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Pluvious

(4,303 posts)
Wed Mar 10, 2021, 01:37 PM Mar 2021

Salon: "...interesting theory about Donald Trump and Lindsey Graham's relationship"

Of all the theories we've pondered, this is the most intriguing...

...

The theory was broken down by former acting Solicitor General Neal Katyal, who was interviewed on MSNBC to answer questions about Fulton County District Attorney Fani Willis hiring racketeering expert John Floyd for the investigation into whether Donald Trump and Sen. Lindsey Graham, R-SC, may have violated the law with efforts to overturn the election results in Georgia.

...

"And here Trump does have a defense," he continued. "What he's going to say is 'I wasn't falsifying information, I genuinely believed I had won the election.' Now ordinarily, that kind of defense wouldn't pass the smell test, but when you're dealing with delusion of grandeur Donald, maybe he's got a defense there."

"The investigation is not just about Trump. It's also about Lindsey Graham, Rudy Giuliani, the former U.S. Attorney, Mr. Byung Pak and some others," he said. "And any of those folks can flip on Trump."

"And I heard you in last segment talking about Lindsey Graham, why is he still palling around with Donald Trump? Well, one shouldn't rule out . . . the possibility that he might be palling around with Donald Trump, because he's hoping Trump will let something slip that Lindsey Graham can use in exchange for a deal."


https://www.salon.com/2021/03/09/a-washington-insider-has-an-interesting-theory-about-donald-trump-and-lindsey-grahams-relationship_partner/
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Salon: "...interesting theory about Donald Trump and Lindsey Graham's relationship" (Original Post) Pluvious Mar 2021 OP
Or pay him off. marble falls Mar 2021 #1
What a lovely bunch of people. Dark n Stormy Knight Mar 2021 #2
Graham is too afraid of the Trump base to turn on him. Lindsay is no hero. dem4decades Mar 2021 #3
That's the simplest explanation and is consistent with evidence. spooky3 Mar 2021 #18
I agree but what Neal Katyal just did was put some doubts into Bev54 Mar 2021 #35
Doesn't explain why he fell for drumpf in the first place soothsayer Mar 2021 #4
Thank you! Mike 03 Mar 2021 #6
Exactly. And Graham changed his tune about Trump LONG before the 2020 election Taylor Picker Mar 2021 #8
If T***p has any kompromat on Lindsey leftieNanner Mar 2021 #22
If drumpf and v putin have kompromat on Lindsey, he already knows what it is soothsayer Mar 2021 #23
Good Point leftieNanner Mar 2021 #25
Great point. I'd love to know his motives here soothsayer Mar 2021 #27
Remember back to 2016 The Wizard Mar 2021 #29
He's a real a-hole isn't he soothsayer Mar 2021 #32
I have a feeling that DENVERPOPS Mar 2021 #26
+1, ... or worse, Graham is a true believer uponit7771 Mar 2021 #38
they are more than golf buddies. They are bearded dragon breeders. Trueblue1968 Mar 2021 #31
It's a horny toad !!!!!!!!!!!!! DENVERPOPS Mar 2021 #41
ha ha ha ... donnie and lindsay are horny toads. lol Trueblue1968 Mar 2021 #45
Nah DENVERPOPS Mar 2021 #47
+1, Graham was hugging on Putin's Whore from the start uponit7771 Mar 2021 #37
Sorry, DENVERPOPS Mar 2021 #40
That's all there is. Mike 03 Mar 2021 #5
"let something slip" - if Lindsey flips for *any* reason, Drumpf will unload on him in an INSTANT! UTUSN Mar 2021 #7
That would be a nice theory, FoxNewsSucks Mar 2021 #9
Salon is kind of getting embarrassing Mike 03 Mar 2021 #10
Well, Katyal's speculation that Graham could be trying to increase his value Hortensis Mar 2021 #11
The turning point for Graham's about face on Trump seems to have come on a visit to Mar-a-Lago OAITW r.2.0 Mar 2021 #12
Hm, yes. Graham was only one of several who abandoned his Hortensis Mar 2021 #17
Fanciful nonsense greenjar_01 Mar 2021 #13
I don't buy it. I don't think Lindsey is that clever. Goodheart Mar 2021 #14
Meh...my only "interest" is in taking them both down... Wounded Bear Mar 2021 #15
Whatever dirt Trump has on Lindsey must be spectacular. keithbvadu2 Mar 2021 #16
There is only ONE thing DENVERPOPS Mar 2021 #30
And they have it ScratchCat Mar 2021 #33
Bingo, your last line DENVERPOPS Mar 2021 #42
Epstein. They are all pedophiles. They don't hang out together FlyingPiggy Mar 2021 #46
That makes sense because I believe trump has the goods on Graham, his 180 degree after one round Escurumbele Mar 2021 #19
So a delusional person can act on whatever delusion beliefs they have? PoindexterOglethorpe Mar 2021 #20
I think everyone looks for a lot of stuff that just isnt there. oldsoftie Mar 2021 #21
Yes, I heard Neal Katyal say that last night. msfiddlestix Mar 2021 #24
To repurpose a meme in response to these theories: Salviati Mar 2021 #28
Probably both are trying to gather Kompromat. lagomorph777 Mar 2021 #34
It's a Burns/Smithers relationship Disaffected Mar 2021 #36
It is hard to figure out a logical reason for Graham's actions karynnj Mar 2021 #39
Nah. Graham is just a stupid racist two faced southern 'gentleman'. Tommymac Mar 2021 #43
Trump knew they were going to lose before election day - that's why they cancelled the Lucinda Mar 2021 #44

spooky3

(34,387 posts)
18. That's the simplest explanation and is consistent with evidence.
Wed Mar 10, 2021, 03:02 PM
Mar 2021

So parsimony says you’re right.

Bev54

(10,028 posts)
35. I agree but what Neal Katyal just did was put some doubts into
Wed Mar 10, 2021, 04:41 PM
Mar 2021

the former guy's head, should he hear about his comments. That will put them both on egg shells. The Lincoln Project split Pence and former guy maybe this will split him and Graham.

Mike 03

(16,616 posts)
6. Thank you!
Wed Mar 10, 2021, 01:52 PM
Mar 2021


This isn't "the most intriguing" theory -- it doesn't even rise to the level of being a theory.

Taylor Picker

(3,572 posts)
8. Exactly. And Graham changed his tune about Trump LONG before the 2020 election
Wed Mar 10, 2021, 01:58 PM
Mar 2021

or the attempts to overturn Georgia.

leftieNanner

(15,051 posts)
22. If T***p has any kompromat on Lindsey
Wed Mar 10, 2021, 03:17 PM
Mar 2021

Then the inference here is that he is keeping his ears open so he can negate that kompromat and free himself.

That's the way I read it.

soothsayer

(38,601 posts)
23. If drumpf and v putin have kompromat on Lindsey, he already knows what it is
Wed Mar 10, 2021, 03:26 PM
Mar 2021

Plus, in the case at hand, Lindsey’s attempts to interfere in the election aren’t on tape, and Drumpf’s are. So drumpf needs Lindsey, and not vice versa.

Idk why Linds is dazzled by a guy he used to badmouth. Simping fanboy. It’s embarrassing.

leftieNanner

(15,051 posts)
25. Good Point
Wed Mar 10, 2021, 03:35 PM
Mar 2021

I don't know why ANYONE likes Drumpf, but one would think that Lindsey is smart enough to know that #45 is a toxic lunatic.

The Wizard

(12,527 posts)
29. Remember back to 2016
Wed Mar 10, 2021, 04:01 PM
Mar 2021

when Trump broadcast Graham's cell phone number on TV. that was a shot across the bow.

DENVERPOPS

(8,780 posts)
26. I have a feeling that
Wed Mar 10, 2021, 03:54 PM
Mar 2021

the reason Trump, Lindsay, and several other of them are all complicit in this mess, is that Putin has 8 x 10 Color glossies of THEM ALL involved in the "same activity" at some point in the past. Putin has Kompromat he has been collecting for decades on Trump and other potential politicians that he felt he might be able to use in the future.

Trueblue1968

(17,184 posts)
31. they are more than golf buddies. They are bearded dragon breeders.
Wed Mar 10, 2021, 04:05 PM
Mar 2021

say isn't this darling ..... i found it yesterday on twitter. now i want a beared dragon !!!!!
what a sweet little lizard dude. lol lol lol



DENVERPOPS

(8,780 posts)
41. It's a horny toad !!!!!!!!!!!!!
Wed Mar 10, 2021, 05:54 PM
Mar 2021

At one time, about 60 years ago us kids could go to any vacant lot in Denver, catch one, play with it and then let it go.

I haven't seen one since, anywhere around Denver........Horny Toads and a bunch of other nature things that are long gone......

DENVERPOPS

(8,780 posts)
40. Sorry,
Wed Mar 10, 2021, 05:51 PM
Mar 2021

but up until that weekend with Trump, he was known for totally trashing Trump more than any other RepubliCON at that time.

He went to golf and dinner, and on Monday about the time of the first impeachment getting ready for a vote, he was shouting Trump being wonderful, with every ass kissing adjective you can think of in front of the entire press corps and hasn't stopped since.

At first I thought that he was shown a color glossy of him with someone of the same gender. But then I thought, and that would't be enough, everybody knows he's gay.....Then I thought, it's not only Graham but a whole bunch of Repub Senators willing to go out of their way to kiss Trump's ring. What one thing could make them all so overwhelmingly subservient and submissive to Trump. What Kompromat could Putin possibly have on all of them.....something that would immediately destroy them ...Think about it..............

Mike 03

(16,616 posts)
5. That's all there is.
Wed Mar 10, 2021, 01:51 PM
Mar 2021

Katyal doesn't elaborate in any way beyond that speculation.

In four years, Graham hasn't come into any knowledge he can use to make a deal? So he's hoping Trump will slip up now?

I really like Katyal but this sounds like more wishful thinking. Also, it doesn't explain the last four years of the relationship between Graham and Trump. I think Woodward is right that the pilot fish theory of Graham is going to turn out to be correct.

FoxNewsSucks

(10,406 posts)
9. That would be a nice theory,
Wed Mar 10, 2021, 02:01 PM
Mar 2021

but it's far more likely that Putin shared enough dirt on Leningrad Lindsey with MF45 to keep him in line.

Mike 03

(16,616 posts)
10. Salon is kind of getting embarrassing
Wed Mar 10, 2021, 02:03 PM
Mar 2021

Lindsey Graham is a lot like the character Tom Ripley in the movie The Talented Mr. Ripley.

He selects people he thinks are powerful, idealized figures and wants to become them and vicariously share their power by hanging around them and becoming their best friends.

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
11. Well, Katyal's speculation that Graham could be trying to increase his value
Wed Mar 10, 2021, 02:12 PM
Mar 2021

to the feds definitely seems interesting coming from him.

So does the theory of ex- fed prosecutor Glen Kirschner that when Russia hacked Graham's own emails it found kompromat used to compel Graham's allegiance to Trump. It was apparently after the hack that Graham did an about face and turned into a Trump sycophant.

Steve Schmidt's "pilot fish" analogy seems too apt not to be true.

Quite possibly they're all true.

And who knows what else? It seems likely that Russia, and other adversaries, developed kompromat on almost any person they chose in the Trump and McConnell/McCarthy's circles, and a good number in the media.

OAITW r.2.0

(24,255 posts)
12. The turning point for Graham's about face on Trump seems to have come on a visit to Mar-a-Lago
Wed Mar 10, 2021, 02:28 PM
Mar 2021

to play golf with Trump. It would be interesting to see a review of tweets/public comment by Graham before and after this meeting. It was a pretty abrupt change in his tune, as I recall.

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
17. Hm, yes. Graham was only one of several who abandoned his
Wed Mar 10, 2021, 02:49 PM
Mar 2021

dignity, reputation, and legacy to put on bizarre public displays of support. Abrupt personality changes that astonished all who knew them.

Some, like Jonathan Turley, maintained superficially respectable postures for those who didn't care what they were saying, but others, like Dershowitz and Giuliani, and of course Graham, behaved more like frenetic circus dogs forced to do tricks in clown costumes.

Goodheart

(5,307 posts)
14. I don't buy it. I don't think Lindsey is that clever.
Wed Mar 10, 2021, 02:36 PM
Mar 2021

He's just a pathetic suckup. It's FAR more likely that trump has kompromat on that disgusting creature.

keithbvadu2

(36,622 posts)
16. Whatever dirt Trump has on Lindsey must be spectacular.
Wed Mar 10, 2021, 02:49 PM
Mar 2021

Whatever dirt Trump has on Lindsey must be spectacular.

DENVERPOPS

(8,780 posts)
30. There is only ONE thing
Wed Mar 10, 2021, 04:02 PM
Mar 2021

that Putin and Trump could have on all these Republican Senators that would doom the Senators and Trump in an instant................And the Senators would do absolutely anything on earth to appease Trump and keep it from being revealed.........

ScratchCat

(1,975 posts)
33. And they have it
Wed Mar 10, 2021, 04:16 PM
Mar 2021

Its very obvious. They have it. On Graham for sure. Trump showed him when they played golf. Then LG went from NeverTrump to Lap Dog in the after press conference like you flipped a switch. They invited all those other guys to Moscow to get to them to. No doubt. Underage hookers are the calling card of Russian blackmail schemes.

DENVERPOPS

(8,780 posts)
42. Bingo, your last line
Wed Mar 10, 2021, 06:14 PM
Mar 2021

Pictures of all the Senators in compromising photos with underage girls, (OR BOYS) is the only thing that could frighten them that much......THAT would destroy them immediately. Period. "Adult" Hookers are no big deal, as Trump and others have proven.

I can't remember the master pervert's name who was the "child/minor female entertainment organizer" for everyone important who was recently whacked in prison? What video, photos, or diary do you think he kept as insurance to protect himself in case he ever needed it.....
His perverted female accomplice is hidden away by the Feds, but I am sure she is keeping her knowledge and participation as insurance to avoiding prison for life and a bargaining chip for no prosecution, and witness protection...........

FlyingPiggy

(3,376 posts)
46. Epstein. They are all pedophiles. They don't hang out together
Wed Mar 10, 2021, 09:37 PM
Mar 2021

Bc they love golf so much. It is sickening.

Escurumbele

(3,372 posts)
19. That makes sense because I believe trump has the goods on Graham, his 180 degree after one round
Wed Mar 10, 2021, 03:02 PM
Mar 2021

of golf is too suspicious, something happened during that round of golf that caused that "change of heart" in Graham...so, Graham may be trying to find something where he can make the situation even so that neither crook can spill the bean on the other.

PoindexterOglethorpe

(25,808 posts)
20. So a delusional person can act on whatever delusion beliefs they have?
Wed Mar 10, 2021, 03:10 PM
Mar 2021

Seems like those who hear voices telling them to kill some one ought to be let off, based on that.

oldsoftie

(12,480 posts)
21. I think everyone looks for a lot of stuff that just isnt there.
Wed Mar 10, 2021, 03:11 PM
Mar 2021

Graham is looking out for Graham; wanting more followers. Trying to get trumpers to like him. If there was really anything super salacious on him, SOMEONE would've found it out by now. Trump is no sleuth & none of the really good ones would work for him

msfiddlestix

(7,270 posts)
24. Yes, I heard Neal Katyal say that last night.
Wed Mar 10, 2021, 03:30 PM
Mar 2021

It's actually something I've considered in the past, maybe wearing a wire or some sort of undetected recording device.

But then, he'll say and do something so freakin' lame and assassine that it just can't be true.

karynnj

(59,492 posts)
39. It is hard to figure out a logical reason for Graham's actions
Wed Mar 10, 2021, 04:50 PM
Mar 2021

I thought I understood the reason he would be a toady before the election - though it means that he was completely willing to sell any integrity he had for over 3 years to avoid being primaryed. However, once he won AND Trump lost, one would think just staying quiet would be the best position for someone who cynically supported Trump for political reasons.

Oddly, it may be that he honestly belief his strange comment that there was both a dark side of Trump and magic. Magic that he did not see in other Republicans (and likely not Democrats.) I don't get the attraction, but a cursory look at RW Trump "art" that has been posted in threads here, there seems to be a prism that renders Trump into something he isn't - noble,strong, handsome, fit etc. I wonder if a similar prism exists that transforms his actions, personality and values to something acceptable to the people who follow him. I guess, as Graham did, you can call those prisms, magic. I prefer words like distortions, illusions or hallucination.

Just like others who fall prey to a cult, he seems to have forgotten everything he once claimed to believe in. All sacrificed to follow Trump.

As to getting something to "use" - I doubt it. How do you explain taking illegal actions after the election. It is true that having something to use might keep someone out of jail, but he could be censored or even pushed out of the Senate. Everything he did post election had to be for Trump - not a Senator just reelected for a 6 year term.

Tommymac

(7,263 posts)
43. Nah. Graham is just a stupid racist two faced southern 'gentleman'.
Wed Mar 10, 2021, 06:19 PM
Mar 2021

Knew a lot of males like him growing up in that part of the country back in the 1960's and 70's.

Stupid lazy narcissistic sycophants who pose under the false colors of 'old southern gentry' but in reality are modern self-serving southern white privileged stupid racist bigots.

Lucinda

(31,170 posts)
44. Trump knew they were going to lose before election day - that's why they cancelled the
Wed Mar 10, 2021, 09:04 PM
Mar 2021

election night party at the DC Trump hotel...

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