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edhopper

(33,552 posts)
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 10:19 AM Nov 2020

I hate to be a downer, bur we probably lost the House for a decade.

We only barely retained the House for the next two years. In 2022, the vote usually goes to the opposition Party. The GOP retained control of many States, and the Supreme Court has OKed gerrymandering. With this a Census year, like 2010, they can give themselves as many House districts as they want.
Sorry for the pessimism, but I don't see voters waking up to who the GOP are. If they backed the GOP this year, with the shit Trump pulled with the complete backing of the GOP, I don't see why they would move away from them in 2022.
Sorry for the pessimism, but that is the reality we face.

121 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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I hate to be a downer, bur we probably lost the House for a decade. (Original Post) edhopper Nov 2020 OP
I agree, but... AZ8theist Nov 2020 #1
That does the country little good, we nee all three uponit7771 Nov 2020 #2
Yes. But with the Senate, we can rebalance the courts... AZ8theist Nov 2020 #4
Sounds like stagnant government with expanded presidential Powers something I wouldn't want even wit uponit7771 Nov 2020 #5
Does that require the House too, though? Bonn1997 Nov 2020 #9
yes, you are 100% correct, it requires an Act of Congress Celerity Nov 2020 #17
It requires an act of Congress to change the numbers, BUT StarfishSaver Nov 2020 #70
yes, this is true, but the poster said rebalance the courts, which requires expansion Celerity Nov 2020 #74
True. But my point is that a Democratic Senate isn't useless. It matters StarfishSaver Nov 2020 #76
I never said it was useless, in fact the 2020 results are a huge reason for my semi-melancholy atm Celerity Nov 2020 #82
not if we lose the House, it takes an Act of Congress to expand the courts Celerity Nov 2020 #27
2022 US Senate 'in-play' races Celerity Nov 2020 #49
I don't see the Dems edhopper Nov 2020 #59
well, it will be hard if we wander into a 2010 (the last time a 1st term Dem POTUS had midterms) Celerity Nov 2020 #71
Without Trump on the ticket MAGAs don't show up like in 18 uponit7771 Nov 2020 #3
That is my hope. Laelth Nov 2020 #6
+1, and without reliable polling we will have no idea uponit7771 Nov 2020 #8
I'm not completely convinced that polling is that inacurrate. FoxNewsSucks Nov 2020 #11
Polls already "account" for gerrymandering davekriss Nov 2020 #63
I agree, plus there should be some Covid vaccines out, thus helping the economy, AND I expect a OnDoutside Nov 2020 #22
It was a COVID pandemic and Trump election, our policy was invisible bucolic_frolic Nov 2020 #57
+1 uponit7771 Nov 2020 #112
Biden's win was huge but long term is scary Bradshaw3 Nov 2020 #7
What happened down ballot the pollsters should be answering for ... uponit7771 Nov 2020 #10
I don't know enough about polling to suggest an answer Bradshaw3 Nov 2020 #107
Get rid of the voting machines and go to mail in paper ballots JCMach1 Nov 2020 #109
we worked like hell to get voters out.. trump just snapped his fingers... samnsara Nov 2020 #21
rightwing media is so pervasive and powerful is the problem LymphocyteLover Nov 2020 #44
Yep Cosmocat Nov 2020 #103
That is for sure Bradshaw3 Nov 2020 #108
Please stop... Demsrule86 Nov 2020 #12
I'm pessimistic but also feel that the force is with Biden/Harris. betsuni Nov 2020 #13
Yeah edhopper Nov 2020 #46
It's difficult to overcome a cult figure like Trump, along with the gerrymandering of districts. kentuck Nov 2020 #14
But they can't edhopper Nov 2020 #20
You are absolutely right calguy Nov 2020 #15
Far left messaging????????????????????? Ferrets are Cool Nov 2020 #19
Defunding the police for starters calguy Nov 2020 #26
Show me where those things are in The Democratic Platform. Ferrets are Cool Nov 2020 #29
So where did they get that lie? calguy Nov 2020 #41
No elected democrat said it. Some lefty activists said it. Not the same thing LymphocyteLover Nov 2020 #45
AOC: "Defunding the police means defunding the police." betsuni Nov 2020 #73
OK, fair enough LymphocyteLover Nov 2020 #78
The Right didn't say that, she did! betsuni Nov 2020 #80
From a sign in a street somewhere in America. Ferrets are Cool Nov 2020 #92
The media loves extremes. If one person shouts "Defund the police!" the media treats it like it is CTyankee Nov 2020 #56
The media always follows edhopper Nov 2020 #62
Do you think it is because the members of the media are aligned politically with the GOP or just CTyankee Nov 2020 #65
A lot of reasons edhopper Nov 2020 #83
I have noticed some push back from journalists about what you refer to as fear of being seen as CTyankee Nov 2020 #89
Then "somehow" we must persuade them that being viewed as LIBERAL is a good thing. Ferrets are Cool Nov 2020 #94
That would be a good start edhopper Nov 2020 #100
Good post. Ferrets are Cool Nov 2020 #93
The voters we need to reach edhopper Nov 2020 #54
How do you fix a lying propaganda machine Ed? Ferrets are Cool Nov 2020 #96
No not caused by them edhopper Nov 2020 #97
AOC: "Defunding the police means defunding the police." betsuni Nov 2020 #72
Back to my main point. It is NOT a Democratic Platform Issue. Ferrets are Cool Nov 2020 #98
"Far left" Yeehah Nov 2020 #32
Elections are won and lost in the middle calguy Nov 2020 #36
we do appeal to the middle-- and I don't see how modern Republicans appeal to the middle LymphocyteLover Nov 2020 #48
The vote results don't reflect it. calguy Nov 2020 #113
I dunno. Dems win the popular vote regularly since 1992. LymphocyteLover Nov 2020 #116
That is why the fight for the house starts now MacKasey Nov 2020 #16
This it is the job of Democratic politicians to prove that it is better to vote for them than Ferrets are Cool Nov 2020 #18
Absolutely correct! MacKasey Nov 2020 #23
+1 Ferrets are Cool Nov 2020 #25
How could they prove it though? betsuni Nov 2020 #28
Actions? Ferrets are Cool Nov 2020 #34
We need to dramatically overhaul our democratic consultancy. Blue_true Nov 2020 #39
While I agree with your first paragraph, the second one is a bit problematic. Ferrets are Cool Nov 2020 #47
I agree moose65 Nov 2020 #79
I think we need to make more substantive changes than that - like changes in Democratic leadership. Midwestern Democrat Nov 2020 #110
We can do that and generally are successful with people we can reach LymphocyteLover Nov 2020 #50
"...but I don't see voters waking up to who the GOP are." Me either, and it's a big problem. ooky Nov 2020 #24
Our side does a horrible job with messaging. Blue_true Nov 2020 #42
But they won't have the Trump-fueled voter energy in 2022. marmar Nov 2020 #30
DU never failed to disappoint in its servings of pessimism Sunsky Nov 2020 #31
Were you one of those that promissed edhopper Nov 2020 #38
No. Sunsky Nov 2020 #90
Boohoohoohoo!!!! Yeehah Nov 2020 #33
That's it. edhopper Nov 2020 #40
You have predicted the future. Yeehah Nov 2020 #105
Sure edhopper Nov 2020 #114
How about we actually enjoy the win today? Takket Nov 2020 #35
Demographics continue to be with us and against Republicans Tom Rinaldo Nov 2020 #37
Currently edhopper Nov 2020 #43
I don't at all see it as a big win this time, except in one key regard Tom Rinaldo Nov 2020 #51
Our House majority is just one seat? moose65 Nov 2020 #77
Hence "currently" edhopper Nov 2020 #81
I'd say it depends on how much Republicans deliberaly sabotage anything Biden tries to do Silent3 Nov 2020 #69
Maybe, maybe not. We fucking need to work our asses off in 2022 because there LymphocyteLover Nov 2020 #52
Then don't be a fuckin' downer. Happy Hoosier Nov 2020 #53
We have to stop trying to motivate the faithful and find the non-voters bucolic_frolic Nov 2020 #55
Wow Me. Nov 2020 #58
The house is up every election karynnj Nov 2020 #60
Gone, maybe 20 years. All hope gone. End of the Repubkic grantcart Nov 2020 #61
Start Right Now.... essaynnc Nov 2020 #64
This Cosmocat Nov 2020 #104
No we need to celebrate now dustyscamp Nov 2020 #111
Assuming the green guy is the sarcasm emoji?? essaynnc Nov 2020 #121
Remind the GOP what they did in 2020 to win 2022 SmartVoter22 Nov 2020 #66
How will the Suburban shift effect Gerrymandering? judeling Nov 2020 #67
Biden's win IS a WIN! BlueWavePsych Nov 2020 #68
No. It's only "the reality we face" if we let it be that. nt mtnsnake Nov 2020 #75
Did we "let" the GOP keep the Senate edhopper Nov 2020 #84
How about we give the Biden administration a chance before we start making doomsday predictions mtnsnake Nov 2020 #95
And the gerrymandering, purging and voter suppression? edhopper Nov 2020 #99
JFC... SidDithers Nov 2020 #85
Yep edhopper Nov 2020 #86
+1 treestar Nov 2020 #88
We just barely defeated edhopper Nov 2020 #101
JFC treestar Nov 2020 #87
RepublicansParty of the Rich czarjak Nov 2020 #91
If Democrats who up for the election, we will be fine. What exactly does a post like this Demsrule86 Nov 2020 #102
Democrats need to gerrymander the shit out of places where they have control Eid Ma Clack Shaw Nov 2020 #106
Respectfully Disagree Aepps22 Nov 2020 #115
I think it is way to early to be a downer about 2022 and beyond. Too many variables to list but two yellowcanine Nov 2020 #117
And I would add keeping our promises to young people on global warming. yellowcanine Nov 2020 #119
The electorate overall will change dramatically in the coming decade as the Boomers die off and Yavin4 Nov 2020 #118
But the Republican party is dead sarisataka Nov 2020 #120

AZ8theist

(5,447 posts)
4. Yes. But with the Senate, we can rebalance the courts...
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 10:27 AM
Nov 2020

Unfortunately, losing the House will have Gym Jordan and Vladimr Nunes leading endless IDIOTIC investigations....

uponit7771

(90,329 posts)
5. Sounds like stagnant government with expanded presidential Powers something I wouldn't want even wit
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 10:30 AM
Nov 2020

.... a Democratic president

Bonn1997

(1,675 posts)
9. Does that require the House too, though?
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 10:33 AM
Nov 2020

Wouldn’t a law changing the number of justices on the Supreme Court need to be passed?

 

StarfishSaver

(18,486 posts)
70. It requires an act of Congress to change the numbers, BUT
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 11:39 AM
Nov 2020

A Democratic Senate can help Biden fill vacancies that come up during his term, which is a good start.

Celerity

(43,255 posts)
74. yes, this is true, but the poster said rebalance the courts, which requires expansion
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 11:45 AM
Nov 2020

replacing Breyer with another liberal still leaves us down 6-3

and there are few lower court vacancies after Rump and Moscow have rammed through so many asshats

Celerity

(43,255 posts)
49. 2022 US Senate 'in-play' races
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 11:20 AM
Nov 2020

Last edited Sun Nov 15, 2020, 12:13 PM - Edit history (1)

At-Risk (even if marginal) Dems

In order of risk

Georgia (IF Warnock wins the runoff with Loeffler)
Nevada Catherine Cortez Masto (Brian Sandoval would be by far the toughest Rethug to beat from what I see)
Arizona Mark Kelly (It will not be McSally running against him, lolol)
New Hampshire Maggie Hassan (her two strongest opponents would probably be Former Senator Kelly Ayotte and Governor Sununu)
Vermont Patrick Leahy (IF he retires, the very popular Rethug Governor Phil Scott may prove to be trouble)
Colorado Michael Bennet (I see little chance for him to lose)


Possible Rethug Flips

In order of risk

North Carolina Open Seat Jeff Jackson FTW
Pennsylvania Open Seat Tom Wolf FTW (he is term limited)
Wisconsin Ron Johnson (asshat deluxe, I fucking hate this clown) Mandela Barnes FTW
Georgia Loeffler (unless we win it in the runoff) Sally Yates or Jason Carter perhaps, too early to tell
Florida Marco Rubio Val Demmings, or perhaps Charlie Crist or Stephanie Murphy or Gwen Graham
Iowa Chuck Grassley (may retire he will turn 90yo in the first year of his next term if he runs, if he retires we have a good shot, Vilsack should run, he should have ran in 2020, or perhaps Axne)
Kansas Jerry Moran Only shot we have, and it would be a decent one, is if Sibelius runs this time, she should have ran in 2020) If she refuses again, forget winning this seat, and it still will be hard even if she does
Kentucky Rand Paul (fucking berk)
Ohio Rob Portman
Indiana Todd Young (no clue if Buttigieg would try, Indiana is SO Red now, ffs)
Missouri Roy Blunt

Celerity

(43,255 posts)
71. well, it will be hard if we wander into a 2010 (the last time a 1st term Dem POTUS had midterms)
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 11:40 AM
Nov 2020

style maelstrom.

Republicans gained seven seats in the Senate (including a special election held in January 2010) but failed to gain a majority in the chamber. In the House of Representatives, Republicans won a net gain of 63 seats, the largest shift in seats since the 1948 elections. In state elections, Republicans won a net gain of six gubernatorial seats and flipped control of twenty state legislative chambers, giving them a substantial advantage in the redistricting that occurred following the 2010 United States Census.


I cannot see it being anywhere near THAT bad though, and I think we have great shots at flipping PA and NC. Wolf and Jackson are superb candidates.

Wisconsin Ron Johnson
Georgia Loeffler (unless we win it in the runoff)
Florida Marco Rubio
Iowa (if Grassley retires)

are decent chances as well

FoxNewsSucks

(10,428 posts)
11. I'm not completely convinced that polling is that inacurrate.
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 10:36 AM
Nov 2020

There's no way a poll can account for voter suppression and gerrymandering. I think the simple explanation is that polls are fairly accurate, represent what the public does want, and the difference is due to republicon methods of cheating & stealing.

davekriss

(4,616 posts)
63. Polls already "account" for gerrymandering
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 11:30 AM
Nov 2020

Doesn’t gerrymandering refer to the drawing up of congressional districts in a manner that maximizes outcomes for one party? This is done once every 10 years by the state legislatures. The likely mix of Repub/Dems in the House of Representatives is thereafter set for a decade. So what is important here is who wins the state houses, and we did meh there.

What the polls do not account for is the cheating. Nate Silver made it clear before the election that he was confident that his model did a good measure of the will of the people, but warned that it did not take in to account the illegalities of voter suppression, voter role tweaking, man-in-the-middle vote count manipulation, and the so on. Even with that, his model was pretty good: it picked the winners that Biden needed to win right past the tipping point (Pennsylvania being the tipping point) and a few more (Arizona, Georgia).

Nates models were not as good when predicting outcomes for the Senate and House.

OnDoutside

(19,949 posts)
22. I agree, plus there should be some Covid vaccines out, thus helping the economy, AND I expect a
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 10:56 AM
Nov 2020

Biden administration to lift the tariffs, which will demonstrably help farmers (even better if they can give reliefs to small farmers rather than big farm corporations).

Bradshaw3

(7,495 posts)
7. Biden's win was huge but long term is scary
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 10:30 AM
Nov 2020

What happened down ballot not just in Congress but in the statehouses was the opposite of what was expected: a change election for Democrats and democracy. Losing House seats, likely failing to flip the Senate and not winning statehouses after the kind of incompetence and divisiveness the repubs displayed the last four years is disheartening for the future. We can't keep our heads in the sand and deny what happened (for example me being told on here that Tom Perez did a great job) or Democrats will again be just holding on when they should be running things.

uponit7771

(90,329 posts)
10. What happened down ballot the pollsters should be answering for ...
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 10:36 AM
Nov 2020

.... No other country puts up with polling does bad for so long tilted towards one political party we need answers from these posters they know what's up or should if they're worth a damn

Bradshaw3

(7,495 posts)
107. I don't know enough about polling to suggest an answer
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 01:47 PM
Nov 2020

Do you know polling from other countries and how it's better? I haven't read a good answer as to why it was off but regardless Dems lost and maybe improved polling would help target races and issues in the future.

JCMach1

(27,555 posts)
109. Get rid of the voting machines and go to mail in paper ballots
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 01:54 PM
Nov 2020

And see what happens.

All you need to do.

samnsara

(17,615 posts)
21. we worked like hell to get voters out.. trump just snapped his fingers...
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 10:55 AM
Nov 2020

...but I would rather be someone who has independent thought and critical thinking than be a Stepford wife.

Bradshaw3

(7,495 posts)
108. That is for sure
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 01:50 PM
Nov 2020

I just hope the critical thinkers are the ones in charge in the future. We've seen what a lack of intelligent approaches to problems has dome to our people and it does not bode well if the venal idiots get back in charge.

betsuni

(25,447 posts)
13. I'm pessimistic but also feel that the force is with Biden/Harris.
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 10:38 AM
Nov 2020

Of course a lot of people will blame Democrats for not fixing everything in two years, same as they always do.

kentuck

(111,072 posts)
14. It's difficult to overcome a cult figure like Trump, along with the gerrymandering of districts.
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 10:38 AM
Nov 2020

If Democrats can do something about the gerrymandering, I think they will be in good shape.

calguy

(5,304 posts)
15. You are absolutely right
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 10:42 AM
Nov 2020

I keep saying if the dems don't learn how to temper their far left messaging they will continue to scare off the moderate votes required to sustain a solid majority going forward.

Ferrets are Cool

(21,105 posts)
19. Far left messaging?????????????????????
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 10:51 AM
Nov 2020

JUST STOP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Show me FAR LEFT MESSAGING in our Democratic Platform. I DARE YOU.

calguy

(5,304 posts)
26. Defunding the police for starters
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 11:00 AM
Nov 2020

Reparations is also a big loser. Free college also doesn't fly in middle America. I could go on and on.
I'm not saying these things are bad. I am saying that a whole lot of people we need to vote for us think they are bad. Until we learn to communicate our message without scaring the shit out of a large segment of voters, voters we NEED, then it's going to be a lot harder to win. It's all how we communicate.

Ferrets are Cool

(21,105 posts)
29. Show me where those things are in The Democratic Platform.
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 11:04 AM
Nov 2020

Find me ONE PLACE in our Platform where we indicate that we want to DEFUND THE POLICE. You can't do it because it doesn't exist.
It is a LIE of the repug party. They LIE, LIE and LIE and people fall for it. They say ONE time that a LIE came from the far left extremists and people believe it. Just STOP.

calguy

(5,304 posts)
41. So where did they get that lie?
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 11:15 AM
Nov 2020

Some democrat somewhere said it. The GOP uses it to brand every democrat as being for. It's a lie. But it works.
I rest my case.

LymphocyteLover

(5,640 posts)
45. No elected democrat said it. Some lefty activists said it. Not the same thing
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 11:19 AM
Nov 2020

the problem is rightwing media

betsuni

(25,447 posts)
80. The Right didn't say that, she did!
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 11:58 AM
Nov 2020

Democrats are always criticized for "giving ammunition" to Republicans, often for things they have no control over. This wasn't that.

Ferrets are Cool

(21,105 posts)
92. From a sign in a street somewhere in America.
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 12:39 PM
Nov 2020

How the hell are Democratic politicians supposed to control what people see on the streets? But yes, this "case" is closed because you don't have one. Have a great day.

CTyankee

(63,900 posts)
56. The media loves extremes. If one person shouts "Defund the police!" the media treats it like it is
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 11:24 AM
Nov 2020

THE major issue. So our party's job during the Biden Administration will be to disabuse the media of this notion. It's as simple, and as difficult, as that. We need prominently placed stories in the media about how communities are working with the police departments to improve community relations. Lift up the conversation to cooperation, understanding and shared values.We need the help of artists, song writers, reporters for both print and other communications media (all of them) to publish responsibly and truthfully.

I think we can engage academia in this effort. We have many communications media courses and majors in our country, state universities and community colleges, who can undertake this task.

Things do not have to be static, unmoving. We can and must change the rhetoric.

CTyankee

(63,900 posts)
65. Do you think it is because the members of the media are aligned politically with the GOP or just
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 11:33 AM
Nov 2020

that its stories are more sellable to the the American public?

If you watch "Morning Joe" you hear more from regulars who write for the NYT, the Washington Post, and other print and electronic media. That show seems to be extremely popular. Joe Scarborough is forthright in telling his story about moving away from the GOP and now and Independent. And he regularly explains why, how the "party left" him, not the other way around.

Look, this is not going to be easy but media who are sympathetic to our Democratic values must be nurtured and heard. And the more the Right goes after Joe S. the louder our voices become.

edhopper

(33,552 posts)
83. A lot of reasons
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 12:02 PM
Nov 2020

including their messaging is better, but also the media's fear of being seen as "liberal" so they err in giving the GOP side of things.

CTyankee

(63,900 posts)
89. I have noticed some push back from journalists about what you refer to as fear of being seen as
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 12:12 PM
Nov 2020

liberal. They often protest that what they report is the truth. They get huffy about it. I see a lot of disgust on their faces. And often they come right out and blame RW outlets by name, or they just say that a lie is a lie. Rachel does that and she has an hour long show. So do some others who are prominent on MSNBC.

edhopper

(33,552 posts)
54. The voters we need to reach
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 11:23 AM
Nov 2020

do not read the Dem platform. They see these topic talked about in the media. Defunding the Police, no matter how much of a bullshit nonissue it was, lost us votes.
I dare you to show me how this was not a big topic in the media and hung around the Democrats.

Ferrets are Cool

(21,105 posts)
96. How do you fix a lying propaganda machine Ed?
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 12:43 PM
Nov 2020

This was and is NOT a problem caused by Democratic politicians. And I dare YOU to prove to me that it was.

Ferrets are Cool

(21,105 posts)
98. Back to my main point. It is NOT a Democratic Platform Issue.
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 12:47 PM
Nov 2020

I don't know how to stop the MSM from treating the liberal message as somehow EVIL. It is quite clear that the EVIL comes from the right. Caging kids and ignoring a pandemic which has killed a quarter of a million Americans is largely ignored while they spend hours and hours on a line that was said by ONE politician and a few protesters that may or may not have been Democratic voters.
Somehow we must make the msm to understand that it's ok to be viewed as Liberal because WE are on the side of honesty and compassion.

calguy

(5,304 posts)
36. Elections are won and lost in the middle
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 11:12 AM
Nov 2020

If you can't appeal to those in the middle, you won't be winning many elections.

calguy

(5,304 posts)
113. The vote results don't reflect it.
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 02:54 PM
Nov 2020

Both sides appeal to the middle. They have been appealing to more of them than we are historically speaking.

LymphocyteLover

(5,640 posts)
116. I dunno. Dems win the popular vote regularly since 1992.
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 03:57 PM
Nov 2020

gerrymandering, vote suppression, the electoral college, FoxNews and a false sense of balance from the MSM seems to be what keeps us from winning more, from what I can tell.

MacKasey

(986 posts)
16. That is why the fight for the house starts now
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 10:45 AM
Nov 2020

With Jamie Harrison leading the way

Using the Stacy Abrams model

Ferrets are Cool

(21,105 posts)
18. This it is the job of Democratic politicians to prove that it is better to vote for them than
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 10:50 AM
Nov 2020

the repugs. Yes, our country is filled with a LOT of hate and racism, but it is slowly dying out. I will NOT lose hope.

Ferrets are Cool

(21,105 posts)
34. Actions?
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 11:09 AM
Nov 2020

I don't have the answers. But our politicians must do two things. Prove with actions that we work for the people of America AND hire people like The Lincoln Project to get OUR message out. That part can't be as hard as we seem to think it is. We also have to stop "going high". That only lets the repugs walk all over us.

Blue_true

(31,261 posts)
39. We need to dramatically overhaul our democratic consultancy.
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 11:14 AM
Nov 2020

Democratic consultants seem to routinely miss key and important opportunities. Republicans claim to be better for business, investment and taxes, yet over 100 years of historical results show that is a lie, yet democratic consultants routinely fail to research the historical record and then crystallize the findings into clear imagery that the average man and woman can understand.

We also must figure out how to not nominate candidates that have skeletons in their closets or who are actively doing things that will turn off voters, risqué works for republicans, but it doesn’t work for us. Democratic voters actually value values such as morals and integrity, if push comes to shove, they won’t fully back a candidate in a General election who has negative things being uncovered on him or her.

Ferrets are Cool

(21,105 posts)
47. While I agree with your first paragraph, the second one is a bit problematic.
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 11:19 AM
Nov 2020

Al didn't have any skeletons in his closet, yet he was still pushed from the party. That was wrong then and is still wrong today.
Yes, the hypocrisy is glaring when it comes to Repug voters. I don't know how to fix that.
And we will never rid ourselves of the occasional stupid candidate who decides it's a good thing to have an affair during his or her candidacy.

moose65

(3,166 posts)
79. I agree
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 11:53 AM
Nov 2020

Those “consultants” have been costing us seats for 10 years.

They are the ones who told candidates to run from Obama in 2010 and 2014.

They are the ones who constantly tell Dems that they have to moderate their views to appeal to Republicans.

How’s that working out so far??

110. I think we need to make more substantive changes than that - like changes in Democratic leadership.
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 02:06 PM
Nov 2020

One of the biggest cop out lines put out by a flailing business is "It's not the product, it's the salesmen" - i.e. our product and our executive leadership is just fine - it's just the salesmen that suck - well, there's comes a point when you can't get away with that line anymore.

I know there won't be any changes of substance this year, but if 2022 goes bad, I certainly hope everything is on the table - I mean, how many times can you watch the same movie and be shocked that the hero dies at the end?

LymphocyteLover

(5,640 posts)
50. We can do that and generally are successful with people we can reach
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 11:21 AM
Nov 2020

hard to reach rural Americans glued to FoxNews and conservative media

ooky

(8,920 posts)
24. "...but I don't see voters waking up to who the GOP are." Me either, and it's a big problem.
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 10:58 AM
Nov 2020

It seems to me that we can either wait decades for demographic changes to sort it out or find an effective way of telling voters who the GOP are ourselves. I prefer the latter, so we don't die waiting for the demographics to change. The GOP has no problem telling voters who we are, Fox News does it everyday. We know it's all lies, but that doesn't seem to matter to those who keep watching Fox News and keep voting for the GOP. We need to find a way to counter that other than just trying to outvote them every election.

Blue_true

(31,261 posts)
42. Our side does a horrible job with messaging.
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 11:16 AM
Nov 2020

Republicans claim to be better in a number of areas that they are not, and our messaging allows them to win the day with their lies.

marmar

(77,066 posts)
30. But they won't have the Trump-fueled voter energy in 2022.
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 11:05 AM
Nov 2020

His cult might be delusional, but they are energetic.

Sunsky

(1,737 posts)
31. DU never failed to disappoint in its servings of pessimism
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 11:06 AM
Nov 2020

Pessimism doesn't equate to realism. Instead of being negative, those with that thought process should help us make sure it is not so. Instead of distributing doom and gloom, be a motivational force to help us retain the house. We did retain the house this year (even with those sleeping voters who are unaware of who the GOP are and other conditions you've laid out), though we lost seats and we can retain the house in two years. It will be challenging but not impossible.

The new Democratic-led House hasn't even begun yet some of us are predicting a loss for the next one to come. Sigh.

edhopper

(33,552 posts)
38. Were you one of those that promissed
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 11:14 AM
Nov 2020

we would win the Senate and gain in the House.
In this case, what I describe is real, it is just a depressing reality.

Sunsky

(1,737 posts)
90. No.
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 12:26 PM
Nov 2020

Because I can promise nothing, that's realism. I cannot promise victory or defeat but I'll do my part to shift the odds in our favor.
Our definition of what is real seems to differ. What I've read here is pessimism.

Takket

(21,550 posts)
35. How about we actually enjoy the win today?
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 11:10 AM
Nov 2020

Instead of lamenting a loss in two years?

You haven’t even given Biden a chance to show the country he and our party can lead.

Tom Rinaldo

(22,912 posts)
37. Demographics continue to be with us and against Republicans
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 11:12 AM
Nov 2020

And Republicans already gerrymandered districts after the last census, while they retained control of more state legislatures than control even now, post 2020 election. They can't gerrymander districts more to their liking than they already have, and they still lost the House in 2018, and with the whole House up for reelection in 2020, Democrats still won a majority of seats there.

If all things stayed equal, the continued diversification of our nation and the aging out of a set of voters much more friendly to Republicans than the emerging younger generations bodes poorly for Republicans. But in the end it always comes down to turnout.

edhopper

(33,552 posts)
43. Currently
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 11:17 AM
Nov 2020

our majority is just one seat. And we don't have the Senate.
I see that as 2018 saved our ass, not a big win this time.

Tom Rinaldo

(22,912 posts)
51. I don't at all see it as a big win this time, except in one key regard
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 11:22 AM
Nov 2020

But in light of that one big regard, 2020 saved our ass even bigger time. Yes, 2022 is shaping up to be a critical contest.

moose65

(3,166 posts)
77. Our House majority is just one seat?
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 11:51 AM
Nov 2020

Nope.

Currently Dems have 219, and there are 13 seats that haven’t been called. At least 3 of those have the Dem leading at the moment. Dems will probably end up with 222-225 seats when it’s all over.

Silent3

(15,181 posts)
69. I'd say it depends on how much Republicans deliberaly sabotage anything Biden tries to do
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 11:37 AM
Nov 2020

And how much bad shit comes out, that we haven't learned yet, about what Trump's been doing for the last four years.

I can see plenty of ways for this to go either way. The most positive scenario is that we come out of the pandemic and the economy improves a lot, and that has people happy with Democrats two years from now.

On top of that Trump, and his many enablers will possibly be caught at (and hopefully many convicted for) crimes committed these past few years, creating enough scandal and disgrace that some of it even breaks through to a small, but electorially significant, number of Republican voters.

LymphocyteLover

(5,640 posts)
52. Maybe, maybe not. We fucking need to work our asses off in 2022 because there
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 11:22 AM
Nov 2020

are a HUGE number of senate seats we could win if we get our act together and keeping the house is critical.

Happy Hoosier

(7,274 posts)
53. Then don't be a fuckin' downer.
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 11:22 AM
Nov 2020

Joe and Kamala aren’t even sworn in yet and we’re already swamped with infighting and doom and gloom! FFS, keep it together people!!!!

bucolic_frolic

(43,115 posts)
55. We have to stop trying to motivate the faithful and find the non-voters
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 11:23 AM
Nov 2020

Slick and expensive mail fliers is not reaching potential new Democrats. It's more about fundraising.

karynnj

(59,501 posts)
60. The house is up every election
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 11:26 AM
Nov 2020

The reason that the party in power usually loses seats in the mid term is because most of the time they won the very close races as they won the Presidency. This time, we came in with the seats defined in 2018 when we won almost every close district. In the 2020 election, BOTH sides brought more people out. Every district is a microcosm with its own characteristics.

Where we could have a problem is if things - health and or economy - are seen to be worse and getting even worse than they were under Donald Trump. In fact, covid IS getting worse right now. While fighting the spread of the virus is the number one thing that needs to be done, the peak of covid is likely in the future when Biden is President. We need to make sure that we do better on communications than we have often done. If we take the right steps, by 2022, the covid pandemic will have receded substantially. (I wonder if winter 21/22 might be very very important. We need it to be far less bad than this winter. )

One problem we might have is that the Trump tax cuts, which are unsustainable. Economically, these tax cuts were a stimulus - at a time when the economy did not need it. While more money went to the top 1%, most people got at least a small gain - other than upper middle class and higher people in states like NY, NJ, CT and CA who had their mortgage and state taxes deduction capped. (Trump et al used that in the elections when they said that "ending the Trump tax cut would be bad for the middle class" - note that the states where people were hurt are reliably blue.) Trump's "strong" economy claims all flow from that tax cut. (He throws in the decrease in regulations.)

I expect that the Republicans will suddenly - en masse - see that the deficit has sky rocketed. They will likely blame it on the extra money spent in covid relief, ignoring that the deficit started to rise before the pandemic. When the tax cut was passed, they used the usual Republican voodoo economics to claim that the tax cut would lead to higher tax revenue because it would stimulate the economy enough to recoup tax revenue lost to lower rates. (Remember in 2009 that the House and Senate both had to find savings and small tax increases to make ACA revenue neutral - even as it provided great benefits to the country?)

I suspect the Republican will fight to preserve ALL of the Trump tax cuts, while arguing against any new programs and for actually cutting existing programs. We need to fight that by making people understand the choice - restoring the tax rates for the wealthy versus cuts that hurt people already hurting and not NOW having the stimulus when it IS needed.

The next few years won't be easy. So much needs to be fixed and the sources of faux news have increased exponentially.

essaynnc

(801 posts)
64. Start Right Now....
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 11:31 AM
Nov 2020

Every m-f year, the repubs control the messaging and stick us with their lables... defund the police, John Kerry is a coward, we're baby killers, crooked Hillary, tax and spend democrats, etc, etc. and they repeat it untill it sinks in. I'm not sure that I've ever heard anything like a slogan come from the democrats. We've already got the platform, and it's a good one. let's use it, come up with sound bites and use them...advertising campaigns from the get go..START NOW

dustyscamp

(2,223 posts)
111. No we need to celebrate now
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 02:28 PM
Nov 2020

Save the planning, messaging, gotv for the last minute. Trump & the GOP will do the same

essaynnc

(801 posts)
121. Assuming the green guy is the sarcasm emoji??
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 07:06 PM
Nov 2020

yes, we are pretty good at waiting untill the last moment, just like the republicans DON'T !!!!!

SmartVoter22

(639 posts)
66. Remind the GOP what they did in 2020 to win 2022
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 11:33 AM
Nov 2020

You are right, under normal circumstances. But, and that is a big but...
the pandemic, Trump's legal issues and GOP inaction will continue until 2022. Those will be the news and the moderate Republican voter is not likely to see all that as favorable. I expect Dems will have an advantage, as many GOP Senators have claimed retirement for 2022.

We must remind the moderate GOP voter what that party did in 2020 and 2019, 2018 and 2017.
They failed to kill off the ACA, failed on North Korea, Russia and Trump's China trade deal never materialized.
We must also remind voters, with your normal circumstances, that the GOP failed to prevent the same thing they tell us every election, and those are:

1) We are all gonna die, become a socialist state and/or reinstate a monarchy.

2) Immigrants will rape & kill everyone, because world immigration to the US only goes through Mexico?

3) The economy will collapse, the dollar will have Lenin's portrait on it and the deep state will let it happen.

4) Benghazi, or Hillary's back or watch out for that FDR guy- he's a troublemaker.

By 2022, the Trump legal issues will have dominated the news. Trump will drag those out as long as he can. It may take until 2022, for the rape allegations to be heard in court which should affect Evangelical voters. His taxes and shady banking likely will have been exposed. The RNC may have gone into illegal territory, too.
I hope Biden can seat a full Federal Elections Commission which will investigate, the current and future claims, that Trump intentionally avoided, by not seating a full commission.

judeling

(1,086 posts)
67. How will the Suburban shift effect Gerrymandering?
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 11:35 AM
Nov 2020

Far from losing the house for a Decade I expect we will gain seats and establish a firm governing majority.

First look at the landscape. To begin the states are pretty much already at max gerrymander. A legislature will be hard pressed to concentrate or urban core vote any more then it already is. Last cycle the GOP was able to play offense with gerrymandering, this cycle because of both demographics and internal migration they will be playing defense. Their rural base has gotten redder, but also smaller in other words they have concentrated themselves just as the Urban shift concentrated us. The immediate effect will be to make the purple house seats we have gained Bluer and the purple hose seat they hold slightly redder at best. However the trends will be in place and those red tinged purple seats will become the next battle grounds. The best they can hope to do is to fight a retreat until the Party is able to shift more towards the center.
That is true nationally as well. The Sunbelt is getting bluer as it gains population. The Rustbelt is not getting any Redder and indeed is likely to get Bluer also. Look at both Minnesota and Michigan. They have finished the sorting and back to Blue solidly the rest of the Midwest is likely to follow (if slowly). The seats they are likely to lose will turn out to be Red and the seats the Sunbelt gains are likely to be blue.

Next, we are going to be coming out of the pandemic. There will be a positive wave flowing. The nature of both the health and economic crisis favors Democratic solutions. Part of the general resistance to active measures to help that Trump and the GOP have shown is that the possible actions are at there core detrimental to their narrative. But we are likely to see the GDP rise over the next two years at a 4-5 percent range instead of trend in the 2-3 percent range we have seen. That alone will solidify our gains.

So looking ahead 2022 is more likely to resemble 1934 then the normal mid-term. At least modest if not robust gains by the party in power.

mtnsnake

(22,236 posts)
95. How about we give the Biden administration a chance before we start making doomsday predictions
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 12:42 PM
Nov 2020

I understand your concern, but 2 years from now the voters are going to judge things on what's going on in 2022, not what went on during the reign of Trump. Come election time in 2022, if Biden is doing well in the voters eyes, then it will be reflected in the outcome of the races. I would rather speculate that Biden is going to be successful, and if he is, we'll not only increase our House numbers but we'll get a strong hold on the Senate as well.

edhopper

(33,552 posts)
99. And the gerrymandering, purging and voter suppression?
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 12:47 PM
Nov 2020

Noe that they have control of most States? What about that?

edhopper

(33,552 posts)
101. We just barely defeated
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 12:51 PM
Nov 2020

the worst President in American History. And I am not talking the EC. The margins in the popular vote were too close for comfort. You have more faith in the voters than I do.

treestar

(82,383 posts)
87. JFC
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 12:07 PM
Nov 2020

The HOUSE? It's the one thing that is at least on its face Democratic. There's no hard and fast rule that it has to go to the opposition two years later. It stayed R through Bush's term. It's also not a hard and fast rule that incumbents always win. We just prove that does not have to be. Or whoever wins Iowa wins the primary.

This is practically superstition.

czarjak

(11,266 posts)
91. RepublicansParty of the Rich
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 12:39 PM
Nov 2020

Republican policies only benefit the rich. If you’re not rich and voting Republican, you’re slitting your own throat. None of my business though?

Demsrule86

(68,539 posts)
102. If Democrats who up for the election, we will be fine. What exactly does a post like this
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 12:56 PM
Nov 2020

achieve...Jesus. Biden isn't hasn't been inaugurated yet. I am trashing this.

Eid Ma Clack Shaw

(490 posts)
106. Democrats need to gerrymander the shit out of places where they have control
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 01:12 PM
Nov 2020

There shouldn’t be a congressional district in New York State that doesn’t run through Manhattan or the Bronx and California's Dem-stacked redistricting commission needs to take a similar view when it comes to ensuring the likes of Darrell Issa need an 80-20 win in Compton to stand a chance of losing by a point.

Gerrymandering is a disgrace, it should not be allowed to happen but it will never, ever get any better while there is no incentive for Republicans to come to the table. The road to a national consensus on the issue begins by playing them at their own game.

Aepps22

(166 posts)
115. Respectfully Disagree
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 03:05 PM
Nov 2020

I'm actually very pleased with the election results and I'm more positive than negative on what the Dems did. With all of the Gerrymandering, cheating and lies to get the type of turnout we did was Amazing. Losing some of the house races was a direct result of the Trump wave in red districts. Hard to win when their Obama is on the ballot. The only Senate race that was a disappointment was the Susan Collins race. I don't think Maine has the minority demographics to drive up the votes in the city which hurt Sara Gideon but the polling was totally off in that state. Cal Cunningham in NC wasn't going to win because he was running too far behind Joe and Joe didn't beat Trump there. The fact that Joe won Georgia is amazing and points to the future. We turn NC and GA blue. We keep the blue wall intact though I recognize the margins will be tight, keep GA and AZ blue we have a great path. We need to make sure that we keep our promises to Black and Latino voters and we will be fine.

yellowcanine

(35,698 posts)
117. I think it is way to early to be a downer about 2022 and beyond. Too many variables to list but two
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 04:03 PM
Nov 2020

big ones are no Trump and more and more young people becoming old enough to vote and getting inspired to vote. A strong environmental program will win their votes.

Yavin4

(35,430 posts)
118. The electorate overall will change dramatically in the coming decade as the Boomers die off and
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 04:03 PM
Nov 2020

take their late 20th century political issues with them. For example, religious affiliation is on a steep decline in America with younger generations. People are living under extreme income inequality so there's no energy for more tax cuts for the rich.

Finally, it's not going to be easy for the Republicans to find another Trump.

sarisataka

(18,558 posts)
120. But the Republican party is dead
Sun Nov 15, 2020, 04:08 PM
Nov 2020

I have been assured dozens of times over the past years that the final male has been put in their coffin

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