I am shocked and disappointed. Don't tell me "people are just disappointed and upset about the

[CTyankee]

election..."

My neighbor for over 20 years, a strong Democrat, retired architect, man of distinction and helpful friend, has shocked and offended me.

We were talking on the phone last night about the election. I mentioned something HRC had said and he blurted out: "Hillary should keep her mouth SHUT!!!" I mean, he practically spit the words out.

I stammered out "What?"

And again he said "Hillary should NOT TALK! She should shut up about the election! She should not be saying ANYTHING about the election!" At this point, he was nearly shouting.

All those past years of being told to sit down and shut up, you have nothing to say, came back to me in a rush of anger and I just couldn't talk to him. I hung up.

My husband said it was the election, that it drove some folks over the edge. He just shook his head in disbelief and sadness.

No, without a full and complete apology, I will never speak to my neighbor again. Period. I never thought that beneath his calm veneer, he would even THINK this way! I don't CARE if he's upset over the election! Is he a baby? Is he such a weakling that he can't handle his emotions, or at least THINK about what comes out of his mind and straight out of his mouth?

Thank god for you, Democratic Underground! I am grieving for being betrayed, for loss of what I thought was a friendship, a loyalty, a good Dem. Whatever he thinks about HRC, can't he have the decency to discuss her without raging sexist language??? Where has he BEEN these past 20 years or so?

I'm still enraged but a bit quieter. I hope you understand the rage I am talking about. If I didn't have rage, there would be something wrong with me. Well, I'm NOT DEAD YET!

[The Magistrate]

1. Horrible, Ma'am

And yet we still have people maintaining misogyny had nothing to do with the 2016 result.

[spooky3]

60. +1

[still_one]

2. Like racism, sexism is very much alive, and both have actually gotten worse since trump occupied

the WH

[LuckyCharms]

3. Don't sweat it, it's alright.

Finally broke down yesterday and gave it back big time to my neighbor after months of abuse. Sent a huge text. Seems I got my point across.

All this stuff comes with the state of the nation right now.

It will be OK, don't worry...everyone is on the head of a pin.

My guess is he will apologize.

Sorry this happened, try not to let it upset you...it will work out.

[CTyankee]

7. I'm just glad that, coincidentally, I am picking up a prescription for Elavil this morning...

It is actually for the off label use for nerve pain. Doc told me it also is effective on mood enhancement. "You'll feel it right away."

I'll let you know how I feel after I take it.

[LuckyCharms]

12. I take Ativan and it helps.

I'm feeling your words this morning. I have lived in my home for 42 years. Never ONCE had a bad conflict with a neighbor. But bad things have been brewing next store, and my subtle hints were not working.

I sent an absolutely scathing text to my neighbor. I hated to do that, but it seems to have fixed things. I essentially said not to bother to apologize. Fix this shit instead. Don't apologize, just fix it.

They know they are in the wrong...and they fixed it.

People eventually come to realize when they did something wrong. Just take care of YOURSELF, don't give him another thought. I'm not trying to downplay what happened by saying "It will be alright"...but it will be.

Good luck, best wishes. Remember, people are almost never blaming you when they blow up at you...you're just an outlet for their anger. That's all it is.

[CTyankee]

19. We used to ride together to the polls for the Democratic Primary and had discussions about

Democratic politics all the time. Never ONCE did anything like this come out of his mouth! I know he had strong feelings about our Dem reps at the local level and the elections which would decide them, but that was between DEMS!

He lives alone and a friend of mine (who also lives alone) once said that people who live alone get a little strange. I think he meant men, actually.

In this case I agree. I also think this man has not fully come to grips with another issue but I won't discuss it here...

[LuckyCharms]

26. I'll tell you...

a woman who is close to me FINALLY expressed some righteous anger toward a man who deserved it. It was a sight to see. I was so proud, and a bit frightened at the same time.

If you don't get an apology, hand this guy's shit right back to him...I'll be the first to tell you...when a woman expresses her righteous anger, there are very few men in this world that won't back down when they know they were were in the wrong.

I've never doubted the strength of a woman, and I've always respected it. And when it is shown, it is a sight to behold. Give him a chance to apologize, but if he doesn't, and after you have thought more about the big picture and are convinced you are right in doing so, cut him off at the fucking knees. Friend or no friend, he owes you an apology. You don't need to take any shit when you did nothing wrong.

[dameatball]

14. Going to follow that. Thanks. On Friday, I was diagnosed with ruptured vertebrae. As far as

your neighbor, I suppose time may make some amends. Can't hurt to wait and see. Good luck.

[CTyankee]

20. OMG! Good lord, mb, I am sorry! I did not know of your predicament and that puts it all into

perspective for me.

Hope you are in good hands with whatever you need surgery or otherwise.

What is your prognosis?

[dameatball]

59. Sorry, not ruptured vertebrae. It is a ruptured disc. Got MRI results Friday. I really don't know

much yet about the prognosis. Still waiting on a referral. Ha!...I'm not sure there is such a thing as a ruptured vertebrae but sounds horrible.
I'm guessing some pain management for a while and wait and see, but who knows?

I hope you are doing okay as well.

[Paka]

63. I had a ruptured disc about 20 years ago.

It was extremely painful and debilitating for a couple of weeks and then it healed up. I haven't had any trouble since. I had to stay very quiet while it healed, but I've fully active now.

[dameatball]

72. Thanks for the info Paka. I'm pretty optimistic as of now. I just plan on doing what they tell me

[Paka]

76. I'm not sure if it matters which disc ruptures.

Mine was an upper disc, I forget now whether it was 5 or 6. I'm sure your doctor can give you good input on that. But I'm totally energetic and it hasn't slowed me down at all and I didn't have any discernible pain after the initial period. Good Luck!

[robbob]

37. Did you make an OP about this?

I would love to hear more details about your interactions with this neighbour. I love reading anything on DU about “close encounters with a rabid MAGAT”, or anything along those lines. Only if you feel comfortable sharing the story, of course.

[Walleye]

4. I grew up in the 50s and 60s. I feel your rage. It burns hot!

[CTyankee]

11. I clearly remember my ex father in law telling his wife "You be quiet! You don't have an opinion!"

about a political issue. That was in the late 60s. My then husband and I were deeply in debt to his father's good graces since he kept us afloat financially during those years. I was enraged, hurt, deeply embarrassed for my m.i.l. How she must have felt, being dismissed so loudly by her own husband.

And yeah, alcohol was involved...

[TicketyBoo]

38. I was 12 years old

and heard my father's brother call his wife all sorts of vile names.

I was shocked because Dad respected Mom. I never imagined a man would ever talk to his wife that way.

[csziggy]

56. Wow! If my Dad had said that to my mother, she would have thrown him out of the house

She did not put up with that kind of sexism ever. She raised her four daughters to be the same way and told me once to never rely on a man for my support - to always be able to take care of myself.

One of my aunts, a very "Christian" person who did not believe in birth control and who never liked my mother (they were married to brothers), once told me that I was just like my mother. I shocked her when I said "Thank you!" since she did not mean it as a compliment.

Mom never had much use for her brother in law. Since my uncle married a woman who believed the crap about women submitting to their husbands, he became pretty unsufferable about women being dominant. I bet my grandmother, his mother, would not have approved - she's the one who got a divorce in 1916 and supported herself as a school teacher so she could claim in court her first husband had abandoned her with no financial support.

[niyad]

5. I am so very sorry that you experienced this shock. As others have said, misogyny and sexism

are alive, and, indeed, flourishing. You are absolutely correct, but even if you get that apology, how can you ever trust him again? You do not need such toxicity in your life.

[LuckyCharms]

6. After further reflection...

If he is indeed a strong Democrat, he could be showing his frustration over the fact that Trump cheated his way in and that she is the rightful President. Sometimes anger comes out in odd ways...ways you would not expect.

Stay away from him. My guess is that he will realize that he took his anger out on you in a misguided way, and he will apologize. Might take a week or so.

It sucks to get badgered over sometime that had nothing to do with you...he will realize that. He's probably just so pissed off that he can't think straight.

[CTyankee]

10. My guess is that he blames her for "losing" the 2016 election, i.e., she didn't do what I would do

and now look at where we are!

That kind of thing.

well, take it and shove it. I don't listen to sexist shit any more.

[LuckyCharms]

15. Could be.

You would have to look at the big picture with this guy. If you look at his past statements, his past actions, etc., you will probably be able to determine if this was just a one off situation, or if there is something deeper there. He either just lost his temper, or he is not as good of a person as he portrayed. You'll know soon enough.

[luvtheGWN]

50. Here's my Canadian 2 cents:

Is it possible that your neighbour is actually concerned that what Hillary says publicly will remind those Dems why they didn't vote for her last time (for whatever reason) and influence their vote (or worse, non-vote) this time?

The Repubs did a bang-up job over the past 30 or so years of denigrating the Clintons at every opportunity. Those of us who recognized her capabilities and experience, and had hoped so much that she would become your President, had great difficulty understanding how she could be so hated by otherwise intelligent and thoughtful people.

That's why I think it's possible your neighbour just simply doesn't want Hillary to take any part at all in this election. But you know him and I don't.

[ihas2stinkyfeet]

8. hang in there. i agree w lucky charms. i think he will apologize.

might not be until after nov 3. but dont be timid. tell him he was a jerk, and you expect an apology. w flowers and chocolates.

[LuckyCharms]

16. How are you doing today, stinky?

[ihas2stinkyfeet]

18. good.

thanks. been having some serious health struggles, but getting a grip on them.
plus, it rained here yesterday for like the 4th time this summer. and it is cool.
you?

[LuckyCharms]

21. Same with health, same with the weather.

"Struggles" is the right word. On my way soon to the lab at the hospital for blood and urine work. Gathering up my PPE now. LOL

Best wishes on your health struggles. We both know how it is, I think. One day at a time.

[ihas2stinkyfeet]

25. yup. scheduling a ct scan of all my guts today.

at least the current struggle has unearthed the cause. i have sjogrhens syndrome. it usually just causes dry mouth and eyes. but it is aggravated by pregnancies, of which i had 6, and by viruses, of which i have had most. got west nile in 2002 and been puzzling docs ever since.
they dont suspect it cuz it doesnt make most ppl sick. 5 rheumatologists, and i figured it out myself.

in the end, you have to inform yourself.

[LuckyCharms]

30. I wish you the best outcome possible

You have a lot on your plate. You are strong. Respect to you. Chronic illness is no picnic.

All the best....

[ihas2stinkyfeet]

33. thx. rly appreciate that.

stuff getting better already. thanks to the leaf you have for your avatar, my hidden epilepsy is finally gone.
got my head bashed in at 6. was dead for a few minutes, and haunted for 60 yrs in strange ways. but finally found the right dose of the right strain last year. weird the things that cleared up. like being left/right stupid. and not being able to grok spanish because the syntax baffled me. or play an instrument cuz right is higher and left is lower. or that my muscle spasms were rly seizures.
the only one i will miss is the rare olfactory seizures. gardenias. guess i just have to grow them.

[LuckyCharms]

43. Jesus. So sorry to here about the trauma in your youth.

We could probably commiserate on a few things. The mind and body is are amazing and sometimes terrible things.

I have a friend who had cancer as an infant. We had a long discussion the other day...he opened up to me about the problems he has now because of it. Frightening and terrible stuff. Blew my mind...don't want to repeat here...but Jesus, it opened up my eyes to a few things.

Had what I thought were muscle spasms in my right arm. Turns out to be seizure related. No one knows why. It's just my arm. Flops around for a few minutes.

Suddenly developed problems with what I call "directional thinking". I remodeled my kitchen myself and you have to do a lot of thinking like "If I move this a quarter inch to the left, how is that going to effect which direction this other thing will move? How much will it move by? Will it move to the left too? To the right? This is stuff a first grader could figure out, suddenly I can't do it. Have to draw it out on paper and think about it for an hour. Maddening!!!

Used to be a decent drummer. Those days are gone. Now I'm like a monkey beating a rock with some sticks randomly.

The doctors? Doc, I have problems with "directional thinking". Let me explain....Their answer..."I dunno".

You are spot on when you say you have to figure things out for yourself. If it doesn't show in a blood test or xray..."Hmmm, dunno, can't see anything wrong.

Hang in there, and thanks for sharing.

[ihas2stinkyfeet]

52. well, it wasnt rly trauma. it was an accident.

the great guy next door was playing a little ball w my brother and me. bro was pitching, i was catching. dude was a semi-pro softball player. which is why i am not still dead.
when he saw the pitch was high and inside, he checked his swing. he was also an ambulance driver, so his quick reaction saved me. i was laying there w a bleeding artery.
but he picked me up, and propped me against his wife. so the blood in my head drained back out. and he hustled me off, still bleeding, to the hospital down the street where both my mom and huis wife worked.
all the docs saw was a broken nose. they patted themselves on the back at how nicely it healed. cuz god forbid a little girl should have a bump on her nose and not be pretty any more.

i started figuring this all out about 10 yrs ago. my youngest also had a head injury. her brother was giving her a helicopter ride and smacked her head into an iron radiator. she had a big goose egg, but no other symptoms. it was forgotten. wasnt till 15 yrs later that docs discovered she had epilepsy as well. she wasnt crazy. she was tagged as having ptsd, cuz she saw ppl following her out of the corner of her eye. but no. hallucinations, which i also had for a decade. docs said it was a genetic tendency to develop epilepsy after a head injury and a light went off.
the funny thing is that after my head cleared up, i remembered the moment of the blow. that is how i know i was dead. white light and all that.
and that i had an arterial bleed. i came too and his wife had a handful of diapers against my face. it looked like the rising sun flag. bright red. arterial blood.

all pf which is why nobody can scare me. living on borrowed time for 10 times as long as my allotted, and yeah. my enemies cant even cut my life short. they can only make me one w everything which is my goal. my dogs would be pretty pissed, tho.

[LakeArenal]

9. I guess the unwarranted hatred of Hillary remains.

Before I left WI there were still Hillary for prison signs.

Thankfully, Joe has a lot less of that shit held against him. I find that very hopeful actually. Comey is to blame whether he regrets it or not.

[SoonerPride]

13. Sexism is why she lost.

[CTyankee]

23. If he had given me one good reason to continue the conversation we could have had a decent

political discussion.

This is a man I thanked in the preface of my book for his input about architecture in one of my essays. He downplayed it later but I told him he was very helpful, and he was. I am always extremely thankful for people who give me information I need to put in my books about art history. I am grateful to them and I say so...

[Laelth]

17. That doesn't sound like Hillary-hate to me.

It sounds like someone who really, really wants Biden to win and who also thinks that Hillary is poison, i.e. her involvement hurts Biden more than it helps him.

That’s not an unreasonable position. It doesn’t excuse his rudeness, but it may have been pro-Biden passion that was poorly contained and badly expressed.

-Laelth

[CTyankee]

24. telling women to shut up is an emotional trigger to me, as it is for so many women of a certain age.

My ex husband told me he "was the one who helped" me "find my voice" when my first book was published. He got torn a new one and never spoke about it again in my presence (Thanksgiving dinner at my daughter's house, I had to attend if I wanted to see my grand kids).

[Laelth]

28. It's a definite trigger. I get that.

Using those words demonstrates a degree of insensitivity, no doubt, but, to me, it demonstrates neither misogyny nor hatred of HRC in this context. I suspect the guy voted for HRC in 2016. Why would you assume he hates HRC now?

I am not telling you how to feel. You’re upset, and rightly so, but I just wanted to give you an angle that might let you save a 20-year-long friendship. Personally, I would hate to lose something like that—just because I raised my voice ... once.

-Laelth

[CTyankee]

31. I dunno why he feels that way.

My guess it is from feelings that she was at fault for losing her election so she should not have any say in this one. He could have said that in a quiet way. I would disagree but at least we could have a decent conversation. Instead, he chose to lapse into sexist shit which, as a Democrat, he should know better about. I tried but it was "off with her head!" from the start and I never got anywhere so I hung up. He was hysterical.

[ihas2stinkyfeet]

34. but you think monica should shut up.

interesting.

[Laelth]

48. Not fair. Back in the 1990s, on one subject, yes.

I think we have all been better off if she had “shut up” then. Otherwise, I am glad that she has found her voice now and is making a positive contribution to the world.

-Laelth

[ihas2stinkyfeet]

54. that's not what you said just yesterday.

you said you would never forgive her.

[Whiskeytide]

36. That trigger is understandable. But I suspect Laelth is ...

... right - that he’s so committed to beating Тяцмр in November it is causing stress and making him lash out irrationally. If he is a true Democrat, he will - and should - apologize for his attitude.

The HRC hate by republicans is crazy, but real. I have conservative friends that just despise her. The mention of her name causes them to go off on rants about how terrible she is. And these are pretty smart people who have never liked Тяцмр. Two of them wrote in Kasich in 2016. One claims he wrote my name in. All three are staying home (they say) in November. But if Hillary actively campaigned with Biden, I suspect that would change. Especially if the Тяцмр campaign used that - as we know it would.

If your neighbor is reacting to a genuine belief that she would hurt Joe more than help him, he might not be wrong. That’s not fair (to Clinton), obviously, but it might be smart politics.

That doesn’t excuse his attitude, but might explain his thinking. I hope he shows some contrition and you guys can patch things up.

[spooky3]

61. Let me guess--you never had a male subordinate "shush" you

In the workplace? Women who have, and men who are paying attention, would recognize the sexism in the neighbor’s remarks and not try to make excuses for it.

[Arazi]

22. If your (ex) friend is a strong Dem he may want her to stay out of 2020

For good Dem reasons...

HRC riles up Republicans. She's such a trigger - wrongly but there it is - that having her out campaigning for Biden atm, when we need every electoral advantage to overcome Russian cheating, is probably a bad strategy. R hatred of HRC is a powerful motivator. Why give them any incentive?

She's also a useful foil for Russian disinfo campaigns. Her words will be twisted by the troll farms and blasted onto Facebook like a nuclear bomb.

There's no getting around the fact either that her negative favorability numbers were (are?) historically high for a presidential candidate. Do we need that in this race?

It could be sexism too of course but if you have that much history with this guy seems weird you never saw it before

[CTyankee]

27. He is very quiet, very private about lots of things. Never raises his voice. which is why I was so

shocked at his virulence.

[Arazi]

40. Unfortunately HRC can be very polarizing even amongst Democrats

She did have very high unfavorable numbers and it's undeniable that if she were to become active in this campaign it would electrify the Republicans.

I don't like it but those are facts

It's possible your friend is sexist or it's possible he has some valid reasons for his vehemence and they revolve around his strong desire for Biden to win

[thesquanderer]

46. I agree. He may or may not be sexist, but nothing in the OP convinces me that he is.

I mean, unless we don't have the whole story. As far as we can tell, it's not like he said something like "that b*tch should keep her mouth shut" -- then okay. But otherwise? This doesn't seem different than the Dems who have occasionally said that Bernie Sanders should shut the F up. It doesn't make them anti-Semitic.

[CTyankee]

58. He would never say "b*tch" but his virulence was telling.

Or it was to me. I was taken aback.

[spooky3]

68. How would you assess a situation where a neighbor who is believed to be a Dem,

in talking with a Black neighbor, says angrily that "Obama should just SHUT UP?"

I would expect the Black neighbor to be concerned that the first neighbor is racist and I would not try to tell the Black neighbor that I know better than s/he does whether racism is involved, or that the first neighbor would have to use a racial epithet for me to be convinced otherwise.

[thesquanderer]

69. I was not trying to say she was *wrong* in her assessment...

...only that, in her post, she did not provide evidence that she was *right*, either. Of course she is fully entitled to feel however she wants about the encounter. I just don't want to join the chorus of "yeah, what a sexist jerk he is" based solely on the statements in the OP which do not seem to clearly justify it.

[spooky3]

71. In almost any situation, there are lots of potential explanations for someone's behavior.

His behavior IS very odd, and there IS evidence that sexism could account for it.

But if we tend to try to argue for alternative explanations--especially when we aren't present and don't have all the evidence (and the OP has more than we do)--then we often are denying the true explanation, and there is harm in doing that. I know it wasn't your intention, but this happens very frequently and works to undermine the woman's confidence in reading situations.

There are many men who believe themselves to be progressive and/or Dems, who are sexist. Not the over, raging, over the top Trump supporter nasty sexists, but sexist nonetheless. I've worked with several, had several friends and relatives who fall into this category; they are often more resistant to change than the hard core.

[Sherman A1]

53. Precisely

I don't see HRC as a plus for the Biden/Harris campaign for the reasons you eloquently stated.

[Autumn]

29. I had a relative tell me pretty much the same thing. She said that the focus should be on Joe

and Kamala and she's doesn't want to have to discuss Hillary and she doesn't want to spend time defending or explaining what Hillary says or shit she was accused of 30 years ago. This person did phone calls for Hillary in her primary.

[CTyankee]

32. I can't say I blame her. It is a waste of our time to fight old battles but this was different. It

felt like he couldn't "process" his feelings better. But I am not his therapist. He needs one to process his feelings better. If I were not so shocked I would have told him so.

[Autumn]

35. That's a condition with some men. LOL Hillary has a lot of advice she can give Joe and

Kamala so I had to agree she may have a point, stay on the sideline and out of the limelight till the election is won. Hillary is a lightning rod and nothing stirs up the Pukes and nuts like she does. Joe could appoint her as US AG. She could prosecute Barr

[bucolic_frolic]

39. In some youtube interviews

Steve Schmidt had nothing good to say about the Clintons. He didn't elaborate, but 'self-dealing' did come up, and I seem to recall him saying Republicans 'hated' her. Yeah, we know. But ... I'm bewildered. What was their problem with her exactly? The global reach of the Clinton Foundation? HRC's successful stint as SoS, with particular emphasis in eastern Europe? That seams an area of conflict between our two main parties.

[Rhiannon12866]

41. Hillary Clinton is going to be reporting on tonight's debate on MSNBC

With Rachel Maddow and the rest. Rachel announced that last night.

[cwydro]

42. Well, he certainly shouldn't have shouted at you.

But he has a right to his opinion, after all.

A close friend of mine, a female who voted for Hillary, also thinks she should stay out of it.

[maxsolomon]

44. He sounds like he's on the edge. Like me. I'm having wild mood swings.

I don't want to see or hear from ANY Dems who rile up the low-information flibberdigibbets who decide our elections. Those ding dongs sat on their hands, or worse, voted for Trump in 2016.

GOP propaganda works too well on weak minds - don't give them ammunition.

[IronLionZion]

45. There was a massive disinformation campaign to discourage Hillary voters in 2016

They targeted black men, and men of all types in swing states. UK's Channel 4 news has the story of how they targeted millions of Dem leaning voters by appealing to sexism and pure lies.

[GoneOffShore]

47. Is there something that may have happened to him in the last couple of days that caused this?

You do mention that he's a 'private person' and generally very quiet.

The outburst may have very little to do with HRC, his attitude towards women, his attitude towards you in particular, but an outside circumstance that happened to set him off.

I do know that tensions are running high. Mrs GoS and I are snapping at each other far more than normal, and anthills have approached Himalayan proportions.

[CTyankee]

67. I wonder. Usually, we have great conversatons and I appreciate his point of view.

which is why this threw me for a loop.

I am going to trust that these were raw feelings, brought on by upcoming election. And he lives alone so raw stuff goes "unprocessed" as it were.

[GoneOffShore]

74. Raw feelings is a good way to put it. I feel like this election has put everyone on tenterhooks

It's pushed everyone in directions that really don't reflect who they are. We're all in fight or flight mode 24/7/365.

[CTyankee]

75. Also, when I go "off the wire" so to speak, hubby's there to steady me. He doesn't seem to go

a little nuts and he rarely gets mad. He just figures he'll get even, in November!

[TlalocW]

49. Here's what your friend is probably worried about

Hillary has a reputation - whether she deserves it or not (not) - due to republicans going after her so much over decades. It doesn't matter that they've never been able to pin anything on her or not. The general public aren't into politics as much as we are so hours of Hillary on the news where she's having to defend herself take their toll that a 20 second blurb about how she was exonerated, couldn't be charged with anything, etc. can't erase.

Unfortunately, Trump's method of attacking people - projection - worked well with Hillary and the image a lot of people had of her in their mind, and I think Trump's projection is partly the reason Biden is doing so well. Biden doesn't have the rep that Clinton unjustifiably had. Your friend is overly-anxious about any kind of spanner being thrown into the works that could gum things up (tortured mixed metaphors). I'm not necessarily seeing the raging, sexist language in your post, but if there were some that is less forgivable.

TlalocW

[brooklynite]

55. You're not going to like this response...

I find his response understandable.

Hillary Clinton was one of the most qualified candidates we had and lost to one the least qualified candidates they had

* NO, Clinton didn't actually win. We don't elect Presidents based on national popular vote.

* NO, the voting machines weren't hacked. Clinton lost because enough people in enough States voted for Trump.

* NO, Russian bots didn't turn liberals into conservatives. Their messaging played on animosities that voters already had.

Some people who voted for Clinton in 2016 and WILL VOTE FOR BIDEN IN 2020 want Clinton to stay out the election discussion because they see her comments as giving Trump the opportunity to divert the election focus on her. Doesn't mean they're "betraying" you; doesn't mean they're being "sexist" (nb - your OP shows no indication of "raging sexist" language.) Just means they're stressed about the election -- like you are.

[CTyankee]

65. well, the person who was raging was him and his language, not mine. he was worked up.

I trust HRC to do whatever is best for the Biden campaign. No indication I have found that she would rehash the 2016 election whatsoever if she does speak on Biden's behalf.

Who said "Russian robots" turned liberals into conservatives? That's a new one on me.

Please expound upon what you think the Russians DID do during the 2016 election.

Uh, who argues that we have an Electoral College to elect Presidents?

Who argues that she was not popular enough to win the popular vote for President?

I was just surprised at the anger he was directing against her. She's not in office, Trump is. My neighbor is a big grown up. He can figure that out.

[spooky3]

70. Why do you feel comfortable telling women you know better than they do whether

someone they know and interacted with is being sexist.

News flash - it is not necessary to show "raging sexist" language to demonstrate sexist behavior. Many sexists (and racists) know enough to know not to use the n-word or other race & sex-based epithets, because language that was once socially acceptable at least in some contexts no longer is.

[brooklynite]

73. Point to actual language that was "sexist"...

The only thing the author points to is that the person she talked to said Clinton should stay quiet about the election.

[CTyankee]

77. Here's my take on what you said:

Trump needs no provocation to "divert the election focus on her." He'll do whatever he wants.

Hillary will do whatever will help Biden the most. I trust her political instincts enough to know that. Plus, Biden will let her know what he feels is best.

[Boogiemack]

57. Remember, many are still infuriated that Obama was a capable and successful President who is

admired all over the world. They are infuriated that, despite the many obstacles thrown in front of him by older, more experienced white GOP bigots, he managed to rise about it all, remain respectful, decent and scandal free. The ACA was a "big f***ing deal" and it helped so many suffering people. Was it perfect, no. Was it an historical achievement. Yes. Quiet as it is kept by the media and the inside pols, Obama and Pelosi left a lot of egg on their faces and huge cuts into their psyche. Hillary, hated for her competence, confidence, and ability to remain steadfast and respectful in the face of all the lies and fake scandals is seen as an extension of Obama and they set out, and actually succeeded, to beat her as a proxy for beating Obama. And they really hate her now because she has proven to be so right about Trump and how and what he would be as President.

In short, their anger is really about not being able to erase the history that haunts them about their own failures and exposure as not so superior beings. Take away their ill-gotten wealth and they most would not even be able to get a security clearance or pass a competence test for a job at your local bank. If it were not for the privileges they enjoy, most would be wretched mediocre sniveling losers.

That's my take...and I am sticking to it.

[triron]

62. I would be too.

[ms liberty]

64. Hillary Clinton motivates the right like nothing else can

That could be why your neighbor is upset. It is probably not about her being a woman speaking, it us about her being Hillary Clinton, the right's 30 year symbol of what they're fighting against speaking. She brings them out like few other Democrats. I will admit that I feel some trepidation when she's interviewed or something myself, because she is such a rallying cry for the RW fruitcakes.
If you've been friends with this man for that long and have not seen him behave this way towards women before, then I think you might perhaps speak to him about it at another time, to clear the air. If he was that kind of person, you would have already known it. I think it very possible there are factors separate from gender at work there.

[CTyankee]

66. I wasn't as surprised at what he said as to the way he said it.

If he had taken a less emotional way, or had worked out his emotions ahead of the discussion, it would have been received better by me.