I'm not a big fan of abortion, but...

[AmyStrange]

-

I do believe a woman should be able to choose.

The problem with repubs is that they just want to make it illegal, and that's it. They don't care one iota about how that affects the women.

If at the same time, they also helped the women with financial, day care, employment, educational, and health care support, I'd be more on their side, but they don't.

Basically, it's one of the many reasons why I think they're BAT-SHIT CRAZY and as stupid as a dead orangutan.

[/RANT]

My apologies to orangutans.
=========

[Me.]

1. No ONe Is A Fan Of Abortion

[AmyStrange]

2. Thank you

-

At least we don't want to make it illegal.
==============

[Beakybird]

4. That's right! It's a choice between an undesirable birth and an undesirable procedure.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

6. I am a fan of abortion. It does a great job of ending an unwanted pregnancy, as well

as ending pregnancies that are dangerous to a person's health.

[demmiblue]

42. This is an embarrassing thread on a Democratic forum. n/t

[WhiskeyGrinder]

51. I'm fine with a Big Tent but not everything needs to be said with a full voice.

[uppityperson]

57. Exactly

[OriginalGeek]

182. 100% agree

Couldn't have said it better.

[GreenEyedLefty]

190. I'm pro abortion in the sense that if a woman wants one, she should be able to get one.

With no questions asked, no value judgments, or any of that crap. This world would be a better place if there was no guilt or negativity attached to it.

[mr_lebowski]

12. Exactly ...

My biggest issue with the Repuke stance is that they don't want to do anything to help reduce them, OR help anyone (including the children) with the consequences of disallowing it.

Their stance is, ultimately, simply anti-Woman, and anti-Sex-in-general. Even though they're all a bunch of horndogs themselves.

Nothing whatsoever to do with any principled stance/truly being 'pro-Life'.

With a few rare exceptions.

[Me.]

93. Exactly

and, they seek to punish women for a situation that is generally full of anguish.

[uponit7771]

95. "anti-Sex-in-general", I've believed this for the longest they don't like sex cause they're not good

... at it or too selfish or incels there fore they don't like sex.

[mr_lebowski]

116. Someone having an abortion means that they got laid ...

And the 'pro-life' people are jealous, cause they didn't.

Simplest explanation possible, really.

[gratuitous]

14. I think that's true

It's just that it's not a fit subject for legislation, because there are far too many variables that make passing meaningful legislation regulating it, especially by legislators who approach the subject from a person/religious angle rather than a medical angle.

[Me.]

96. As I Said...This Is A Matter That Is Generally An Anguished ONe

and such decisions are made because of necessity .

[WhiskeyGrinder]

101. For many people, it is *not* an "anguished" decision, and using that language promotes the

idea that abortion is something regrettable and that should be controlled. People tend to know what they need.

[Me.]

106. I Disagree

[WhiskeyGrinder]

112. The data doesn't, but okay.

[Me.]

119. Pro Choice Is Not Pro Abortion

and I suspect the data to which you refer is whether people approve of being able to make their own decision on this matter.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

122. No, it's data about how people feel before and after getting abortions.

And I didn't say "pro-choice = pro-abortion." I am definitely pro-abortion, though.

[GreenEyedLefty]

191. Me too

[Mariana]

120. I get so tired of being told how women must feel.

Every time the issue comes up it's the same. Women should be able to have an abortion, but abortion is A Very Bad Thing, and women who make that choice should feel awful about it.

[AmyStrange]

148. That's true and...

-

I apologize for my insensitivity.
===========

[treestar]

172. Some might

each woman is different and some might feel bad about it, or at least somewhat regretful, while others don't. Talking about the ones who feel bad about it is mainly to counter the right wing claims that it is so easily done, as in their supposed stories about those who do it just because they don't want to be pregnant in the summer and look good in a bikini. It's to counter the right wing idea that it is just cold and callously done for convenience.

Especially the late-terms ones: where the fetus is wanted but has a terrible condition that won't allow it to survive long, yet the right wing calls this "murdering babies." That may be a lot of anguish, not just the callous act the right wing tries to describe it as.

[Mariana]

173. Some do and some don't, depending on the woman and her particular situation.

You won't find in my post any hint that NO women ever feel awful about having an abortion. Of course some of them do.

I object to those who go one as if abortion is inherently A Very Bad Thing to do, and imply that women who have one should feel anguished about it, or there's something wrong with them. I don't agree.

[SidDithers]

74. No one is a fan of heart surgery...

No one is a fan of a tonsilectormy

No one is a fan of orthopedic surgery

but, like any medical procedure, they're there for a purpose.

Sid

[Me.]

85. Quite

[JanMichael]

132. Speak for yourself. nt

[WhiskeyGrinder]

3. Financial and educational support, day care and health care don't make a person stop being pregnant.

Abortion does. Add all the support you want to name, but we still need abortion, because people sometimes just don't want to be pregnant.

And they're not "bat-shit crazy." They're control freaks.

[AmyStrange]

7. That wasn't my point...

-

My point was that repubs just want to make it illegal.

We'll have to agree to disagree about whether they're BAT-SHIT CRAZY or not, but is that really important?
===========

[WhiskeyGrinder]

10. No Republican wants to outlaw abortion entirely, for all reasons. They just want to make

it widely inaccessible, and they're pretty good at that.

[AmyStrange]

19. Agreed

[TwilightZone]

31. Some do.

22% of Republicans said abortion should be illegal in all cases.

https://www.usnews.com/news/best-states/articles/2019-08-13/majority-of-americans-dont-support-total-ban-on-abortion-study-finds

In an NPR poll, 48% of Republicans wanted to make performing an abortion a crime.

https://www.npr.org/2019/06/07/730183531/poll-majority-want-to-keep-abortion-legal-but-they-also-want-restrictions

[WhiskeyGrinder]

55. Fair. Legislators know it's a non-starter, though -- even if they introduce the bill, they know it's

going nowhere. It definitely moves the window, though.

[TwilightZone]

67. They need it as a perpertual wedge issue...

so they will never ban it entirely, regardless of their beliefs. As you noted, they will, however, consistently test the waters.

And what they really mean is that it should be illegal for everyone else. If their 14-year-old daughter gets knocked up, all bets are off.

[MoonlitKnight]

56. I would not agree that none want it completely illegal

A good portion favor outlawing birth control as well. The fact that they did so and it took a Supreme Court ruling to overturn the laws tells me that there is no limit to the extreme positions they can, will and have taken.

[SharonClark]

15. Well said.

[safeinOhio]

5. If they were REALLY against abortion,

they would push for free birth control and sex education.

[AmyStrange]

8. Thank you

-

That's why they're stupid.
========

[GulfCoast66]

13. Are you kidding. If they outlaw abortion birth control is next on their agenda.

Theocrats and all.

[MyOwnPeace]

20. AND......

a society that would take care of EVERY child, wanted or not.

[AmyStrange]

25. +100000000000000000000000000000000 x 2

-

Thank you.
==========

[musette_sf]

49. I saw a gleeful post supporting this bullshit

on a Tennessee page on FB, in which the poster stated that Griswold vs CT will go down next. So they have criminalizing contraception next on their list.

[treestar]

186. +1

It is sex they are against. It is women having control they are against.

[brooklynite]

9. MURDER (Noun):

the crime of unlawfully killing a person especially with malice aforethought

Legal Abortion is not murder.

[AmyStrange]

22. You're right, legally it's not murder.

[Mariana]

52. I don't think you really consider it to be murder in any sense.

Unless you've made up your own personal definition of the word "murder" that is very different than the ones to be found in the dictionaries. Is that what you've done?

[AmyStrange]

158. You're right...

Last edited Fri Feb 12, 2021, 08:39 PM - Edit history (1)

-

I used too strong a word for how I felt about it.

It's why I post them here. I do read what people post, and I'm more than willing to change my mind if I'm wrong. I'm not a stick in the mud.
==========

[treestar]

184. When it was against the law, abortion was a separate crime

with its own name, which marked a difference between killing a fetus vs. a person.

It is telling that instead of saying they want abortion to be illegal again, they insist on changing the terminology to "murder." They seem to think they need that in order to get anywhere with their argument. What's wrong with just saying they want abortion to be illegal? It seems they realize that would not sound like a strong argument.

[Ptah]

11. Abortion is not murder.

[roamer65]

16. THIS.

Abortion is NOT murder, it’s birth control.

[Lars39]

21. Thank you!

[WestLosAngelesGal]

66. It is not murder and it is not illegal.

This original post is a GOP kind of talking point.

(I edited my post to add the word original.)

[SammyWinstonJack]

167. That's correct.

[DFW]

17. No reasonable person is a FAN of abortion

That is why reasonable people ARE fans of contraception and choice.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

28. As I said above, I am a fan of abortion. It does a great job of stopping an unwanted pregnancy, as

well as ending pregnancies that are dangerous to a person's health.

[DFW]

39. That is a set of specific cases, not the procedure in general.

My wife is a full-blown proponent of abortion RIGHTS, as are my daughters (as am I, but biology excludes me from worrying about it). None of them thinks it would be a fun thing to do on a free weekend.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

45. Neither is an appendectomy, but people who need them tend to be fans of the procedure.

[DFW]

61. No one would forbid anyone from getting an appendectomy.

And, for that matter, I doubt people get them for fun, and I doubt that people get them because they feel good, any more than they get an abortion for the same reason.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

72. Being a fan of something doesn't mean I think it's fun or that it feels good.

Although I was DEFINITELY a fan of my cholecystectomy, because it DEFINITELY made me feel good (and tbh was kind of fun because of the great team that performed it).

[Mariana]

59. "None of them thinks it would be a fun thing to do on a free weekend."

Which makes it no different than any other medical procedure.

[DFW]

69. Depends on the treatment

My sister loved to go to the dentist because he would put her on something that made her high, and she thought it was better than having no toothache at all. Chaque un à son goût.

[Me.]

104. "None of them thinks it would be a fun thing to do on a free weekend"

That's because the word fun doesn't come into it nor does being a fan.

[lame54]

18. Nobody can legally choose murder

[poli-junkie]

23. Forced birthing indentured servitude

Taking away abortion rights is ALL about controlling a woman's life and how she wants to seek her own path in the world.

[AmyStrange]

81. Spot on!

-

thank you.
==========

[gollygee]

24. Thank goodness nobody is having recreational abortions

all these mythical people who are fans of it and wish they could do it all the time for fun.

[11 Bravo]

26. Abortion is NOT murder. Murder is the "unlawful killing of a human being".

Abortion is legal according to our Constitution, and the use of the term "murder" is right-wing, forced birther, bullshit.

[Deuxcents]

27. I'm not a fan, either

I’m also not a fan of being a judge of a woman who seeks one. There are many reasons for this procedure and I don’t want others to judge. This decision is a personal one and should stay legal and legislatures should respect that..as we all should.

[AmyStrange]

30. +100000000000000000000000000000000 x 4

-

Exactly and thank you.
=======

[jmbar2]

29. Reposting this - Mormon mother of six comments on abortion

ALL unwanted pregnancies are caused by the irresponsible ejaculations of men.

https://designmom.com/twitter-thread-abortion/

[AmyStrange]

33. Well said!

-

Thank you.
==========

[Lars39]

32. Why give right wingers cover by using their language (murder)?

What brought this up anyway? TN legislation? Your language is not helping us here.

[AmyStrange]

44. I'm not using their language

-

I think it's murder.
=======

[Lars39]

47. And that's what right wingers type and say, too.

Language matters

[AmyStrange]

77. You're right

[Ptah]

115. Abortion is not murder.

[LanternWaste]

125. What specifically leads you to allege the medical procedure is murder?

[myccrider]

176. Then it's murder if you have not volunteered to donate

blood, part of your liver, bone marrow and/or a kidney to keep someone else alive.

I, also, am a fan of abortion. I had 2 and am glad I did.

[Squinch]

179. As you are a man, your opinion on this subject is completely irrelevant. Offensive as it may be.

[Mariana]

34. You believe a woman should be able to choose to commit murder?

You're not making any sense.

[AmyStrange]

35. It doesn't make any sense to me either, but...

-

that's the way my weird mind works, sorry.
==========

[SharonClark]

75. If your posts don't make sense to you maybe

you should refrain from posting until they do.

[AmyStrange]

76. Posting them helps me sort them out

-

the replies are very, very helpful.
=========

[ChubbyStar]

84. Get a white board and put it in your kitchen

Posting there might be helpful. Good luck!

[AmyStrange]

89. Outside input is what I need.

-

This place is excellent for that.

By the way, I took out the murder part.
==========

[Ptah]

139. You left in the part about you think it is murder.

AmyStrange (7,885 posts) Fri Feb 12, 2021, 02:24 PM

44. I'm not using their language

-

I think it's murder.

[AmyStrange]

143. That's how I felt when I made that post

[treestar]

185. you can differentiate between the two

right wingers have made it confusing

Termination of life of:
person already born - murder
fetus - abortion

what they really want is for abortion to be illegal. Apparently that sound not too exciting to them and not too convincing, so they mischaracterize it. Refusing to acknowledge any difference between a fetus and a post born person. Which is dumb, because birth is a major event in a life line. The most momentous thing in a life. Even death only follows because there was a birth.

[msfiddlestix]

36. I don't anyone who is a Fan of Abortion

I'm not a fan of abortion , but I had to have two. Of course it was ages ago, but still.

I don't understand why it's even regarded as anyone else's business anymore. Or a social dilemma. It is neither anyone else's business nor is it a social dilemma. The social dilemma is entirely fabricated by the Religious Right and mostly White Men in my view. Yes I understand that some women are "against" it.

But you know what, I never in all of my Adult years going on five decades now, have ever seen so called "anti-choice advocates" express any outrage, anger, or disgust at what society does to children in poverty. Or case in point, the infants, toddlers, children ripped from nursing mothers, separated and caged. Not a freaking word from so called "pro-life"

I could go on, but I'm not going to. I'm done. Good luck sorting this out.

[AmyStrange]

38. You put it very well

-

thank you.
============

[WhiskeyGrinder]

46. Abortion Fan, checking in.

[msfiddlestix]

63. interesting to meet you.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

83. .

[Mariana]

68. Well, the OP considers you a murderer

but magnanimously also thinks it's all right for you to be a murderer.

No, it doesn't make sense to me, either.

[msfiddlestix]

88. That's her problem and not mine.

I'm both allergic and immune from those pronouncing jugdements on me that supposed to be made by "my maker" according to their "book" they supposedly believe in.

I'm seriously considering becoming a donor to Ronald Reagan's Freedom From Religion Foundation.. I love his ads I've seen on tv recently. I'm not an Atheist, but I'm not Religious either, and frankly am reminded of Sharia Law whenever I hear the Religious Right impose their dogma in law of the land.

I have a feeling this discussion shouldn't be in the General Discussion forum.

[Squinch]

180. It's not a her. Mr. strange is a man. A very entitled one, as we can see.

[msfiddlestix]

181. I see. Posing as a woman advocating Patriarchal Supremacy over Women's Life Choices

Thanks for the heads up. Duly Noted.

[Squinch]

183. Yep. Exactly.

[msfiddlestix]

187. I appreciate being informed.

I reminded of the old lady (kind of like me) holding a sign at the Million Women's March right after djt's installment.

The sign said: "I can't believe I still have to protest this shit" ..


that's where I'm at with this issue.

[VA_Jill]

133. Yeah, that doesn't make any sense

Perhaps the OP has never had to make the decision someone I am close to had to make some years ago when her ultrasound showed a life-threatening congenital defect in the fetus she was carrying. It was the kind of defect that, if the pregnancy were carried to term and the child survived more than a few days, would have meant a short lifetime full of pain and most likely multiple surgeries. This person did not feel capable of dealing with that, nor did she feel it would be kind to the child. She made the painful decision to undergo a pre-term induction, which was legal in our state since she was only 18-19 weeks pregnant, and since she was single, she asked me to be her support person. I said yes and two days later we were in the hospital for her procedure. I won't go into it all, but 18 hours after admission a tiny female with the expected horrendous birth defect was delivered. It was pronounced by the doctor "the worst of its kind" he'd ever seen, a myelomeningeocele (spina bifida) so high that the baby, had she been born at term, may never have breathed on her own. Clubbed feet and twisted legs. Only her tiny face was perfect. She never breathed. She was whisked away to another room. Mom was semi-conscious due to a morphine drip she was on, but she had previously asked me to baptize the child, so I asked a nurse for some water and went to the room where she was and did as mom asked. The nurses had wrapped the tiny morsel in a blanket and they took pictures for mom, asked her later if she wanted them. She did, but didn't want to look at them then and not for months. She gave them to me to keep for her.

That was not murder. That was mercy. I hope I am safe telling this here. (I have permission.)

[demmiblue]

37. The dudes on this thread, though.

[TwilightZone]

54. I think...

any response will have a hard time topping "abortion is murder".

[GulfCoast66]

40. I used to be personally against it as well.

Although never supported making it illegal.

Then my wife, after being told we could not have kids got pregnant. A Previa pregnancy with a severely genetically damaged fetus. A miscarriage was likely and she would have bled out in minutes.

So yeah, reality corrected my ignorance and stupidity. I have no doubt you would have the same choice we did. Have no regrets.

Oh, and to top it off, she did not realize she was pregnant until after 12 weeks. 2-3 more weeks to take all the test and we were well past the time limits many states want to put on abortion.

Still the most painful period of our lives including the deaths of parents.

Abortion became on of the most important issues to me.

[AmyStrange]

50. Thank you for the personal account...

-

I know I would've made the same decision as you.
==========

[GulfCoast66]

70. I've never shared it before. Too personal and painful

But reading it called murder made me feel it was time.

It’s been 20 years.

We did learn one thing...we had only been married 8 years at the time. An event like that will destroy a marriage or make it unassailable. We have been growing closer since then and looks like we will make it to the death do we depart thingy. So it was not all negative.

[GulfCoast66]

79. Maybe change the verbiage in your OP?

It is really inflammatory and to people who have had to make the choice, potentially painful.

Just say you agree with Joe on the issue. No one would take offense.

Have a nice evening.

[AmyStrange]

86. What word should I use?

-

Regardless of the reason, you're ending a potential child's life.

I apologize if I've hurt you in any way. That was not my intent.
==========

[GulfCoast66]

90. I was not hurt, but thanks for asking. Had I been my post would have read much differently!

Just say ‘I agree with Joe on the issue’.

Everyone on DU knows his position and get it. Some don’t love it be he is a serious Catholic and it is acceptable to all.

[AmyStrange]

92. I took out the murder part

[GulfCoast66]

110. Thank you.

Have a nice evening.

[Lunabell]

41. I don't agree that it is murder.

It may be the taking of a life, but it is not a human life until the fetus is viable outside the uterus. Even then, it is a decision for a woman herself to make.

[AmyStrange]

53. legally it's not

[Ptah]

91. Is abortion murder?

[AmyStrange]

97. I took out the murder part, but...

-

regardless of the reason, it still ends the life of a potential child.

Personally, I think NOT having sex is murder also. All those potential baby sperms dying.

Sorry, but I have VERY weird mind.
=============

[LanternWaste]

142. I think you're making excuses for yourself and your position.

All other things being equal, a mind is either rational or merely undisciplined.

If you can think rationally, you cannot use "I have a weird mind" as a cover any more than "muscle spams made me hit you over and over again..."

At least own your own convictions s yours rather than blaming the fates.

[AmyStrange]

144. I agree

[safeinOhio]

43. Just remember this

[AmyStrange]

60. Wow!

-

Thank you.
============

[Iggo]

48. It's not murder. (n/t)

[SMC22307]

58. How about esophagogastroduodenoscopy? Closed reduction percutaneous pinning of a femoral neck fx?

I'm pushing 60 and have never heard anyone use the term "fan" to describe a medical procedure.

[AmyStrange]

64. I'm not a fan of having my teeth cleaned or a tooth pulled either...

-

There, now you have.
=======

[SMC22307]

78. Yikes. You don't like having your teeth cleaned?

Abortion isn't murder, no matter how many times the Phyllis Schafley's of the world tell you it is.

[AmyStrange]

94. or my tooth pulled...

-

Don't forget THAT part.
===========

[AmyStrange]

138. I took out the murder part

[uppityperson]

62. How is abortion murder?

[AmyStrange]

98. Legally it's not

-

I took that part out.
===========

[demmiblue]

65. Also, who fucking recs this garbage?! n/t

[Lars39]

71. People who want to find this train wreck again?

[demmiblue]

80. Good point. It certainly is a train wreck. n/t

[AmyStrange]

105. +1/2

Last edited Fri Feb 12, 2021, 09:51 PM - Edit history (1)

[AmyStrange]

103. +1/3

Last edited Fri Feb 12, 2021, 09:52 PM - Edit history (1)

[cwydro]

82. Thank you.

Smh.

[AmyStrange]

102. +1/4

Last edited Fri Feb 12, 2021, 09:53 PM - Edit history (1)

[meadowlander]

73. Not being a fan of something isn't a reason to conclude that it's murder.

If you've decided it's "murder" why would you agree that people have the right to choose to commit it?

Until it is capable of existing outside another human being completely independently, a zygote/embryo/fetus is not a person, it is a collection of cells with the potential to become a human with significant inputs of resources and at some risk to the life and long-term health of the mother. Since she is the one expected to put in those resources and take those risks, it is her decision whether or not to take the steps that would result in the potential of that collection of cells being realised.

After the first few months, women generally only have abortions when there is a significant risk to the health of the mother or where the viability/quality of life of the fetus is in serious doubt. That's a decision for women to make with their doctors and is nobody else's business. Willingness of some party to provide financial aid, day care, etc is irrelevant as a state-imposed criteria for that decision.

For example, if you're six months pregnant and you find out that there is a 100% change that the fetus you are carrying is functionally brain dead because of oxygen deprivation from the umbilical cord accidentally being wrapped around its neck, how would you feel about being forced to carry that fetus to term and deliver it because it technically still has a pulse and some Christian rights group and/or the government is willing to pay for the hospital bills and long-term care for an infant that has no hope of any kind of quality of life?

That is not a hypothetical situation for a number of women in States where access to abortion is significantly curtailed. And in my view, it is psychological torture to put a woman who was likely really looking forward to having a baby through three months of having to carrying around a virtually dead fetus inside her instead of just letting her end the pregnancy and try to move on with her life.

It's the woman's body. It's the woman's choice. Period.

[AmyStrange]

100. I agree, and...

-

all I can say in my defense is that I have a VERY weird mind.

By the way, I took the murder part out.
============

[MerryBlooms]

165. I'm reading through your responses here, and you keep saying you have a weird mind...

You're comments are disjointed and emotional. I hope you're okay, take care.

[ismnotwasm]

87. I'm a murderer several times over.

[AmyStrange]

113. I took out that part...

-

It was insensitive of me, sorry.
=========

[ismnotwasm]

128. S'alright

[Piasladic]

99. Is this another post I'm going to see an apology for in the morning? -nt

[AmyStrange]

108. Nope...

-

I took out the murder part
========

[GulfCoast66]

117. I had a nice back and forth earlier in the thread just now

She got it and changed the OP.

[Piasladic]

121. Thank you

sometimes a kind/thoughtful response does more good than a snarky comment like mine

[GulfCoast66]

126. I have been in her place earlier in my life.

So can emphasize. But life intervened. Still make me ashamed it took life affecting me rather than innate empathy for me to come to my current beliefs.

Have a nice evening.

[gollygee]

107. It's a medical procedure. People aren't "fans" of medical procedures, but they're glad they exist

when they need them.

[AmyStrange]

109. Absolutely correct

-

Thank you.
============

[rsdsharp]

114. I hate the imputation that pro choice is pro abortion.

In late 1973 — after Roe was decided — my future wife became pregnant out of wedlock (not my biological child — we hadn’t even met). Many, including her father, urged her to exercise her choice under the recent Supreme Court case, and get an abortion.

After much thought and prayer, she did choose.

Her name is Jennifer. She is now my daughter, too.

[AmyStrange]

118. +100000000000000000000000000000000 x infinity

-

Best reply yet!
================

[BannonsLiver]

123. This thread is fire.

[AmyStrange]

127. Agreed

-

The PC Police are all over it like...
==========

[BannonsLiver]

129. My favorite

Was the poster castigating you for attempting to have a discussion on — checks notes — a discussion board.

This place never disappoints.

[AmyStrange]

131. Heh heh heh

-

thanks for the chuckle.
=======

[SharonClark]

134. "PC Police"?

So you’re suggesting that people who disagree with your “abortion is murder” statement are acting like “politically correct police”?

You must know that “PC Police” has been used by right-wingers for years to denigrate liberal ideas like justice, equality, and inclusiveness.

Or are you just pranking everyone?

[AmyStrange]

135. Bazinga!

[Piasladic]

149. Just Stop

it's not a joke, and this isn't funny.

[AmyStrange]

152. I guess it depends on your perspective

[Piasladic]

154. You are definitely going to wake up regretful. -nt

[LanternWaste]

147. I dig how you perceive disagreement with an unsupported position as "pc police..."

Sounds like nothing more than self-validation, and places the burden of blame on everyone but you.

But I guess that's what self-proclaimed thread masters do...

[AmyStrange]

150. Absolutely

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what's wrong with being the PC Police anyway?
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[leftstreet]

145. It makes DU look stupid n/t

[AmyStrange]

146. For some reason...

-

people keep responding.
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[leftstreet]

151. lol

I probably shouldn't have

I was just surprised to log on and see it

[BannonsLiver]

156. You might be right

Though I’ve seen worse. Hell, I’ve seen worse today. The TJ Ducklo thread being exhibit A. Lots of stupid in that thread.

[AmyStrange]

168. You're both right

Last edited Sat Feb 13, 2021, 08:46 AM - Edit history (1)

[kskiska]

130. I wish the term "fan" hadn't been applied to a medical procedure.

A fan or fanatic, sometimes also termed aficionado or enthusiast, is a person who exhibits strong interest or admiration for something or somebody, such as a celebrity or a sport or a sports team, a genre, a politician, a book, a movie or an entertainer.

[Mariana]

137. It feeds the RW bullshit idea that women have abortions for fun. nt.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

162. And pushing back on "fan" feeds the RW bullshit idea that every abortion is a difficult, sorrowful,

heartrending decision that requires tons of regulation to make sure people know what they're doing.

[Mariana]

166. Actually it's mostly people on the left who insist that every abortion

is a difficult, sorrowful, heartrending decision, and that every abortion is A Bad Thing and women must feel terrible about it if they have one. See this thread for plenty of examples. You're absolutely right that it's a crock. Very often it isn't a difficult decision at all.

Notice that the person who first used the word "fan" in this thread is the same one who said abortion is murder. It is right-wing speak, intended to denigrate the women who have abortions and those who support them when they make that decision.

[Me.]

157. Right

[twin_ghost]

153. All that matters is does the woman want to give birth.

If she doesn't then ahe is free to get an abortion. A few dollars more per month won't be enough for a woman to want a child.

[AmyStrange]

155. Welcome to DU and you're right...

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It takes love too.
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[Hekate]

159. I am a Big Fan of women having access to the full range of women's necessary medical care ...

You may not be a big fan of men having access to prostate exams, but it is part of men’s medical care. You may not be a big fan of prostatectomies, but on occasion, they are necessary. You may not be a big fan of vasectomies, but some men find them necessary.

Don’t judge human beings’ private medical decisions, especially about their reproductive parts.

I spent too much of my life parsing the abortion issue, trying to allow for the “sincerity” of abortion foes. Several years ago I finally, finally realized it was a hopeless endeavor. The RW in particular cares nothing about my level of sincerity, nor do they care about my or any woman's life or health. If they did care they would not be trying to outlaw all forms of contraception. If they did care they would ensure that all children would be fed, housed, and schooled, instead of abandoning them to hunger, poverty, and ignorance.

I understand your inner struggle with the word and concept of abortion. But that uncertainty is the wedge the RW anti-choice fanatics uses against us. I am over 70 and I decided to not even allow that any more. To hell with the RW, and I mean that. To hell with them.

Instead, what I hold to is: I believe women should have full & affordable access to the full range of women’s necessary medical care. Full stop.

[AmyStrange]

160. To hell with the RW!!!

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I can't argue with that.
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[pandr32]

161. If they did more to help women there would be fewer abortions.

Women don't take the decision to have one lightly. Some women see no way to accept the extra burden of a dependent child in their lives, while many are already trying to manage the ones they already have. Another mouth to feed might mean all will be hungry or the loss of a job that is needed to meet the need of the others.
Inequality is very real.
Also, Republicans put the entire burden and blame squarely on women for becoming pregnant in the first place, yet Republicans don't want to have birth control covered under health care. At the same time they have no problem having sexual aids such as those for erectile dysfunction covered. Those stiffies have to go somewhere!

[AmyStrange]

163. Well said

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Thank you.
============

[pandr32]

164. You are welcome!

[mvd]

169. No reasonable person would be a fan of abortion

But sometimes it is necessary, and women need to have the choice of what to do with their bodies. Conservatives who want abortion outlawed often rant about government while supporting TRULY overbearing government.

[AmyStrange]

170. There's someone on this thread who IS a big fan.

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It's NOT me, but thank you for sharing.
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[mvd]

171. Well, I disagree with that poster's viewpoint

That poster and I have different ideas about what being a fan means. I envision cheering and major admiration/attachment when I think of fandom. Even if not somber, I think having an abortion is more of a relief or duty.

[aikoaiko]

174. Abortion is not murder, it's the termination of a pregnancy.

Pregnancy is a condition of the adult.

FWIW: here is my view.

As a consequence of ending the pregnancy a complete human organism at the earliest stage of development is terminated. Human development doesn’t end until we die. In this way, the termination of the human organism isn’t that much different from using an IUD or resulting from a miscarriage except for the level of intrusive measures.

I don’t believe it is correct to call it a murder (even unrecognized by law) because personhood isn’t legally attached until after birth. I think there is good reason to not attach personhood until after birth.

[AmyStrange]

175. I took the murder part out of the OP yesterday...

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It was insensitive.
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[aikoaiko]

188. I understand. I just wanted to present to you...

...another way of thinking about it

[demmiblue]

177. ...

[ChubbyStar]

178. Trumpets are blaring with a bit of drums!

Finally

[BigDemVoter]

189. Thank you.

I always tell any anti-choice acquaintances that NOBODY wakes up in the morning just skipping around and wishing for an abortion. It is a choice that is intensely private and nobody else should be interfering with a woman's decision about what to do or not to do with her own body.