdaline (Reply #23)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 10:58 AM

34. It shouldn't make a difference on your Federal tax return because

those taxes are not deductible if you itemize. What it will do is at a minimum stunt the growth of the SocSec fund and then the fund will run out. Current beneficiaries will see their monthly payment reduced over time and eventually there will be no money.

I suspect all hell is going to break loose over this, and all these people who are doing those great videos will tear up jack

He is really cutting off his nose to spite his face because it should cause him to lose the elder vote.

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Response to yellowdogintexas (Reply #34)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 11:09 AM

37. Yes. In a normal world this would be the death knell to anyone's campaign

Last edited Sun Aug 9, 2020, 11:54 AM - Edit history (1)

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Response to yellowdogintexas (Reply #34)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 11:55 AM

52. It actually may.

Payroll taxes are functionally just like income taxes, but most people don't realize that, since the withholding is an exact match for the tax due.

Those who might recognise it are the self-employed, or tipped employees.

You owe a fixed percent of your income in FICA taxes. Your router withhold it. It matches. No reconciliation required at the end of the year.

The directive to stop withholding throws that out of whack. You still owe the taxes -the only thing that changes is that your employer didn't collect them as you owed them (and didn't pay them to the government), So come tax time, you will still owe the taxes - and will likely have to write a a 6.2% check to the IRS to pay back that extra money that was in your paycheck from Sept through December.

Trump is using this threat of a significant tax liability to coerce voters to re-elect him. If I'm elected, week make this permanent (i.e. You'll never have to pay these taxes back . . . But if you don't, Biden won't rescue you, and you get a huge tax bill.)

Biden should probably pledge to create a refundable tax credit in the amount of any taxes not withheld by this obscene move. Taxes would be owed, the credit would cover them, the credit would come from the general treasury (ensuring this stunt did not harm social security.). It would, in effect be another stimulus bill. For now, trumps order means you get another small chunk of money in each paycheck -those taxes you owe, but which are not being paid as you go. A retroactive credit means you aren't hurt by it (i.e. Never have to take $ out of your pocket to pay those taxes.)

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Response to Ms. Toad (Reply #52)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 02:15 PM

59. Although be careful about funding Social Security out of the General Fund

because that's a lot easier to play games with and cut than if the funds go directly to Social Security.

Al Gore had it right with the lockbox. Of course many 'Muricans laughed at him at the time.


pukes are talented at hiding their tracks and playing the shell game so people don't realize what they are up to.

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Response to not fooled (Reply #59)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 02:44 PM

60. This would be solely for the period from September through December.

Most people don't understand how FICA taxes work, and will spend the extra money in their paychecks for the next 3 months - not realizing that they will need to reconcile them on tax day. Those people will be hurt by Trump's gambit.

AND - what I'm talking about funding is not social security, but a tax credit to hold taxpayers harmless for Trump's campaign stunt.
's

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Response to Ms. Toad (Reply #60)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 06:10 PM

65. Yes. Evil and stupid scheme

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Response to MaryMagdaline (Reply #13)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 10:19 AM

20. From what I have read it comes due Jan 1 2021. Payable on April 15, 2021

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Response to LiberalArkie (Reply #20)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 10:30 AM

24. Thank you!

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Response to MaryMagdaline (Reply #13)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 05:29 PM

63. Through the end of the year.

Here is the actual order:

https://www.whitehouse.gov/presidential-actions/memorandum-deferring-payroll-tax-obligations-light-ongoing-covid-19-disaster/

It defers until the end of the year. Presumably it is all due back then.

However, Trump has stated that if re-elected he would make it permanent.

Essentially this is an artificial way of created a large tax bill for most people in January that can only be fixed by re electing Trump.

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Response to whopis01 (Reply #63)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 10:31 PM

67. Biden will not force people to pay it. He'll make soc security whole by taking money

from General. In fact that's what he and Obama did in 2009.

But THEY can be trusted to do that. Even though yea, it's not good to have social security money coming out of the Gen Fund - because it's easier to meddle with and cut.

TRUMP has said he'd permanently keep the cuts ie: DEFUND SOCIAL SECURITY ENTIRELY.

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Response to Squinch (Reply #12)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 10:17 AM

19. So you are saying that we have to pay it all back in a few months?

What kind of crap is that.

We all get personal loans now? whether we want them or not.

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Response to fescuerescue (Reply #19)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 01:11 PM

56. Yep. Exactly.

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Response to MaryMagdaline (Original post)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 09:58 AM

14. It's not a tax cut, Trump can't do that, it's a deferred payment.

It's like our income tax payment (the due date) was deferred from April 15 to July 15. The tax is still due, & it's the same amount, the due date has just been delayed. I saw one media source say it would be due "at the end of the year."

Edit to add: This assumes Congress does nothing. Congress could cut it, or extend the deferment, but only Congress can cut it.

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Response to CaptainTruth (Reply #14)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 10:39 AM

30. Thank you! Another scam

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Response to MaryMagdaline (Original post)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 10:10 AM

15. Trump just lost Florida

Unless he knows the fix is in no matter the vote counts.

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Response to duforsure (Reply #15)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 10:40 AM

31. I can only hope

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Response to MaryMagdaline (Original post)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 10:12 AM

16. This is a typical mob tactic.

We will give you a little more time but know your life belongs to us.

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Response to MaryMagdaline (Original post)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 10:14 AM

17. The EOs themselves...

Will immediately be mired in the courts, and Congress will hammer something out on Coronavirus relief in a few days. The EOs will eventually dissipate like other Trumpian brain farts and will be formally cancelled early in the Biden Administration.

This is me putting my Nostradamus hat on, of course.

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Response to MaryMagdaline (Original post)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 10:21 AM

21. McConnell was installed in office,

and is kept there just for the purpose of destroying all entitlement programs. It has been his mission for years. He doesn't need them since he has lined his pockets for years from wealthy donors who want this, too. Until all the traitors in the gop are thrown out of their cushy positions, we will not make any progress toward universal healthcare, either. McConnell is just as much a fan of Russia as tRump is. He is partnered with a Russian oligarch in an aluminum plant in Kentucky. He is a traitor who needs to GO, along with his wife who is just as corrupt as Moscow Mitch.

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Response to Scarsdale (Reply #21)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 10:33 AM

25. And he finally got the Fox News brainwashed elderly he needs

to pull it off

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Response to Scarsdale (Reply #21)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 11:00 AM

36. how ironic is it that probably 50 to 60 percent of KY voters depend heavily

on these social support programs. Three of the poorest counties in the nation are in KY

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Response to yellowdogintexas (Reply #36)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 11:49 AM

46. I remember a few years ago

during the oxycontin epidemic, watching a TV program. They showed a poor town in Kentucky that had low employment, and many addicts. Republican reps. were bribing people to vote gop, by handing them pills. It was wide open bribery, yet nothing was done to stop it. Mitch has people brainwashed into thinking HE will save the poor. He is as big a con artists as tRump, no doubt about that. Vile excuse for a human being. Democratic reps. need to travel the backroads in these states that insist on keeping traitors in power, and inform them what is REALLY going on. I would wager that very few of these people even know Social Security and Medicare are on the chopping block.

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Response to MaryMagdaline (Original post)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 10:24 AM

22. Kudlow said this morning that it will have to be paid back unless trump steps in.

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Response to MaryMagdaline (Original post)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 10:33 AM

26. I'm no longer sure the country will even last until January 2021.

Trump is moving at a faster pace to dismantle everything he can touch. The virus is out of control with no end in sight, and with schools starting across the country, infections will start spreading even faster.

Riots in Portland are giving Trump an excuse to return his secret police if he chooses. Oregon also seems out of control, or if it isnít the media is portraying it that way.

Trump is doing his best to destroy the postal service to prevent mailed ballots. And who can stop him? It seems no one. We no longer have an Attorney General working for usówe have a corrupt one working against us. Congressional hearings are good, but whereís the power to remove DeJoy?

And now Trump has usurped Congressís Constitutional role as the body with sole authority for taxing and spending. The Republican Supreme Court already gave him the green light for bypassing Congress when it allowed him to use defense money when Congress refused to allocate more money for his wall. Trump set up failure in Congress by sending Mark Meadows to Congressional negotiations to ensure that they would blow up, and he was successful. Democrats may be able to file suit to stop Trumpís usurpation, but how long will that take? Meanwhile SS and Medicare funds are being robbed.

Trump and his team are looking at the same polls we are. And states like Florida, Texas, and Georgia where Biden is either ahead or close are run by Republican governors. Iím sure the Trump campaign is working with Republican governors to do everything they can to prevent minorities, seniors, and any other bloc that favors Biden from voting. Does anyone really believe that DeSantis will do nothing to prevent Biden being elected?

Sorry, but my pessimism has taken over this morning because I think we will have nothing but chaos until the vote in November. Having to stay at home 98% of the time and being unable to see friends and relatives is definitely getting to me!

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Response to Lonestarblue (Reply #26)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 10:38 AM

28. No need to apologize. You've eloquently and logically described stark reality

Post Office and Social Security, the sacredness of the vote. Itís all on the line.

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Response to Lonestarblue (Reply #26)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 10:49 AM

33. I'm afraid of the time *after* elections

If he wins he just finishes everything off. "You voted for me suckers! Too bad so sad! No backsies!"

If he loses he just finishes everything off. "This is what happens when people vote for Democrats! Find them and KILL THEM ALL!"

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Response to durablend (Reply #33)

Mon Aug 10, 2020, 12:00 AM

68. Sobering thought

You're probably right. I can see it getting VERY ugly, people with nothing to lose. I just try to take it one day at a time. Trashy reality shows help.

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Response to MaryMagdaline (Original post)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 10:39 AM

29. Death by a thousand cuts. The only upside is this may be the final cut to end of Trump

Essentially eliminating funding for Social Security and Medicare. Senior citizens will not respond well to this. Any that are still in his cult, may finally see the error of their ways.

I do not see the rational to this. Surely some of his advisers told him this would not be viewed favorably by his followers.

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Response to Fla Dem (Reply #29)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 10:41 AM

32. Hoping this wakes up the elderly. I'm 61 and awake all night

Also a Florida Dem. Broward County

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Response to MaryMagdaline (Reply #32)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 09:12 PM

66. St Johns here.

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Response to MaryMagdaline (Original post)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 11:17 AM

38. its not a tax cut

 

and because thats the case, businesses will likely continue withholding payroll taxes as per mormal

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Response to MaryMagdaline (Original post)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 11:28 AM

39. So we all get a SSA balloon payment taken out of Our paychecks on Jan 1 2021....

This little fact needs to be spread far and wide on the Internets...Lincoln Project where are you?

Hell, Democratic Party WHERE ARE YOU?

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Response to Tommymac (Reply #39)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 11:32 AM

42. Just like we had to repay Bush's

Wunnerful $300 check on April 15TH!

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Response to MaryMagdaline (Original post)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 11:42 AM

43. i live in a 40 unit lo income /seinior/ disabled apartment complex,

there are a # of his supporters living here . they always feel immune to things like this , boy are they in for a shock and so am i. if the thing wins illeagly again in nov, we all need to hit the streets .

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Response to AllaN01Bear (Reply #43)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 03:38 PM

61. Hopefully they will get it

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Response to MaryMagdaline (Original post)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 11:44 AM

44. You had better get a tax attorney.

The IRS is the last thing in the world you want on your back.

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Response to roamer65 (Reply #44)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 11:53 AM

50. Yes.

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Response to MaryMagdaline (Original post)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 11:48 AM

45. My advice to employers.

Continue deductions from paychecks and if the government refuses the payments, put them in escrow until sanity returns.

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Response to roamer65 (Reply #45)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 11:53 AM

47. Just texted my two partners. We are in agreement to pay no matter what

Have to give ADP a heads up to ignore this EO if possible

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Response to roamer65 (Reply #45)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 11:53 AM

48. Agreed

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Response to MaryMagdaline (Original post)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 12:38 PM

54. Schumer said this morning most employers

will continue to withhold and pay the payroll tax so they will not owe it later.
Spread the word this is just another Trump scam.

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Response to Big Blue Marble (Reply #54)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 12:39 PM

55. Great idea!

Just texted partners. We will ignore EO and pay.

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Response to MaryMagdaline (Original post)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 01:36 PM

57. So, they can make it all become due on Joe's watch.

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Response to Baked Potato (Reply #57)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 01:53 PM

58. Yep. Poison pill for next administration

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Response to MaryMagdaline (Original post)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 04:15 PM

62. Also, it will appear as though Biden and Democrats raised taxes

dramatically when the money has to be paid back. Millions will owe taxes. What a nightmare!

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Response to ecstatic (Reply #62)

Sun Aug 9, 2020, 06:08 PM

64. Agreed. This seems to be their plan

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