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[Burgman]

This message was self-deleted by its author (Burgman) on Tue Jan 10, 2012, 04:13 PM. When the original post in a discussion thread is self-deleted, the entire discussion thread is automatically locked so new replies cannot be posted.

[barbtries]

1. who will tell

the birds and the bees.

[seabeyond]

2. wow burgman. start a thread to dismiss very real womens issue. no surprise there.

is indicative and an ass though.

[Burgman]

6. I have no fucking clue as to what you are trying to say here.

[Charlemagne]

19. +1

[Occulus]

66. Copy that. You'll need it later, too.

[seabeyond]

69. ya, right, cause once again you are off base. you do get, all the people that "get it", right?

look thru out this thread. we know he was talking about another thread. we know what OP he was talking about. we know why he addressed it as he did. you dont "get it". that is your problem.

[GeorgeGist]

150. Generally you reply to the thread that offends you.

Not start another one to get attention. Clueless.

[Atman]

9. Nearly every DU jury on which I've served...

...has been about a "calling out" of another DUer far less blatant as this, seabeyond. I'm not going to alert, though...just pointing it out that the op might be "offensive" if you know what the hell burgman is talking about (which, apparently, only you do), but YOU clearly broke the rules with your reply.

Just sayin'.

[RevStPatrick]

12. I know what he's talking about here too.

And it's not particularly amusing.
There was certainly plenty worthy of derision on the thread he is making reference to, but this is not the way to do it. It's juvenile.

[Atman]

14. Posting a thread about another thread is also against the rules, no?

I haven't seen the other thread in question. It sounds like it was a Camille Paglia type rant, but I'm obviously speculating.

Point is, if burgman's thread is offensive, alert on it, don't post another offense.

[Burgman]

16. Juvinile?

Nya na na.

It wasn't meant to be particularly amusing. It was meant to be a rebuttal to certain over sensitive knee-jerk reactions.

[RevStPatrick]

20. Then you should have rebutted on that thread.

I happen to agree that it was "over sensitive," and I said so on that thread.
You still have the opportunity to do so, if you choose.

[seabeyond]

31. a thread calling out another thread? 3rd rule broken. nt

[Charlemagne]

33. I saw we leave this thread up

so that the DUers who care about women's issues can see the vitriol they face, even from their supposed 'allies.'

[redqueen]

74. Right? Telling a feminist "blow me"...

not quite the dialogue one would expect from an ally.

[uppityperson]

106. Where was that, i read it last night, can't find it now

Wanted to make sure to be able to see it in context as well as my memory. Thanks.

[redqueen]

110. It's the hidden post in this thread.

It was apparently the best rejoinder the OP could come up with when I bothered to attempt to engage him in actual rational discussion.

[uppityperson]

120. Thank you, thought I read this last night in another thread.

[Charlemagne]

109. that is why ally is in quotes

[snooper2]

130. Would telling Santorum to blow me be okay?

as long as he brushed first?

[MineralMan]

38. That was a DU2 rule. Hosts on DU3 are leaving

most copycat threads to stand, as long as they meet the forum's SOP. That said, it's still a very weak thing to do to open a new thread to continue another thread, or to mock it. It demonstrates that the arguments can't hold themselves up within the original thread, and accomplishes nothing, really. The hosts for GD have discussed copycat threads at length, and the consensus was to leave them up, as long as they are more or less within the forum's Statement of Purpose.

Nothing, however, prevents anyone from entering such a copycat thread and pointing out that the argument presented in it is a weak argument, and couldn't stand up in the original thread. Laugh at the copycat thread or even ridicule it, but be careful not to attack the poster. That's my advice in these situations.

[seabeyond]

39. thank you. i didnt know a thread joking about masturbation met SOP. nt

[MineralMan]

44. Just barely. The real subject of this thread

was rules and standards, I think. It was alerted on as violating SOP, but none of the hosts deleted it. I thought about it, but after all the discussions about copycat threads, decided to leave it.

However, it could be alerted on by anyone for violating Community Standards. I suspect it already has been, but a jury may have let it stand. As I said, the best approach to this type of thread may well be to ridicule it or just argue against it within the thread. I've posted a reply to the OP, myself, just now. As on DU2, there's a pretty flexible standard for posts in GD. Some odd or weird stuff will stand here, based on what I've seen so far.

[seabeyond]

48. thanks for the explanation MM. nt

[jberryhill]

35. Glad you figured out what is "over sensitive"

...in your whole month of membership at DU.

[muriel_volestrangler]

47. A piss-poor rebuttal, then

If you can't tell some basic differences between masturbation (solo), and prostitution and pornography (involving multiple people), then you're going to lose a hell of a lot of arguments.

[MineralMan]

50. You could have attempted your rebuttal in

the other thread, actually. That's sort of how discussion works. This copycat thread which attempts to mock the other thread, is pretty lame. And it's juvEnile, to boot.

[seabeyond]

25. doesnt meet SOP of gd. copy cat not allowed in GD. i am the issue? really? nt

[Charlemagne]

29. exactly

this post condones, if not out right celebrates, the rape culture in the US. The OP is indicating that women make up charges of rape in almost every instance.

[seabeyond]

30. and the men in this thread, doing the happy dance, are the ones best at dismissing womens concerns

we are men, hear us roars.... in such a sad and wimpering manner. lol

[LeftyMom]

61. Shaka. When the walls fell.

Kadir beneath Mo Moteh.

[seabeyond]

63. like the Op, you have to be participating to "get it". that is not my problem. it is yours

ever so consistent with your same bullshit. the only reply you seem to be able to make to me. so, once again, i repeat, dont read my threads. nothing but stalking to repeatedly say the same shit over and over and over. not to mention, behaving like you are back in high school.

[LeftyMom]

65. Darmok on the ocean.

[seabeyond]

70. silly girl. nt

[stevenleser]

92. I just got her point and it is an interesting one but I am not sure you will appreciate it.

Let me know. I'm willing to, um, I guess the word to use is 'translate'

[seabeyond]

95. go for it. but, i bet it is going to have the same end result that every reply

she has made to my posts for a year, has been.

[redqueen]

98. I wonder what the point would be.

When someone is interested in communicating ideas to other people, they make an effort to be clear.

This person obviously does not want to be understood or engage in meaningful dialogue, they want to make inside jokes.

As for me, I'd just accept that and move on.

[seabeyond]

102. no, this person never engages. stalks, insults, and runs away. clever.... lol. nt

[LeftyMom]

172. Ma'am, that's a personal attack.

[seabeyond]

174. it is a description and explanation of what YOU continually do on my posts. nt

[LeftyMom]

179. Dear God, I do believe that was a complete sentence.

I guess reminding you does some good after all.

[stevenleser]

105. OK, first off, 'Darmok' is an episode in the old series Star Trek the Next Generation

this is going to require a bit of background. I am going to try to condense it.

In the Star Trek Universe, a ubiquitous piece of technology is the Universal Translator. When you watch the show, every alien species appears to speak English. In reality, each person is equipped with a Universal Translator which is a powerful computer that can translate languages on the fly. You hear the translated versions of what the Vulcans, Klingons and every other race says.

The Tamarians are an alien race that have been isolated because there is an issue with the way the Universal Translator handles the translation of their language. The Translator translates the words just fine, the problem is the words dont seem to make sense. I'm going to cut to the chase although an episode artfully explains how what I am about to say is discovered. The Tamarians communicate in allegory. One of the ways it is explained in the episode is thusly and I will paraphrase the explanation.

If someone says to an eligible heterosexual man in reference to his girlfriend (whose name is not Juliet), "Juliet is waiting for you on the balcony", the reference is that your girlfriend is waiting somewhere to be romantic with you. We know that because one of the most famous books of one of history's most famous author contains a scene that is relatively universally known and understood.

If an alien species landed on earth and you said that to them or in their presence, even if the individual words were translated, would they be able to understand the reference? No, because their cultural experiences do not include a woman named Juliet who was waiting to be romanced on a balcony.

These references to Darmok and things he and other people experienced are not understandable to the Enterprise Captain and crew or any other races in the Star Trek the Next Generation Universe because they dont share a common culture and cultural history. They have no idea what these allegories mean. If anything, some of them suggest aggressiveness or contriteness or various other things when they are not meant to be.

What I believe Leftymom is trying to say is, because you feel the same way about something, because your experiences and your beliefs lend you to intellectually think, or emotionally feel some way about something, doesn't mean everyone else does and doesn't mean everyone else will get it or even agree.

I got all the Darmok references immediately because I saw the episode, even though it has been over a decade. You didn't because you dont have that as part of your life experiences. Leftymom is attempting to use that as a metaphor to explain why good people can disagree on what we are talking about.

[seabeyond]

111. species appears to speak English.

no. this is what leftymom was saying. i didnt have to read all about star trek, but yea you, for seeing glass half full.

you got it in about the first sentence.

like i said to you and the reply i gave her. because she is uninformed and does not know what the thread or my post is about, does not mean the strong majority of us dont "get it". she should get informed before throwing out her insults. but that is not her agenda. so why bother.

you put way more thought into it than what there was.

she has made this comment on my posts for a year. bully for her. like i said, highschool behavior. no, wait, middle school

[redqueen]

114. You at least attempt to make yourself understood.

Other people, not so much. But like I said, one has to be actually interested in communication to make an effort.

[stevenleser]

115. Well, I am curious to know what she thinks of my explanation, assuming she doesnt have me on ignore

which with me is entirely a possibility.

[seabeyond]

117. ah hahaha

betcha i have more than you.

she will probably say

oh ya
uh
ya
that is
ah
what
uh
i
uh
meant.

seabeyond is picking on me.......

lol

[stevenleser]

118. I have to say that I think what she tried to do was extremely interesting. The problem with these

discussions is, everyone seems to see folks on the other side as evil. While throwing out this intellectual exercise and hoping people would research what it means, she sought to engage in a non-confrontational way.

I happen to think it rather impressive.

[redqueen]

122. That's hilarious.

You are looking at one post with no context, no knowledge of the history between that poster and seabeyond.

Familiarize yourself with their pattern of interactions in the past (and yes, there is a well-established pattern) and you wouldn't have any doubt as to the intent behind that so-called 'intellectual exercise'.

[stevenleser]

125. To a STTNG fan, what someone is trying to say with a Darmok reference is unmistakeable

I dont know the history of their communications, but a Darmok reference like the one Leftymom made is clearly meant to convey a misunderstanding due to different cultural experiences.

[seabeyond]

127. you are not listening steven. i told you the history, so that should be clear now.

why are you insisting that it has to be something, it just is not. it is along you telling me 2nd wavers dont like sex. you dont get to make these all knowing truths. you just dont.

[seabeyond]

123. what are you not getting. regularly on my thread she makes a reference like this

every. single. reply. to. me.

every one.

a short, insulting comment about a second language, talk english.... you moran, you fool.

every one.

for about a year now.

there is a group of four or five.

others are responding to me. interacting. or they ask. i get my posts are hard. dont like my posts, dont read my post.

she replies in this manner regularly.

[stevenleser]

129. I understand you are frustrated by how she tried to do what she did

but I dont think it was malicious. I think it was an attempt to break out of a malicious pattern of people on the opposite sides of this issue calling each other essentially evil.

[redqueen]

132. You admit you're unaware of the pattern...

then you proceed to tell seabeyond that you know better than she what the agenda was.

Stunning.

[stevenleser]

135. Why is this so hard for you to understand? It is completely straightforward.

I dont have to know the entire history of communication between Seabeyond and Leftymom to understand what Leftymom was trying to convey with this particular effort.

[seabeyond]

137. wow. insightful. ok. lol. nt

[MattBaggins]

141. You do need the history

You are trying to see a positive but there is none.

Leftymom is was doing nothing more than insulting Seabeyonds writing style.

[stevenleser]

145. Yes, you are wrong.

Happy?

[seabeyond]

147. i have never seen anything like this. and i have been here a long time.

funny, huh, lol.

[MineralMan]

169. Are you the Steven Leser at that link in your signature line?

[stevenleser]

182. That question sounds like it is going somewhere pretty personal. Please PM me. nt

[MineralMan]

183. It's just a question. You have the same screen name as the person

at the link, so I thought I'd ask. It's not going anywhere.

[seabeyond]

133. you dont understand, because i am not frustrated. it doesnt bother me. she thinks she is so clever

and... not so much. i dont care. she doesnt like my posts? fine, dont read. doesnt hurt my feelings.

you dont understand because she is continually remarking on my poor english, grammer and god forbid i refuse to CAPITALIZE or use my shift key.

she doesnt like me. there are others. they cant argue what i say, so they resort to this childish behavior.

why should i care?

[Dr. Strange]

67. Sokath! His eyes uncovered!

[stevenleser]

89. Darmok and Jalad at Tanagra. The beast at Tanagra.

Picard and Dathon at El-Adrel
The beast at El-Adrel
Dathon, the walls fell.

What was this OP about again? Am having too much fun with the STTNG nostalgia.

[stevenleser]

91. Oh my. I just got your point here. Very clever. nt

[Froward69]

152. Yes Mistress

I will Obey.

[Sky Masterson]

3. Then I'm a violent mother f_cker.

[Mr Dixon]

5. LOL

Agreed

[Maine-ah]

17. and this woman fully admits the same.....

you're a violent mf'er

[Sky Masterson]

73. I need an intervention

[Codeine]

4. Beating. Yanking. Choking. Jerking.

All couched in the language of physical violence.

[Atman]

11. You forgot "flogging."

[MineralMan]

51. And "pounding, whipping", and several others.

For some folks out there, it seems that violence is a turn-on, even when they're by themselves. How strange...

[Upton]

59. If some folks are turned on by S&M or whatever..

are they are consenting adults, what business is it of yours?

[MineralMan]

77. That's not my point, and you know it.

BDSM is something completely different. It's not my kink, but It's OK if everyone participating is good with it.

[Charlemagne]

21. +1

[leveymg]

7. DU now has its own Anti-Sex League. Just ask Alice . . .

When logic and proportion
Have fallen sloppy dead
And the white knight is talking backwards
And the Red Queen's "Off with her head!"
Remember what the dormouse said

Feed your head
Feed your head

[hootinholler]

37. I have noticed an authoritarian bent

Since the launch of DU3.

To quote someone "It gives me a sad."

[leveymg]

46. Petty dictators now have a fresh opportunity to do what they couldn't before: not be ignored.

Actually, I never used the Ignore feature and find all species of would-be policemen to be interesting specimens of repressed violence.

[seabeyond]

49. all the lonely... lonely men. i think the problem is their lack of sex. hence, these issues, lmao

[leveymg]

52. For every lonely man there's a Material Girl. Any contract takes at least two parties.

I don't think the issue is just about men.

[seabeyond]

53. i think this thread is ALL about men. nt

[leveymg]

58. You may fantasize as you like.

So may the rest of us.

It's an easy transfer from the Anti-Sex League to the Thought Police. Repressed, a bit?

[seabeyond]

60. what does that have to do with the OP or his misogyny. nt

[leveymg]

62. I thought that was odinism, not misogyny. Which do you have on your mind today?

Sorry, no illustrations for this one.

[seabeyond]

64. i need not.... lmao. nt

[leveymg]

71. Lol. eom

[The Straight Story]

108. Lack of sex? More like fear of having it because we might be seen as violent

Love how some folks will label a whole group, spread fear of them, and it is called progressive - yet when others do the same it is called hate speech/bigotry.

[seabeyond]

113. i dont know. i tell my boys make sure girl is as enthusiastic as you. good way to avoid rape

doesnt seem so scary to most men.

[snooper2]

136. You may have a problem with that one---

It doesn't matter male or female, some people just lay there...








Okay, I'll say it...


Dead Fuck LOL

[seabeyond]

140. ya, well, then it is a good piece of advice

to skip those, of either gender.

[redqueen]

124. Love how some folks will misrepresent arguments

in order to play the victim.

Come on, who is labeling a whole group? Where do you see that?

Where is the fear-spreading?

[MattBaggins]

142. Actually the ladies have been rather nice to try and not paint

I however; have no such restraints.

Men who frequent prostitutes are low life scum bags who should be ridiculed and shamed.

but but but it's just a "transaction" for a "Service". yeah yeah yeah that's it. prostitutes are just service employees.

Come on now. Let's hear the childish rebuttal about how I must be "repressed" just because I think men can act like sentient beings and not root around like basic apes.

[seabeyond]

148. i think i love you....

beetles or partridge kids.

[redqueen]

151. Preach it!

[Whisp]

146. oiy...

so you have no idea what violence is?

that is all...

[Froward69]

153. Yes Mistress

YOU know EVERYTHING...

[redqueen]

75. Who's 'anti sex'?

There is a serious shortage of logic in here when a handful of people decide that rather than discuss an issue on its merits, they instead resort to twisting words, misrepresenting arguments, etc.

I don't think anyone on DU is anti-sex. Objectification, dehumanization, and hypersexualization are not synonymous with sex. I feel sorry for the handful of DUers who apparently can't tell the difference, or who still don't understand what these terms even mean/are still in denial about their existence.

[MineralMan]

80. That's a very interesting question, isn't it?

Completely consensual sex is a wonderful thing, and I can't imagine anyone being against it. Coercive sex is a horrible thing, and I can't imagine anyone being for it. In between, there is an infinite range, I think.

For myself, completely consensual sex is the only kind of sex I find acceptable, and that has been the case since I was a teenager. I can't imagine enjoying anything else. Now that's me. I've sure seen other people for whom that wasn't true, apparently. I don't understand it.

These discussion seem to bring out an entire range of attitudes toward sex, don't they?

[redqueen]

96. They sure do.

It's always enlightening.

I'm the same as you, consensual (and free) sex is the only way to go.

[Upton]

8. Don't laugh..

the puritan lets legislate morality crowd here at DU..well, actually less than a handful of people, may be coming after masturbation next.

[Atman]

10. They'll have to pry my cold, dead hand off my...

Oh, never mind.

[Occulus]

83. There are exactly three or perhaps four core members

and they are the most sexist people on DU. I have never seen sexism against either gender like what they've displayed against men in the past few weeks.

I'm trying to stop them, but I need help. Their key failing, where they are weakest, lies in those of us men who do not treat women they way they imagine men must, who were not raised to see women as objects to be used (as one of them bitterly wept just yesterday), and who do not fantasize about ravishing every woman they lay their eyes on. A particular weakness in that regard lies in gay men, who by definition do not see women as sexual objects to be exploited (a mention of gay men nearly always ends their arguments, because it shatters all their gender-biased assumptions regarding 'typical male' behavior).

Their hypocrisy regarding sexual issues is another weak point. In nearly every argument, they openly and shamelessly display the very same sexism against men that they shrilly screech about seeing against women ("We are men, hear us roars", said one, on this very thread). How they are able to get away with using open misandry while at the very selfsame time pissing and moaning about perceived misogyny- apparently rampant on DU, but which few if any others actually see being posted- is a mystery to me, but their level of hypocrisy and broadly-applied gender bias needs to be addressed.

Witness what happened when someone asked, "If you videotape yourself and nobody sees it is it still porn?"

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002144386#post15

They're shameless, absolutely shameless, and shrilly misandrist even when presented with reasoned arguments.

[Scout]

85. LOL, poor poor Occulus n/t

[MattBaggins]

143. I know I have to run to the store now for more tissues

[DisgustipatedinCA]

165. I believe you're correct

I usually stay as far as I can from the sex threads, but I opted to join in yesterday. That was clearly a mistake. I was attacked for stating a simple fact (that it's NOT the new norm to talk to women in terms of oral sex--this will get you fired or divorced or both, in short order). Start with post #4 and follow the indent to see examples of sexism, lying, game playing for sport, completely unbased accusations toward me, and hypocritical and sexist language.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002142505

[liberal N proud]

13. Is that why they call it choking the chicken?

[Zorra]

15. If you boys posting on this thread really honestly want to know why you never "get laid",

read this thread, and try to figure it out from there.

Smells like teen spirit...

oh, well, whatever...

nevermind.

[Burgman]

18. I'm near 60. Grew up in the 60's & 70's

Was even married and fathered a child or two.

I did "get laid."

[Pacafishmate]

23. Try not to worry about this.

They'll eventually exhaust themselves with all their yelling and righteous indignation about the personal choices of other people. Here's a tip for those who feel the need to regulate sex: if it's a consensual activity please shut your mouth. Two people having violent sex does not support "rape culture". That's just a fantasy that you invented so that you can feel like you're doing something about a problem, when you're actually just wasting the time of everyone around you.

[Zorra]

99. Thanks! More food for thought for the boys who want to understand

why no woman will sleep them.

[Occulus]

116. Zorra, your gender's internal plumbing has exactly zero appeal to me

and I agree with him.

I should point out that on another thread one of the "feminists" stated in so many words (what follows is a direct quote) that &quot a)ll I'm saying is that our priority as a society, IMO, should be protecting those who are victimized. And if that infringes on some people who want to sell their bodies or buy access to other people's bodies, oh well."

The unspoken presumption, of course, being that those who engage in prostitution are victims by default, and further that those who desire to 'sell their wares', be they ever-so-unvictimized in their own opinion, even if they want to shouldn't be allowed to do so because they're victimizing themselves without even knowing it and that's Bad For Them and Bad For Society.

What that amounts to is one of DU's oh-so-vaunted "feminists" telling us that no, there are some forms of sexual activity between two (or more!) consenting adults- male and female- that should not be allowed. That's fucking bullshit and I'm not going to tolerate it.

If the quote above doesn't express a common 'ick yuk' response toward and a desire for control over others' sexual activities, I don't know what does.

[redqueen]

126. You are completely misrepresenting what I said.

I dam not calling them victims. I am asserting that their desire to sell their body, IMO, does not outweigh the importance or protecting victims of human trafficking or other members of society who are coerced into prostitution.

That's all there is to it. It's quite simple, really.

[seabeyond]

128. they gotta win. they have to misrepresent to argue. that is the only way it can be argued. nt

[redqueen]

139. Precisely. (nt)

[Zorra]

154. Occulus? You seem to be misunderstanding redqueen, and me as well.

redqueen: "I am asserting that their desire to sell their body, IMO, does not outweigh the importance of protecting victims of human trafficking or other members of society who are coerced into prostitution."

Zorra: A truly mature male will not engage in prostitution because he recognizes the importance of protecting victims of human trafficking or other members of society who are coerced into prostitution.

Women almost universally like this type of mature, caring man that places a high value on protecting others. The male who takes the time to listen really listen to, and makes a sincere effort to understand, what we are really saying.

These are characteristics that separate men from boys in the estimation of the majority of women.

[seabeyond]

159. no. he doesnt care. just a jab here and a jab there

if it hits a target, then cool. but always falls WAY short.

[Zorra]

164. I'm hoping for more clarity and understanding.

I believe that the achievement of more clarity and understanding of the scope of problems inherent in, and related to, the practice of prostitution, is what redqueen intended by her OP "Prostitution is Violence".

[seabeyond]

167. ya. and i have enjoyed your posts and hearing what you have to say. agreed. nt

[redqueen]

22. Wow. 60 years old and this is your idea

of rational discourse.

Oh well, I guess the tea party includes a lot of seniors too, and they don't do rational either.

[Charlemagne]

26. You cant say blow me

that is a form of violence. You are dismissing legitimate and real crimes against women. Your post just shows that you celebrate rape culture and think women either make up claims of rape, or, deserve it in the first place.

[Burgman]

27. LOL!

[redqueen]

28. Classy.

[seabeyond]

32. a really really hot 60 yr old, though. lol. nt

[redqueen]

34. I'm not surprised to see this childish backlash.

Most people like the status quo. They like that women are the sex class. The backlash against feminism shows progress.

We see it on the right when we make progress on issues they would rather we didn't, and we see it here too.

[seabeyond]

41. weeeve my porn and hookers alone, or all those blue pills are

going down the toilet.

but, this is just one big thread of joshing with each other, right?

[hlthe2b]

57. heavens...I certainly hope he does not have female children or grandchildren..

Actually, I hope all his children and grandchildren have access to a more "enlightened" adult.

[redqueen]

72. It's also possible that they recognized the patriarchy on their own,

and decided to stop silently accepting what most people resign themselves to believing is unchangeable.

Most people don't, but many do.

[Odin2005]

36. Context please???

I haven't been on DU in a while.

[demmiblue]

42. He can't answer because he had a thread hidden for telling redqueen to perform oral sex on him. N/t

[seabeyond]

43. he is being sexually repressed. nt

[demmiblue]

45. .

[Odin2005]

54. Oh, yuck!

[MineralMan]

40. This is a very weak retort to the thread it's mocking,

you know. Why not make your arguments in the original thread? Masturbation is nothing like prostitution, which was the topic of that other thread. I'd say that this copycat thread is FAIL.

[zappaman]

90. "I'd say that this copycat thread is FAIL."

no shit.
+100

[RadiationTherapy]

55. BAAAHAHAhahaha!! "Wah! My orders for someone to metaphorically penetrate themselves on my phallus

were disobeyed and deleted!!" HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHahahahahahaha.

Keep evolving, people, we're gonna get there.

[seabeyond]

56. Keep evolving, people, we're gonna get there.

this made me laugh, right along with you, lol.

sometimes i wonder

[redqueen]

76. Most of us, anyway.

I have no doubt that the sad few will still be angrily resenting anyone who dares to threaten their privilege.

Some people are quite happy with women being the sex class, and they feel threatened and get extremely upset when anyone tries to address or change that fact.

[RadiationTherapy]

97. It used to be the vast majority and not just the sad few. It's happening and it will get better.

Thank you for your bold words.

[redqueen]

100. Thank you for your words of encouragement.

It's nice to be reminded that there are good reasons to be optimistic.

[reorg]

68. In countries where masturbation has reached dangereous levels

of acceptance, dogs start dragging their tails and the presidential spouse is rumored to have been a professional you know what. Numbers are staggering. People calling for the legalization of non-violent rape.

Beware of where you go!

[Atman]

78. Wow. This is one of the strangest threads I've ever read on DU.

And that is saying a LOT.

I'm not sure what I missed, but clearly there are lots of panties in a wad (sorry, is that sexist? What if you're a man who wears panties?). I recall several years back Camille Paglia saying "All sex is rape." I'm not sure what the original post on the other thread says, but I do think it is over the top to condemn all men who respond in disagreement. Believe it or not, you can be a man, and you can be sympathetic to the argument while also disagreeing, and at the same time NOT be a crazy, masturbating idiot.

Okay, so the masturbating part might be stretch...but we're not all crazy idiots.

.

[seabeyond]

79. actually, the boxers are in a twist. but again, you are not aware of the issue, obviously. nt

[MineralMan]

81. That's why I wear briefs, instead of boxers.

Briefs never get in a twist, but boxers often do.

[seabeyond]

84. that is fuckin funny MM. lol

i have three guys in my house, so i have dealt with this issue. individual preferences. that whole boxer thing going on has always made me wonder about the twistin issue

[MineralMan]

87. The boxers v. briefs controversy

even comes into play in the locker room. Some guys consider briefs to be "unmanly." A few times in high school, I heard people taunt brief wearers with, "Hey, look at this. Bill's wearing panties." Amazing that underwear choices would be used to taunt people. Or maybe not amazing...

[RadiationTherapy]

104. White cotton briefs are for little boys and teenagers.

Grown men can wash their underwear regularly without visual clues. They come in lots of colors and shapes, guys, and they don't have to look like a cotton diaper without pins.

[MineralMan]

112. Well, I don't wear white cotton briefs.

At one time, that's all there was. Today, that's not so. Of course what kind of underwear a man puts on in the morning doesn't really say much about the man wearing it, I'd think. People who would ridicule a person for a style of underwear have larger personal problems to deal with, I think. When I was in high school back in the early 60s, I wore white cotton briefs, because that was the available color. Nobody taunted me for them, though, since I was a pretty big guy. They only taunted the smaller kids. Again, more personal problems than what underwear people were wearing.

[RadiationTherapy]

138. Well, I am a bit hyper-sensitive about the amount of arrested development I see among adults;

I count wearing adult-sized, children's underwear as a symptom of that social disease. But, yes, I do have issues with control and how I perceive maturity and how I perceive the powers-that-be as using certain psychological cues in order to propagate an immature, consumerist society.



I also drink a lot of coffee and over analyze things to the point of absurdity - Hail Eris!

[MrCoffee]

156. I made an honest effort to stay out of this

But come on, Y-fronts are used to "propagate an immature, consumerist society"?

That is too good to pass up.

[RadiationTherapy]

157. Thank you, thank you.

I have an absurdist streak. I also believe what I wrote. hahahaha

[redqueen]

161. And they're just ugly.

I think I have the same aversion to them as most people seem to have to the larger version of women's underwear commonly referred to as 'granny panties'.

Boxer briefs, though... those, I like.

[MineralMan]

162. I really don't pay much attention to what kind of underwear

men wear. I can't see that it's relevant to anything at all.

[seabeyond]

163. lmfao.... ya, i HAD to go into the stores to buy undies for guys. i didnt notice all those pictures

either, showing what undies looked nicest on what bodies.

[hlthe2b]

88. Atman, rather than making assumptions with repsect to Camille Paglia writings/comparisons--

which, btw suggests a rather poor and stereotypical attitude towards your female DU colleagues, why not actually go look at the thread in question? While i don't agree with everything in that OP, the issue of violence and its correlation with prostitution is an incredibly serious one--and which I think you would not mean to be so flippant in referring.

[redqueen]

101. I would expect nothing more than thoughtless kneejerking from most people.

Privilege is power. And power concedes nothing without demand.

I'm encouraged that things are improving, albeit at a glacially slow pace.

[Atman]

103. I didn't see the thread linked.

Rather than making assumptions that I'm just making assumptions...

Seriously, I'm not casually throwing Paglia into the mix, just using the only benchmark I have to work from. This thread seems to be a mystery thread that only those "in the know" know about. People bashing each other back and forth. I never once said that I had seen the original thread. My first comment was essentially that the entire thread was out of place. The op, and initial responses, break so many of the so-called DU3 rules that I'm amazed it hasn't been taken down, or locked, or whatever we do to offending threads these days.

To say that I have flippant about the subject matter being discussed is in itself flippant. Of course violence and prostitution are serious issues. But this thread started out being a stupid remark about masturbation, and instead of educating anyone about what the hell was being discussed, it just turned into personal attacks. Which are supposed to be verboten here, but apparently not in this thread.

[hlthe2b]

134. I had no problem finding it in GD--this is, after all a copy cat thread--if you had really wanted to

I never participated in that thread, but in order to understand what the issues were I went to GD and immediately found it.

It is flippant to make such assumptions towards others without having even educated yourself on what is under discussion and I do not consider violence towards women to be less than a highly serious matter.

Allow me to point you directly to that which you are unwilling/incapable of finding:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002142688

[Atman]

170. I'm sorry I'm not good enough for your sanctimonious ass.

In the future, I'll try to be as perfect as you. Thank you for your concern about my inability to understand serious matters.

[hlthe2b]

171. I have not been incivil to you... It does speak volumes that you reply in this manner.

[Atman]

173. If you don't think your response was uncivil, then therein lies the problem.

And why I called you "sanctimonious." As with Mitt, you couldn't understand how I couldn't understand that you're superior. Calling out another poster for not understanding YOUR interpretation of a post could is the definition of it. I saw the post differently...but YOU knew what it really meant, I'm just a dumbfuck.

I bow down to your greatness. I'll try not to disagree with you again, oh great one.

.

[seabeyond]

176. how many people have clued you in before your second post to rant about panties? how many people

have clued you in since the second post on your rant about panties? and still, you are pretending you dont know what this post is about? or that simply does not meet your agenda?

[hlthe2b]

177. Calling someone an ass is your definition of civility... Ummm ok. I think your derision of others

and your dismissive attitude towards those DUers who express concern about sexual violence is something you would do well to give some thought. At least others can see where you are coming from

[redqueen]

180. Please.

You replied to an OP you admit to not knowing flipall about by name dropping feminists you don't like and whining about someone you imagine condemns all men who respond in disagreement... to what, you don't even know, but there you are, sounding off.

Just admit you don't really care that much. You were called out for not caring, and now you're being all defensive about it. I don't know why.

[Atman]

184. The same three of you, responding to every post.

Yeah, I'm the one being all defensive. I won't admit that "I don't care that much," because that wouldn't be true. Do you even know what my first post was about? It was about jury service, and seabeyond calling out another DUer by name, totally against the supposed DU rules. It wasn't about "name dropping feminists" or whining about someone I imagine condemns all men. You three made up those responses. I was totally up front about the fact that I hadn't read the offending thread that burgman was apparently mocking, yet which hadn't been linked to. I never hid that fact. Then seabeyond jumped my shit for being "uncivil," and did so in a very uncivil way. And yet, I'M the one who is being all defensive.

Good one. You don't know shit about me. But feel free to continue to imagine you do.

.

[redqueen]

185. I'm responding to every post?

WTF?

I didn't see your first post. I'm not paying that much attention believe it or not. The only one that caught my attention was the one you made about panties being bunched, and the subsequent exchange wherein you got all upset because she called you out for going off about feminists and men being condemned without knowing wtf the context was.

[William769]

82. Masturbation is also a form of safe sex.

thats good enough for me.

[MineralMan]

86. Plus it's pretty much guaranteed

to actually happen, unlike partner-oriented sex.

[Whisp]

93. your post is offensive, so yah, stop fucking around with us.

[Douglas Carpenter]

94. Amen +1000 -

[Whisp]

107. I think you tell more about yourself than you want to reveal

You are equating normal sex with some of the dark sides of it like rape, violence and pornography that is demeaning to people.

We try to try you there is a difference, but some don't get it, do they?

[redqueen]

131. I think they work very hard at not getting it.

It takes a lot of denial, obfuscating, derailing and misrepresenting to do it. No easy task to continue to pretend not to get something after it's been explained over and over.

[Suji to Seoul]

119. only jackoffs jack off!

[jorno67]

121. Not to mention the terms that go along with the practice....

choke your chicken
beat your meet
to rub one out

all very violent indeed.

We should teach all of society to be ashamed of Masturbation and all those who participate.
It's the way I feel about it so if you disagree with me you will have to accept the fact that you are wrong.

[uponit7771]

149. lofl

[sledwreck13]

155. I have no idea...

...what is going on in this thread.

[KamaAina]

158. Every sperm is sacred

every sperm is great,
And when a sperm is wasted,
God gets quite irate!

[DeathToTheOil]

166. This is a cheap-shot thread

I disagreed with many of redqueen's points in her "Prostitution is Violence" thread, but it dealt with a very serious issue. This thread is nothing but mockery, and I spit on it!

[redqueen]

181. I just want to say...

I appreciate your willingness to disagree in a civil manner.

[AtomicKitten]

175. You're doing it wrong! LOL.

[whatchamacallit]

178. Ha!

[Nuclear Unicorn]

186. So this thread calls out the "Prostitution is Violence" thread

Supposedly to point out some absurdity in the latter thread. To do this the new OP conflates prostitution with masturbation and we're supposed to just acknowledge this as fact, admit to the presumed absurdity and move on.

Except I don't see it that way.

If prostitutes are are the equivalent of maturbation than they have been just as dehumanized as if they were treated violently. Perhaps the OP is just really bad analogies but it seems to me it's equating women -- living, breathing, dreaming human beings -- with tissues that wipe up the mess and are thrown away. Prostitutes, in fact no human being, should not be considered so readily used and disposed of when no longer useful.

Look at every evil destroying our world and you will see the exact same attitude of disposability for someone else's pleasure at work. War. Corporate greed. Environmental destruction. Genocide. All of it is based on humans becoming commodities to be bought, sold, exhausted and traded by those with money.

I stayed out of the original-original OP because I had some mixed feelings on the subject. This thread may very well tilt my opinion; but not in the manner in which the OP of this thread had hoped.