Capitol Police once arrested & fined Rep. Jayapal for wearing a mylar blanket!

[SunSeeker]

Link to tweet

But no charges against the murderous insurrectionists for wearing flags or "crowding"!!

[mobeau69]

1. What is crowding?

[SunSeeker]

2. If what those insurrectionists were doing wasn't crowding, I don't know what is.

Maybe crowding is exceeding the Capitol's maximum allowed number of brown people.

[jaxexpat]

6. Bingo! "Crowding IS exceeding the Capitol's maximum allowed number of brown people."

[ck4829]

3. This could be it

https://code.dccouncil.us/dc/council/code/sections/22-1307.html

Sounds like if she could be arrested for this, then they ALL need to be slapped with this.

[James48]

4. How on earth

Can that be Constitutional?

I don’t get it. If you are not actually blocking the path, how can they cite this?

[mobeau69]

8. Sounds like it's a vague statute and therefore unconstitutional imo.

Thanks.

[ancianita]

5. Polygraph all Capitol police. They lie, they're fired.

More jobs for those who protect law and not just order.

[LiberalFighter]

7. Thumbs up

[jaxexpat]

9. Brilliant idea! For ALL law enforcement organizations. Screen for racism. No polygraph? No job.

In America, THAT is the number one knowingly and willfully committed crime. Has been for centuries. And perfectly acceptable within one's own tribe.

All the counselors hate the waiters and the lake has alligators.

[ancianita]

10. Make tech work for law. More jobs for more protectors of lawmakers, none for

enforcers of order and white supremacist, Trumpist disorder. F those guys.

[Jedi Guy]

16. Polygraph isn't considered reliable enough to be admissible in court.

Why would you think it's reliable enough to make hiring/firing decisions? It's entirely possible to beat a polygraph by controlling your bodily responses. It's also entirely possible for a truth to be wrongly interpreted as a lie based on a polygraph.

When I worked for a police department, our intake process included a polygraph... but it also included two different personality test batteries, in addition to three face-to-face interviews with a psychologist. There was also a 28-page background check, wherein the department called every relative I have, in addition to my neighbors. They even went as far back as high school teachers, and at that time I'd been out of high school for 10 years. And by the way, that was just for a dispatcher position. There was more to the process for actual officers.

I can't speak for every single police department's hiring process, since I'm sure some rinky-dink county sheriffs and smaller cities don't have those kinds of resources to throw into the hiring process. But for most large law enforcement agencies, it's really hard to get through that process. The entire thing is designed to unearth as many details about your life as possible, in addition to poking and prodding at you to find out what makes you tick. It's not a perfect process by any means, but there's a lot more to it than most people think.

If there are doubts about an officer's fitness for duty, turn the "hiring process" on again. If those doubts are severe enough, put them on administrative leave until the process is complete. If something nasty turns up, act on it and get rid of them. But just rounding them all up and polygraphing them isn't going to solve anything.

[ancianita]

19. Depends on the circumstances. And we're not talking just about states, but national security.

I brought it up because no one else has mentioned it, and it deserves consideration.

The fact that it's prevalent and used across the business world for qualifying job candidates, and in the intel world in debriefing intelligence operatives, and in police internal investigations, shows that it has precedence for use in this situation.
2.5 million polygraph tests are given each year in the US, with the majority administered to paramedics, police officers, firefighters, and state troopers.

Polygraph testimony was been admitted by stipulation in 19 states, subject to the discretion of the trial judge in federal court. The use of polygraph in court testimony is controversial, but it's still used extensively in post-conviction supervision, particularly of sex offenders.

I'm not talking about a silver bullet solution as you imply with "just rounding them all up and polygraphing them isn't going to solve anything." It's a tool. Right now, all tools can and should be used where judged as applicable.

Administrative leave sounds fine, too, but without legal stipulations such as "an abundance of caution," also could be challenged as assuming guilt and might be protested as unfounded.

[RVN VET71]

11. That would be a start

But I think the plan was to deliberately understaff security so the rioters could gain entry by overwhelming them -- which they clearly did. That lets the Cap Police off the hook with only one being murdered! Nice plan.

Need to track the obfuscation and road blocking that took place. The resignations are far from enough. Those responsible for this disastrous trashing of the Cap Bldg need to be ferreted out into the light of the sun and tried for treason -- if not treason, than the next most serious and available charge -- insurrection? Attempted murder of the Congress?

[ancianita]

12. Polygraph and fire the understaffers. No off the hook anything.

Key questions will ferret out those who would deviate from top security plans.

[RVN VET71]

13. I'm guessing that several congressional staff members will be busted, tried, and imprisoned

Some MF let the crazies know where Rep. Clyburn unmarked and “secret working office” was -- Even other Congress people didn’t know where the damned thing was, but the traitors were able to rush to it and trash it. Fortunately Clyburn and his staff had long since evacuated it, or the racist traitors might have had their first lynching on the Capitol grounds.

I think the staffs of the 100 or so Republican Representatives who tried to block the confirmation need to be thoroughly investigated and interviewed. Check out also the staff of Senator Cruz.

If the Federal Government is incapable of finding the abettors of treason and murder in its own legislative body, this Government is truly on death’s door. Because as long as traitors remain in the Government, we are all at risk.

[ancianita]

15. It's also known in security circles that the Architectural Office of the Capitol probably

had some maps released. Can't prove it but have read it in mulitiple sources, which also means the maps can now be used by any attackers on the capitol building ...

Which then calls for stricter armed security around the grounds, all entrances, and a reshuffling of offices away from public entry halls (like Statuary Hall) and close to exit tunnels and exit doors close to vehicles.

[RVN VET71]

20. Then a lot of investigating needs to be done of Architect of the Capitol employees

If maps were released, they were probably released by regular worker-bees and not by anyone in the upper levels of control. But everyone needs to have a sit down with the F.B.I. --- The aftermath of this first battle in the war is going to be messy and take time. In the interim I hope that somebody takes charge of security. The deliberate exclusion of security forces from the Capitol Building on Wednesday was an act of treachery and treason. There is no other way to see it. (I’ve heard that there were actually fewer police guarding the Cap Bldg on Wednesday than on a normal weekday. Has this been verified?)

This is looking more and more like the plot to kill Lincoln and his cabinet. The closer you look, the more people and offices seem to be targeted, the more people on the inside need to be identified as abettors who will need to be arrested and jailed. This was a wide conspiracy and everyone involved in its perpetration needs to be identified and punished, severely.

Jesus, the Architect of the Capitol!

[ancianita]

22. Maybe the personnel. Maybe maps have 'walked off' over time.

Anybody from building custodians to anyone fascinated with history or maps, who knows. Innocent acts that could have unintended consequences.

It's not even those who shared them, but what those who used them did with the information. The information itself could be open source, really.
It's just how we defend against information's criminal use.

[RVN VET71]

24. I doubt the maps were printed with "Rep. Clyburn's secret office" on them, but you're right.

Maps might have been taken home as souvenirs. As I think of it, the trash bins around the Architect of the Capitol offices may well have provided the maps used in the attack.

The Feds should be able to sort it out via interviews and other aspects of their investigation.

The F.B.I. -- I’m assuming it is they who will take the lead in this -- are going to be very busy for the next few months. There are so many aspects to the attack, criminal aspects, that need to be investigated: Security was botched; who were the dudes in armor usually used by SWAT teams? the ones repelling down the wall of the building? ; what was the plan for using the plastic “handcuffs”?; how did anyone know about Clyburn’s secret office -- his working office -- location?; and, most importantly, who were the murderous men and women who murdered, assisted in the murder, or just stood by and cheered on the murder of Officer Slicknick? (There are videos of the killing which I saw on reddit but which have since been taken down. Faces can clearly be seen and identified in those videos. Arrests will be made pretty quickly.)

[Jedi Guy]

14. No, polygraph isn't reliable enough.

Polygraph results are hardly ever admissible in court anymore for that reason. Polygraphs also have issues with false-positives, where a truth is interpreted as a lie. It's also possible to beat a polygraph test by controlling your body's responses. They're better at spotting lies than the average person, but not to the point where people should be deprived of their jobs and livelihoods just on a polygraph examiner's say-so.

Also, why polygraph all of them? You going to include the ones who were home sick on Wednesday, or just off-duty that day? Are you going to go to an officer who fought back against the mob and say, "Hey, even though you did your job, you're still a suspect. Sit down here and take this polygraph test so we can possibly fire you"? That'll do wonders for morale!

Blanket punishment is garbage. Identify the ones who stood aside or took selfies with the rioters and come down hard on their asses. If there's suspicion of other malfeasance, investigate. If the investigation turns up evidence, act on it. Otherwise, leave them alone. What you're proposing is that they're guilty until proven innocent, which is an ass-backwards way of looking at things.

[ancianita]

17. ONLY if you're a practiced taker of polygraphs. Which is not 99% of security. Only field

operatives of 3-letter agencies attain such skill.

You show little knowledge of polygraph use. Polygraphs are NOT used under the assumption of guilty until proven innocent. They are used as qualifying job candidates, debriefing intelligence operatives and in police internal investigations. 2.5 million polygraph tests are given each year in the US, with the majority administered to paramedics, police officers, firefighters, and state troopers. Polygraph testimony was admitted by stipulation in 19 states, ubject to the discretion of the trial judge in federal court. The use of polygraph in court testimony is controversial, but it's still used extensively in post-conviction supervision, particularly of sex offenders.

Of course not ALL who were not on duty. Gimme a break. "Sit down here and take this polygraph as part of our national security protocol" is my answer to your snickering sarcasm.

If you want to argue with this, and you think what's happening now is enough, you don't get how all tools ( RT tests and others) can be used for national security. Call me ass-backwards, but you're arguing from ignorance.

[Jedi Guy]

18. I beat a polygraph the first time I ever took one, so no, you don't have to be Jason Bourne.

At best, they have an accuracy rate of 80-90%, which isn't good enough to deprive someone of their job and livelihood. If you're going to strip someone of their job, it should be based on evidence beyond a polygraph examiner's say-so.

And I wasn't saying that polygraphs are used under the assumption of guilty until proven innocent. I was saying your approach to this issue is guilty until proven innocent. If you say "sit down here and take this polygraph test as part of our national security protocol" what you're saying is "you're a suspect until you prove you aren't." That's guilty until proven innocent.

And given the hiring process I went through when I worked for a police department, I daresay I'm not arguing from ignorance, thanks very much.

[ancianita]

21. Okay, then. You're the expert. Let's dispense with any considerations once they're made.

Thanks for your posts. At least now we know.

The way I look at it, it needed to be brought it up.

[Blue Owl]

23. Same with Rev. Warnock for PRAYING in the Capitol