I'd like to say something about veterans who participated in the insurrection

[maxrandb]

I saw some of these guys interviewed in the news. Some fat fuckstick on a motorcycle was saying; "I'm a veteran who swore an oath to support and defend the Constitution", and, "if it came to it I'll take up arms".

A couple of things.

First: Please stop pretending you're a badass. 95% of us veterans have never even seen a shot fired in anger. I've personally seen guys like this cry if the Mess Deck Ice Cream Machine is secured for cleaning, or if the Ship's Store ran out of Doritos. Just STOP it. Veterans know that guys like you would be the first to turntail and run in a bar fight.

Second: Be brave. The next time you want to storm something, please don't pick a bunch of unarmed civilian men and women, 75% of which are septuagenarians, or older. I recommend you show your bravery by trying that shit at Camp Lejune, or Naval Station Norfolk.

Finally, Fuck You! If you're retired, we're going to drag your ass back to active duty, shave that raccoon off your face, slap a triple XL uniform on your fat ass, and Court Martial the everloving piss out of you.

[blm]

1. Hammer em with the truth.

As usual.

[MLAA]

2. You made me cheer right out loud!

Your opinion/observations and how you delivered it really hit the mark.

[housecat]

107. me too!

[TxVietVet]

3. Amen, brother.

Patriots, my ass. They talk a lot of bu$hit.

[SKKY]

4. As a fellow Veteran, I endorse these comments.

[Prof. Toru Tanaka]

11. This fellow veteran seconds your endorsement and agrees 100%.

[Johnyawl]

36. As a fellow Veteran, I too endorse these comments.

Also, if you're going to claim to be supporting the Constitution, get a copy of it and study it so you have an idea of what you're talking about.

[Fortinbras Armstrong]

132. I'm a veteran as well, and I agree completely n/t

[soldierant]

124. Me too, and me too. maxrandb for SecDef! (or at least JAG.)

[OldBaldy1701E]

129. Me too (n/t)

[underpants]

5. I saw that bit.

I see these tough types on Facebook all the time. We all served in combat arms but we never saw action. Yeah we missed the largest movement of personnel ever at that point (Gulf 1) so we got a bit lucky. A few of us have become very raging liberal but some cling to those 2-4 years Even though I notice they didn’t stay in. I guess it’s not as sad as “peaking in high school”.

That guy looked like he hasn’t exactly been struggling. Nice bike he had there - You know you aren’t too “HARD” when your recreation involves sitting down (yes I’m a golfer too).

Are we talking regular Doritos or Cool Ranch here?

[JHB]

6. Every time I hear this sort of wingnut "hard ass" bloviating...

...I remember a comment I've heard in some form from every vet who actually had hot lead flying their way that I've known well enough for them to talk some:

"The guys with the biggest mouths are always the ones who were farthest back."

[Codifer]

23. During World War Two

The Stars and Stripes cartoonist Bill Mauldin called them "Garatroopers"; (... too far foreward to wear ties and too far back to get shot).

[getagrip_already]

7. veterans are people first...

Some are good, some, well, some not so much.

I think the best description I heard was when oliver north was being tried in his military uniform. Someone said something to the effect that it is the uniform that gets automatic respect, the person wearing it has to earn it.

Veterans have a special place because of their sacrifice for the good of the country. Even those not firing weapons still worked for far too little money, and spent long stretches away from family.

So this old douche socket gets no respect for his views or actions. I don't care what he did in his twenties.

[pwb]

8. There were a lot of assholes in the Army When I was in.

No surprise to me some were there. Most were not there and are disgusted with what happened.

[kimbutgar]

55. My husband was in the Navy and would 100% agree with you

He said he met a lot of racist idiots while serving.

[Kaleva]

56. I was a Navy Fire Controlman for over 10 years but I don't brag about my military prowess

because I don't have any.

[bottomofthehill]

9. The oath

Support and defend the Constitution against all enemies foreign and domestic

Those seditionists that participated in this insurrection violated their oath, those seditionists who supported or assisted in the planning violated their oath, those who attacked those who took the oath and were actually were defending democracy violated their oath. Fuck them all, they built a gallows at the US Capitol, investigate them, charge them, try them, and if convicted, hang them. People died due to their actions. They led and participated in an armed insurrection against the government of the United States.

[Prof. Toru Tanaka]

15. After Trump, they may have to make a change to this oath...

and place the word "lawful" in front of "orders of the president".

Other than that, I still agree with this oath decades after my service time ended.

[bottomofthehill]

17. Copy,

[Wounded Bear]

20. That's what the final clause is for...

"According to the UCMJ."

[Prof. Toru Tanaka]

52. looking again, yes you are right on that

[aggiesal]

69. I've never served, but when I read the oath, I felt the same way ...

I was thinking more "Legal" but "Lawful" works for me.
And not only the "Lawful" orders of the pResident, but "Lawful" orders of the Officers ..., as well.

[MasonDreams]

104. Those "oath keepers" must, over time, come to realize that that "POTUS" was a domestic enemy

Last edited Thu Feb 11, 2021, 11:51 PM - Edit history (1)

of the Constitution of the United States. Faithfully was not even in his vocabulary. Take care only applied to himself. His lust for unlimited power was uninhibited by any law. Faithfully execute the laws? That thought would need provisions for an large expedition to cross his mind.

[N_E_1 for Tennis]

10. Being a veteran...I appreciate and fully endorse your remarks.

[SCantiGOP]

42. Any vet at the Capitol who took their earlier oath seriously

Would have joined the Police in defending the Capitol.

[MineralMan]

12. There is nothing predictive about being a veteran.

It is a meaningless designation when it comes to how a person will behave as a person. At the time I served in the USAF, I met people of all kinds wherever I was stationed. Some were wonderful people; others were assholes.

Being a veteran simply means that you wore a military uniform at some point in your life. It means nothing else that predicts what kind of person you are.

[stevesinpa]

50. BRAVO!

i couldnt agree more.
being an active duty soldier, marine, airman or sailor or a veteran does not automatically make you a decent person. being a veteran is like being a christian, it doesnt mean a damn thing if you are a POS

[maxrandb]

75. Here! Here!

Bravo Zulu!

Folks who act like earned some type of glory for wearing the uniform make me sick.

I served for almost 29 years, and for the majority of that time it was just like a normal job. I had duty and deployments, and one time dove under a desk while in the Sandbox, but for the most part, it was go to work, make sure we can launch aircraft, go home at the end of the day.

There are tons of teachers, firefighters, nurses, single parents working double shifts and construction workers who I am sure did more to advance the freedom and liberty of America than I ever did.

[Hulk]

78. Think your post expresses my feeling accurately.

I'm really frustrated when I hear "thank you for your service." I won't ever say it. I did my service. Nobody needs to thank me. I did it for my country, not some worthless accolade which most often means nothing.

[MineralMan]

84. Everyone who served in the military did it for different reasons.

Some were drafted. Others enlisted for a single term. Still others make a career of military services. I'm in the second group. I enlisted in the USAF as an alternative to being drafted. Instead of two years, I was in for four. I was a young guy of 19 when I enlisted. I did my four years, doing what the USAF decided they needed me to do. Then, I got out and went on with my life.

If someone asks me, I'll say, "Sure. I was in the USAF for four years." If someone thanks me for my service, I'll say, "Thanks, but I enlisted on my own accord. I learned a bunch of stuff and got to travel some. Then, I went back to college on the GI Bill. No thanks are needed. It was my choice."

Every veteran has his or her own story. I didn't serve out of some sense of duty. It was what I did for four years, because it was an option for me, instead of being drafted. I learned some things about myself and gained some new skills.

[Callmecrazy]

114. I totally agree...

I served because I felt it was my duty as an American.
I'm of the opinion that all Americans should serve this country in some form.
Be a forest Ranger, an air traffic controller, railroad worker or a police officer; serve your countrymen for the good of all.
When someone says that to me I think they should add, "Because I didn't."
I've never had a fellow veteran say thank you for your service to me. Except for those I'm still in touch with after 30 years. They say, "Thanks for serving with me and making it so much fun."

[Yeehah]

13. They make me puke

They embarrass and shame all veterans.

[COL Mustard]

35. No, They Only Embarrass and Shame Themselves

They don't embarrass me...just piss me off.

[Demonaut]

14. Completely agree, brothers in mops

we try to keep politics out of the military fb groups I'm a member of

[judesedit]

16. Fantastic post. They probably never even read the Constitution

This is where I blame the educational system in this country. Research The Dumbing Down of America. It's pretty bizarre and it has worked.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

91. They are defending an erroneous set of factoids, not the Constitution

If you truly thought that tRump or Biden had stolen the election, you better base that on verifiable true facts that can pass detailed scrutiny, not some convoluted chain of conspiracies. Not some shaky video of people moving boxes with a voice-over interpreting it as evil.

Not a set of factoids so bogus they don't dare present them in court because the few times they tried they got laughed out and shut down.

And yes, the educational system has not equipped many people with the skills to detect and deflect propaganda; the skills of critical reasoning; the skill of avoiding confirmation bias and seeking counter-facts to test the strength of the hypothesis.

It has not equipped many people to recognize or even to avoid anti-democratic authoritarianism.

[Joelteply]

122. Is it really the education system?

My feeling is it’s the person first, and then the parents. I received an outstanding education in civics and mathematics all before even high school, a public school in Kansas. I know these people. They intentionally avoided learning. They sat in the back of the class and terrorized others. They skipped class and some got kicked out.

[judesedit]

126. Most schools don't offer those classes now. They don't want you to think. What you are

taught is the only answer or you fail. So much depends on the schools and the curriculum they insist be taught or not taught. And the donors can dictate some of that.

[The Polack MSgt]

18. +++

I'm The Polack Msgt and I endorse this message.

[Ohiya]

44. This Irish ex-Petty Officer 2nd class concurs!

[maxrandb]

76. Oooh-Rah Master Sargent

[plimsoll]

19. My apologies to you, guys like that make people suspicious of the military.

That shouldn’t happen in our society, but every time you see that guy you ask yourself, “would he protect all of us?”

It lends credence to the question of are we spending this money for our protection, or domination. I wonder if the Pentagon realizes how much damage people like Michael Flynn have done to faith in our armed services.

[dware]

74. I disagree,

I believe that the public's faith and trust in the Military is stronger because of the Military's refusal to become involved in the election process and any election disputes despite the intense pressure to.

[plimsoll]

89. I hope you're correct, because we've bet our lives on it.

[DENVERPOPS]

94. EXACTLY NC

[maxrandb]

77. I take pride in knowing

That for every one Mike Flynn in the military, there are 50-100 Admiral Mullen's, Admiral Stavrides', General Honore's, General Powell's, RADM Goodwin's and Master Chief Breshear's.

Of course, even one Flynn is one too many, and he should be one of the first recalled for a GCM.

[CaptainTruth]

21. I don't get "defending the Constitution by attacking my government"

Especially not in support of T*.

If they really wanted to defend the Constitution they would have been working against T* for the past 4 years.

[FakeNoose]

29. Exactly - they swore an oath to defend the Constitution

OK, so why were they at the U.S. Capitol tearing everything - including the Constitution - apart? Makes no sense to me.

[NoRoadUntravelled]

41. Could be they don't know the difference between Democracy and Fascism

They believed they were willing to die to defend the Constitution. In reality they were willing to die to keep their beloved fascist dictator wannabe in office.

[FakeNoose]

97. They were willing for someone else to die for Chump

None of them were volunteering.

[Rural_Progressive]

116. I served, someone from every generation of my father's family since before the Civil War served

They are oath breakers, plain and simple. I have no use for an oath breaker.

[Raster]

22. I am not a Veteran. Thank you and all other Veterans for your service.

Rhetorical question: When did protect and defend the Constitution become protect and defend Donald Trump*?

[LastLiberal in PalmSprings]

24. Most people who use the Constitution to justify their actions haven't read it.

I would imagine that includes half the GOP senators and representatives from red states.

I agree with the sentiment expressed in the OP. I know as retired officer I can called back to active duty until I die. I know of doctors who were retired from active service who were reactivated during Dubya's ego-war on Iraq. I'm not sure the same rule applies to enlistment personnel, who have to "re-up" at specified intervals.

[sarge43]

57. Retired enlisted can and have been recalled.

Rank isn't a no-go. Article 2, UCMJ.

I want every military retiree who was in that mob get the Book dropped on them -- from a great height.

[Rabrrrrrr]

71. Would they have to be retired? Or could anyone who served - even for two years -

be hauled in for a court martial?

[maxrandb]

79. Probably limited to retirees

Unlike folks who only did a couple if years, retirees have agreed to maintain a relationship with the military by applying for and accepting benefits.

Now, I do understand that there is a requirement to maintain eligibility for an Honorable characterization of service.

In the same way that Character of Service can be administratively upgraded from Other Than Honorable, an Honorable Discharge can be downgraded. This is strictly an administrative action, so no courts are involved.

Lose an Honorable Discharge characterization, and you can lose entitlement from all kinds of VA Benefits.

[sarge43]

85. Depends upon their status

If they were discharged (enlisted) or completed their obligation, required term of service or released from it (commissioned officers), no.

If they still have a contractual obligation, active duty, reserve, active or inactive, yes. Retirees, definitely yes.

There are more possibilities, but the above would probably cover anyone claiming veteran status.

Check the UCMJ, Article 2. Anyone listed is subject to the UCMJ and should behave themselves.

[LastLiberal in PalmSprings]

93. Thanks for the information.

I got to administer the re-enlistment oath to a young airman once. Even though it wasn't a fancy ceremony, he and I, and his family members, took the occasion very seriously. If you truly recognize what you're signing up for, it should be a moving occasion, no matter the setting. It was evident both he and his family were proud of him--as was I. I felt honored to participate.

When I saw these "veterans" storming the nation's capitol and killing in the name of the false god they worship, I think back on that young man. I don't remember his name and after 30 years I doubt I'd recognize him, but I got the feeling he was going to have a long and satisfying career. And that he wouldn't have been in the crowd of insurrectionists on January 6th.

Round 'em up, activate them, court martial them, convict them, jail them and take away all their benefits. They were the domestic enemies they had taken an oath to protect the Constitution against. They can serve as an example of just how serious the oath is.

Now, if only we could do something similar to the QRepugs who conspired with T**** to overturn our democracy...

[sarge43]

100. Thank you, sir.

Yup, it's a hellva commitment.

Concur with the rest. I keep remembering all the men and women served with honor, kept their oath and too often put everything on the line.

As for T**** lackeys, history will be their judge.

[monkeyman1]

25. d. trump - ex -president draft dodger -chief !!!

[shrike3]

26. Hear, hear. And thank you for your service.

[keithbvadu2]

27. Some of Trump's terrorists have tried to enlist and some have gotten in.

https://www.mercurynews.com/2020/05/29/man-who-allegedly-threatened-to-murder-jews-and-police-sentenced-in-federal-case-over-attempt-to-join-army/

East Bay man who allegedly threatened to murder Jews and police sentenced in federal case over attempt to join army
Nearly $18,000 in restitution ordered



OAKLAND — A Concord man known for allegedly threatening to murder Jewish people and cops at random was sentenced in his federal case Friday, for joining the army based on a falsified application.

Ross Anthony Farca, 24, was sentenced to six months he’s already served in jail and ordered to pay $17,832 in restitution, for a conviction of making false statements to a government agency. The six month sentence is the maximum Farca faced.

U.S. District Judge Jon Tigar, who handed down the sentence, said in court he was aware of the threat charges but could only sentence Farca for his federal case, according to Jweekly.

Now, Farca is expected to be to the Martinez Detention Facility in Contra Costa County, where he faces charges of making criminal threats and illegal possession of an assault weapon.


Federal prosecutors say Farca claimed he falsely denied having consulted with a health care professional about an emotional or mental health condition, when he applied to join the army in 2017. In fact, Farca had seen a psychiatrist regularly six years prior.

Farca was granted admission to the U.S. Army, but was discharged after getting into a fight at a training camp, according to court records.

(more)

[relayerbob]

28. Bear in min that ...

Last edited Thu Feb 11, 2021, 03:55 PM - Edit history (1)

while it's clear that veterans were involved, more than one of the treasonous losers were lying about being in the military in the first place. We all know them .... I recall knowing one guy, who was younger than I was, talking about his "time in Nam". Considering the war ended just as I was getting of the age to be concerned, there was no way he was in "Nam", and frankly, pretty obvious he had never been anywhere near the military.

Also, good on you for calling out the bastards who actually were in the military and chose treason over duty. Thank you and I agree 100%.

[ProfessorGAC]

80. That Happened To Me, Too

In my fifties, I had a guy I knew was younger than me (went to same HS, wasn't there when I was) talking about Vietnam experience.
I left HS after 3rd year to go to college, and he was not a freshman yet. So, he was at least 2.5 years younger than me.
They quit deploying to Vietnam nearly 2 years before I turned 18. The draft ended around 14 months before I was 18.
The war would have ended when he was between freshman & sophomore year and the draft ended when he was in 7th grade.
I will say he looked rough & older than he actually was. But, I knew he was lying.
Who knows how many people he told that lie to.

[TheCowsCameHome]

30. Very well said.

[4Q2u2]

31. 4 out of 5 Dentist

Prefer Harley Davidson's. Did he have the Leather Vest with 8 million patches. Nothing says phony like that vest.

NOB is too big and expansive. They should try their luck at one of my favorite places not too far from Norfolk.

Little Creek, Amphib Base.

[redstatebluegirl]

32. I confronted a neighbor of ours who said he was a "veteran who would defend Trump to the death".

He wasn't in Washington, I know because I saw him out walking his dog. When he said that to me I asked him what kind of combat he was involved in. He started stammering, said "well I was trained to do my duty". I told him my brother was flying missions in Vietnam where in one case he was the only one who made it back to the carrier. He looked at the ground, looked at his hands and walked off.

They are cowards! They stand behind being "veterans" but like you say a big difference between him, and guys like my brother who actually were in combat and got shot at.

[Paladin]

33. Nicely put. Thanks. (nt)

[leanforward]

34. May those of us veterans have difficulty for the rest of their lives.

This thread got me going. I've met GI's like those we're talking about here.

[flying_wahini]

37. I have a theory that most of these guys are just "I wannabe a soldier." Because they missed

Or didn’t take an opportunity to fight in a real war they have to show their mettle by dressing up and carry guns like real soldiers do. That and too much testosterone.

[SCantiGOP]

39. Maxrandb:

Your last paragraph should be etched in granite on a monument somewhere.
Bravo

[flamin lib]

40. Well said. As a fellow vet (Vietnam Era, never served outside US)

I'm here to tell ya' that as a class vets aren't that damn special. We're just another random selection of human beings (loosely speaking).

It's not about wearing a uniform, it's what YOU did that makes you who YOU are.

And that's true for every human being in this country; serving as military, police, politician, service worker and voter. It's not about what group you belong to it's what YOU do.

[Traildogbob]

43. Damn!!!

Obviously a sailor and I love every fucking word you said. Saw that frequently on my DDG.
Sorry for the “F” word but sailors usually use it between every other word, so this was a clean post.
I am pre female shipmates sailor so maybe the “F”s have diminished a bit.

[Ingersollman]

45. Preach

it, brother! I was in the Army throughout the 80's. These sons-of-bitches that think they're tough and that 1/6 was "patriotic" can all kiss my ass. When push comes to shove, I'll be there to shove them right off a cliff.

[onethatcares]

46. and if they are retired with benefits

they lose them all up to refunding the government they hate so much the money they and their dependents may have collected.

You don't get to eat at the table if you hate the cook.

[sarge43]

47. Thank you, Brother

First: "95% of us veterans have never even seen a shot fired in anger." Truth.
I fired a M-16 exactly once in 21 years and it sure wasn't in anger. Most of us were in combat support or combat support service. We made sure combat had what they needed.

Second: I know of a retired Air Force bird who could still kick biker slob's ass up around his ears -- Buzz Aldrin. I'd put down the next retirement check to see that. Hell, this ancient former MTI could have slob in ten minutes in the fetal position.

Finally, I want Michael Flynn and that AF lite colonel as the first guests of honor at a general CM. They betrayed their oath and their commission. That's as low as it gets.

Cluster coitus all of them.

[BobTheSubgenius]

48. Hell yeah!

While my father was Canadian, so it's not exactly the same, he was a WW2 vet in a war where they shot real bullets, and MILLIONS of them. Had his Spitfire shot out from under him, evaded capture for days and made it back to his unit. I'd say he was a veteran, and I know for a damned FACT what he would think of this.

Every Nov. 11, he'd show up, in uniform, at the cenotaph in downtown Vancouver for Dawn Patrol and honour those who died. Year after year after year. He would have nothing but contempt for these people, because they have no honour.

[matt819]

49. What goes through their minds?

These veterans boggle the mind.

The president said China is the eneby. If you're a former intelligence officer, do you fly to China and try to recruit the finance minister? Do you stake out the foreign ministry and find someone who will spy for you? FFS, No. Do you go to Wuhan and try to blow the place up or capture every bat you see? Of course not, you idiot. You are no longer an intelligence officer.

The same questions apply to law enforcement or, for that matter, park rangers. You're retired, or resigned, or ousted. YOU'RE NO LONGER A SOLDIER OR AN INTELLIGENCE OFFICER OR A PARK RANGER, YOU FUCKING MORON.

On the plus side, I've read many posts here that suggest that these low-IQ veterans can be recalled to active duty and court martialed. If that's true, I'm all for it.

[LiberalLoner]

51. 👍👍👍👍❤️❤️❤️❤️🌹🌹🌹

[packman]

53. Damn right - That oath was to an ideal, not a person

Any vet that took part in that should be ashamed - they showed no love for America that day

[magicksmom]

54. Bravo

,
. . . 'trying that shit at Camp Lejune or Norfolk Naval' . . . I'm married but I think I love you.

[AmBlue]

58. Oh HELL yeah!

My Dad was a Navy man and was thoroughly disgusted by these types.

[Greybnk48]

59. I love every word you just said,

and read it to my husband, who's a vet. He was in the Navy for four years, from 1970 to 1974, and he never once shot a gun. Not once.

He was trained as a corpsman at Great Lakes Navel Station.

[Tommymac]

60. In the 1980's I knew Paramilitary Wannabe's in the Colorado Rockies.

Braggart's and cowards - every fucking one. Even then.

They would come in the bars dressed up in camo - looked like halloweenies to me - and brag about how tough they were, how many secret CIA commando missions they had been on and how many people of color they killed in Africa as 'paid mercenaries'.

They were 'natives' where most of the rest of us were transplanted hippies from all other parts of the US.

They would try to bully us, saying they hated outsiders. But shout BOOOO at them and they would piss their pants and run home to their 'rich' daddies.

Posers every one. Losers.

Nothing has changed in the last 40 years.

[liberalla]

61. Shave that raccoon off your face! Best line! and thank you for saying everything else, too!

[pandr32]

62. A-friggin-men!

[Richard58]

63. Spot on!

I totally agree with you! Nothing gets me more pissed off than seeing some self-professed veteran ranting about how much he "loves" the Constitution and freedom and that he why he tried to overthrow the government. Yeah---right. Plus they love to dress the part by wearing bandanas, reflector sunglasses and cammo attire. And often carrying an assault rifle too of course! They think they are such badasses but they come off as little boys playing soldier. And they talk about "going to war" to "stop the steal" when most of these idiots are out of shape fat fucks who couldn't walk a flight of steps without stopping and gasping for air. They are just Rambo wanna-bees.
I happen to be a veteran. I served 4 yrs in the Marine Corps. I never saw combat. I met some Marines who were great people and others who were total dirtbags. So there is no need to put all service members on a pedestal. Some don't deserve it. The ones that don't are the same ones who stormed the Capital and brag about how "patriotic" they are. I can't stand them!

[ProfessorGAC]

81. On The Camo Wearing

A couple years ago, there was a picture of 3 guys wearing gray on gray camo.
They were standing in front of a red brick building!
My first thought was "You guys realize we can see you, right?"

[Redleg]

64. Agreed

I especially appreciated the last part about needing a triple XL uniform. I occasionally have dreams about being called back into the Army and I show up with my too-tight uniforms and beard, out of shape and clueless- the oldest captain in the Army. At least I would only need a double XL uniform!

[SunSeeker]

65. K & R

[Demsrule86]

66. +10000

My Father would roll over in the grave if he saw asshats who were in the service attempted a coup. My Dad served in actually wars...Korea and Vietnam...he was a Navy Medic attached to a combat unit. My sister and brother were Marines...my brother who is a libertarian (sigh) was furious with Trump and the GOP. He told me if he has to vote Democratic to keep Trump and the insurrectionist GOP out he will. I in was pleased and shocked at his words. My brother-in-law switched from independent to the Democratic Party. Also, I have a niece and a nephew now serving in the Air Force and the Navy.

[AmyStrange]

67. +100000000000000000000000000000000 x infinity

-

Yeah, fuck you!
==========

[dhill926]

68. hell yeah....

this needed to be said...

[Hulk]

70. Because one is a vet, or one is active service is no pass...

I am so disgusted by thugs and criminals that have had military service on their sleeve, milk it as though they should be saluted, regardless of their actions and words. Fact: these white supremicist groups and treasonous militias are FULL of veterans and active duty military thugs and criminals.

I quit saluting veterans and active duty military with some blanket admiration long ago. Sorry. I’m an 11Bravo Vietnam vet. I did my service, and I shed blood in line of service to my country. I do not, and will not thank someone for their service alone. Too many are undeserving, too many have done as much to destroy this country as to protect it.

Salute them if you want. You won’t hear those words come out of my mouth.

[reader1]

87. Sign of the time

Great response, but equally important we now live in an era where everyone adulate and idolize the military, of whom many have took advantage and milk it as much as they can. There are many reports/documents of John Kennedy when he was running for president he never wore his military service on his sleeve and no one else seems to care he was in the military. He did his duty and return in private life to be a patriotic citizen.

[llmart]

101. I do believe that nonsense started after 9/11.

Dubya and his cohorts beat the drums about the military in order to get more young people to sign up and fight his illegal wars. Our country became more militaristic and that's when I saw more and more people and newscasters saying "thank you for your service" to everyone that claimed they were a veteran. I'm a Viet Nam war baby boomer (pacifist - never supported that war whatsoever) so I could see the trend starting and it disgusted me.

I know way too many men of that era who were in a branch of the service at one time or another who have conveniently revised the history of what they did and why. One joined the national guard in order to avoid the draft so he wouldn't have to go to Viet Nam. Now he revises that history to say his unit "almost got called up to go" which I know for a fact wasn't true. So he spent the majority of his weekends sitting at the armory or the donut shop across the street from the armory and every summer his two weeks summer camp was playing war games in the woods of Michigan. Another family member spent less than two weeks in the air force and got out on some phony medical reason and went on to tell the biggest whoppers about him being a veteran.

I feel the same way about police. That began after 9/11 also. Basically what we see here is how the narrative was created that we should put these guys on some pedestal.

[dware]

72. Well said maxrandb,

well said.

[Texin]

73. Well that was a beaut! LOL. These guys (and some gals) remind me of kids play-acting.

Or the fucking idiots who spend their weekends re-enacting Civil War battles FFS.

[ProfessorGAC]

82. Great Post, Max!

K&R

[world wide wally]

83. Max for Secretary of Defense!

[Nululu]

86. How many lie about being veterans

[Skittles]

88. I APPROVE THIS MESSAGE

Sgt Skittles

[rickford66]

90. 20 percent of military riflemen fired their weapons in WW II (quick Google)

The results were consistently the same: Only 15 to 20 percent of the American riflemen in combat during World War II would fire at the enemy. Those who would not fire did not run or hide—in many cases they were willing to risk greater danger to rescue comrades, get ammunition, or run messages.

I remember reading the after reports of WW II and I thought a lower percentage was reported. Only one guy I grew up with fired his weapon in Vietnam and that was during the Tet Offensive.

You'd never know any of this if you listened to the guy at the end of the bar.

[maxrandb]

134. We have a very small percentage that are truly at the front lines

The vast majority of the rest of us are in logistics, support and, in my particular case, Naval Gunfire Support (NGFS).

The closest I ever got was doing tanker escorts in the Persian Gulf during the Iran/Iraq War. There were SCUD Missiles that could have done some damage, but I was always more worried about a Main Space fire while 3000 miles from the nearest land, colliding with another ship, or an F18 crashing on the Flight Deck.

Even during the Afghanistan war, we were dropping bombs from 18,000 feet, or shooting Tomahawks from 1200 miles away.

[Baked Potato]

92. I agree, I wish they would shut the Eff up!

It is good to know 18 million veterans and 2 million active military *didn’t* storm the Capitol.

It’s generally not the WW2, Korea, and Vietnam vets. It’s the post Gulf War #1 vets. They really need to get the eff out of the way.

[Permanut]

95. Vet here. Righteous rant, maxrandb. K & R

[marie999]

96. My husband and I were both in the army during Vietnam.

At one time we were only 7,800 miles away from the fighting. And that was as close as we wanted to be.

[maxrandb]

98. My Carrier was so far away during Afghanistan that

Planes had to in-flight refuel twice, and just about every "piddle-pack" was full upon return.

[yardwork]

99. I love this post. /nt

[1plus1equals1]

102. A uniform is a clothing item

Wearing a uniform does not define a person, nor does one's job in the military. I've experienced great people ranging from cooks to combat soldiers and likewise, I've experienced some pretty bad people. As with any endeavor, a person should be judged based their actions and not a blind fact of service.

With that said, if you rely on mob rule to bolster your illegal activities, you are stupid and a coward; if you are using your veteran status to boost/justify/validate your illegal activities, you are stupid, a coward and your status should be changed from veteran to inmate and your character of service should be changed to read as Dishonorable.

I am humbled by my service and keep it personal and private; I'm just trying to be a good citizen now that I am a retiree. I doubt that the veterans we are discussing here will read this type of stuff, but I still have to say this: if you are a veteran that is making your status known, then do do in a manner that is becoming of a service member (regardless of rank or character of service); anything less diminishes your status, your service, could sway public opinions and could impact those of us who still honor service and are just trying to adapt and be good citizens.

35 years, 6 months and 14 days!

[demigoddess]

103. those guys may be 'vets' but as an old militarybrat, I call them damncivilians.

and that is one word.

[spanone]

105. K&R

[ooky]

106. Navy vet here...

Salute.

[ClusterFreak]

108. THAT...

...was a thing of beauty!

[Aussie105]

109. It's your standard post military service retirement resentment syndrome.

We have a classic case of it in our family.

Do your military service, serious stuff or trivial stuff, it doesn't matter.

Then leave, and expect adulation and respect wearing that 'Vet' label.
And it doesn't come.

Resentment builds up, you look for someone or something to blame, and the resentment feeding itself leads you down some strange paths.

My relative?

Served during the Vietnam war days, didn't see active duty.
But he now posts on Facebook old pictures of those he knew (or didn't know) who served and died on active duty.
Every year, on the day they died.
Every single dead soldier, every year.

Dwelling in the past like that isn't good for his mental health, and it shows.

I call it self induced post traumatic stress syndrome, but I'm no professional shrink.

[BigmanPigman]

110. Shave the raccoon off his face

and get an XXXL uniform...good visual.

[Initech]

111. I love the wannabe bad asses.

Like really dude, you're just a fat guy on a bike with a gun and some serious rage issues.

[Piratedog]

112. If you're a veteran who participated in the insurrection, you are a worthless fuck!

You don’t deserve to be honored for your service any longer. You traded that in the DJT. Fuck em

[NoMoreRepugs]

113. Thanks for my best laugh of the day.

[Oakenshield]

115. I hope more of these insurrectionists out themselves

Especially if they're active duty. Makes me sick that these confederate assholes get to proudly waddle about pretending they're heroes. The sooner they're identified, shamed, and drummed out of the armed service the better.

[Still Sensible]

117. Indeed! These are also the kind of

fucksticks that have no real clue what the Constitution says or means. They think jingoism is patriotism.

[bluecollar2]

118. Can I steal this?

Navy vet here...

[maxrandb]

130. Of course. DU is for sharing

[PatrickforO]

119. Great post!

[Stinky The Clown]

120. OhFuckYEAH, Shipmate!!!!

[Trueblue Texan]

121. Thx, max

I needed this!

[Mr.Bill]

123. Great post. Quick story here.

It was the late 80s. I was hanging out with a few buddies I've known since the early 70s. I was never in the military, neither was one of these buddies. The other one joined the Marines around '72. He spent most of his time in Manilla, PI. As we were leaving Vietnam, he went there for a few weeks to help pack up and load trucks. He never bragged about his military service. Then movies like Full Metal Jacket came out and suddenly he's Captain Commando, bragging about his military exploits to pick up chicks in bars.

A story come on the news about flag burning, a big deal to the reich wing at the time. He says damn those people for burning flags I served my country and fought for that flag. My other friend says to him You didn't join the Marines to fight for your flag, you joined the Marines because you got fired from Der Weinershnitzel. It was true and he knew it and we all laughed.

[zipplewrath]

125. The hardest thing a soldier will ever do

It's not storming the Capital. The hardest thing is following a legal order they don't agree about. These idiots didn't agree with the certified results so they stormed the Capital. That isn't bravery or valentry, it's hubris.

[The Jungle 1]

127. Forever, moving forward repukes will carry the label of the party of treason!

How soon till repukes build statues celebrating their treason?

[black-bear]

128. Attaching Unarmed Congresspeople

They want to fight, start a new civil war, let them attach a black neighborhood and see who survive. Punks.

[ananda]

131. What on earth does "Constitution" mean to them?

Have they actually read and understood ours?

[denbot]

133. Concur.

Bravo Zulu, shipmate.