Make no mistake about this---what Hawley, Cruz, Blackburn, et al are planning to do in

[Atticus]

the US effin' Senate on January 6th is the equivalent of flopping to the floor kicking, whining, crying and screaming "NO-O-O! ME NO WANT TO HEAR 'TRUMP LOSE!' "

Honor? Honesty? Respect? Patriotism?

Fuhggeddaboudit!

[lisa58]

1. Exactly- the reflection of a 74 year (and counting)...

Temper tantrum

[DownriverDem]

55. Why are folks

so sure it won't work? It would help a lot of us tremendously to know your thoughts.

[marie999]

62. The Democrats control the House. It takes both houses of Congress to nullify the vote.

[samnsara]

2. shame them, laugh at them then label them and treat them like traitors

[Turin_C3PO]

3. It's all theater.

Trying to win the deplorables in order to have a chance in 2024. It‘s pathetic.

[Gidney N Cloyd]

5. Yep. They figure Trump had the right formula but he himself was the weak link.

[lame54]

4. Cruz is going to read Orange Eggs and Ham...

No Ted
We will not elect him on a plane, train or in the rain
We will not elect him in car, bar or a mason jar

No, Cruz You Lose
Trump will not be king so give up your ruse

[KS Toronado]

16. That gave me a chuckle.

[MustLoveBeagles]

29. +1

[Roisin Ni Fiachra]

6. They need to be stripped of their places in committees

if we win both Georgia seats, then banned for life from ever holding a spot on any committee.

They are traitors who actively work against democracy, the Constitution, and the US government.

[onenote]

8. The majority doesn't get to tell the minority what members are on what committees.

[Maven]

7. Take this seriously.

This is an honest-to-goodness effort to overthrow democracy and establish permanent Republican rule. Or at the very least, to establish a precedent for doing so in the future. It is an attempted coup in progress.

This is not just “theater”

This is not just “a grift”

Republicans are not just “crybabies” to laugh at

They are doing this in Congress, in the courts and in the media. The perpetrators include the president, several U.S. Senators and a majority of House Republicans. They have a large and heavily armed contingent of supporters. It doesn’t get more serious.

We Democrats have GOT to stop acting like embarrassed adults at the country club who treat Republicans like unruly children. The condescension is just an excuse not to take action. This is an attempted coup and we are not above it just because some of the perpetrators are not “serious” people.

Take this seriously and demand action to oppose it. Demand consequences for those responsible. Otherwise we’ll be the ones crying.

[Boomerproud]

10. It will be forever until Wednesday

The media is also not taking this seriously.

[Beartracks]

14. Very much this. There are very serious implications indeed.

[Turin_C3PO]

25. It has implications for future elections.

But it won’t change a thing for this election. They’ll force debate for a number of hours and Biden will be certified and take the oath on Jan. 20th. The danger is that it undermines confidence in our democratic system.

[Klaralven]

32. At most they will challenge 6 states and take 12 hours.

Speeches are limited to 5 minutes, which Senators are unused to. Debate is limited to 2 hours per challenge. At worst, it will be over the evening of the 7th.

[BarbD]

30. This is not a drill. It is an attack on our Democracy.

You are absolutely right.

[soldierant]

35. It doesn't matter how seriously we take it

Until January 20 we do not have the means to respond seriously. And even then it will take some time before we can effectively take it seriously.

I truly do not believe anyone is blowing it off. A whole lot of us are saving our ammunition for the time when it will work.

[Evolve Dammit]

43. Agree 100% I hope the military stays out of it. "General" Flynn needs to be arrested as do others.

Traitors. Every one.

[Doremus]

58. Agree 100% Next time won't be a practice run like this one. nt

[HUAJIAO]

60. THIS is the truth.

I'm tired of people laughing at these fascists asshole and not taking them dead seriously...

Many of them are ignorant fools, but not people like Josh Hawley.

[wiggs]

69. Agree. they are buying time for some reason, and also changing the definition of normal nt

[Skittles]

77. thank you

you know it, Maven

[Flaleftist]

82. I have no doubt they will fail THIS TIME

,but you are right. This is something to be taken very seriously. The fact that so many Republicans officials and so many Republican voters are okay with overthrowing democracy is alarming. They will not give up after this loss. If they had more sympathizers in positions of power, we would be in trouble.

[Cracklin Charlie]

9. Why would they do this?

These are not stupid people. This could lead to humiliation, and loss of position. What would compel them to participate in this ridiculous stunt?

Gotta be blackmail.

[luvtheGWN]

13. Blackmail may very well be involved, but

I think we lack proof (so far) of that.

I tend to agree with some political pundits that suggest these renegade Senators and Reps are desperately trying to hang on to Trump's base. They're not concerned with the present, but only with their future election prospects.

From my aerie up here in the Great White North, I cannot understand why there aren't more Democrats hitting cable and the airwaves and calling these guys anti-democratic. After all, they want to throw the votes of the people in the garbage. Why isn't there more NOISE about this?

[Skittles]

42. it is for Trump cultists

Last edited Sat Jan 2, 2021, 05:46 PM - Edit history (1)

and it is sickening beyond belief

edited to remove the word theater - yes it is a show (Biden will still be president) but these tactics to undermining democracy can have very serious results

[jaxexpat]

57. True. Thoroughly so. You speak with straight tongue, Skittles.

[Skittles]

59. we've always known the GOP puts party above country

now it is obvious to the WORLD

[HUAJIAO]

63. I don't agree. I think they are deadly serious.

[Skittles]

65. oh they are seriously undermining democracy

don't get me wrong

but their main motivation is 74 million stupid fucking voters

*I edited that post to remove the word "theater"

[wiggs]

71. In addition to buying time, in addition to excusing treachery as normal, they are trying to give

cultists an excuse to stay with the gop

the gop should be done, in a normal healthy country, but it would really be gone if the cultists head for the exits and choose to follow a new Qanon-approved party.

[Klaralven]

11. Once Hawley broke the dam, the other potential 2024 candidates have to follow suit.

But it is a "free vote" so long as they know that the House will vote against the objection and the elector's votes will be counted.

It just like voting against the Defense Appropriation override to pander to your base, so long as you know the override will succeed.

[Ligyron]

21. Hawley likely drew the short straw.

Hey, somebody has to go first.

Not It !!

[DallasNE]

48. Hawley Outmaneuvered The Rest Of Them

So they had to say me too. This cannot be allowed to go unpunished for the sake of America.

[Lilaclady]

12. Typical

This is a fund raising gig for them.

[Beartracks]

17. Sedition as a fundraising ploy. How nice. n/t

[BGBD]

15. I disagree with most in this thread.

It's not a serious attempt to "overthrow democracy" because it has no chance to actually work.

What it is is a terribly miscalculated attempt to position themselves with the Trumpies prior to 2024. HOWEVER, the miscalculation is that they will be able to put the toothpaste back in the tube. They are breathing life into Frankenstein's Monster with the belief that they will be able to control it afterword. That's not going to happen.

[StarfishSaver]

19. Exactly

Objecting to the electoral vote results pursuant to the procedures set forth in the Constitution and statutes is no more an attempt to overthrow democracy then similar objections made by Democrats in 2001, 2005, and 2016 were anti-Democratic conspiracies.

We may not like it, but, so far, they are working within the law and within the Democratic system. If and when they step outside of those parameters and attempt any extra-legal or extra-judicial means to invalidate the election, I will be the first to scream foul. But right now, we are watching democracy in action.

[Ligyron]

22. Thank you!

[BGBD]

23. Don't get me wrong

I fully think we should repeal the law if given any opportunity. I do worry what a single party controlling the Senate and House, with an opposing President-Elect would do in the future. Alter the law to require a 2/3 or 3/4 majority in each chamber to carry, for example.

[StarfishSaver]

27. I hear you and think that's reasonable

especially if people take into account that this high bar would also apply to Democrats who have a problem with the way an Electoral College vote went, as in several recent election years.

But unless and until that law is changed, we can't call an effort to overturn election results by using the legal mechanism set up in the law an attempt to overthrow democracy.

[Atticus]

33. I am sorry, but characterizing an attempt to hand the presidency to the monster who lost a

free and fair election by over seven million votes as merely "democracy in action" is beyond the pale. IMHO.

[StarfishSaver]

44. It is indeed democracy in action

The Constitution allows people to do just what they're doing and doesn't limit them to only do it to benefit candidates we don't hate or whom we don't think are vile and unfit. Some people truly thought Hillary Clinton was a monster and probably were just as furious about Democrats trying to "hand the presidency" to her through the constitutional process for objecting to the Electoral College results.

No matter how much you hate Trump, that does not make their actions anti-democratic. Democracy isn't only in effect when we like the potential results. It also sometimes results in actions and outcomes we hate.

Fortunately, the democratic process is a series and combination of many things, not just this one event, and because many other people who agree with us also engaged in other facets of the democratic process (including giving Biden way more electoral votes than he needed, and a Democratic House and enough senators to likely ensure the House and probably the Senate will reject Hawley's objection), the results of the Electoral College won't be overturned.

That's how the democratic process works.

[Atticus]

52. And here, for all these years, I understood that the foundation of "democracy" was rule by

the majority of the people.

Seriously, by your standard, the entire Trump administration could be written off as "democracy in action". I thought he violated numerous laws, should have been impeached, convicted and then prosecuted for several crimes but, hey---his conduct went unpunished in our "democracy" and the system surely cannot be perverted or abused, so it must have been just "democracy in action".

[StarfishSaver]

53. Not really.

Sometimes a majority of the people decide that majority rule in every respect is not the best way to govern and, thus, they create ways in which a minority can thwart the will of the majority. This is one of those instances. Objecting to the results of the Electoral College is a democratically-created process included in our elections create. Following this process is not anti-democratic wasn't anti-democratic when Democrats tried to do it in past elections and it's not anti-democratic now, no matter how much you claim it is.

[Atticus]

61. I will end this "discussion" here as, unfortunately, saying what needs saying would likely

involve a "Terms" violation.

I leave it to others here to compare our opinions of democracy and draw their own conclusions.

[maddiemom]

70. And he was down in the previous election by three million votes, but still won the White House.

Now he seems to expect that the popular votes aren't going to count unless they're in HIS favor, because he's never had to win them (having only ever run in ONE election before). We should have done something about the electoral college after 2000. Why should the voters expect to be respected at all? Those of us who have often worked to GOTV seem to have been wasting our time.

[True Blue American]

37. You know, I read an article

About the MSM that this was a slow news week and they are dragging out everything they can to scare people when there is no reason. Harley is already raking in big money. I tuned the cable news out.

Simply copying Trump.

[Evolve Dammit]

45. Democrats didn't tell armed "men" to "stand by" and encourage them to show up in DC to contest.

[StarfishSaver]

46. That's a different issue

I'm talking about people who are saying that objecting to the Electoral vote count on January 6 is an insurrection. It's not. It's an action permitted by law.

And, as far as I've heard so far, Hawley and his Senate and House colleagues have not told any armed people to "stand by" or encouraged them to show up in DC.

[Evolve Dammit]

73. 45 did. As Michael Cohen told us: "He speaks in code."

[EndlessWire]

28. Well, I disagree.

I don't understand why the criteria of a "serious" attempt would be whether it can succeed. That's like saying, "Aw, I was just joking." Isn't that what they always said after something blew up in their (his) faces?

They would be delighted if Pence were stupid enough to actually do what they wanted. It would be serious then.

I agree with upthread. It is a procedural thing, but suing Pence to force him to go along is astonishing. They are serious about this attempt to overturn the election--and the Government--even if they are being stupid about it.

[StarfishSaver]

49. But the Constitution and law permit the overturning of elections

If the House and Senate voted to reject the Electoral vote count, they would be doing so pursuant to the law set up for that purpose. That is not insurrection.

The same thing applies to suing Pence. They are using the legal process to get what they want - and the courts, once again, smacked them down. That's how democracy works.

[EndlessWire]

67. You are instructing me in how Democracy works?

Please learn to read. I was replying to BGBD's comment regarding a "serious attempt" -- you can follow the lines back up thread on the left to find the post I was responding to, because you seem lost.

"It's not a serious attempt to "overthrow democracy" because it has no chance to actually work." My comment addressed this statement. It seems the standard of "no harm, no foul" has taken over probably due to the seep-through effect of Trumpian philosophy. I assure you, Democracy does not work that way.

And the law doesn't care whether an attempt to commit a felony succeeded or not. Nor does it care about the degree of seriousness unless they have codified it in the law. Black letter law regarding sedition --if it is sedition -- is pretty specific.

It would behoove me to point out that Senator Gohmert followed his failed attempt to force Pence to elect Trump through a change in the EC voting by stating on camera that we should now resort to violence.

That's how a Civil War starts. So, I don't need instruction in what they are doing, and trying to do, under color of authority. Why they prefer to live under a mentally-ill dictator is something I don't understand.

#RecallMcConnell

[Atticus]

72. Thank you for being a vertebrate. nt

[Upthevibe]

66. BGBD,,,

Did you mean to say that the miscalculation is that they "won't" be able to put the toothpaste back in the tube or they "will" be able to put the toothpaste back into the tube?

I'm trying to really understand what's going on and what we, as individual citizens, can do. I live in a very progressive part of California. My U.S. Representative is Ted Lieu. I'm not sure what I can or should do. What they're doing or trying to do is NOT acceptable and I'll march in the streets if I need to. I'll effing take a bullet to my death if need be - I'm not kidding - I'm 63 years old and I won't be able to live another four years with this lunatic driving the car.

I've donated what I can (I'm on a tight budget, not able to work due to COVID, etc.) and have phone banked for the past 1 1/2 months for the upcoming Georgia runoff for Warnock and Ossoff.

I'll do whatever I'm able to do.....

[BGBD]

81. I mean

They are assuming they will be able to keep the nuts in line in the months and years to come. They think they can fan these conspiracy flames without getting burned, but they can't. They will either have to eventually go against them and have their heads called for, literally, or keep going down the rabbit hole until they are campaigning on democrats being lizard people from space.

There isn't anything that you need to do right now, Biden is going to be President, without a doubt. I have 0 worries about that.

[Maven]

79. Was it not serious enough when they sabotaged the postal service?

Was it not serious enough when they shut down polling stations?

Was it not serious enough when they strong-armed state election officials and legislatures?

Was it not serious enough when they filed 60 lawsuits?

Was it not serious enough when they refused to start the transition?

Is it not serious enough that they are turning a procedural vote to approve the election results into a political showdown ?

Is it not serious enough that they are summoning their “patriots” to D.C. on the 6th to cause havoc if they don’t get their way?

Can we only tell how serious something is by whether the desired result has been obtained...this time around?

[kairos12]

18. Attempted Bureaucratic Reichstag Fire

[Dave in VA]

20. "NO MOMMY,

I won't eat my brocolli!"

[colsohlibgal]

24. Whiny Losers

Attempting Insurrection basically....and Hawley has designs on the White House.

[StarfishSaver]

31. Not insurrection. They are following a legal procedure.

They are doing exactly what Democrats did in 3 of the previous 5 elections. We may not like it, but they are not engaging in insurrection.

[Jon King]

26. They all overestimate their charisma and chances in 2024...

Every one of them think they are going to be the next Trump. But they are seriously miscalculating things. Demographics in the metro areas of all swing states is changing fast, anywhere Trump lost in 2020, they would lose by a bigger margin. In addition, they would lose NC guaranteed, and be very close in TX.

If their goal is to keep a grip on their own state Senate seats, it will work. But any of them thinking delusions of a Presidential run are going to be destroyed. The combination of changing demographics in key areas, along with the fact they simply are not Trump reality TV show stars, will cause them to lose by a much bigger margin in 2024 that Trump did in 2020.

[Klaralven]

34. Four years is an eternity in politics.

Especially if the Democrats win the Senate now, the Republicans are likely to gain control of both the House and Senate in the mid-term 2022 elections.

For 2024 all bets are off.

[Hugin]

36. You forgot 'dignity' from your list...

I simply HAD to recc this thread to get it off of 45.

[panfluteman]

38. These So-Called US Senators Don't Really Care About Trump

They see him as being on his way out, as someone who mounted a coup attempt that has failed, or is failing. However, they are in a kind of alt right feeding frenzy, trying to snap up whatever they can of Trumps phenomenally loyal base, hoping that that support will rub off on them. Unfortunately, Trump has opened the door to a kind of Pandora's box of fascism and totalitarianism in this country and, sad to say, it is having an appeal beyond the wildest expectations of many on the right. Pandering to these fascist and totalitarian tendencies is extremely dangerous and pernicious for our country, and our democracy, but these shameless hucksters are more than willing to put their own personal ambitions before their country.

[Mr.Bill]

39. If it were possible for a Vice President

to overthrow an election, the republicans (and possibly the Democrats) would have done it a long time ago. These rules and regulations have been in place since the 19th century.

[TheCowsCameHome]

40. Good old CrusTed - always the biggest turd in the punchbowl.

A pox on all of these fools.

[Smackdown2019]

41. A Democrat Senator should do this to Cruz

Replay the 2016 primary accusation of Cruz Father. Then ask who he puts his loyalty towards... Trump or his Family!

[zaj]

47. It's much worse that that.

It's turbo-charging an anti-American movement to implement a coup in the coming years.

[0rganism]

50. traitor tantrums galore

ruining our nation to build an advantage for 2024

like wrecking a car to prove you're the best driver

[Escurumbele]

51. We all need to watch Hawley closely, this guy is very dangerous

The moment I saw him a red flag clicked in my head. I was talking to a friend of mine, when I mentioned the guy's name he said the same thing, not that two of us are enough to certify a warning, but one thing for sure is that he is hungry for power, and he has shown he will do anything to get it. Hawley is an opportunist, I believe he has learned every lesson he needs from trump on how to manipulate the base, how to manipulate the GOP members as well, and how to lie. The difference between trump and him is that he is well educated and will know how to do it right, he is flexible which is an attribute that trump lacks.

[Enoki33]

56. Absolutely right. It is only a matter of time

before Putin finds a way to get his hooks into Hawley. I'm sure CI have learned a lot from watching the orange dime store Mussolini since 1982. The fight for democracy here will require the participation of every patriotic American. We have to toss the mr nice guy weakness out the window.

[rocktivity]

54. Translation: "ME NO WANT TO HEAR 'TRUMP LOSES', 'CAUSE IT MEANS I'M A LOSER, TOO!"

Last edited Sat Jan 2, 2021, 05:55 PM - Edit history (1)

rocktivity

[Judi Lynn]

64. Cruz is working hard, day by day, to develop his rugged, macho, authoritarian look:

A lady's man, like his idol.

[rocktivity]

68. Jeepers, creepers

Where DID he get those peeper?




rocktivity

[Skittles]

74. come on

you cannot see how serious this is? It goes beyond DATES.

[Atticus]

75. I don't understand this response to the OP. Can you explain just what it has to do with

"DATES"? ✌

[Skittles]

76. this isn't just about Jan 6

these are unprecedented, serious attempts to make people believe this election is illegitimate - they're setting the stage for stealing the show in the future- it is serious business, not equivalent to a "tantrum"

[Atticus]

78. I understand. nt

[Dark n Stormy Knight]

80. In digital media, this ought to be the GOP's new logo:

[rocktivity]

83. It needs a name, too

rocktivity

[Dark n Stormy Knight]

84. Adding that to my spell check.