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Yavin4

(35,421 posts)
Sat Nov 14, 2020, 01:10 AM Nov 2020

How about "De-Militarize" the Police?

It's a police department, not an occupying army. So, there's no need for military grade weaponry or tanks or military style tactics like shock and awe.

But more importantly, just like we shouldn't use our military to solve international disputes when diplomacy is the much better alternative (see the Iran nuclear deal), we shouldn't use our police to solve social problems of unemployment, lack of education, lack of mental health care, etc.

So, no. Don't say "De-Fund the Police" which is a completely unrealistic, politically ignorant slogan. Say, "De-Militarize the Police" which means don't convert our police force into occupying armies.

Finally, end the drug war. That would go a long way towards putting certain populations in conflict with the police.

22 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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How about "De-Militarize" the Police? (Original Post) Yavin4 Nov 2020 OP
How about Reform the police? Zoonart Nov 2020 #1
"Reforming the police since 1970" wellst0nev0ter Nov 2020 #6
End qualified immunity questionseverything Nov 2020 #12
That's the ticket. Zoonart Nov 2020 #22
Those most likely to be injured by the police don't trust "reform," because Ms. Toad Nov 2020 #7
Both.. reform and de-militarize ananda Nov 2020 #17
This message was self-deleted by its author Guy Whitey Corngood Nov 2020 #2
Reform the police. I will follow the lead of Joe Biden, Jay Clyburn, and Stacy Abrams thank-you still_one Nov 2020 #3
Either work. And can be effective. GulfCoast66 Nov 2020 #4
reform the police (which obviously should include demilitarising them, but it goes unsaid, so less Celerity Nov 2020 #5
De-militarize the police is a necessary but not sufficient step. Ms. Toad Nov 2020 #8
If they have to go up against white wing militia, I'm OK with Hoyt Nov 2020 #9
They wouldn't go up against White militia Yavin4 Nov 2020 #14
Maybe. Good point. Some large cities are often on their own if white Hoyt Nov 2020 #15
I like it. It's a huge improvement over the incredibly dumb defund the police. brush Nov 2020 #10
"Re-imagine policing". I heard that said tonight by an activist. nt oasis Nov 2020 #11
Oh, I like that even better than mine! obamanut2012 Nov 2020 #19
That's the phrase I've been using since summer relayerbob Nov 2020 #13
I like Reboot, or Reset the police JCMach1 Nov 2020 #16
Demilitarize, Humanize, Rebudget, Reform, Reallocate obamanut2012 Nov 2020 #18
I'm all for ending the drug war, for sure. End Of The Road Nov 2020 #20
What's missing in this discussion genxlib Nov 2020 #21

Ms. Toad

(33,992 posts)
7. Those most likely to be injured by the police don't trust "reform," because
Sat Nov 14, 2020, 01:22 AM
Nov 2020

it never really results in any meaningful reform.

Response to Yavin4 (Original post)

GulfCoast66

(11,949 posts)
4. Either work. And can be effective.
Sat Nov 14, 2020, 01:20 AM
Nov 2020

Even many right wingers I know are tired of over aggressive cops.

They kill black folks. But many treat the white folks they stop like shit. They are too often high school graduates who saw police academy as the easiest way to make a living and live feeling like a winner in society. Not all I’ve known buy a long shot. But plenty.

Celerity

(43,096 posts)
5. reform the police (which obviously should include demilitarising them, but it goes unsaid, so less
Sat Nov 14, 2020, 01:20 AM
Nov 2020

provocative)

My fear is that the whole police issue is now considered so toxic that many will be afraid to do much of anything that will have true impact, and we will continue to have white power coppers murdering us PoC, which will in turn lead to more protests (with the RW going agent provocateur again to ensure violence) and the whole cycle starts all over again. There surely are multiple powerful motives for the RW to hope for more killings, as it presents more opportunities to frame us for another kneecapping, it feeds the fear of the other amongst white voters (when mass protests occur), plus they get their nazi bonus of more dead black and brown people.

Ms. Toad

(33,992 posts)
8. De-militarize the police is a necessary but not sufficient step.
Sat Nov 14, 2020, 01:30 AM
Nov 2020

Defund the police doesn't work for me - not because I disagree with the definition that many use (which is shifting money away from police to other resources more likely to create a truly safe community) - but becase to be effective slogans need (at least) two characteristics: (1) they have to require little to no explanation to convey the gist of what they mean and (2) those using the slogans have to largely agree on what they mean.

"Defund the police" instantly brings to mind taking all the money away from the police - and requires quite a bit of explanation to get to what is really meant - which brings us to the second problem: Many who use the slogan do - literally - mean take all the money away from the police. So some of those using the slogan are promoting the thing that many fear the most - while others are saying, "No, we don't really mean that!"

De-militarize the police is fine on both accounts, but even if we demilitarize the police that doesn't address the problem that existed long before police were militarized: police violence against (especially) minority individuals - and the corresponding lack of community support systems that would minimize the need/opportunities for police intervention.

 

Hoyt

(54,770 posts)
9. If they have to go up against white wing militia, I'm OK with
Sat Nov 14, 2020, 01:31 AM
Nov 2020

them having superior resources. If they are going after some kid or supposed petty criminal, not necessary.

Reform seems OK.

 

Hoyt

(54,770 posts)
15. Maybe. Good point. Some large cities are often on their own if white
Sat Nov 14, 2020, 02:24 AM
Nov 2020

wingers decide to cause a problem.

relayerbob

(6,537 posts)
13. That's the phrase I've been using since summer
Sat Nov 14, 2020, 02:19 AM
Nov 2020

Ia gree with our analysis. That's the issue, and that phrase focusses attention to the right location.

obamanut2012

(26,046 posts)
18. Demilitarize, Humanize, Rebudget, Reform, Reallocate
Sat Nov 14, 2020, 07:09 AM
Nov 2020

ALL of these work well.

I am 100% all for defunding the police, but that is a loser slogan and has been since the beginning. It didn't fly even with my friends and family who loathe what LEO are like in this country.

End Of The Road

(1,397 posts)
20. I'm all for ending the drug war, for sure.
Sat Nov 14, 2020, 07:53 AM
Nov 2020

I haven’t smoked marijuana since waaaay back in the day. I’d be a much happier camper if I had some now.

genxlib

(5,518 posts)
21. What's missing in this discussion
Sat Nov 14, 2020, 08:33 AM
Nov 2020

Is gun control.

One of the reasons that police are so heavily armed is because the population that they serve is increasingly more heavily armed.

One of the reasons that the police often escalate situations unnecessarily is that they have come to treat every interaction as potentially lethal.

Everything noted above is true and necessary but it really helps to acknowledge the source of the inherent conflict.

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