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soothsayer

(38,601 posts)
Tue Feb 16, 2021, 01:50 PM Feb 2021

This is a good time to note that the electrical grid in Texas was deregulated, privatized, and remov


?s=21


Bryan William Jones
@BWJones
This is a good time to note that the electrical grid in Texas was deregulated, privatized, and removed from interconnected networks to avoid federal regulation and increase profits to a small number of wealthy individuals.
9:50 AM · Feb 16, 2021 from Salt Lake City, UT
81 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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This is a good time to note that the electrical grid in Texas was deregulated, privatized, and remov (Original Post) soothsayer Feb 2021 OP
KNR niyad Feb 2021 #1
Kick dalton99a Feb 2021 #2
He's such a turd soothsayer Feb 2021 #4
Now, let's not go rubbing his nose in that tweet Grokenstein Feb 2021 #11
Lying Ted can fuck himself. rickyhall Feb 2021 #15
(when inspiration strikes...) orleans Feb 2021 #59
Get thee to the greatest page malaise Feb 2021 #3
Trickle down is shorthand for UpInArms Feb 2021 #5
You used North Shore Chicago Feb 2021 #9
They sure pissed over all of us malaise Feb 2021 #21
Tom Harkin said Oldem Feb 2021 #16
Perfect malaise Feb 2021 #19
Reminds me of an experiment I heard about years ago. jaxexpat Feb 2021 #29
So basically ... 'Eat shit and fry' Celerity Feb 2021 #46
Or baked, with cloves and pineapples. jaxexpat Feb 2021 #65
Except there is no way maxrandb Feb 2021 #49
True, but you must appreciate how they've shaved the milling costs. jaxexpat Feb 2021 #64
It has since been renamed: tinkle down economics Purrfessor Feb 2021 #68
Tom Harkin said Oldem Feb 2021 #18
It is actually called Horse and Sparrow economics. gab13by13 Feb 2021 #26
Or for the cruder crowd, Horse shit economics rurallib Feb 2021 #31
John Cornyn Budi Feb 2021 #6
+1 dalton99a Feb 2021 #12
Cornyn doesn't even know what he is talking about. Mr.Bill Feb 2021 #62
Someone makes bank OldBaldy1701E Feb 2021 #80
First thing Texas Governor Abbot did was scream for help from the Soshlist nanny state Roisin Ni Fiachra Feb 2021 #7
And the first thing Joe did was help. Did not make them grovel or beg soothsayer Feb 2021 #14
I wish he had told them to go rake their lawns. 33taw Feb 2021 #28
Or forests Celerity Feb 2021 #47
So much of our National Power Grid is Wellstone ruled Feb 2021 #8
Yep. musette_sf Feb 2021 #10
I remember those 1970s bumper stickers bucolic_frolic Feb 2021 #13
Can't do schadenfreude on this one. RVN VET71 Feb 2021 #24
This Ferrets are Cool Feb 2021 #71
I remember the ones that said Leith Feb 2021 #34
So much winning with privatization. Liberal In Texas Feb 2021 #17
Well, it doesn't produce Co2. plimsoll Feb 2021 #39
KnR sarchasm Feb 2021 #20
Texas could use some global warming and fossil fuels right about now IronLionZion Feb 2021 #22
Turbines are part of the problem. gab13by13 Feb 2021 #27
It amazes me that something like a turbine would even have such an option rurallib Feb 2021 #32
Cold weather states use deicing systems IronLionZion Feb 2021 #60
By far the largest part was natural gas pipelines and compressors froze IronLionZion Feb 2021 #53
The turbines are an incredibly small part of the problem. whopis01 Feb 2021 #81
And Republicans would like the rest of us to live in the same conditions TeamPooka Feb 2021 #23
it also relies on wind power according to Houston Chronical SleeplessinSoCal Feb 2021 #25
Wind Turbines work fine in Minnestota, Sweden, the Artic Circle obamanut2012 Feb 2021 #33
Eastern Washington. plimsoll Feb 2021 #40
Wind turbines are freezing. SleeplessinSoCal Feb 2021 #54
Something like Tbone P.... Karadeniz Feb 2021 #63
Thank you Karadeniz! SleeplessinSoCal Feb 2021 #74
T. Boone Pickens? House of Roberts Feb 2021 #75
Yes. He died 9/11/19 SleeplessinSoCal Feb 2021 #76
Wind is currently only about 13% of Texas' power & it's been overproducing... CaptainTruth Feb 2021 #41
Ironically named "Energy Reliability" progressoid Feb 2021 #45
a major rethink is in order. SleeplessinSoCal Feb 2021 #55
Wind wasn't the problem. TwilightZone Feb 2021 #50
I also heard a discussion NPR this afternoon whereby the "energy expert" HUAJIAO Feb 2021 #58
Not good timing. TwilightZone Feb 2021 #61
ERCOT is a piece of shit organization, and guess what? ananda Feb 2021 #30
From what I've read, TX was never on the national grid... Wounded Bear Feb 2021 #35
As I said in an earlier thread, there is nothing wrong with the infrastructure. BobTheSubgenius Feb 2021 #36
Well it was. Now they're going to be answering all sort of things for a week or more Clearly fogged in Feb 2021 #78
El Paso not on the grid,,, benld74 Feb 2021 #37
Republicans can't govern. It's been obvious for decades, since Eisenhower left office. SunSeeker Feb 2021 #38
Does Ted Cruz, John Cornyn, Greg Abbott and all their extended families have power? Fla Dem Feb 2021 #42
Smells like Enron. C Moon Feb 2021 #43
YEP! Rebl2 Feb 2021 #67
Ted Cruz: "Socialism sucks". But, it's OK to suck all the electric power NCjack Feb 2021 #44
Only 3 grid in the lower 48, one of them is Texas Ziggysmom Feb 2021 #48
Oh, We Know Why! Deacon Blue Feb 2021 #52
Rt TY Smh.. & Texas Suffers bc Cha Feb 2021 #51
The travesty is that they don't understand they voted for this. Elections have consequences. nt live love laugh Feb 2021 #56
That falls on deaf ears. BigmanPigman Feb 2021 #73
I would never have assumed anything else. dchill Feb 2021 #57
So how's Rebl2 Feb 2021 #66
Yeah, Texas has always been very generous to "energy providers." The electrical grid buys energy, so Nitram Feb 2021 #69
And they think they can successfully secede! obamanut2012 Feb 2021 #70
Wealthy WARM individuals, you can be sure. Kablooie Feb 2021 #72
K&R MustLoveBeagles Feb 2021 #77
Kind Of Disagree, But We'll See modrepub Feb 2021 #79

Oldem

(833 posts)
16. Tom Harkin said
Tue Feb 16, 2021, 02:32 PM
Feb 2021

that trickle down economics is the theory that you feed the birds by giving more oats to the horse.

jaxexpat

(6,818 posts)
29. Reminds me of an experiment I heard about years ago.
Tue Feb 16, 2021, 03:07 PM
Feb 2021

The Ralson Purina company was looking into more efficient ways to feed hogs.

They housed a hog in a crate area with a slatted roof and housed another hog in a crate immediately above the first. The top hog received normal rations of shelled, un-milled corn. The bottom hog ate only what the top hog had passed through it's system. At the end of the experiment both hogs had gained identical weight over the time span. Additional savings was found in that feed milling costs were eliminated.

Republicans have applied this to their economic philosophy. I suppose they have a problem with millers making a decent living. They personally don't care what they're eating so long as their portion is served first.

maxrandb

(15,322 posts)
49. Except there is no way
Tue Feb 16, 2021, 04:10 PM
Feb 2021

we're gaining an equal amount of weight as the people at the top shitting on us

jaxexpat

(6,818 posts)
64. True, but you must appreciate how they've shaved the milling costs.
Tue Feb 16, 2021, 06:10 PM
Feb 2021

They don't even pretend its processed. They just run it out of the hose right onto the airwaves. 100% unadulterated pig shit, 24/7.

Oldem

(833 posts)
18. Tom Harkin said
Tue Feb 16, 2021, 02:34 PM
Feb 2021

that trickle down economics is the theory that you feed the birds by giving more oats to the horse. Oops! Posted twice. Maybe Harkin bears repeating.

 

Budi

(15,325 posts)
6. John Cornyn
Tue Feb 16, 2021, 02:09 PM
Feb 2021

Last edited Tue Feb 16, 2021, 03:39 PM - Edit history (1)

Cornyn:








And here:






And more at Friedman's twitter link
https://mobile.twitter.com/BFriedmanDC/status/1361693012225650688
****

"...privatized, and removed from interconnected networks to avoid federal regulation and increase profits to a small number of wealthy individuals."

The entire corrupt GOP Tx Gov't is profiting from their own deregulation laws.
Because THAT IS WHAT REPUBLICANS DO.

Someone's making bank off this deadly storm. And they don't give a shit who lives, dies or suffers. People or animals.


Mr.Bill

(24,282 posts)
62. Cornyn doesn't even know what he is talking about.
Tue Feb 16, 2021, 05:25 PM
Feb 2021

California doesn't use "rolling blackouts" to mitigate wildfires. They used them last summer because of high demand caused by a heat wave.

To mitigate wildfire danger "public safety power shutoffs" are used and they are prolonged shutoffs in areas served by power lines that are in fire danger zones, usually by a combination of high winds, high temperatures and low humidity. These shutoffs are not "rolling", they are prolonged usually lasting anywhere from 2-7 days so far.

OldBaldy1701E

(5,117 posts)
80. Someone makes bank
Wed Feb 17, 2021, 08:36 AM
Feb 2021

On just about every social or personal malfeasance in this country. Hell, in the world when you figure in the weapons makers. And, no they do not give a shit and I doubt they ever did. Greed is going to destroy everything around here... assuming it hasn't already and we just can't see it yet.

Roisin Ni Fiachra

(2,574 posts)
7. First thing Texas Governor Abbot did was scream for help from the Soshlist nanny state
Tue Feb 16, 2021, 02:11 PM
Feb 2021

federal Gubmint headed by President Joe Biden, and run by them evil Democrat enviro-commies in Congress.

 

Wellstone ruled

(34,661 posts)
8. So much of our National Power Grid is
Tue Feb 16, 2021, 02:11 PM
Feb 2021

owned by Hedge Funds filled with Foreign Money. And the Enron effect is now hitting Texas,Arkansas,Oklahoma and Louisiana.

Not surprised how Mother Nature has kicked these Right Wing States in the butt. This is what happens when one does not follow the Science and relies on some Mystical ideals.

RVN VET71

(2,690 posts)
24. Can't do schadenfreude on this one.
Tue Feb 16, 2021, 02:43 PM
Feb 2021

There’s just too many good, which is to say non Republican, human beings in Texas who are suffering because of the a-holes who voted-in Abbott and Patrick and Paxton and Cruz and Cornyn and all of the other grifting low-intelligence lower-life schemers who are to blame for this.

Liberal In Texas

(13,546 posts)
17. So much winning with privatization.
Tue Feb 16, 2021, 02:34 PM
Feb 2021

And regulations, who needs that? We can put up windmills cheaper because they're not required to have the cold weather kit.

Also saw something today that we're getting people now saying we'd better build more nuclear plants. Because of some BS that it's clean energy.


plimsoll

(1,668 posts)
39. Well, it doesn't produce Co2.
Tue Feb 16, 2021, 03:38 PM
Feb 2021

Clean? Depends on your definition. We still need a more robust energy infrastructure, and nuclear probably should be a part of that until we have fusion. But fusion has been just around the corner since the 1950's, so don't hold your breath.

IronLionZion

(45,427 posts)
22. Texas could use some global warming and fossil fuels right about now
Tue Feb 16, 2021, 02:40 PM
Feb 2021


GOPers are online claiming frozen Texas windmills are the problem, not their deregulated power grid.

gab13by13

(21,304 posts)
27. Turbines are part of the problem.
Tue Feb 16, 2021, 02:52 PM
Feb 2021

but...Texas didn't want the cold weather turbines which do just fine in the cold. Texas chose to go cheap and buy the warm weather turbines.

rurallib

(62,406 posts)
32. It amazes me that something like a turbine would even have such an option
Tue Feb 16, 2021, 03:20 PM
Feb 2021

There can't be much difference in the price, can there?

IronLionZion

(45,427 posts)
60. Cold weather states use deicing systems
Tue Feb 16, 2021, 05:15 PM
Feb 2021

and heaters for various parts. Canada has plenty of wind turbines in conditions way colder than Texas can ever dream of.

This happens so rarely in Texas that they designed their system for hot summers, not icy winters. Conservatives like to blame wind turbines, but natural gas is the main source of power for Texas in the winters, and the pipelines and compressors froze for the same reason. They were designed for warm weather.

IronLionZion

(45,427 posts)
53. By far the largest part was natural gas pipelines and compressors froze
Tue Feb 16, 2021, 04:23 PM
Feb 2021

yes wind is part of it, but a smaller part.

Here's a Vox explainer: https://www.vox.com/2021/2/16/22284140/texas-blackout-outage-winter-storm-uri-ercot-power-grid-cold-snow-austin-houston-dallas

However, the cold itself posed a direct challenge to the power sources that the state was counting on. Wind turbines iced up. Coal piles froze.

The biggest shortfall in energy production stemmed from natural gas. Gas pipelines were blocked with ice or their compressors lost power. Much of the gas that was available was prioritized for heating homes and businesses rather than generating electricity. That’s helpful for people who use gas for heating but less so for those who use electric furnaces.

Wholesale natural gas prices, meanwhile, shot up as much as 4,000 percent. According to Bloomberg, electricity prices in northern Texas jumped to $300 per megawatt-hour, up from the average this month of $18 per megawatt-hour.

In total, about 34,000 megawatts of power generation in Texas went offline during the winter blast, more than 40 percent of peak winter demand. So even with a diverse range of energy sources, Texas was left scrounging for electrons in the bitter cold.

whopis01

(3,510 posts)
81. The turbines are an incredibly small part of the problem.
Wed Feb 17, 2021, 10:23 AM
Feb 2021

The power lost due to problems with natural gas and other fossil fuel generation systems was an order of magnitude greater than the power lost due to wind turbines.


SleeplessinSoCal

(9,110 posts)
25. it also relies on wind power according to Houston Chronical
Tue Feb 16, 2021, 02:46 PM
Feb 2021
"The Texas power grid, powered largely by wind and natural gas, is relatively well equipped to handle the state’s hot and humid summers when demand for power soars. But unlike blistering summers, the severe winter weather delivered a crippling blow to power production, cutting supplies as the falling temperatures increased demand."


https://www.houstonchronicle.com/business/energy/article/Wholesale-power-prices-spiking-across-Texas-15951684.php

obamanut2012

(26,068 posts)
33. Wind Turbines work fine in Minnestota, Sweden, the Artic Circle
Tue Feb 16, 2021, 03:22 PM
Feb 2021

They only don't work in Texas for some reason.

plimsoll

(1,668 posts)
40. Eastern Washington.
Tue Feb 16, 2021, 03:40 PM
Feb 2021

Lots of places where it get's cold. It's obvious that Texas once again planned on the happy path.

SleeplessinSoCal

(9,110 posts)
54. Wind turbines are freezing.
Tue Feb 16, 2021, 04:31 PM
Feb 2021

Or so it's being reported

Who was the big time Texas oil man who became a major wind power advocate? I can't recall his name.

CaptainTruth

(6,588 posts)
41. Wind is currently only about 13% of Texas' power & it's been overproducing...
Tue Feb 16, 2021, 03:44 PM
Feb 2021

...the past several days to do high winds.

The problem is the approx 30GW of gas/coal plants that are offline.

I should note that the "13% wind" is the baseline contribution that ERCOT uses for this time of year when compiling their energy supply "budget" (how much each source can be counted on to contribute).

ERCOT is the Energy Reliability Council Of Texas, the organization that runs the state's power grid.

TwilightZone

(25,464 posts)
50. Wind wasn't the problem.
Tue Feb 16, 2021, 04:11 PM
Feb 2021

Other articles have noted that wind production was at higher than expected levels, even with the frozen turbines.

The problem was mostly frozen equipment at other facilities - natural gas, coal, and nuclear - and a shortage of natural gas.

HUAJIAO

(2,383 posts)
58. I also heard a discussion NPR this afternoon whereby the "energy expert"
Tue Feb 16, 2021, 04:55 PM
Feb 2021

said that quite a few natural gas and oil 'plants' were shut down for repairs/maintenance preparing for the summer 'rush' !

TwilightZone

(25,464 posts)
61. Not good timing.
Tue Feb 16, 2021, 05:22 PM
Feb 2021

They've known for a couple weeks that this storm was going to arrive. It was a bit worse than forecast, but not that much. Mismanagement all around, it seems. Not surprising considering the deregulation and funding cuts under Perry, Abbott, etc.

ananda

(28,858 posts)
30. ERCOT is a piece of shit organization, and guess what?
Tue Feb 16, 2021, 03:13 PM
Feb 2021

They’ve just called on all public utilities, including
Austin Energy, for more load shedding.

Austin Energy seems to be pushing back a bit bc
this would mean cutting energy for hospitals
and critical services.

I do not expect to have my power restored for
quite some time, but I can tough it out OK.

Well over 40% of Austin residents are without power
as it is.

This is beyond ridiculous!

Wounded Bear

(58,647 posts)
35. From what I've read, TX was never on the national grid...
Tue Feb 16, 2021, 03:27 PM
Feb 2021

or at least most of it. Apparently there are some areas in the panhandle and in East TX that are connected to adjoining states.

I also hear that much of Northern Mexico is losing power because the TX natural gas pipelines have been freezing up and failing.

BobTheSubgenius

(11,563 posts)
36. As I said in an earlier thread, there is nothing wrong with the infrastructure.
Tue Feb 16, 2021, 03:27 PM
Feb 2021

It is working just fine for the few controlling it....and really, that's all that matters, isn't it? We should be happy and even honoured to be carrying water for the. Sometimes literally.

benld74

(9,904 posts)
37. El Paso not on the grid,,,
Tue Feb 16, 2021, 03:28 PM
Feb 2021

Used their own. Publicly sold. Until 07/20, sold to JPMorgan hedge for $4.3b!

Look out El Paso

SunSeeker

(51,550 posts)
38. Republicans can't govern. It's been obvious for decades, since Eisenhower left office.
Tue Feb 16, 2021, 03:35 PM
Feb 2021

All they know is how to do is to cut taxes for the wealthy and cut regulations for the wealthy.

Fla Dem

(23,650 posts)
42. Does Ted Cruz, John Cornyn, Greg Abbott and all their extended families have power?
Tue Feb 16, 2021, 03:44 PM
Feb 2021

Someone should look into that.

Deacon Blue

(252 posts)
52. Oh, We Know Why!
Tue Feb 16, 2021, 04:16 PM
Feb 2021

Oil (pronounced ‘awl’), black gold, Texas tea, dinosaur wine and its sister Methane run the politics of this the Reddest of the Red. Texas, Our Texas, so benighted and beholden.

And have you noticed how the Fossil Lovers have slammed green energy for this problem? Nothing to do with the oligopoly sheltered as a semi-state-run (socialist? no way!) enterprise. Jehezius Christ, just awful, so many handles to grab here...

Nitram

(22,791 posts)
69. Yeah, Texas has always been very generous to "energy providers." The electrical grid buys energy, so
Tue Feb 16, 2021, 06:57 PM
Feb 2021

it is fair game in the Lone Star State. Remember Enron?

modrepub

(3,494 posts)
79. Kind Of Disagree, But We'll See
Wed Feb 17, 2021, 07:48 AM
Feb 2021

To me it seems TX has politicized its electric grid. It reflects a political philosophy that all government is bad and doesn't work.

If it is truly a private business organization then heads will roll. No private company would tolerate a failure of this magnitude. Stock owners would be upset, board meetings would be contentious, management would be shaken up and CEOs would be fired. You don't run a private company this badly without repercussions.

If no reforms are made and upper management stays intact then this is more of a political creature than a private company. As we've seen, politicians seem to be the only folks who get to deny that rules apply to them.

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