You know, I was thinking last night as I drifted off to sleep

[PCIntern]

that all the movies and fun stories about mobsters are great for entertainment purposes, but when you see a real low life mobster in action, who is in a position to destroy the very fabric of the country in which we live, it’s not entertaining. It is frightening. The ruthlessness with which they ordered this nightmare to occur, the support given by senators and others of import and power to this sociopath and his family is overwhelmingly frightening and despicable. Films like the Godfather were designed to both romanticize and explain the existence of this crowd and films such as Goodfellas attempted to show the crass and violent side of their work lives, But I’ll tell you that for me the most frightening aspect of this was the way the crowd via their leader was looking to assassinate none other than Mike Pence, the vice president of the United States of America.

I hold no briefs for this toady, whose unctuous religiosity nauseates me, but the fact that this group of amateur storm troopers could convict him in their minds of a capital crime and look to lynch him is beyond the pale. One can only imagine what would’ve happened had they caught up with any of the representatives or senators from the left, particularly the females. This of course is a microcosm of America and representative of a tremendous number of people with whom we rarely if ever come into contact on a daily basis, but who most definitely exist in the background of our lives.

So many people have said to me during the last few days that they have been unable to watch this since it occurred because it’s so horrifying, and it gives credibility to the great movie line that they “can’t handle the truth”. I understand this, it’s like watching a battlefield in real time and forever being scarred by the images. I have to tell you that as a sentient individual I watched the Kennedy assassination‘s aftermath, the resultant societal tumult following the deaths of Martin Luther King and Bobby Kennedy, The horrors of Vietnam and other wars, as depicted in newsreel footage and seeing the wounded and despondent come home, the nightmare that was 9/11, and countless other minor incidents which affected my emotions greatly, But I will tell you that I have never had my soul shaken as I have been watching all of this. It is, to borrow a phrase, the sum of all fears. These are the people among whom we live, work, and play. They are capable of any behavior when they congregate in masses. Make no mistake, it is not over, it will never be over, and we will have to find a way to manage this group that has been given voice by this tinhorn Mussolini who ruled this country for four years.

[Kid Berwyn]

1. They no longer are invisible.

Now that we know who they are, we can neutralize the fascists. We don’t know them all, but we can do “contact tracing” and follow money trails.

What gets me is how well-off so many of them are — and still they want to take away the little others have, like democracy.

[Tumbulu]

2. Those of us who have lived and worked in rural

areas have been terrorized by these forces for decades. They are the small time bullies that threaten us in so many ways.

It is why you don’t see and Democratic signs or bumper stickers out in the countryside.

We are painfully aware of their monstrosity.

And they are only getting started.

Yesterday at my post office I saw a gang of them. Sick and dangerous.

Most of us have been trying to warn the urban people who have dismissed the power of Limbaugh and his ilk, but nobody has paid attention to us. Finally yesterday in The NY Times one article! After being terrorized for over 35 years by this inflammatory rhetoric, call me unimpressed.

Anyway, thank you for your post- I love reading what you have to say.

[PCIntern]

5. I grew up in a rural area that was supposedly enlightened

The hate, racism, and anti-Semitism ran rampant. We were the only practicing Jews in the area although there were many who were present. In all seriousness, I used to carry a gravity knife with me and my father had said if you feel your life is in jeopardy then use it and we will deal with the consequences later. Fortunately, I never had to withdraw it from my pocket although there were times when the temperature was increasing to the point where I wasn’t certain what to do next.

Thank you for the compliment

[Tumbulu]

6. Wow, you get it!

I grew up in an urban area and went into agriculture in the early ‘80’s so I have experienced the effect of Limbaugh amping up the forces that might have not grown and metastasized without his relentless efforts.

But perhaps I give him more credit than due.

Thanks again for all you share.

[BelieveCassandra]

15. Seeing the same where I live

They steal or knock over our Biden signs, we have had road rage incidents, threats, animal heads left on the lawn, hay bales set on fire, really a nasty bunch of petty bullies.

At least I an no longer seeing the black trucks with the blackened windows flying the F*** your Feelings & Trump flags.

We, as Democrats here, keep discussing how to assert our right to political speech. Remaining silent does not seem to be the correct answer, but we do not want to endanger anyone, either.

Thanks for your post, sometimes us Democrats in rural areas feel totally alone.

[Tumbulu]

39. it is terrorism, and I have known people whose children were poisoned and horses shot

all by these bullies. It has remained a terribly fearful situation for many. My friend with the child hospitalized emigrated to Australia.

I feel that it has given me a small taste of what POC have gone through.

Glad that black trucks have stopped, for the time being.

Lets hope that now that the urban Democrats can see what these people can do and have been doing for so long to us, there will finally be some action.

[chia]

21. I live in a blue state with lots of pockets of red. I've lived most of my life in the red. I've been

watching the impeachment, absolutely blown away by the brilliance of the impeachment managers, the speeches, media presentations putting the timeline side by side with Trump's words with crystal clarity, showing us this wasn't an unruly crowd, but dangerous people with dangerous intent... all the things we here at DU already know.

I was having coffee with friends yesterday, the wife of one said she was watching the impeachment, but her husband wouldn't watch. The other friend whom I love dearly said neither she nor her husband were watching.

I said it saddened me that the people who needed to watch the most were the people who refused to watch.

[LymphocyteLover]

23. "the people who needed to watch the most were the people who refused to watch."

sadly, that always seems to be the case. Meanwhile liberals get overburdened with all these worries and often almost paralyzed by all the problems of the world.

[Tumbulu]

40. Oh my goodness, isn't that the case?

And I am so proud of these Impeachment Managers. So proud.

[chia]

42. Me too, I could not be more proud... they're the real patriots!

[LymphocyteLover]

22. frightening, truly. What was the NYTimes article?

[Tumbulu]

41. Here is the link to it

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/02/10/business/media/conservative-talk-radio-capitol-riots.html?action=click&module=Spotlight&pgtype=Homepage

By Michael M. Grynbaum, Tiffany Hsu, Katie Robertson and Keith Collins
Feb. 10, 2021
Two days before a mob of Trump supporters invaded the United States Capitol, upending the nation’s peaceful transition of power and leaving at least five people dead, the right-wing radio star Glenn Beck delivered a message to his flock of 10.5 million listeners: “It is time to fight.”

“It is time to rip and claw and rake,” Mr. Beck said on his Jan. 4 broadcast. “It is time to go to war, as the left went to war four years ago.”

A former Fox News host, Mr. Beck had speculated for weeks about baseless claims of voter fraud in the presidential race. He told listeners that Donald J. Trump had taught conservatives that “you don’t have to cower anymore, you don’t have to back down when ridiculed into oblivion. You can fight back.”

[LymphocyteLover]

43. thanks!

[The Wizard]

3. How would Lindsey Graham, Rick Scott, Ted Cruz et al.

respond to a Democrat who acted like a Russian agent trying to destroy the United States. There's no nice way to say treasonous Nazi.

[barbtries]

4. i cry often while watching these scenes.

the seditionists are not in their right minds. this is my country. people died, but not as many people as the insurrectionists wanted to kill. I realized watching this that they would have killed congress people if they had reached them.

which pleased donald trump, because it was all for him. he was over in his ivory tower like a toddler opening presents that were all for him and nobody else.

[bdamomma]

35. And there

were people who actually saw him enjoying the chaos and mayhem. He should be arrested period.

[rurallib]

7. K & R you are on the money

[Dread Pirate Roberts]

8. I reluctantly recommend this post

Not because I disagree with anything in it but because it is true and it make my head and stomach hurt.

[bronxiteforever]

9. Kick and recommend. It has echoes in the Serbian conflict

An intimate hate where people you live with or thought you shared peaceful cooperation could turn your country into a fascist hellhole.

“I realize that what happened in Bosnia could happen anywhere in the world, particularly in places that are diverse and have a history of conflict. It only takes bad leadership for a country to go up in flames, for people of different ethnicity, color, or religion to kill each other as if they had nothing in common whatsoever. Having a democratic constitution, laws that secure human rights, police that maintain order, a judicial system, and freedom of speech don't ultimately guarantee long lasting peace. If greedy or bloodthirsty leaders come to power, it can all go down. It happened to us. It can happen to you.”
― Savo Heleta, Not My Turn to Die: Memoirs of a Broken Childhood in Bosnia

[PJMcK]

12. Good post

Thanks for the quote, bronxiteforever. Have a heart!

Off topic, for about ten years I lived on City Island in the Bronx. It was lovely, quiet and fun with great waterfront and terrific restaurants. It was remarkable that one could be in such a dramatically different environment only 45 minutes from midtown!

[bronxiteforever]

20. Thanks PJMcK! My fondest memories of my Dad

was when, on Saturday, he would take me to City Island and we would ramble about and have a great lunch. I am glad you got to live there and I am envious of your experience there!

[MyOwnPeace]

10. I am one of those that will not watch......

NOT because I don't believe it or 'can't handle the truth' - but because I can't believe that there is even ONE PERSON that will refuse to find IQ45 guilty of all charges and more!

And to support my decision - I had forgotten the Texas bus incident. I was outraged when it had happened but, as happened so many times in the "Age of tRump" - it got lost in the never-ending saga of more and more outrageous acts to follow.

They are right to press the case - he IS guilty - he IS a monster - and we must never forget.

[N_E_1 for Tennis]

11. Thoughtful article PCIntern...

Reading your words caused me to go into an introspective romp across my younger self’s mind.
Came to realize that murder shaped much of the thinking I have today.

As you, I watched the aftermath of Kennedy’s assassination as an eleven year old. Jack Ruby’s murder was the first “real time” murder I witnessed watching live on TV.

Then to experience the assassination of Robert Kennedy and Martin Luther King in what seemed to be rapid succession. Murders of students while protesting the undeclared war in Vietnam, watching bodies of the participants be escorted off transport planes.

All this and more to be lived through after I was drafted into the Army. Murder and violence shaped my beliefs more than I realized.

And it continues as I approach my 7th decade.

[PCIntern]

13. We are the same age and have lived through very trying times

But the one thing I never expected to see is what we witnessed on January 6

[N_E_1 for Tennis]

14. I weep with you, never, ever...

[Jetheels]

16. It is disturbing to watch but I'm finding some solace in the amazing presentation with video and

audio interspersed by the Democrats who are speaking. It’s almost like a Frontline documentary.
And of course it is mind bending that any Republican would not convict with evidence that could not be laid out in any clearer and succinct way. Really, the republicans can’t tear themselves away from this trump monster after all this, someone they collectively hated before he became president? If republicans don’t convict, and anyone or company from here on out that is associated with trump crime family, might as well brand a swastika on their forehead, á la Manson. One victory is Twitter finally took away trumps megaphone permanently. He was president 4 years but before 2016 he ruled the narrative with the birther lies.

[PatSeg]

17. I was talking about this last night

What is most horrifying to me is that these people were not some strangers from a foreign land who for some reason hate us. They are our friends, co-workers, neighbors, customers, and possibly even our relatives. Looking around, it makes you wonder, who are the people in our world who could be capable of such mindless, mob violence? And what is there about those people that would cause them to maim and murder in the name of a tyrannical leader? I know some of them were already gun-toting extremists, but most were seemingly ordinary citizens. That is truly frightening.

[llmart]

18. "it will never be over, and we will have to find a way to manage this group"

Very thought provoking post. Now...

This is a Democratic discussion board. Let's just look at your quote and formulate some steps we can take to do just that. No. 1, of course, is to continue to fight like hell to elect many, many more Democrats up and down the ballots. We focus way too much on the presidential elections and not enough on the local ones. All elections matter. We need to hold our elected officials responsible and make sure they know we are watching them and what they do.

Many here have suggested targeted boycotts. Some people think they aren't effective. I think they are. See a GOP sign in a small business supporting a Republican? Do not give them your business even if they are a small business. Same goes for the big corporations. It's not like you can't get the same service or product from another place. Find out who is financing the campaigns of your local people also.

If all you can do is write letters to the editor, do that.

Last but not least, do not be afraid to be vocal about who and what you support. Many of these right wing nutters convince themselves that you are all in with their agenda if you stay silent. Don't ever show a bully that you are afraid of them. It only emboldens them.

I welcome any other suggestions. I am just a small, peace loving female senior citizen, but I have a voice and will use it. Besides, I am retired and I have nothing but time on my hands right now. My new rep was put into office backed by the big dollars in our county's GOP. She has zero experience in government, but the powers that be in my neck of the woods knew that they could manipulate her to do their bidding. Her first act after being sworn in was to not certify the election. She has heard from me many times since then and I make sure she knows I'm watching her every vote and spreading the word to others in the area.

[bdamomma]

36. I am senior citizen too

in the over 65 club. I think it begins at state level concerning all state offices or even being on your state council. Right now the Republicans (if you can call them that) are still stopping people from voting, gerrymandering etc. The poison they have for our country is spilling into the main stream of our society such as right wing radio and right wing TV, social media and the rest. I do not have to say how powerful propaganda is and how it was a factor in this whole thing. People believed the lies, and they still do, unfortunately.

[llmart]

44. Propaganda

When my son was in fifth or sixth grade he had a teacher who taught the students what propaganda was, how to recognize it, how to respond to it. She did this through a gamelike session to make it fun. He has always remembered that and tells me it was one of the best life lessons he learned in school. He's now fifty years old. Granted, this was in a class for only a handful of kids who were identified early on as gifted, but in some fashion or other it could be something that is taught to all students if they're not being taught this at home.

[summer_in_TX]

46. I too was taught about propaganda in elementary school.

I often think how lucky I was to have had that. It was the early '60s in Austin. I've wondered how widespread that kind of curriculum was in the post-war years.

[llmart]

47. That's interesting to know.

You were fortunate but I imagine Austin was always a fairly progressive place. I grew up in a small, rural town where everyone was white and mostly conservative. My parents taught us about propaganda. As a teenager there were times when I hated that they were so different from most parents, but part of the time I reveled in being "different". My mother, whose parents were German was especially vocal about us all not being followers, but to do what's right and be leaders. Your post made me realize that maybe that's why she was so adamant about it. My mother wasn't a particularly vocal person living in the shadow of my father who was vocal about anything and everything.

[sinkingfeeling]

19. I'm 73, so very aware of what a violent country we are. What

terrifies me the most is that 3 out of every 10 people around me support this mobster gang. They are the store clerks, mechanics, doctors, cable guys, lawyers, teachers, and IT folks we see and speak to daily. How do you know who to trust?

[world wide wally]

24. It shouldn't be surprising how destructive lies coupled with ignorance can be.

We've seen it before and now we see how it CAN happen here.

[Hortensis]

25. I'm less affected because I've known this about some people for years.

It's frightening, horrifying, to see actually playing out.

But knowing and understanding help maintain balance and resilience and allow people to foresee. If more people understood what could happen if the worst of us got control, it'd be much less possible. Some of them are also very nice, even admirable people, loving parents, good, caring neighbors, heroic firefighters, inspiring teachers -- as if we all have many facets but show the ones current circumstances turn forward.

So it'd be helpful to learn about the kind of people who searched for a strongman leader, created one out of Donald Trump, and now spread deadly disease for him and want to make him their dictator. When they're not over shoveling their neighbors' walkways and calling to see if they need something from the store.

This book is very highly regarded (research since only confirming and enlarging on it), free online, and a very good read. Many people really are broad-spectrum haters and only a passing mob away from murdering neighbors they've always smiled at and taken in mail for. We're in the middle of a holocaust of their leaders' -- and their enthusiastic -- making. But most people would probably come out less afraid and angry at them and even able to accept them as neighbors again because they understand them better. And because they're also "normal" but mercifully a minority that we have to both control and live with.

https://theauthoritarians.org/

"Options for getting the book" is at the top.

[NJCher]

30. checking it out

wonder if it has the same line of argument as Escape from Freedom by Fromm.

re your comment about hate, I observed that the other day. I have a few professional colleagues who were trump supporters, all the more amazing because they are academics, and one sent out an email yesterday that I had to conclude was based in hate. It always gives me pause, because hate seems so out of place in a teacher.

Disturbing. I actually shuddered.

[Hortensis]

34. The need to turn the fear and burden of responsibility, including

their consciences, over to their leader is one of the key traits discussed. Escape from freedom, for sure.

So ironic that fighting for freedom is the trumpists' excuse for obeying their leader's instruction to ignore (and spread) disease that could harm, even kill, them and theirs. In the height of the murderous holocaust they've been integral to, many still fanatically believe and obey.

[flying_wahini]

26. Breaking out the ONE Fact that the unruly mob were encouraged to kill Pence and Nancy

Is all you need to know about the chain of command and Trump goons whispering in his ears....

The plan was to remove the legal replacements so he could retain control.

[malaise]

33. THIS

the truth

[Dave in VA]

27. I.O.K.I.Y.A.R.*

Has reached its zenith. He didn't have to stand on 5th Ave and shoot someone, he just sent his mob to the United States Capitol and people died as a result.

Law and order, Support the Blue, USA, USA, they never really meant any of this. Only power matters.

Cowards all!

*It's OK If You Are Republican

[Stuart G]

28. Great last sentence...quote: "Make no mistake, it is not over, it will never be over and we will....

have to find a way to manage this group that has been given voice by this tinhorn Mussolini who ruled this country for four years."

Thank You PCIntern,.... for this post and for all your service to DU.

[bdamomma]

29. Propaganda

works, it was all based on lies. And it did happen within the United States. All who were involved need to be found and arrested be it citizens or insiders in the Congress. I am glad they showed the videos, most Congressmen did NOT even know how close they were to being hurt or killed.

[mnhtnbb]

31. I was moving into my new house on Jan 6th so did not see the insurrection in real time

After my cable was connected the next day, I could watch news reports and videos as they were shown.

But nothing frightened me as much as watching the Managers presenting their case yesterday. It's terrifying to see how close we came to not only losing more people to the violence, but our democracy to a coup envisioned and managed by Trump to overturn the results of the election.

I told a friend around 5 pm that a firing squad would be too good for the man. If the Senate refuses to convict him after hearing all that evidence yesterday, well, then they can join him in going down in history as complicit with the attempt to overturn the government and be remembered as traitors, too.

We are not out of this, yet, especially if Trump is not held accountable. I found remarks by Angus King on MSNBC to be most to the point when he discussed the "But for" criteria used by prosecutors to be applied in determining guilt. But for Donald Trump, the insurrection would not have happened. No one can disagree with that. No one.

I just sent messages to both my Repub Senators from NC telling them that if they do not vote to convict Trump of high crimes and misdemeanors for his role as architect of the insurrection of January 6th, then they deserve to be remembered as traitors right along with Trump, and that we, the people, will not forget.

[malaise]

32. A great OP

I watched Jan 6 live and was still in s state of incredulity yesterday.
And yes evil is everywhere.
In Escape from Germany Margot could not believe the boy who let her ride his bike the week before was now throwing stones at her as his parents and friends burned down the homes and businesses of .Jews.

I watched them burn down the home for senior citizens right here in Jamaica.

[bdamomma]

37. Lincoln Project "Blood"

[Pluvious]

38. We can no longer say "it could never happen here" nt.

[halfulglas]

45. I watched the effects in the 90s.

In the 90s we brought my MIL to live in our house as she couldn't live alone. We didn't have cable TV yet but we had Rush. I was working at home as a transcriptionist so my MIL spent most of her time in her bedroom listening to radio, Rush and the local conservative commentator who followed him. They must have been moneymakers for the radio station because it seemed they were on constantly, any time I checked on her. My MIL was a good person, but with some prejudice because the area of the city she had grown up in was "ruined by those people." I tried to explain blockbusting to her, how it worked and it's effect, how subsequent landlords don't keep up on repairs and so the neighborhoods deteriorate, but it's hard to correct how others "feel," but when I would check we would see each other for lunch or whatever she would hear some of the things he was saying, I would be flabbergasted at what was coming from her radio. And the copycat who followed him was almost as bad. He was local and she thought he was a wonderful person. I tried to tell her what I knew of him, how he had sexually harrassed my friend, and she said he would never do that, my friend must have misunderstood. There is something about how they mix facts they pull out of their posterior and mix it with feelings that reinforces their belief.

I remember one time after picking up my car from getting it serviced and not realizing my station had been changed and listening to the Rush clone for a little while because I wasn't in a position to reach to change the station. He was quoting gun "facts" during an argument and his "facts" were mostly untrue and as I finally changed the station I wondered how he could get away with that. But of course in retrospect with Fox and Trump and so many others now we realize that's what they do - they flood the zone with so much crap that it's hard to correct it and you can't stop people from listening to it. And daytime AM radio is mostly talk. But Rush changed my MIL. He reinforced every negative opinion she had. That's how the hate begins.