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Gothmog

(145,475 posts)
Thu Aug 20, 2020, 02:45 PM Aug 2020

TRUMP COMES UP EMPTY WHEN PRESSED FOR EVIDENCE OF ELECTION FRAUD IN COURT

In both the the Texas voter id and the Kobach proof of citizenship needed to register to vote the cases, the GOP could provide no evidence of voter fraud in the real world. In the Penn , trump is suing to block vote by mail and the court asked for proof of voter fraud. Guess what happen




PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMP’S campaign, ordered by a federal court judge in Pennsylvania to back up its claims of fraud in the state’s vote-by-mail system, has documented only a handful of cases of election fraud in recent years — none of which involved mail-in ballots. The revelation, which came in the form of a partially redacted 524-page document produced by the Trump campaign last week, undermines the claim by Trump team operatives that mail-in ballot fraud is a grave risk to Pennsylvania voters.

The campaign is suing Pennsylvania Secretary of the Commonwealth Kathy Boockvar and each of the state’s county election boards to prevent election administrators from providing secure drop boxes for mail-in ballot returns. These drop boxes allow voters to return their mail-in ballots by hand, without sending them through the postal system and risking delays. The Trump campaign alleges that the practice “provides fraudsters an easy opportunity to engage in ballot harvesting, manipulate or destroy ballots, manufacture duplicitous votes, and sow chaos.”

In a motion last week, Citizens for Pennsylvania’s Future and the Sierra Club called on the Trump campaign to provide evidence of the existence of voter fraud, arguing that the campaign’s lawsuit was “replete with salacious allegations and dire warnings” about Pennsylvania’s elections and that they “must either be compelled to provide discovery concerning their fraud-based allegations or be precluded from pursuing these claims going forward.” Judge J. Nicholas Ranjan granted the motion, ordering the campaign to “produce such evidence in their possession, and if they have none, state as much.”

The response provided by the Trump campaign to the opposing counsel, which was shared with The Intercept and Type Investigations, contains a few scant examples of election fraud — but none of the instances in the 524-page discovery document involved mail-in ballots.

“Not only did the campaign fail to provide evidence that voter fraud was a widespread problem in Pennsylvania, they failed to provide any evidence that any misconduct occurred in the primary election or that so-called voter fraud is any sort of regular problem in Pennsylvania,” said Suzanne Almeida, interim director of Common Cause PA, one of the parties in the lawsuit. The Trump campaign did not immediately respond to a request for comment for this story.
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TRUMP COMES UP EMPTY WHEN PRESSED FOR EVIDENCE OF ELECTION FRAUD IN COURT (Original Post) Gothmog Aug 2020 OP
Shocked! Brainfodder Aug 2020 #1
Once again, little Donny comes up short Blue Owl Aug 2020 #2
🤣🤣🤣 SheltieLover Aug 2020 #8
"she said.............." MyOwnPeace Aug 2020 #13
Donnie comes up short rumleyfips Aug 2020 #28
Little hands; little whatever MoonRiver Aug 2020 #52
i know one case of mail-in fraud: donnie voted by mail from florida unblock Aug 2020 #3
This!👆 SheltieLover Aug 2020 #9
so trump gave them 524-pages of bullshit spanone Aug 2020 #4
The judge is unlikely to be dazzled by Trump's brilliance gratuitous Aug 2020 #7
"The judge is unlikely to be dazzled by Trump's brilliance" MyOwnPeace Aug 2020 #14
Right When a Party Presents "No Evidence" on an Essential Issue a Judge is Left with No Discretion Stallion Aug 2020 #22
you want evidence? all trump has to do is get limbaugh into court to confirm to the judge certainot Aug 2020 #36
OBJECTION: Hearsay Plus Limpballs Can't Qualify as an Expert on Election Ballots Stallion Aug 2020 #37
hearsay! 1500 radio stations reaching 50 mil/wk are proof it's not hearsay!!!!! and how can anyone certainot Aug 2020 #43
Trump is a vertual louzke9 Aug 2020 #46
K&R spanone Aug 2020 #5
One of the Greatest Scam Arguments Every Perpetuated on the American People Stallion Aug 2020 #6
Every case of voter fraud I've ever heard of, has been committed by Reptilicans. lagomorph777 Aug 2020 #10
I remember a handful from 2016 NewJeffCT Aug 2020 #12
Fifty Million Anecdotal Accounts of Mail-In Voter Fraud on Right Wing Forums Lonesome Beet Aug 2020 #11
Yeah, and most of them admitting that they engage in it. Mariana Aug 2020 #16
"I heard" is not evidence. louis-t Aug 2020 #39
BUT.... louzke9 Aug 2020 #47
Not just "people" but "some people"... Wounded Bear Aug 2020 #53
Thank you, Goth! Rt. Cha Aug 2020 #15
You know that I have been following this and other cases Gothmog Aug 2020 #20
Yes, I like that.. it's important. TY! Cha Aug 2020 #21
They refuse to understand that "Many people are saying..." is not evidence. Marcuse Aug 2020 #17
Courts did not accept this in either Texas voter id or the Kobach voter registration cases Gothmog Aug 2020 #19
In FOXworld, an accusation rises to the level of proof when a Democrat is targeted Mr. Ected Aug 2020 #18
They really don't. give shot if it is true scarytomcat Aug 2020 #34
The intercept? progressoid Aug 2020 #23
Trump campaign fails to show evidence of vote-by-mail fraud, filing reveals Gothmog Aug 2020 #51
Anyone surprised? Once again the little toad stool comes up short! George II Aug 2020 #24
The purpose is to delay and besmirch, not to win. They don't care if they look like clowns. maxsolomon Aug 2020 #25
524 pages of BS. nt iluvtennis Aug 2020 #26
Isn't that something? SergeStorms Aug 2020 #33
Exactly spot on. nt iluvtennis Aug 2020 #41
524 pages is some championship level gaslighting... Wounded Bear Aug 2020 #54
The courts should have made the trump campaign pay all of the legal costs of both the defendant's SWBTATTReg Aug 2020 #27
Can anyone cite examples of ELECTION THEFT!? StClone Aug 2020 #29
It was TrumpSpeak ... the "grave threat" was not to the elections, it was to ... Trump bucolic_frolic Aug 2020 #30
This should be a major national news story n/t malaise Aug 2020 #31
The real voter fraud and interference... SergeStorms Aug 2020 #32
We in PA have only had "no excuse" vote by mail for the very first time this past primary election BumRushDaShow Aug 2020 #35
Thanks for the legal stuff Gothmog. panader0 Aug 2020 #38
He has no legal basis for this claim Gothmog Aug 2020 #42
K&R Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin Aug 2020 #40
It's like when some bot or idiot troll makes some ridiculous claim and then Grokenstein Aug 2020 #44
Cheating is so... Republican elias7 Aug 2020 #45
The GOP is the party of voter suppression Gothmog Aug 2020 #49
Trump Campaign Fails To Produce Evidence Of Voter Fraud In PA Lawsuit Gothmog Aug 2020 #48
LOL at ya POS! MoonRiver Aug 2020 #50
The Plaintiffs have the burden of proof treestar Aug 2020 #55
BREAKING: Federal judge HALTS Trump/RNC lawsuit seeking to block drop boxes in Pennsylvania. Gothmog Aug 2020 #56

unblock

(52,285 posts)
3. i know one case of mail-in fraud: donnie voted by mail from florida
Thu Aug 20, 2020, 02:48 PM
Aug 2020

and has claimed to be a new york resident and agreed that mar-a-lago isn't a residence.

gratuitous

(82,849 posts)
7. The judge is unlikely to be dazzled by Trump's brilliance
Thu Aug 20, 2020, 02:54 PM
Aug 2020

And is equally unlikely to be baffled by his bullshit. If there is a hearing, I expect a choice addition to the legal world's compendium of judge's colloquies wherein an attorney is forcibly pantsed on the record.

MyOwnPeace

(16,937 posts)
14. "The judge is unlikely to be dazzled by Trump's brilliance"
Thu Aug 20, 2020, 03:18 PM
Aug 2020

That's probably because Trump wasn't in the courtroom and couldn't impress the judge with his incredibly YUGE brain!

Stallion

(6,476 posts)
22. Right When a Party Presents "No Evidence" on an Essential Issue a Judge is Left with No Discretion
Thu Aug 20, 2020, 03:43 PM
Aug 2020

the Court must deny the Trump administration's case

 

certainot

(9,090 posts)
36. you want evidence? all trump has to do is get limbaugh into court to confirm to the judge
Thu Aug 20, 2020, 06:53 PM
Aug 2020

millions of people vote illegally for democrats all the time

 

certainot

(9,090 posts)
43. hearsay! 1500 radio stations reaching 50 mil/wk are proof it's not hearsay!!!!! and how can anyone
Thu Aug 20, 2020, 11:39 PM
Aug 2020

dispute what he says! for thirty years he has been 99.9% correct on everything, as he claims, and only a handful have ever gotten through the call screeners to challenge him before getting cut off!

Stallion

(6,476 posts)
6. One of the Greatest Scam Arguments Every Perpetuated on the American People
Thu Aug 20, 2020, 02:52 PM
Aug 2020

goes back generations including a lawsuit during which the Bush administration couldn't come up with more than a handful of cases over a 5 year investigation

NewJeffCT

(56,828 posts)
12. I remember a handful from 2016
Thu Aug 20, 2020, 03:13 PM
Aug 2020

of Trump voters getting caught and using the excuse of "testing the system"

 

Lonesome Beet

(43 posts)
11. Fifty Million Anecdotal Accounts of Mail-In Voter Fraud on Right Wing Forums
Thu Aug 20, 2020, 03:00 PM
Aug 2020

doesn't count as "evidence"?! What's this world coming to?

Mariana

(14,860 posts)
16. Yeah, and most of them admitting that they engage in it.
Thu Aug 20, 2020, 03:22 PM
Aug 2020

I can't tell you how many times I've read some variation of: "I moved to [blue state], but I still vote in [swing state] where it can make a difference." Including Trump himself, who recently posted publicly that he lives in New York, even though he has requested absentee ballots from Florida.

louis-t

(23,296 posts)
39. "I heard" is not evidence.
Thu Aug 20, 2020, 07:21 PM
Aug 2020

There was a now deceased right wing asshole on radio here 25 years ago. A caller to his show said "I heard" then went on to describe how there was only one survivor of the plane crash that killed Ron Brown. It was a "stewardess" and a black helicopter landed at the crash site and picked her up but when the black helicopter landed, she was dead. The radio host ended the segment saying "There's your evidence, folks." There's your evidence.

Wounded Bear

(58,682 posts)
53. Not just "people" but "some people"...
Fri Aug 21, 2020, 06:49 PM
Aug 2020

you know that "some people" is a lot stronger argument than just "people" say.

Gothmog

(145,475 posts)
19. Courts did not accept this in either Texas voter id or the Kobach voter registration cases
Thu Aug 20, 2020, 03:34 PM
Aug 2020

It is amusing to see these idiots try this crap and fail

Mr. Ected

(9,670 posts)
18. In FOXworld, an accusation rises to the level of proof when a Democrat is targeted
Thu Aug 20, 2020, 03:32 PM
Aug 2020

"It has to be real, sounds just like those libtards"

You'd think FOR ONCE there'd be a few MAGATs that noticed that every accusation they've made has been proven to be a lie, while a whole litany of their own crowd is being arrested and indicted and incarcerated for the crimes WE have accused them of.

Hmmm. There seems to be a pattern here.

progressoid

(49,992 posts)
23. The intercept?
Thu Aug 20, 2020, 03:55 PM
Aug 2020

Isn't that some sort of super lefty liberal progressive outlet founded by that Greenwald feller?

Gothmog

(145,475 posts)
51. Trump campaign fails to show evidence of vote-by-mail fraud, filing reveals
Fri Aug 21, 2020, 06:36 PM
Aug 2020

Other papers are picking up this story https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/aug/21/trump-campaign-voter-fraud-pennsylvania

Donald Trump’s campaign failed to produce any evidence of vote-by-mail fraud in Pennsylvania after a federal judge ordered it do so, according to a 524-page court filing obtained by the Guardian.

The order came from US district judge Nicholas Ranjan, a Trump appointee, earlier this month amid a lawsuit in Pennsylvania over several voting policies. The Trump campaign is suing to block the widespread use of official ballot dropboxes in the state in locations other than an election office, and to allow poll watchers to work in counties other than the ones they live in.

The campaign also wants to block election officials from counting mail-in ballots if a voter forgets to put their mail-in ballot in a secrecy sleeve within the ballot return-envelope. The campaign argued in court that the current practices will lead to voter fraud without these changes.

Ranjan last week ordered the campaign to turn over its evidence of the prevalence of fraud in Pennsylvania, including fraud related to dropboxes and vote by mail. While the Trump campaign cited a handful of mail-in ballot fraud cases in its original complaint, the campaign turned over little evidence of pervasive fraud in its partially redacted response. Certain documents in the filing were designated confidential and withheld from the Guardian.

The campaign also offered no evidence of fraud specifically linked to dropboxes or mail-in ballots. The filing was first reported by Type Investigations. Several studies and investigations have shown that voter fraud is extremely rare.

maxsolomon

(33,358 posts)
25. The purpose is to delay and besmirch, not to win. They don't care if they look like clowns.
Thu Aug 20, 2020, 04:52 PM
Aug 2020

The same as all of his Court machinations - tie it up, appeal as far as they can and back. Use the deliberate pace of the legal system to run out the clock.

SergeStorms

(19,204 posts)
33. Isn't that something?
Thu Aug 20, 2020, 05:54 PM
Aug 2020

They knew going in they didn't have any evidence, but they went ahead with this frivolous lawsuit anyway. That's been Trump's modus operandi his entire life, tying things up in court for years until the plaintiff just gives up. Fucking conman.

Wounded Bear

(58,682 posts)
54. 524 pages is some championship level gaslighting...
Fri Aug 21, 2020, 06:50 PM
Aug 2020


Apparently the judge reads with electric lighting.

SWBTATTReg

(22,156 posts)
27. The courts should have made the trump campaign pay all of the legal costs of both the defendant's
Thu Aug 20, 2020, 05:09 PM
Aug 2020

and the state's court systems in total, as well as pay punitive fees, being that they are quick to blame or accuse of illegal deeds or misadventures, falsely.

bucolic_frolic

(43,249 posts)
30. It was TrumpSpeak ... the "grave threat" was not to the elections, it was to ... Trump
Thu Aug 20, 2020, 05:42 PM
Aug 2020

He might lose. That's what he perceives as a "grave threat".

SergeStorms

(19,204 posts)
32. The real voter fraud and interference...
Thu Aug 20, 2020, 05:48 PM
Aug 2020

has come from Trump and DeJoy in dismantling the U.S. Post Office. This should go to the Supreme Court ASAP. Votes should be counted up to two weeks after the election as long as they're postmarked before November 3. They broke it, so there has to be a fix. Allowing 14 days buffer time would be a suitable fix for something Trump and DeJoy did purposely to alter the results of the election. Since it's already been demonstrated that there is no mail-in voter fraud TrumpCo. and the RNC should be made to accept that decision, or whatever decision the SC came up with. These rotten bastards cannot get away with their voter interference, AGAIN!

BumRushDaShow

(129,297 posts)
35. We in PA have only had "no excuse" vote by mail for the very first time this past primary election
Thu Aug 20, 2020, 05:59 PM
Aug 2020

I was honestly shocked last year when I found out the GOP-controlled state legislature actually passed a law authorizing it and setting it up.

I had participated in multiple "virtual" town halls with my own Dem State Senator for several years before that happened and would always ask him about whether there were ever any election reforms like "early voting" even being considered. I didn't even broach something like vote by mail, since although we did have mail-in absentee ballots, something like that always required a specific set of reasons to qualify (I used to absentee vote when I was in college for example).

But we know their go-to tried and true tactic is always to stall and delay by tying stuff up in court.

panader0

(25,816 posts)
38. Thanks for the legal stuff Gothmog.
Thu Aug 20, 2020, 07:16 PM
Aug 2020

A question--How can trump sue states like Nevada for offering vote by mail?
What legal basis does he have to mess with state laws?

Grokenstein

(5,727 posts)
44. It's like when some bot or idiot troll makes some ridiculous claim and then
Fri Aug 21, 2020, 01:38 AM
Aug 2020

tells you to Google the evidence. Except it's the highest office in the nation covering for its treason.

Gothmog

(145,475 posts)
48. Trump Campaign Fails To Produce Evidence Of Voter Fraud In PA Lawsuit
Fri Aug 21, 2020, 06:26 PM
Aug 2020

trump failed to provide evidence of voter fraud https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/trump-campaign-lawsuit-pennsylvania-voting

In their response, campaign lawyers declined to do so.

“Neither the original Complaint nor the Amended Complaint contains an allegation that ‘ballot harvesting,’ ‘manipulating and destroying ballots,’ double voting, and/or voter fraud from mail-in and absentee ballots actually occurred during the Primary Election,” the lawyers wrote.

“The claims asserted by the plaintiffs do not hinge on evidence of voter fraud actually occurring,” they added. The campaign argued that though it has no proof that fraud of this type has happened, it could — and that’s grounds enough for barring the boxes.

The campaign then loaded the 524-page document with articles about a handful of cases of voter fraud unrelated to mail-in voting or drop boxes.

U.S. District Judge J. Nicholas Ranjan asked the Trump campaign to respond last week after the Sierra Club and Citizens for Pennsylvania’s Future, two intervenor-defendants in the case, argued that the campaign “should not be permitted to raise such spectacular fraud-related claims, particularly in this national climate, and refuse to provide discoverable information to substantiate those claims.”

treestar

(82,383 posts)
55. The Plaintiffs have the burden of proof
Fri Aug 21, 2020, 07:03 PM
Aug 2020

Unlike the media, the courts do not accept something as evidence by its being verbally repeated a zillion times.

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