I keep thinking about when we get a 50-50 senate

[mysteryowl]

I am concerned about Manchin's voting, he often votes with the republicans.
He could really through a wrench in moving legislation.

What are your thoughts?

[Lobo27]

1. I keep thinking he will do what that guy did in the 90s.

Can't think of the name.

[mysteryowl]

2. What happened in the 90's?

[SPDem]

3. Byrd?

[Lobo27]

6. 1994 I believe Shelby became a Republican.

[SPDem]

4. Byrd?

[LowerManhattanite]

7. Zell Miller?

[Amishman]

32. Jeffords 2001 party flip to cause the Pubs to lose the Senate?

Last edited Tue Nov 17, 2020, 08:14 AM - Edit history (1)

Because that's what keeps coming to my mind

50-50 Senate.

Jeffords was a moderate Republican and opposed Bush's tax cut. It passed with the help of blue dog Dems.

Jeffords switched parties to punish the Pubs and cause them to lose the Senate.

I can absolutely see Manchin doing this if we push him to far. WV governor Justice switched in 2017 and just won reelection as a Pub.

With Manchin, he is addition by subtraction. He denies the pubs a deep red seat.Anything he does for us beyond that is a bonus.

[Demsrule86]

39. I doubt he will but even if he did...what difference does it make? We could never elect a different

democrat in WVA.

[LowerManhattanite]

5. GOP money people...

...are gonna put together a nice seven-plus figure package to entice him to change parties to scuttle the Dem majority.

Question becomes, does he have the integrity to say “no” and stay OR what will he ask Dem donors/Chuck Schumer for to stay?

[Demsrule86]

40. I think Joe Manchin has a great deal of integrity.

[moonscape]

8. My thoughts are:

- getting those GA seats is an uphill battle
- should we get them, I’ll kneel at the feet and thank him for his help in putting McConnell in the minority

Schumer can bring bills to the floor and make folks go on record. No more 100% obstruction.

How Manchin votes is less important than gaining control. We could not do it without him. There is not another dem human who would win that seat from WVa. so I’ve never complained about him.

[mysteryowl]

9. Thanks for your comments.

Very interesting.

[Claustrum]

10. Not to mention Manchin will likely still vote for any democratic judges and justices.

He might not always vote or agree with all of the things we want because he represents WV, a very red state. But he will side with us on the big things and he will definitely side with us more than a republican would.

[unblock]

11. Right. Manchin will vote party line for chairs and such.

And he'll join us where he can. The times when his votes annoy us are that times he's telling us it's the only way to keep an otherwise impossible seat for us.

The way to deal with manchin is to have more of a majority but as it is we need him and both Georgia runoffs just for the winnable tie.

[Flaleftist]

12. Yes, making Schumer majority leader is paramount.

There must be some Republicans willing to support the hundreds of bills passed by the House that McConnell is refusing to allow a vote. Or else why the obstruction?

[In It to Win It]

13. Agreed! Step 1 is gaining control. We'll get to Manchin when we cross that bridge

[joshcryer]

36. Exactly. Simply having bills put forth means they have to do their job.

McConnell has protected them from doing their job for 12 years now. This shit has to stop. Doesn't matter if people don't vote, they must speak up, or be denounced.

[In It to Win It]

14. Step 1: Get to 50

[mysteryowl]

16. I heard a suggestion that Biden picks two republican senators for his administration

from states that have democratic governors to replace them with democratic senators. Nice idea, but I doubt an republican senator would go for that.

[LuvNewcastle]

15. Put up against McConnell as Majority Leader,

Joe Manchin is no kind of problem at all. If we get to oust McConnell, you won't hear me bitch about any of the Democrats. We'll need each and every one of them, contrary or not.

[mysteryowl]

17. What a relief it will be to get rid of Moscow Mitch!!!

[Bleacher Creature]

18. Manchin will vote for Schumer as Majority Leader and for Democratic control of committees is the key

He'll obviously make it hard to pass some bills and for certain appointments, but controlling the committees and deciding what bills go to the floor is SO important.

Let's just worry about getting to 50-50 and then we can worry about the rest.

[mysteryowl]

19. maybe some of the moderate republicans will vote with dems if he doesn't

They do sometimes.

[Bleacher Creature]

20. Maybe on legislation, but ZERO chance on the organizing vote.

Maybe we can peel off Collins and Murkowski on a few bills and nominations, but they are 100% voting for McConnell.

[mysteryowl]

21. At least the senate democrats could lead investigations!

[Bleacher Creature]

22. Only if they have 50!!

Those special elections are just so important!

[Demsrule86]

41. Nah, they delay things (like the ACA) and in the end never support us.

[Tribetime]

23. If we win both runoffs I'm celebrating all night.

Anything is 100% better than Mitch the grim reaper in charge. I still think it's going to be tough to do.

[brooklynite]

24. "he often votes with the republicans"

Name the votes you objected to...

[Dem4Life1102]

25. Brett Kavanaugh

[mysteryowl]

27. Wow, that's right, he did that.

[Demsrule86]

38. Kavanaugh had the votes...no point in Manchin risking his seat for a 'message' vote...

seriously, we need Manchin...go down to 270 to win and see where the opportunities are for senate seats...and don't expect the new Arizona Justices or even the Georgia ones to vote much differently than Manchin. In order to win, we need a big tent. And the trade off is we get some of what we want.

[brooklynite]

29. One vote is "often"

FWIW - he voted against Barrett and for all of the Trump Impeachment resolutions.

[Dem4Life1102]

31. I never said often

[Polybius]

26. WHEN we get a 50-50 Senate?

After what happened on November 3rd you're still this confidant?

[mysteryowl]

28. It is always best to project what you want to help manifest it.

[tritsofme]

30. A 50-50 Senate means Biden gets his Cabinet, a chance at tax reform under Reconciliation

and an opportunity to move judicial nominees through the Senate. None of that will happen if McConnell is in charge.

It will take 60 votes to move major legislation, something that will be impossible even under a sweep in Georgia. Being in the majority, even just barely, would make all the difference.

[Hassler]

33. A 50-50 split will empower Manchin, Collins and Murkowski

They'll get stuff for their states in exchange for their votes.

[NurseJackie]

34. An actual Republican in his seat would be even worse.

He could really through a wrench in moving legislation.

An actual Republican in his seat would be even worse. We should count our blessings and not borrow trouble.

[Tommy_Carcetti]

35. Better to have an uncertain chance than no chance at all.

Manchin is important for no other reason than numbers.

He gives us the numbers that provide us majority and control over the committees and the process.

That he might stray occasionally is unfortunate, perhaps expected, but let's not lose the forest through the trees here.

[Demsrule86]

37. Leave Manchin alone...he has voted with us when it counted...and we may or may not get

a 50-50 Senate but one thing is for sure without Manchin, we would have no chance.