About the anti-Manchin vitriole...

[WarGamer]

Manchin can have McConnell sworn in as Majority Leader within 24 hours and the stationary changed within 72 hours.

If Manchin jumped ship... what would his approval numbers be in WV?? 55-60%??

Manchin is teflon and radioactive at the same time.

Calling for ANY action against him is foolish. Any news story speaking ill of him will just push him closer to picking up his phone to Leader Schumer.

Manchin is the ONLY thing between Schumer and McConnell being Leader and the entire Biden agenda foundering.

Until 2022, that is...

[hlthe2b]

1. Yup...

Bottom line, that we may as well get used to, as he will wave his ace card in our faces from time to time.

[Crunchy Frog]

2. That's kinda why I hate him.

I could see him turning full Maga on a dime.

I understand that our side has to kiss his ass, but that doesn't mean I have to like it.

[WarGamer]

4. exactly...

[mikewv]

9. He voted for impeachment twice. "full Maga on a dime"? never

Joe is decent person and I would never see him with that crowd.

[Crunchy Frog]

10. Hope you're right about that.

[Martin68]

19. If he feels he's been disrespected by the Democratic Party that could change.

[mikewv]

23. I respectfully disagree. Manchin is and will always be a Democrat.

He will push back on some issues because of being from a very "red" WV. However, he has always legislated from the middle. Yes, he will be a disappointment to some on the left but he CERTAINLY has not been welcomed or celebrated from those on the right.

[radius777]

34. Manchin could never win a GOP primary and would never switch parties.

Manchin really is to the right of the state economically, that was historically a Dem state but went GOP based on social/racial issues - not economic. WV still elects Dems as governor (Justice was elected as a Dem) and has a history of electing Dem senators (Byrd, Rockefeller, Manchin).

We need to find a decent conservative Dem who is better than Manchin and at least hold it over his head.

[Salviati]

3. As frustrating as he is...

I'd rather have him inside the tent pissing out, rather than outside pissing in. Even if there is more backsplash than is really warranted. What we need to do is to take our frustrations about him and use them to drive our efforts to get more Democrats elected. Even if they are more conservative that we would like, more choices means we have more options.

[WarGamer]

5. '22 is a juicy opportunity to go +3 in the Senate

Just need to keep the ship on an even keel until then.

[Fiendish Thingy]

24. If Dems don't deliver to voters now, forget about adding seats in the senate

They will lose both the house and the senate due to gerrymandering and voter suppression laws currently in the pipeline (laws which would be overruled by the voting rights act, which can’t pass while Manchin opposes killing the filibuster).

“Make Manchin irrelevant in 2022” looks like a workable strategy, but for the reasons I listed above, not feasible.

Dems must pursue swift, ruthless, relentless wielding of their hard won power (isn’t that what republicans do?), and show no mercy to anyone in any party who would obstruct them.

The stakes are just too high.

[uponit7771]

27. +1

[Baked Potato]

30. Agreed. A LOT of Americans came out for Democrats.

Democrats must get real things done—things voters will applaud and come out for again in 2022. This may really be the last chance.

[LymphocyteLover]

39. can't people see the GOP has gone insane and support a lunatic treasonous criminal?

I have to think that Jan 6th and the overall state of the GOP has got to hurt them in 2022 and beyond.

By people-- I mean centrist voters. Not the wingnuts, who can't be reached.

And obviously we have to work to GOTV.

[Demsrule86]

28. We must also hold the house.

[Caliman73]

6. Except he is inside the tent pissing in, not out.

Ultimately it is the voters of W. Virginia who decide on Manchin. I favor the strategy of making him less relevant by picking up more Senate seats in 22, even though that will be a heavy lift.

[LenaBaby61]

18. Ultimately it is the voters of W. Virginia who decide on Manchin.

And friends from West Virginia said that HE is part of the reason they're happy that they left that HELL HOLE. As I mentioned, a friend in his 70's from WV said that he wouldn't piss on Manchin if he was on fire, and all of my friends said he's petty, for himself and his family, and he doesn't give one shit about WV because if he did, they said he'd stop hurting the people of WV, who live in one of the most impoverished, drug-addicted red states around. He's for an $11.00 per hour minimum wage (Which hasn't been raised since 2009), and the people in WV who don't like him but voted for him because of that D beside his name don't deserve what he's doing TO them. THEY continue to suffer in silence, because he's not listening to them, friends from WV tell me. Their right. Manchin and that GQP party doesn't give one shit about anybody but themselves.

Jamie Harrison HAS to work as hard as he humanly can to try to swipe a few more Senate seats in a few years so that Manchin can become irrelevant, because I have the feeling that he's going to do more that what he's doing NOW to fuck with a Pres. Biden/Dem agenda, and with our country almost falling into the hands of an insane, ignorant, grifting, racist, treasonous, mad dictator, we can't afford to turn it completely over to a younger, more intelligent, slicker, gas-lighting, secessionist version of that fat, thuggish, putin-loving criminal tRump, who with other GQP'ers will CONTINUE the big LIE about how this election was STOLEN from him for the millionth time. We've already got Q-Anonists saying that they'll be blowing the place up wherever Pres. Biden gives his State of the Union address. I'm 60, and I do not feel that in what little lifetime I have left that we'll get rid of those KOOL-AID drinking tRumpists/GQP'ers who want to completely take away the votes of African-Americans and other non-white people.

We are a nation who is at a FULL ON crossroads ... GOD HELP US.

[marble falls]

8. He votes with Democrats a lot more than not, he votes with Democrats a lot more than ...

... any Republican does.

[mikewv]

14. Exactly! nm

[mikewv]

7. Well stated!

He has voted for impeachment twice and we should be happy he is not up for re-election in 2022. That seat will most likely go to the republicans in 2024. I have my doubts that Manchin will even run for re-election in 2024. Remember he did not receive 50% of the vote in 2018 but thanks to a 3rd party candidate he won anyways.

[BlueLucy]

11. This is 100% true.

[Baked Potato]

12. I guess we could say that about any of them.

That’s why we should can the filibuster.

[Mr.Bill]

13. Or until a republican Senator flips

to the Democratic Party.

[LenaBaby61]

20. Or until a republican Senator flips to the Democratic Party.

I can't think of ONE Senate GQP'er who'll do that 👆🏻👆🏻 I can see someone on that side of the Isle maybe switching to being an Independent though. But on of them become a Democrat?

NEVER.

God, I wished I was wrong as two left shoes, but I don't think I am.

[Politicub]

15. I have zero power over what he does in the Senate.

So about all I can do is vent on DU about how sick I am of his grandstanding and stopping progress.

And with the equality act, it’s likely he is going to cast his lot with those who are looking to ensure the LGBTQ community stays marginalized.

[BobTheSubgenius]

16. Not the same words, of course, but...

...I posted the same thing in another poster's OP. Not only is there a certain amount of risk in your scenario - and I agree, obviously - but there is no real upside that I can see.

[bullimiami]

17. Is manchin so tenuous a democrat? So delicate he can't be criticized or he'll jump ship?

If so why did he bother putting up with being a D in WVA?
It’s a difficult lift.

[TwilightZone]

31. No, he's not.

People who make that claim have no idea what they're talking about. He's quite comfortable as a Democrat and quite comfortable with the criticism he receives for being an independent-minded one. He's an independent-minded one because that's what his constituents want.

It's also quite clear that many on DU have no understanding of politics in WV and don't understand that Manchin is possibly the only Democrat in the entire country who could hold down a Senate seat in a state Trump won by 40.

[Fiendish Thingy]

21. If Manchin jumps ship, his career ends in 2024- he won't even win his primary

He won re-election in 2018 by 3%/19,000 votes, hardly a landslide. He is certainly not immune to losing to a Trump selected opponent in the GOP primary.

Manchin deserves all the vitriol he is getting, and more. He is the difference between :

1) Biden and the Dems making history with substantive change through unprecedented legislation on wages, healthcare, jobs, courts, immigration, equality, climate and more, laws that would benefit all working Americans, and almost certainly ensure they retain/expand their majorities, or

2) Dems failing to deliver any of the above for voters because of the filibuster, and losing their majorities in 2022, and for a decade or more afterwards, due to gerrymandering and voter suppression laws currently in the pipeline in state legislatures, laws which would be overruled by the For The People Act, which can’t pass with the filibuster intact.

The choice is that stark.

So please excuse me if I’m not worried about Manchin’s fee-fee’s - he deserves all the pressure he is getting, and I hope Schumer, Biden, Harris, and all the activist groups keep it up. Manchin has only one choice if he wants to continue his career as a Senator- support Biden’s agenda. Any other choice means Dems lose their majorities, and if Dems lose their majorities, Manchin must face the political consequences.

[TwilightZone]

32. He's not going to jump ship.

He's quite comfortable as a Democrat and quite comfortable with the criticism about being an independent-minded one.

I find that much of DU has little understanding of Manchin, his history, WV politics, etc. A lot of it is just kneejerk assertions with little basis in reality.

[Fiendish Thingy]

40. My point exactly- he's not jumping ship, so keep his feet to the fire. Nt

[mcar]

22. This is why we need to get 4 or more Democrats elected to the Senate in 2022

Thus rendering Manchin, Synema, and another Senator ineffective.

[Fiendish Thingy]

41. If Manchin blocks Biden's agenda, Dems will lose their majorities in both Senate and house. Nt

[Trueblue1968]

25. President Biden should nominate a GOPig to either ambassador or a lower type cabinet job

is another DEM could win a senate seat, we would be much better off

[TwilightZone]

33. No GOP Senators would accept a position that would require them to resign.

That seems like a no-brainer. They're dumb but they're not dumb.

[Trueblue1968]

38. depends on what the position was. if the idiot thought they could make some $$$$$$

off the Gig, they would take it. The GOPigs are corrupt that way.

[James48]

26. We DO have a choice- TODAY! Statehood!

For the new states of Columbia (DC) and Puerto Rico (PR just voted).

All it takes right now is the will to bring statehood for both to the floor of both House and Senate. I don’t think the filibuster rule applies to voting to accept new states.

Stop everything else you are doing for one day, and make both states immediately.

P.S.- graphic artists- start working on a design for a 52-star flag.

[Polybius]

37. Not gonna happen

It can be filibustered, and will require 60 votes. Manchin and Sinema both oppose ending the filibuster.

[WarGamer]

42. There are AT LEAST 3 DEM Senators standing in the way

If it ever came to vote, I think 4-5 more would spring up in opposition.

[LanternWaste]

29. You then believe holding him to the standard of Democratic Party platform...

would compel him to change stripes?




You rolled a one again. Def Retreat, Lose Three Steps. Until 2022 that is...

[Gore1FL]

35. I doubt he'd switch if leaned on.

Some of that leaning might be a threat concerning supporting a challenger in 2022.

[WarGamer]

43. He's not up for re-election in 22.

[Gore1FL]

46. I stand corrected.

Thank you.

[Hotler]

36. I don't have to like the man. nt

[gulliver]

44. He's fine. We just need more Dems, not purer ones.

The OP is right.

Those who want to rail against any Dem officeholders should all take a chill pill. I don't care what their opinion is at all unless they support said opinion with a constructive, viable alternative plan. We have climate change to defeat, health care to make universal, and discrimination to eradicate. Eyeses on prizes.

Don't like Manchin? "We'd all love to see the plan." No plan? Sorry, it's a pass. Next.

[Vinca]

45. You make a good point. It hadn't occurred to be that he might go 100% GOP rather than half and half.

That said, it would sure be nice to see a viable challenger to his hold on power in the next primary season.

[PBass]

47. He votes with Democrats something like 70% of the time. Compare that to Republicans...

where hardcore conservatives like Eric Cantor (!!!) were primaried and were defeated. There is no longer a large center where Dems and Republicans find common ground. Manchin isn't going to switch parties over the minimum wage, or any other 'single issue'. A "republican" Manchin would lose the very next primary.