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liskddksil

(2,753 posts)
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 03:12 PM Mar 2021

AOC to the Rescue Calls out Democrats on Stimulus Amounts






Call your Senators and Represantive and tell them that anyone who makes up to $100,000 who got a Trump check, needs to get a Biden check or we will likely lose our majority in 2022.

Capitol Switchboard
(202) 224-3121




Update Pennsylvania Lt. Gov and Senate candidate claps back as well.


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AOC to the Rescue Calls out Democrats on Stimulus Amounts (Original Post) liskddksil Mar 2021 OP
Dammit AOC! jcgoldie Mar 2021 #1
AOC really isn't very helpful. nt comradebillyboy Mar 2021 #2
More helpful then anything these "moderates" are doing nt liskddksil Mar 2021 #3
Those moderates will actually get a stimulus bill comradebillyboy Mar 2021 #6
and the 12 million who were promised checks but don't get them will blame us and we will lose our liskddksil Mar 2021 #7
Sure thing... comradebillyboy Mar 2021 #9
You laugh, but this in an own goal of epic proportions nt liskddksil Mar 2021 #10
The all or nothing approach usually yields nothing. comradebillyboy Mar 2021 #12
That's for sure PatSeg Mar 2021 #19
Sounds great in theory. But 12-17 million stand to lose out on their check. They will blame us liskddksil Mar 2021 #36
And Republicans will make sure they mention it Bettie Mar 2021 #41
Yep and all of this nonsense to save only 12 billion dollars that isn't even going liskddksil Mar 2021 #42
And all in the name of "moderation" Bettie Mar 2021 #83
Should I bdamomma Mar 2021 #98
You are correct. ForgoTheConsequence Mar 2021 #38
Glad you think it's funny kcr Mar 2021 #35
No they won't. Especially the people who said they didn't need it and that it should SharonClark Mar 2021 #16
Agree. Most people aren't outrageously greedy and grasping, Hortensis Mar 2021 #44
so this one thing qazplm135 Mar 2021 #17
Exactly PatSeg Mar 2021 #21
Yes, they were promised $2000 liskddksil Mar 2021 #24
who is they? qazplm135 Mar 2021 #43
Yes for those making $80-100K, the promise is broken. liskddksil Mar 2021 #48
it's not true qazplm135 Mar 2021 #66
People want simple and fair policies. We continue to lose elections because we try to get cute and liskddksil Mar 2021 #73
yeah qazplm135 Mar 2021 #74
We lost Seats in the House, only won the Senate because of Georgia, and lost almost liskddksil Mar 2021 #75
we won the House, Senate and White House qazplm135 Mar 2021 #78
No, but shame on those who'd feel cheated at not getting handouts Hortensis Mar 2021 #46
"Handouts", are you kidding me? These are survival checks. And $80,000 in many cities liskddksil Mar 2021 #49
Sorry, but a single person making $80K without savings, without Hortensis Mar 2021 #65
What world is weighted in anyone's favor right now? This is a pandemic! Plus millennials have never liskddksil Mar 2021 #70
These days skilled people are their own production centers. Do you imagine Hortensis Mar 2021 #77
You know, I can't begin to imagine making $80,000 PatSeg Mar 2021 #85
Yes. Some beyond doubt. Hortensis Mar 2021 #102
Yes, this administration is off to a great start PatSeg Mar 2021 #106
1400 bucks qazplm135 Mar 2021 #94
Well, this is also meant to be stimulus, and some dollars Hortensis Mar 2021 #103
If someone is making $80,000 (or $160,000 for a couple) PatSeg Mar 2021 #105
Minimum wage should be $40 per hour because people making 80k are barely surviving MichMan Mar 2021 #82
+1 betsuni Mar 2021 #92
Yup. The average voter is far more interested in their own pocketbook, than any lagomorph777 Mar 2021 #23
Yep, Republicans are already tearing into us for this liskddksil Mar 2021 #25
lol qazplm135 Mar 2021 #45
Guarantee it voters will care when they use this later when the 22 and 24 campaigns ramp up. Autumn Mar 2021 #88
no qazplm135 Mar 2021 #91
They will use that and people will remember. Autumn Mar 2021 #96
nah qazplm135 Mar 2021 #100
And I don't care bdamomma Mar 2021 #99
This is the point that gets me. How stupid do we have to be to capitulate ANYTHING to them? Doremus Mar 2021 #72
Nobody knows that. The proposal was just released an hour or two ago AND it's not final. George II Mar 2021 #54
A stimulus bill guaranteed to piss off anyone who gets cut off... regnaD kciN Mar 2021 #34
So positively comparing trump to Democrats is good? George II Mar 2021 #52
"Moderates" are the Reason we Won Cha Mar 2021 #57
These moderates in States like WV and AZ are occupying a seat that has been red. grantcart Mar 2021 #79
More helpful than Manchin and Sinema, that's for sure. jorgevlorgan Mar 2021 #26
No, she's not. Magoo48 Mar 2021 #37
She's more helpful and realistic than any other politician. If you think that this won't piss off Autumn Mar 2021 #87
What doesn't she understand? Let me make this simple, Manchin, and a couple of other JohnSJ Mar 2021 #4
Its not just Manchin sabotoging this. Jeanne Sheehan and other "moderates" wanted this change liskddksil Mar 2021 #5
There has gotta be a workaround ... mdelaguna Mar 2021 #13
The only way is for the congressional progressives to announce they will not vote for liskddksil Mar 2021 #15
How possible do you think that is? jorgevlorgan Mar 2021 #28
Unlikely but you never know nt liskddksil Mar 2021 #30
I wonder if they will just take out the parts overruled by the parliamentarian jorgevlorgan Mar 2021 #31
...and then any democrats voting to change it could be blamed for killing the bill jorgevlorgan Mar 2021 #33
Some bold Dems need to threaten to vote it down leftstreet Mar 2021 #20
Yes. That is why I referenced a generic couple of other Democratic Senators, also in my statement JohnSJ Mar 2021 #18
But they did not get 1400 under moonscape Mar 2021 #86
Biden said he can unite Republicans wellst0nev0ter Mar 2021 #8
+1 leftstreet Mar 2021 #11
He said he would try, but that ended the moment they countered with a 600 billion package JohnSJ Mar 2021 #22
Could anyone do a better job as President than Biden? Why the immediate negative connotation? George II Mar 2021 #67
If Biden had better coattails during the election, we wouldn't be having this conversation wellst0nev0ter Mar 2021 #76
I honestly can't imagine any president doing a better job than Biden PatSeg Mar 2021 #84
It's about what he said he'd do. Cuthbert Allgood Mar 2021 #114
Pity she isn't in the Senate to vote against it nt AZSkiffyGeek Mar 2021 #14
Why not call out the Republicans? treestar Mar 2021 #27
No, the Democrats are the ones who negotiated this change. Republicans are already liskddksil Mar 2021 #29
I sure wish I was that not rich. OriginalGeek Mar 2021 #39
The Rubio statements doesn't even make sense treestar Mar 2021 #40
just so I'm clear qazplm135 Mar 2021 #47
Oh so now even Marco Rubio is better than our Democrats? By the way, do you even know what.... George II Mar 2021 #59
I'm just commenting on what's reported now in case its not to late to make things right nt liskddksil Mar 2021 #60
Marco Rubio's opinion is hardly relevant PatSeg Mar 2021 #89
160K, once income tax at state and federal levels, property taxes, Celerity Mar 2021 #95
Only 8% of American households PatSeg Mar 2021 #104
Now you are moving the goalposts. I stand 100% behind my analysis and I Celerity Mar 2021 #107
Actually I do know PatSeg Mar 2021 #110
I do not want to fight either. I just think this was a self-inflicted wound that certainly doesn't Celerity Mar 2021 #111
I think we are still going through withdrawal PatSeg Mar 2021 #112
I forgot to ask, you're in NH, what are the odds (given our shit record in first midterms for Dem Celerity Mar 2021 #121
Honestly, I was surprised that Sununu PatSeg Mar 2021 #122
the Rethugs flipped both the NH House and Senate to give them their 23rd state trifecta Celerity Mar 2021 #123
It is funny how many states elect Democrats PatSeg Mar 2021 #124
it so fucks us in terms of gerrymandering at state and federal levels and running elections as well Celerity Mar 2021 #125
AOC is an asset to The Democratic Party. Glad We have her. Tommymac Mar 2021 #32
Post removed Post removed Mar 2021 #56
Nope nt liskddksil Mar 2021 #63
Read her tweet again, please. Thanks. George II Mar 2021 #68
Why is it acceptable to "call out Democrats" especially when they're praising trump in the process? George II Mar 2021 #50
Post removed Post removed Mar 2021 #53
The number of people not getting a check is virtually zero, this is a proposal to scale down.... George II Mar 2021 #55
Where did I praise Trump? I'm just doing math liskddksil Mar 2021 #58
The subject of your OP is saying trump is better than our Democrats. George II Mar 2021 #61
I don't think it is nt liskddksil Mar 2021 #62
You are correct it isn't ChubbyStar Mar 2021 #69
Thats not at what it says even remotely jcgoldie Mar 2021 #93
No it isn't. Not even close George. Autumn Mar 2021 #97
Your math is wrong dansolo Mar 2021 #119
AOC is right about this. aikoaiko Mar 2021 #51
Simple solution. Traildogbob Mar 2021 #64
So all of Wisconsin gets zero checks? Cuthbert Allgood Mar 2021 #115
Just registered republicans. Traildogbob Mar 2021 #116
We don't register here, so... Cuthbert Allgood Mar 2021 #117
If all the Traildogbob Mar 2021 #118
Look, realistically Traildogbob Mar 2021 #120
Maybe she could have said it differently but I agree... electric_blue68 Mar 2021 #71
Who's she rescuing? mcar Mar 2021 #80
Unlikely she can stop the train at this point, but 12 million people who should be liskddksil Mar 2021 #81
She's right... there was absolutely no reason to do this budkin Mar 2021 #90
yes, yes it is Celerity Mar 2021 #109
Tweet threads blaming Biden/Democrats because zero Republican votes betsuni Mar 2021 #101
If it's a stimulus payment, give it to as many people as fiscally possible. BusyBeingBest Mar 2021 #108
Plus those who are still making money... lame54 Mar 2021 #113

comradebillyboy

(10,955 posts)
6. Those moderates will actually get a stimulus bill
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 03:23 PM
Mar 2021

through the Senate despite unanimous Republican opposition. I have yet to see any legislative accomplishments from AOC.

 

liskddksil

(2,753 posts)
7. and the 12 million who were promised checks but don't get them will blame us and we will lose our
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 03:25 PM
Mar 2021

majority in 2022.

PatSeg

(53,214 posts)
19. That's for sure
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 03:38 PM
Mar 2021

My way or the highway rarely ever works in politics or one's personal life.

 

liskddksil

(2,753 posts)
36. Sounds great in theory. But 12-17 million stand to lose out on their check. They will blame us
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 04:32 PM
Mar 2021

for that not the Republicans.

Bettie

(19,704 posts)
41. And Republicans will make sure they mention it
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 05:20 PM
Mar 2021

in ALL of their ads.

It won't matter that none of them voted for it, it will be all about "Democrats think you are rich, that you don't need money!"

True? No, but hey, look at what Rubio is already saying.

 

liskddksil

(2,753 posts)
42. Yep and all of this nonsense to save only 12 billion dollars that isn't even going
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 05:25 PM
Mar 2021

anywhere else in the bill.

Bettie

(19,704 posts)
83. And all in the name of "moderation"
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 07:12 PM
Mar 2021

yet, any election losses will be blamed 100% on the existence of progressives.

bdamomma

(69,532 posts)
98. Should I
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 08:51 PM
Mar 2021

say if the GQP was still in office what would they have done in this case a big NOTHING.

It's something not nothing. Just my opinion.

ForgoTheConsequence

(5,186 posts)
38. You are correct.
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 05:08 PM
Mar 2021

This is going to hurt in the midterms. Of course, the usual crowd will blame everyone but the people responsible.

SharonClark

(10,497 posts)
16. No they won't. Especially the people who said they didn't need it and that it should
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 03:35 PM
Mar 2021

be prioritized for people who do.

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
44. Agree. Most people aren't outrageously greedy and grasping,
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 05:30 PM
Mar 2021

and we're talking about individuals making over $75K annually, etc. Dreadfully, that's more than some people have earned in a lifetime. Btw, I figure those who are like that are far more likely to vote Republican anyway.

qazplm135

(7,654 posts)
17. so this one thing
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 03:37 PM
Mar 2021

this one thing is all it will take for them to switch or stay home? Really?

If that's the case (spoiler, it isn't) then there are going to be ten things "worse" we do between now and 2022 that would cause such a fickle lot to abandon us.

PatSeg

(53,214 posts)
21. Exactly
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 03:41 PM
Mar 2021

And yes, I'm quite sure there will be "worse" down the road. Doing nothing to avoid political repercussions is hardly the answer.

qazplm135

(7,654 posts)
43. who is they?
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 05:30 PM
Mar 2021

The people from 80-100K?

Biden went to each of them and specifically said "You will get 2000?"

Nope, and we know it isn't true because the drop off starts at 75K and finishes at 100K so people over 80K were NEVER going to get the full 200K.

I make 82K. So on paper I don't get squat. Which is fine. It really isn't huge to me. Now, in reality, I will get it because 20K of that is tax free military disability pay so in reality, I only make 62K. But it's just going to go into my account. Because making that much money single with no dependents is plenty.

 

liskddksil

(2,753 posts)
48. Yes for those making $80-100K, the promise is broken.
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 05:39 PM
Mar 2021

During the campaign for the two Georgia Senate races, Joe Biden repeatedly promised to pass $2,000 stimulus checks if the Democrats won. After they did, the administration argued that $2,000 really meant $1,400 in addition to the $600 that had already gone out in the December rescue package.

Whether that is true or not, now Biden is inarguably breaking his promise. Under pressure from moderate Senate Democrats, he has reportedly agreed to cut down the formula under which the checks will be sent out. In the previous packages, the amount started phasing out at $75,000 in income for individuals and $150,000 for joint filers, and vanished entirely at $100,000 and $200,000 respectively (as of 2019). Now the phase-out will start start in the same place but end at $80,000 for singles and $160,000 for couples.

The $1,400 promise clearly implied at least that the checks would go out according to the previous formula used under Trump. But now singles making between $80,000-100,000 and couples making between $160,000-200,000 will get nothing. The Washington Post's Jeff Stein reports that roughly 17 million people who previously got checks now will not.

https://news.yahoo.com/joe-biden-just-yanked-away-183549948.html

qazplm135

(7,654 posts)
66. it's not true
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 06:02 PM
Mar 2021

which tells you all you need to know that they had to add that line to the article. The previously formula didn't have people from 80-100K getting the entire amount. And no it didn't imply that the exact same formula would be used.

But hey, you clearly want to believe all is lost because of this one thing, so who am I to stop you.

 

liskddksil

(2,753 posts)
73. People want simple and fair policies. We continue to lose elections because we try to get cute and
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 06:08 PM
Mar 2021

make this stuff so complicated, that people don't trust us.

 

liskddksil

(2,753 posts)
75. We lost Seats in the House, only won the Senate because of Georgia, and lost almost
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 06:11 PM
Mar 2021

every competitive Governors and state legislative race as well.

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
46. No, but shame on those who'd feel cheated at not getting handouts
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 05:36 PM
Mar 2021

from the public till.

My husband and I are and know retired people whose income is all or mostly from modest SocSec checks, and many of us agreed all along that we'd be okay with not being included. At one point I sort of assumed folk on SocSec wouldn't be.

We'll put it to good use, finish catching up our credit cards after our necessarily modest holiday spending, stimulate the local economy, but we didn't lose jobs and don't need and didn't ask for a handout.

I'm sure far more people feel as we do than that sorry lot you're imagining.

 

liskddksil

(2,753 posts)
49. "Handouts", are you kidding me? These are survival checks. And $80,000 in many cities
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 05:40 PM
Mar 2021

is barely making ends meet, especially with cost of living increases this year.

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
65. Sorry, but a single person making $80K without savings, without
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 05:59 PM
Mar 2021

credit to borrow on, without even extravagant possessions to hock can move in with friends, rent a bedroom to friends, move into their cars, sell their cars, move back with their parents or grandparents, who can explain the lesson they should take from this.

A world that's normally weighted heavily in their favor has temporarily lost some of the "heavily" part of that. Oh, well. They'll still have themselves.

 

liskddksil

(2,753 posts)
70. What world is weighted in anyone's favor right now? This is a pandemic! Plus millennials have never
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 06:03 PM
Mar 2021

recovered from the last recession and they are clearly being targeted by this change. Your world-view is quite interesting.

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
77. These days skilled people are their own production centers. Do you imagine
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 06:27 PM
Mar 2021

unskilled labor is living on $100K per year? Those who earn that are ambulatory money machines, accountants, dentists, production managers, logistics analysts, loan officers, attorneys. They'll be able to come around. So they have to sell their Manolos, relocate to a walkup in Elmhurst, trade down their leased cars for a while? Their future earning abilities are where they always were: in their heads.

There are limits to how much people should expect others to take care of them. Our first duty is always to take care of ourselves, then help others.

PatSeg

(53,214 posts)
85. You know, I can't begin to imagine making $80,000
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 07:41 PM
Mar 2021

or $160,000 if I was married. And if I did, I can't imagine that $1400 would be a matter of life or death, food or starvation, shelter or homelessness. Meanwhile, there ARE people out there who desperately need that check. Holding up this bill any longer will hurt so many people, businesses, hospitals, and schools. I get the feeling that some people are trying to create more of controversy than actually exists in the real world. Sure feels like an overreaction.

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
102. Yes. Some beyond doubt.
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 09:21 PM
Mar 2021

Right now I'm suspecting shockingly unrealistic overreaction might be real in some few perniciously manipulated into believing all things were possible if we chose, only to have Biden and company prove they still just want to screw the nation over and keep children in poverty. Oh, well. Regrettable, but has to be their problem.

We're doing good after all. Every day's more of the giant to-do list hit.

PatSeg

(53,214 posts)
106. Yes, this administration is off to a great start
Thu Mar 4, 2021, 10:53 AM
Mar 2021

and things are really looking hopeful right now. This particular issue will be forgotten in a few weeks. Not everyone will get everything they want, but clearly not everyone understands how government and legislating works. Of course, there are always some who will make a lot of noise no matter how things are going.

qazplm135

(7,654 posts)
94. 1400 bucks
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 08:28 PM
Mar 2021

ain't changing that particular hypothetical reality. It barely makes a dent in it.

And you've provided no evidence that even the average person who is single and makes 80K or more a year is:

without savings
Has no meaningful possessions

1400 helps neither of those things.

1400 buys some things sure, and for that reason alone, for the stimulus value, it has merit and I certainly was in favor of it.

But the argument that those who make 80K to 100K are somehow just eking by (but apparently once you make 100K it's champagne and caviar?), sorry, not buying it. It's an arbitrary cutoff, just like 100K was, but no one was complaining about 100K too much because it seems like a big enough number and we love round numbers.

If you are talking 40-60? Yeah, 1400 can make a difference. It's a rent check for a lot of those people. Or a 2-3 months of car payments. Or a year of insurance or cable/internet. 80? Most people at 80 to 100 are not one paycheck away from oblivion. And if they are, then why stop at 100?

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
103. Well, this is also meant to be stimulus, and some dollars
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 09:25 PM
Mar 2021

shaved off the top won't keep it from stimulating. The more straightened the circumstances, likely the more of the stimulus will be spent locally.

You know, the point isn't all about the expenses higher earners tend to have. There's something also fucked up in just assuming the counter people who serve them should pay to keep them in residences they can't possibly afford, so they don't have to rent out their extra bedrooms to strangers or (gasp) down-scale to the kind of affordable rentals the service workers live in.

Most people do want to take care of themselves. One of the biggest problems has been uncertainty, lack of information about what's best to do. In the last year a lot of people would have finished up their leases, packed up, and moved back with family in Elko IF they'd had any idea how long this would last. They would have taken the empty unit in a favorite waitress's building. Instead, the Republicans were telling them it never started and kicked the "it'll be over by" can from holiday to holiday, opening and closing all year long.

PatSeg

(53,214 posts)
105. If someone is making $80,000 (or $160,000 for a couple)
Thu Mar 4, 2021, 10:47 AM
Mar 2021

and they are eking by, then I think they need to reconsider their life choices. Like you said, I cannot see how $1400 would make a big difference to these people and it is possible it wouldn't even get spent, which is the purpose of a stimulus.

lagomorph777

(30,613 posts)
23. Yup. The average voter is far more interested in their own pocketbook, than any
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 03:44 PM
Mar 2021

macroeconomic voodoo. Such voodoo has always been used to benefit billionaires and disadvantage the disadvantaged.

 

liskddksil

(2,753 posts)
25. Yep, Republicans are already tearing into us for this
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 03:55 PM
Mar 2021



Meanwhile, all we can do is mock how bad we are at negotioting.



qazplm135

(7,654 posts)
45. lol
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 05:31 PM
Mar 2021

no one cares what Marco freaking Rubio says. Republicans don't even care what he says.

Autumn

(48,962 posts)
88. Guarantee it voters will care when they use this later when the 22 and 24 campaigns ramp up.
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 08:07 PM
Mar 2021

qazplm135

(7,654 posts)
91. no
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 08:16 PM
Mar 2021

they won't. There are three and a half years of other things good and bad that will happen between now and then.

qazplm135

(7,654 posts)
100. nah
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 09:06 PM
Mar 2021

right wingers will remember to try to use it as some sort of lame attack, and left wingers will remain to try to use it to attack Dems. The vast majority will look at the next three years and ultimately decide based on where they are economically, socially and safety wise when they walk into the voting booth.

But if you want to believe this dooms everything for Dems, feel free.

Doremus

(7,273 posts)
72. This is the point that gets me. How stupid do we have to be to capitulate ANYTHING to them?
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 06:05 PM
Mar 2021

Is there some kind of rule that we can only negotiate downward from zero? We are patsies!!

George II

(67,782 posts)
54. Nobody knows that. The proposal was just released an hour or two ago AND it's not final.
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 05:43 PM
Mar 2021

Has anyone, ANYONE, read the final bill yet?

regnaD kciN

(27,639 posts)
34. A stimulus bill guaranteed to piss off anyone who gets cut off...
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 04:21 PM
Mar 2021

...because of our "compromises" with Manchin. Especially if, as noted above, they got relief from bills passed under Trump, but not this one under Biden.

This could seriously be enough to cost us both chambers of Congress in 2022.

Cha

(319,076 posts)
57. "Moderates" are the Reason we Won
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 05:50 PM
Mar 2021
the House in 2018 and Saved Democracy!

Which some conveniently ignore.

grantcart

(53,061 posts)
79. These moderates in States like WV and AZ are occupying a seat that has been red.
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 06:30 PM
Mar 2021

I like AOC but it's easy to be for everything when you sit in pure blue districts where the only issue is a primary.

jorgevlorgan

(11,098 posts)
26. More helpful than Manchin and Sinema, that's for sure.
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 03:59 PM
Mar 2021

Also more helpful than any other democrat keeping their mouth shut about our side giving into the extremism of the right, and doing little to help people right now.

Magoo48

(6,721 posts)
37. No, she's not.
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 05:01 PM
Mar 2021

She is extremely helpful, a cool breath of fresh air blowing through stuffy, stagnant doldrums of moderate, lethargic disconnect.

Autumn

(48,962 posts)
87. She's more helpful and realistic than any other politician. If you think that this won't piss off
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 08:02 PM
Mar 2021

people you are wrong. This is a big deal and it will have blow back. Deny all you want but AOC has warned the party.

 

JohnSJ

(98,883 posts)
4. What doesn't she understand? Let me make this simple, Manchin, and a couple of other
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 03:20 PM
Mar 2021

Democratic Senators. The implication that she seems to want to include Biden in the blame game, only demonstrates she has a naivety on how the Senate works when you only have a one vote tie breaker, and not every Senator is on the same page






 

liskddksil

(2,753 posts)
5. Its not just Manchin sabotoging this. Jeanne Sheehan and other "moderates" wanted this change
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 03:22 PM
Mar 2021

which only puts our majority in peril 2022, when people who got Trump checks don't get Biden checks, and no longer consider the Democrats a viable voting option.

mdelaguna

(471 posts)
13. There has gotta be a workaround ...
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 03:32 PM
Mar 2021

what do Bernie and AOC (who I agree with) suggest? Is there a back door way to help the excluded?

 

liskddksil

(2,753 posts)
15. The only way is for the congressional progressives to announce they will not vote for
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 03:34 PM
Mar 2021

this in its current form, and force them back to the table.

jorgevlorgan

(11,098 posts)
31. I wonder if they will just take out the parts overruled by the parliamentarian
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 04:06 PM
Mar 2021

...from the original house bill they passed. Pass it again, and say "take it or leave it."

leftstreet

(40,680 posts)
20. Some bold Dems need to threaten to vote it down
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 03:40 PM
Mar 2021

Everyone fixates on the revolving Manchins and Sinemas, etc refusing to go along unless the good stuff is removed, blah, blah, blah

Instead a handful of Dems need to threaten to refuse a vote until the good stuff is put back in

 

JohnSJ

(98,883 posts)
18. Yes. That is why I referenced a generic couple of other Democratic Senators, also in my statement
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 03:38 PM
Mar 2021

This isn't on Biden though, this is on those Senators, and the reality there is very little that can be done unless we have more of a majority in the Senate.

As for your speculation that this puts our majority in peril in 2022, I don't agree. Those that voted for Biden in 2020, most of those folks will be voting for Democratic representatives in 2021. By representatives I am generically referring to both the Senate and House, though we are at more of a disadvantage in the House to redistricting. Anyone that is the way I see it.

There are more issues than just a one-time check. Unemployment Insurance extension is far more important, freeze on rent evictions, forbearance on mortgages, getting the pandemic under control, getting people back to work, etc.


moonscape

(5,722 posts)
86. But they did not get 1400 under
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 07:53 PM
Mar 2021

Trump either, and not a single republican will vote for 1400 for anyone. The problem here is that we need to own the messaging.

 

JohnSJ

(98,883 posts)
22. He said he would try, but that ended the moment they countered with a 600 billion package
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 03:41 PM
Mar 2021

Manchin doesn't care. He isn't up for re-election, and he likes the power he has right now. The best way to deal with that is get a larger majority in the Senate, because Manchin is not going to change


George II

(67,782 posts)
67. Could anyone do a better job as President than Biden? Why the immediate negative connotation?
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 06:02 PM
Mar 2021
 

wellst0nev0ter

(7,509 posts)
76. If Biden had better coattails during the election, we wouldn't be having this conversation
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 06:18 PM
Mar 2021

PatSeg

(53,214 posts)
84. I honestly can't imagine any president doing a better job than Biden
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 07:26 PM
Mar 2021

I've never seen anything like it in my lifetime, though I suppose it might be compared to FDR's first 100 days.

If he had a magic wand, he could get more, but the expectations of some are unrealistic and totally unfair. Our opponents are probably enjoying all this inexplicable outrage.

Cuthbert Allgood

(5,339 posts)
114. It's about what he said he'd do.
Thu Mar 4, 2021, 12:29 PM
Mar 2021

People here were certain that Biden was better than anyone else because he could get the bipartisan work done and the Republicans would just fight against anything anyone more left than Biden wanted to do. But, hey, surprise, he's not getting the bipartisan work done. And if you don't think he inability to get things done (you know, like his promise that if Georgia senate seats went blue the $2000 would be in the mail) isn't going to be brought up ad nauseam, you're fooling yourself.

 

liskddksil

(2,753 posts)
29. No, the Democrats are the ones who negotiated this change. Republicans are already
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 04:04 PM
Mar 2021

using this against us.


treestar

(82,383 posts)
40. The Rubio statements doesn't even make sense
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 05:18 PM
Mar 2021

At any rate, if the Rs won't go along, that's on them.

qazplm135

(7,654 posts)
47. just so I'm clear
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 05:37 PM
Mar 2021

the dividing line between rich and not rich is 160K v 200K for a couple?

What's the science on that one?

George II

(67,782 posts)
59. Oh so now even Marco Rubio is better than our Democrats? By the way, do you even know what....
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 05:51 PM
Mar 2021

....the actual "change" is? I don't think anyone really does yet.

 

liskddksil

(2,753 posts)
60. I'm just commenting on what's reported now in case its not to late to make things right nt
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 05:52 PM
Mar 2021

PatSeg

(53,214 posts)
89. Marco Rubio's opinion is hardly relevant
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 08:09 PM
Mar 2021

here and $160,000 is a hell of a lot of money almost anywhere in the United States. Why are you even posting that? No one at Democratic Underground cares what Marco Rubio's thoughts on the stimulus checks are. He will criticize the bill regardless of what is in it.

Celerity

(54,407 posts)
95. 160K, once income tax at state and federal levels, property taxes,
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 08:40 PM
Mar 2021

medical insurance/pharma/healthcare costs, childcare care costs, utilities/transportation costs, mortgage costs food, and if applicable, student loan costs for multiple people is HARDLY a hell of a lot of money for MANY families of 4 or 5 living in a large metro area, especially on the coasts.

ludicrous to claim that it is

If you live in NJ and are a family of 4 with 2 minors, for example, and own your own house, just income tax at all levels, property tax (insane rates there) healthcare total costs (and thta is assuming no catastrophic conditions), and an average mortage wipes out around 100K or so of that 160K, more than likely.

That still leaves student loans (will likely be a large combined payment per month at that AGI), utilities, all transportation costs (including fuel and likely car payments), all childcare costs, dental, food, clothing, etc etc. All that is coming out of the 50, 60K. Oh, and I left out any retirement savings as well.

Plus.. COVID has likely taken a chunk out of their collective balance sheet.

Yes! That family is just swimming in your 'helll of a lot of money'.. NOT

PatSeg

(53,214 posts)
104. Only 8% of American households
Thu Mar 4, 2021, 10:36 AM
Mar 2021

make between $150,000 and $200,000 a year. To the vast majority of Americans, that is considered affluent and they would be viewed as a privileged minority. $160,000 can hardly be viewed as struggling middle class when 80% of American households are making less. Maybe it is not as well off as some people believe, but it is more than many people could ever dream of and for those people $1400 could be what keeps a family from ending up homeless.

Celerity

(54,407 posts)
107. Now you are moving the goalposts. I stand 100% behind my analysis and I
Thu Mar 4, 2021, 11:04 AM
Mar 2021

Last edited Thu Mar 4, 2021, 08:08 PM - Edit history (1)

am done here, sorry. 17 million people are arsed out now in terms of COVID cheques thanks to Manchin, Shaheen, and Sinema's little stunt. 12 or so million of those are old enough to be voters, the remainder are children of those voters. The entire cost of just keeping the cutoffs the same as the Rump cheques is only 12 billion usd, a drop in the bucket.

This is a completely self-inflicted wound. My cousin im Los Angeles is just furious. I finally talked her into voting for the first time (she is extraordinarily non political, hates it, her go is 'they all lies, they all never do what they say they will do') She is going from what would have been (under the old formula) 1150 usd to now getting zero, and she just got her hours slashed dramatically at her firm for the next two months. I probably have lost her for good as a voter. Thank fuck she is in a deep blue district in a deep bkue state. Many of those 17 million people are not.

You seem to have no clue how expensive life is nowadays in a major US metropolis.

PatSeg

(53,214 posts)
110. Actually I do know
Thu Mar 4, 2021, 11:25 AM
Mar 2021

and that is also why I cannot see how $1400 would make a big difference to most of these people.

I understand there are going to be different opinions on this and I appreciate your point of view. I also know that not everyone will get what they want. I am very unhappy with the Democrats who have opposed the bill, but I also knew it wouldn't be easy. Manchin and Sinema are going to be a thorn in our side until we can get a larger majority in the senate. I honestly don't know what happened with Shaheen who is one of my senators. I'm trying to find out right now.

Sorry, I really wasn't trying to pick a fight.

Celerity

(54,407 posts)
111. I do not want to fight either. I just think this was a self-inflicted wound that certainly doesn't
Thu Mar 4, 2021, 12:05 PM
Mar 2021

help us in 2022 and 2024. The same can likely be said of other blockages to come.

again sorry if I came across too aggressively

Hugz,

Cel

PatSeg

(53,214 posts)
112. I think we are still going through withdrawal
Thu Mar 4, 2021, 12:16 PM
Mar 2021

after the last four years of outrage 24/7. Its nice to be able to debate about real substantive issues for a change, rather than anticipating the demise of civilization. I think I can live with these kinds of disagreements.

Celerity

(54,407 posts)
121. I forgot to ask, you're in NH, what are the odds (given our shit record in first midterms for Dem
Thu Mar 4, 2021, 07:02 PM
Mar 2021

POTUS's, in 1994 and 2010 especially) that Sununu beats Hassan in 2022 if he runs? IF he doesn't run, who would be the worst (in terms of losing to) that could/would run against her?

NH, GA (Warnock), NV (especially if Sandoval runs v Cortez Masto), and AZ with Kelly (dodged a bullet with Ducey refusing to run) are the most 'at risk' Dem Senate races in 2022

Wild card is if Leahy retires and the very popular (he won re-election by 41%) Rethug Governor Phil Scott runs, it might be a dogfight

PatSeg

(53,214 posts)
122. Honestly, I was surprised that Sununu
Thu Mar 4, 2021, 07:23 PM
Mar 2021

won reelection as governor. Perhaps his Democratic opponent was not a strong enough candidate, plus he seemed to handle the pandemic well. I think Hassan is pretty popular here, but being I am not originally from New Hampshire, I don't always have a feel for the politics. It is a pretty odd mix of voters.

Both Hassan and Shaheen have been governor and are well liked, but there is also a very right-wing element here, the "Live Free or Die" folks. I just don't know how much of the electorate they represent.

PatSeg

(53,214 posts)
124. It is funny how many states elect Democrats
Thu Mar 4, 2021, 07:47 PM
Mar 2021

to national office, but are ruled at home by republicans. Too many voters don't pay close attention to state and local races and often regret it later.

Celerity

(54,407 posts)
125. it so fucks us in terms of gerrymandering at state and federal levels and running elections as well
Thu Mar 4, 2021, 07:59 PM
Mar 2021

Response to Tommymac (Reply #32)

George II

(67,782 posts)
50. Why is it acceptable to "call out Democrats" especially when they're praising trump in the process?
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 05:41 PM
Mar 2021

Response to George II (Reply #50)

George II

(67,782 posts)
55. The number of people not getting a check is virtually zero, this is a proposal to scale down....
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 05:47 PM
Mar 2021

....the amount of the checks starting at the HIGH END of income earners.

Even so, it is acceptable to praise trump over our Democrats in the process? Surely a more sensible and less offensive analogy could be presented.

 

liskddksil

(2,753 posts)
58. Where did I praise Trump? I'm just doing math
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 05:51 PM
Mar 2021

Voter in suburban Georgia district we need on our side to keep our majorities in 2022, who misses the cut off this time and was promised $2,000 when they went to vote in January

$600 Trump check
$0 Biden check
----
Not $2000

Who do you think they're going to blame?

dansolo

(5,387 posts)
119. Your math is wrong
Thu Mar 4, 2021, 01:25 PM
Mar 2021

The people affected by this did not get a $600 "Trump" check. Above $75000/$150000 the amount was reduced down to where it became 0 at $100000/$200000. Anyone who got the full $600 will be eligible to receive the full $1400 in this package.

Traildogbob

(13,018 posts)
64. Simple solution.
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 05:56 PM
Mar 2021

Send zero checks to constituents of Ron Johnson and those opposed to helping anyone. They get their way, money is saved and elections will have consequences.

Traildogbob

(13,018 posts)
116. Just registered republicans.
Thu Mar 4, 2021, 12:54 PM
Mar 2021

They voted for them to do as they are doing. Over 85 percent completely agree. Elections have consequences. There words!

Traildogbob

(13,018 posts)
118. If all the
Thu Mar 4, 2021, 01:05 PM
Mar 2021

Republicans that vote for the Johnsons, Cawthorns, Cruz’s, Hawleys and GYM Jordan’s, call and “demand” the support relief for other than billionaires or they are gone, that would be a start. States with huge majority republicans have the power to force action. The problem is most agree with Russian Ron and love he owns the libs, even to their own detriment.

Traildogbob

(13,018 posts)
120. Look, realistically
Thu Mar 4, 2021, 01:33 PM
Mar 2021

There are no easy fixes for this situation. I live in a state that gave us Tillis, Cawthorn, Burr and Meadows for gods sake. West of Asheville, a blue paradise, but step a foot outside city limits, it is Scarlett blood red. Poor as hell, and damn sure needs help. But all bow to Trump and those fools they put in. My county just told us property taxes will be raised 30-50 percent this year after the re-eval. That is based on new homes. Those homes are Florida seasonal multimillion fall or play houses that exploded after The Trump tax giveaway gave cash out the ass to the extremely wealthy and this is where the invested.
We have been told by judges that we are no longer considered a Democracy because of Gerry mandering and vote suppression. Yet these fools will blame Biden and vote all red 2022 and vote Trump 2024.
Fixing this deep stupid will take a decades.
But we can’t help most people with $1,400 of THIER taxes.
Most of these million dollar play house folks, pay less taxes than these lower middle class people voting for this crap.
Wish you best, hope the Dems get the minimal help to us, even the fools.

electric_blue68

(26,856 posts)
71. Maybe she could have said it differently but I agree...
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 06:04 PM
Mar 2021

that not sending checks to everyone who got one is not good.

They could do that for a third one possibly after having a press conference explaining why. OTOH maybe even a third one should stay the same. Not completely sure.

I just know that we have to hold on to The Senate, and The House if at all possible in 2022!!!

Everytime the Repuglicans run up the deficit by either running it up directly, or indirectly by lowering taxes us Dems get "stuck" with the outcome. 😐

We should NOT be bullied by The Rethuglicans bullshit!
😠😠😠


And I did call my Senator - Sen Schumer. 👍

 

liskddksil

(2,753 posts)
81. Unlikely she can stop the train at this point, but 12 million people who should be
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 06:48 PM
Mar 2021

getting checks, many in cities with higher cost of living, will not because of the change today.

betsuni

(29,078 posts)
101. Tweet threads blaming Biden/Democrats because zero Republican votes
Wed Mar 3, 2021, 09:14 PM
Mar 2021

and just 60 Senate votes making compromise inevitable, as it was with the ACA. Why blame Democrats for Republican obstruction?

I don't understand AOC's statement.

BusyBeingBest

(9,173 posts)
108. If it's a stimulus payment, give it to as many people as fiscally possible.
Thu Mar 4, 2021, 11:08 AM
Mar 2021

Don't care if the truly wealthy get it, there aren't enough of them to matter. Hopefully they'll donate it.

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