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Tue Oct 6, 2020, 01:25 PM

Trump campaign discussing plans to appoint own state electors, no matter the results

Last edited Tue Oct 6, 2020, 01:59 PM - Edit history (2)



https://www.salon.com/2020/10/06/trump-campaign-discussing-plans-to-appoint-its-own-state-electors-no-matter-the-results-report/


A real nightmare scenario: The eight closest battleground states might send competing sets of electors to Congress

Snip


According to a Sept. 23 article in The Atlantic, campaign advisers to Trump, in conjunction with Republican state leaders, are preparing to test this theory. Sources in the Republican Party, at both state and national levels, say that the campaign is considering a plan to "bypass" the popular vote results and install its own electors in key battleground states where the legislatures are controlled by Republicans.

Snip


Republicans control both legislative bodies in the six closest battleground states: Arizona, Florida, Michigan, North Carolina, Pennsylvania and Wisconsin. Of those six, both Arizona and Florida have Republican governors.

After the national election, the plan goes, the Trump campaign would cry foul about rampant fraud and demand that state legislators ignore the ballot tabulations and choose their electors directly. If the campaign can sustain doubt or confusion about the ballot count, legislators will feel more and more pressure to take up the responsibility before the Dec. 8 deadline when electors' names are sent to Congress for verification.
The Atlantic reported that a Trump campaign legal adviser said this effort would be framed as protecting the will of the people.

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Reply Trump campaign discussing plans to appoint own state electors, no matter the results (Original post)
live love laugh Oct 2020 OP
NYC Liberal Oct 2020 #1
lagomorph777 Oct 2020 #2
lastlib Oct 2020 #18
Ms. Toad Oct 2020 #30
NYC Liberal Oct 2020 #32
The Magistrate Oct 2020 #41
lastlib Oct 2020 #50
regnaD kciN Oct 2020 #34
TheRealNorth Oct 2020 #42
stopdiggin Oct 2020 #49
NewJeffCT Oct 2020 #39
no_hypocrisy Oct 2020 #3
ProudMNDemocrat Oct 2020 #4
madaboutharry Oct 2020 #5
Chainfire Oct 2020 #33
NameAlreadyTaken Oct 2020 #6
catbyte Oct 2020 #12
Chainfire Oct 2020 #36
The Magistrate Oct 2020 #43
Statistical Oct 2020 #7
catbyte Oct 2020 #8
TheRealNorth Oct 2020 #44
barbtries Oct 2020 #47
CousinIT Oct 2020 #9
lastlib Oct 2020 #10
Statistical Oct 2020 #13
regnaD kciN Oct 2020 #37
TheRealNorth Oct 2020 #48
Progressive dog Oct 2020 #11
LeftInTX Oct 2020 #14
Renew Deal Oct 2020 #15
EndlessWire Oct 2020 #24
TheRealNorth Oct 2020 #45
not_the_one Oct 2020 #46
Renew Deal Oct 2020 #53
samsingh Oct 2020 #16
Moostache Oct 2020 #17
I_UndergroundPanther Oct 2020 #22
Frustratedlady Oct 2020 #19
gristy Oct 2020 #20
LiberalFighter Oct 2020 #21
obamanut2012 Oct 2020 #26
Cosmocat Oct 2020 #35
liskddksil Oct 2020 #23
obamanut2012 Oct 2020 #25
live love laugh Oct 2020 #27
liskddksil Oct 2020 #28
live love laugh Oct 2020 #31
peggysue2 Oct 2020 #29
Grins Oct 2020 #38
Yavin4 Oct 2020 #40
DonCoquixote Oct 2020 #51
Thrax Oct 2020 #52

Response to live love laugh (Original post)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 01:26 PM

1. A nonstarter. Most of those states have Dem governors.

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Response to NYC Liberal (Reply #1)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 01:27 PM

2. Yup; he'll never pull it off in any state that matters.

Swing states generally don't have single-party governments.

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Response to NYC Liberal (Reply #1)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 01:35 PM

18. Could the argument be made....

...that it is solely up to the legislatures, and the governors have no role?

How many of these states have Dem Secretaries of State?

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Response to lastlib (Reply #18)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 01:58 PM

30. In most states, thre are specified rules for how electors are chosen -

Generally they are popular vote. State legislatures don't just get to ignore the statutory scheme in existence for choosing electors.

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Response to lastlib (Reply #18)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 01:59 PM

32. I'm pretty sure that every state constitution mirrors the federal one

in requiring the governor’s signature for all bills. They’d have to amend their state constitutions.

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Response to lastlib (Reply #18)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 02:17 PM

41. Federal Law, Sir

Dictates that a slate of electors must have certification by the state's governor to vote. Governor no sign, elector no vote. Passed in the wake of the 1876 fiasco.

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Response to The Magistrate (Reply #41)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 04:05 PM

50. Thank you, Sir!

I will sleep better tonight! ---

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Response to NYC Liberal (Reply #1)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 02:06 PM

34. That doesn't matter, according to their theory...

...which holds that the letter of the Constitution empowers “state legislatures” to pick electors, meaning that they can intervene on their own at any time without changing the state’s law (the latter of which would require a governor’s signature). And, if state law provides the choice to be made by the voters, that state law is overruled by the Constitution, which gives it to the state legislatures on their own.

The problem with that understanding is that the Constitution ALSO provides that, when two rival slates of electors are named from a given state, Congress shall give the nod to which should be recognized. And, if Congress can’t agree (which would be the case with a Democratic House), the same provision states that the slate certified by the governor gets chosen. So, they can only make a difference in two of those states, not enough to sway the outcome.

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Response to regnaD kciN (Reply #34)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 02:18 PM

42. and now you also understand why Trump wants his new Supreme Court Justice

they will make it legal.

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Response to regnaD kciN (Reply #34)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 02:40 PM

49. and that still contravenes

both the integrity and letter of state law -- which is pretty bad optics, in addition to questionable legal ground, and probably a big uphill push for state legislators. I think they really have to change or amend state law first -- despite what the opinion given in the OP suggests.

And for that reason, as well as a good many others -- IMO -- ain't gonna' happen.

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Response to NYC Liberal (Reply #1)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 02:14 PM

39. Florida and Arizona have 40 electoral votes between them

29 for Florida and 11 for Arizona

MI, PA and WI have 46 between the 3 of them.

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Response to live love laugh (Original post)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 01:28 PM

3. Even if the Dems did this in 2016 and HRC were in the WH as a result,

I could not condone this kind of electoral corruption.

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Response to live love laugh (Original post)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 01:28 PM

4. The votes in those states have to be overwhelming.

I see this as backfiring badly on Trump. It sends a clear message he is willing to resort to deadly tactics to consolidate power, the US Constitution be damned. Because, that will no longer exist.

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Response to live love laugh (Original post)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 01:29 PM

5. Not only will the governors stop this,

the American people will stop it.

Americans are not going to let this idiot do anything other than leave when he loses.

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Response to madaboutharry (Reply #5)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 02:03 PM

33. Do you think that Rod DeSantis would do the right thing in Florida?

DeSantis has been trying to out-Trump, Trump. He would go along, but if these assholes think that the people will just stand by for it, I believe that they have another think coming.

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Response to live love laugh (Original post)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 01:29 PM

6. "Protecting the will of the people" by

ignoring the popular vote? How does that work?

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Response to NameAlreadyTaken (Reply #6)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 01:32 PM

12. They mean "protecting the will of THEIR people."

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Response to NameAlreadyTaken (Reply #6)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 02:08 PM

36. Remember "Bazarro World" in the Superman comics in the 60s?

That is getting really close to Republicans now.

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Response to NameAlreadyTaken (Reply #6)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 02:20 PM

43. You Have To Know Who's A Real American And Who Isn't, Sir

If you ain't an uneducated white rube living somewhere with a population density under a dozen per square mile, you ain't a real American....

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Response to live love laugh (Original post)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 01:29 PM

7. Nonsense and designed to suppress voter turnout.

We need to beat Trump first.

As the article explains after the scary headline only two of those states have a Republican governor.

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Response to live love laugh (Original post)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 01:31 PM

8. They'd have full-scale riots on their hands if they tried a coup like that in Michigan.

Besides, we have Democrats in control of the Michigan executive branch, so chances are low here. I can't see citizens in Florida & Arizona standing for it either, actually.

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Response to catbyte (Reply #8)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 02:20 PM

44. now you understand why Trump told the Proud Boys

To "Stand Ready".

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Response to catbyte (Reply #8)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 02:30 PM

47. I'm in NC.

been inside for more than half a year and if they pull this shit here I am out of here, on the street, do not expect to be alone.

my greatest hope is that Biden (and all of our Democratic candidates) win in such a landslide that any kind of plot like this could never get off the ground. We need massive voter turnout.

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Response to live love laugh (Original post)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 01:31 PM

9. Warning: This is why he's acting like he doesn't need the votes. Because he doesn't. n/t

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Response to live love laugh (Original post)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 01:31 PM

10. This bothers the hell out of me.

How do we fight it? March on these legislatures? With our own guns? Dec. 8th is too early for the new Congress to have a say. If the election gets thrown to the House, we're fucked, b/c GOPhers have majorities in state delegations.

What do we do? We need to plan now.

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Response to lastlib (Reply #10)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 01:32 PM

13. Win big if the best thing non lawyers can do.

No doubt Biden's campaign has legal teams to challenge this.

I would point out only two states have the trifecta needed unless one things a Democratic governor is going to go along with this plan. Win by more than those two states and cheating is pointless.

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Response to lastlib (Reply #10)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 02:09 PM

37. Read my note above...

If two slates of electors are named, and Congress can’t agree on which to name (as would be the case now), the Constitution says the one certified by the governor must be selected. Which, in six of those eight states, means the Democratic slate.

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Response to lastlib (Reply #10)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 02:36 PM

48. I know some people here are bothered by this talk

... because they believe it decreases turnout. But we know the Republicans are gaming these scenarios out. While I agree, our focus needs to be on turnout, because so much of what happens after that hinges on turning out, we cannot fail to consider what happens after.

And if we are not willing to go to hell and back to prevent the Republicans from discarding the popular votes in the states, how will people not come to the conclusion that voting doesn't matter.

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Response to live love laugh (Original post)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 01:31 PM

11. So obviously illegal that

they'd have to be as stupid as Trump is to try it.

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Response to live love laugh (Original post)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 01:34 PM

14. Each political party appoints their own electors

We voted for our Democratic elector at our state convention. Texas has 38 electoral votes, so if Biden wins Texas, our Democratic electors will cast the votes. If Trump wins Texas, the Republican electors will cast the 38 votes.

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Response to live love laugh (Original post)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 01:34 PM

15. If all of those states were stolen, Biden would have to win OH, IA, and GA or just TX

But I don't think the violence would make it worth it.

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Response to Renew Deal (Reply #15)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 01:49 PM

24. Sorry, but it would definitely be worth it.

We are talking about losing our democratic country if Trump "wins." Trump is a dictator. He will continue to develop as such if he wins. So, we are not talking about bearing up under incompetency; we are talking about giving up an entire way of life. It's important to recognize this.

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Response to EndlessWire (Reply #24)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 02:24 PM

45. if they steal it this time....

you don't think that they won't just keep doing it if they can get away with it. Institutions like the FDA, CDC, HHS, Justice Dept are already succumbing- the Courts and Armed Forces will eventually succumb too.

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Response to Renew Deal (Reply #15)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 02:29 PM

46. In your scenario the democrats cave, yet again.

 

That is unacceptable.

If you aren’t ready to fight, at least get out of the way.

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Response to not_the_one (Reply #46)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 04:49 PM

53. I'm saying it's not worth it for them.

The country would go crazy.

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Response to live love laugh (Original post)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 01:34 PM

16. this is war against Democracy.

at this point, can a majority of the public and world even believe that trump (traitor) would get a majority of the votes?

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Response to live love laugh (Original post)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 01:35 PM

17. If he even TRIES this approach, it is time for a general strike and 247 million protesters

Given that 330M Americans make up the country, and at worst there are 25-30% deadenders in Trumpworld, EVERYONE else should be prepared to hit the streets and to shut down the entire money making enterprise of the United States of America until Trump is arrested and removed from power for an illegal attempt to subvert the vote and seize power.

And if he resists AT ALL - shoot him.

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Response to Moostache (Reply #17)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 01:45 PM

22. I agree

Then get rid of the republicans .

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Response to live love laugh (Original post)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 01:37 PM

19. Just stand back and look at all the confusion, rule changes and poll watcher threats...

of this election. It's something new every damned day.

Have we EVER had such confusion during an election in our history? Hell, have we had such confusion in our everyday governmental operation?

How can we ever get this election straightened out so we can pretty much agree that it ended up an election we can rely on...no matter the winner? (Of course, my hopes are definitely that Biden/Harris win, but with these clowns...) But, we do need to try to figure out what is ahead of us. Each day, the scenario is getting darker and darker.

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Response to live love laugh (Original post)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 01:38 PM

20. Wrong headline

Fixed it

Trump campaign discussing plans for coup if he loses the election: report

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Response to live love laugh (Original post)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 01:41 PM

21. Most states are adjourned for the year.

Don't know whether legislatures in each state have power to reconvene or if Governor needs to call them. But doubt anything can be done with the last 4 states with their legislatures divided.

AZ - Republican
FL - Republican
MI - divided control
NC - divided control
PA - divided control
WI - divided control

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Response to LiberalFighter (Reply #21)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 01:53 PM

26. It is legally past time for FL to change the law on this anyway

The date is sometime in September (cannot remember off the top of my head), so DeSantis and his Leg minions can't do anything anyway.

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Response to LiberalFighter (Reply #21)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 02:07 PM

35. Both chambers of the General Assembly are R controlled in PA

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Response to live love laugh (Original post)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 01:47 PM

23. Texas and its 38 electoral votes going to Biden at 11 PM eastern ends any thought of this nt

 

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Response to live love laugh (Original post)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 01:51 PM

25. third time posted TODAY alone

Please, give this a rest.

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Response to obamanut2012 (Reply #25)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 01:54 PM

27. Thanks I didn't know --will delete

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Response to live love laugh (Reply #27)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 01:56 PM

28. You should leave the post up. Posts rise and fall in the forum, so its hard to know every topic

 

covered and there is already good discussion about counter-actions.

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Response to liskddksil (Reply #28)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 01:58 PM

31. Ok 👍🏾

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Response to live love laugh (Original post)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 01:57 PM

29. This isn't going to happen

They may scheme and dream till the cows come home. Biden/Harris will win this thing by a sizable margin.

We vote. He loses. He leaves.

Whether he goes kicking and screaming is up to Trump and his enablers. But he still leaves.

The writing is on the wall.

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Response to live love laugh (Original post)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 02:10 PM

38. Would be framed as what...?

“...would be framed as protecting the will of the people.”

The “will of the people” is the national popular vote, that Republicans ignored in 2000, 2004, and 2016.

And continue to ignore when issue after issue of things Americans really want and demand, come before the Senate only to be BLOCKED because Senators representing a minority of citizens don’t like those issues.

Republicans like to talk about the majority, and “will of the nation” bullshit, but what we really have is minority rule because of:
A) The electoral college, and
B) The two Senators/state law.

Eventually, it’s going to blow.

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Response to live love laugh (Original post)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 02:15 PM

40. If the polls were showing Trump ahead or a close race, they would not be considering this.

This is a last gasp, desperate attempt to try anything to win.

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Response to live love laugh (Original post)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 04:06 PM

51. florida would hand everything to him

as Gov Ron might as well be his concubine.

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Response to live love laugh (Original post)

Tue Oct 6, 2020, 04:44 PM

52. Fear porn headline

 

SCOTUS has already ruled on faithless electors.

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