If you're going to concoct an Andrew Cuomo conspiracy theory, don't make it a lazy one...

[brooklynite]

Would you risk offering a bribe to a DEMOCRATIC Senior aide who had been hired and vetted by Cuomo and his team?

Would you increase the risk exponentially by offering bribes to SIX other women, also Demanding critic aides or well known members of the press?

Would you concoct this scheme 18 months before the election, allowing the Democratic Party to work out a transition to an untainted Lt Governor and potentially a stronger alternative candidate (Tish James) as opposed to waiting for the heat of the campaign season?

[tulipsandroses]

1. I'm waiting for the day that Atty Gen James will catch heat if she finds wrong doing

From the looks of things, I'm waiting for her to be disparaged for " bringing down another good dem"

[George II]

5. On the other hand the abuse directed toward her would be just as severe if she doesn't find anything

[radius777]

10. +1. The Rose Twitter mob that wants Cuomo's

head on a platter would soon be calling for hers.

[George II]

31. Yes. Don't forget, James was in a contentious primary with Zephyr Teachout in 2018.

[Percy]

11. Very true.

Murky waters -- hope we get to the real bottom of it all.

[tulipsandroses]

12. Somehow I doubt that. I see conspiracy theories about other dems already here

The amount of pretzeling and mental gymnastics going on is astounding. Sure there will be people disappointed. There are "winners and losers" when people take sides. There is a trajectory here already that predicts what may come next.

[Nixie]

14. +1. There already is an angry threat to primary some

who supposedly didn’t act fast enough. That is an admission that the process has some measurable and preconceived results in mind. No conspiracy theory is needed when they tell you upfront how they are going to get revenge.

[uponit7771]

21. +1

[pnwmom]

30. She's in an untenable position as long as the Governor continues to supervise

complainants and witnesses; he should not be in a position with the potential to coerce testimony or retaliate.

[George II]

32. So someone makes a complaint against someone else and before the investigation....

....the accused has to resign?

What if it's a situation where someone doesn't like his/her boss - make a complaint that may or may not be valid and the boss is fired or reassigned?

What happens if the investigation finds no wrongdoing, would Cuomo return to the position of Governor? That wouldn't happen, and as far as I know none of the complainants are still working for him, and there are scant few witnesses, if any - most have been one-on-one "incidents".

[pnwmom]

34. That's not what I said. He can take a temporary, paid leave. That's what the EEOC advises.

Asking an employee to take a transfer instead could be retaliatory. Plus, they probably do want to interview virtually all of his staff as potential witnesses, so just on a practical basis it makes sense for him to move aside.

Complainants aren't the only potential witnesses; other current staffers could be witnesses. But #7's incident was at the end of last year, when she broke down emotionally at a staff meeting. She's still working there.

[George II]

37. Are there any witnesses or just people who were told after the fact? From what I read....

...(and I haven't followed this closely until this week), the only incident that might have had a witness or two was the one on the plane, and that one was sketchy anyway ("we were facing each other and our knees touched"?) and the one at the wedding, an event when EVERYONE is hugging, pecking, touching one another.

Back when I was working, I was laid off and filed a complaint with the state agency and EEOC. It was age discrimination (I was told my job was "eliminated" but the day after I left it was filled with a much younger woman) After a year and a half I was given my job back, and reported to the SAME PERSON who laid me off in the first place.

[dsc]

38. So if that happened in my state

where I have a Dem Gov but insane GOP Lt Gov, all the GOP has to do here to get unified control is repeatedly accuse the governor of misconduct, have an investigation that takes say 3 weeks and we get unified GOP for 3 weeks, enough time to pass a budget, remove all powers from the governor, expand our Supreme Court (we have a one seat Dem majority), and then let him come back. If they need more time all they have to do is rinse and repeat.

[Sur Zobra]

20. Exactly this!

Wash, rinse, repeat

[madville]

2. Best guess is that people claiming

Best guess is that people claiming these women have all been paid are just trolls, pretty ridiculous at this point.

[Budi]

3. Haaaahaaa ha.

Let's talk conspiracy theories Okay?

What's the # at now?
Like 12?

Plenty of conspiracies flying around...
Jus sayin!

[Maru Kitteh]

4. The purge brigade is after you and your uncomfortable, logical

queries and observations. Just FYI.

[George II]

6. There appears to be a common thread connecting some if not all of the accusers as well as....

....some of the first to jump on the "resign" bandwagon.

What's the problem with waiting for the results of the investigation? Are they afraid the AG's office won't find anything?

Guilty or innocent, I'll be very disappointed if Cuomo is forced out of office before we know for sure.

[pnwmom]

8. The investigation is a waste of time, unless Cuomo steps aside while it takes place --

as the EEOC guidelines say a man in his position should do.

He is in a position to affect witness testimony, since staffers currently working for him will be among those questioned.

[Nixie]

13. What would be wrong with having a written account from

the accusers as in a police report? Is there worry they will perjure themselves or contradict themselves? I admit I’m a bit jaded by a current MeToo accuser who contradicted herself in writing. Why can’t they file police reports?

[pnwmom]

16. That wouldn't be the equivalent of a witness interview, where the investigator

can return to a witness to get more information, as needed. And there are witnesses beyond the women who may have been harassed themselves. What sort of written form would fit their situations? A witness wouldn't even know what to put in such a report; they wouldn't know what information the investigator would need to know, because that would depend on all the circumstances of the particular situation.

And all these witnesses would continue to be working for Cuomo. I'm amazed more people don't see that that's a problem, and why the EEOC's guidelines say the alleged abuser should be removed from supervising anyone involved in the investigation (and not the reverse.)

[Captain Zero]

35. EEOC. Everyone stays on their job until investigated.

If I recall the trainings correctly. Everyone stays on their job. Anyone who reports directly to Cuomo would be reassigned to report to someone else during the investigation. So you could determine someone working for Cuomo who is not accusing him and have the others report to that person.

Also all this is supposed to be done internally and within the organization. So I guess the people who no longer work there are free to go running off to the press, but the ones who work there are to report to HR AND it is to taken seriously and investigated.

[Nixie]

39. A police report from the accuser wouldn't affect witnesses.

It would be in addition to witnesses. One of the first accusers was contradicted by witnesses, so witnesses are not the only key. Someone’s written account can be just as informational as witnesses, especially when they contradict themselves.

[uponit7771]

22. This is false, plenty of valid investigations have happened with independent investigators with

... subpeona power

[pnwmom]

24. Not while the supervisor remains in a supervisory position over witnesses.

By the EEOC guidelines, he should resign.

[uponit7771]

28. This is false on its face, why push this ? INDEPENDENT investigators work . The ....

Last edited Sun Mar 14, 2021, 05:24 AM - Edit history (1)

... other side of what your claiming makes the process a punishment.

Accusations aren't convictions

[pnwmom]

29. You don't know what you're talking about. Having an independent investigator

doesn't obviate the need to prevent an accused manager from supervising complainants or witnesses.

https://www.democraticunderground.com/100215222985

[uponit7771]

50. What does a management structure have to do with validity of INDEPENDENT investigations?!

Do you have any facts to even connect independent investigation validaty with management structures ?!

Thx in advance

[Captain Zero]

36. Wrong I think. See my reply number 35 above

If they report to him they are reassigned to report to someone else.

[Budi]

9. Well, Trump will have a lighter step to his walk won't he?

Bets he's calling in favors. As. We. Speak.
~

[tulipsandroses]

15. What's the problem? Aside from the fact that I find his behavior abhorrent - based on Ms. Bennet's

case - which he half assed apologized for and clearly - whether he or his office "mishandled"

He's a wounded candidate going into the election cycle. He needs to give his successor breathing room to ensure dems retain the governorship. Polling already suggest people do not want him to run for another term. As a political strategy, its better to get rid of him now. Don't wait till near the end of his term to decide he's not going to run - meanwhile republicans will be bludgeoning dems with the harassment allegations, the nursing home coverups and reviving his prior scandals. I will say again, he first ran on cleaning up corruption in Albany. NY has a long history of corrupt politicians. Republicans and Democrats.
That's not a place Dems want to be, going into the election season next year. Having republicans beating them over the head with Cuomo scandals. How does that work for whomever is going to run? Not to mention the other races? These days, people tend to vote for a party, not just for a candidate. If Cuomo is seen as tainted. Its very possible all the Dems up for election next year will be seen as tainted if they don't have breathing room before the election. So from a political standpoint, its a losing strategy to keep him. I doubt he will win if he runs again. He needs to step aside so Dems hold on to the governorship.

I will also say again, it was at this point in his father's political career that he was beaten by a little known republican candidate. So although NY is a Dem stronghold, the tide can turn when people tire of you.

As far as the investigation, I find it highly odd, that his office did not follow its own rules and initiate an investigation when Ms. Bennett made her complaint last year. They simply transferred her. I'm not giving him credit for requesting an investigation now, when he should have requested one months ago.

[pnwmom]

17. I didn't know his office transferred Ms. Bennett. That goes against specific EEOC policy,

saying such an action can be viewed as retaliatory.

[tulipsandroses]

18. His office has said she got the transfer for a position she previously requested

Funny how that worked in such a timely manner after she made her complaint. The other important detail is this

Executive Order 187, which Cuomo signed, is clear: There should have been an investigation, and the onus is not on the victim to ask for one. Instead, Bennett was transferred, like Leah and Rita, and nothing was done to account for the abuse that occurred, or prevent future harms.
[link:https://www.democratandchronicle.com/story/opinion/voices/2021/03/11/andrew-cuomo-sexual-harassment-albany-workplace-safety-column/6940985002/|
Note this article is about the history of harassment in NY politics. (hence the mention of other women- not related to Cuomo)

[George II]

33. Until all these accusations suddenly appeared, the people of NY did not "tire of" Cuomo.....

....in February he had about the highest approval rating he ever had:

https://www.politico.com/states/new-york/albany/story/2021/02/22/cuomo-approval-drops-in-new-poll-but-remains-strong-1364870

Cuomo approval drops in new poll, but remains strong

By BILL MAHONEY 02/22/2021 05:43 PM EST

ALBANY — New York Gov. Andrew Cuomo's approval rating dropped modestly in recent weeks, according to a Morning Consult poll released on Monday. But it remains high compared with polls taken before the pandemic hit about a year ago.

As far as the Bennett accusation that, like most if not all of the others was a "one-on-one" situation with no witnesses:

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/02/27/nyregion/cuomo-charlotte-bennett-sexual-harassment.html

The woman, 25, said that when they were alone in his office, Gov. Andrew Cuomo asked if she “had ever been with an older man.”

[tulipsandroses]

40. You asked, what's the problem with waiting. I answered. We have an election to win. I am not going

back to where we were before this political crisis. We are here now. The best strategical way to deal with this to ensure we hold on to the governorship is to move on to the more viable candidate.

It is interesting that you are mounting a defense that even Gov Cuomo is not. He has never denied that what Ms Bennet said did not happen. Instead he has said, his actions were misinterpreted by her. In his apology letter he admitted to joking, getting too personal, being insensitive , acknowledging that given his position "he could have made people feel ways he never intended".


I'm not sure what people are not understanding here. In their quest to defend Cuomo, they want to flout the law and are starting to sound like trump sycophants

It's Against The Law
The NYC Human Rights Law, one of the strongest anti-discrimination laws in the nation, protects against discrimination based on gender, which includes sexual harassment. Under the Law, any unwanted sexual behavior is unlawful, including but not limited to touching, crude jokes, and lewd comments.

[link:https://www1.nyc.gov/site/cchr/media/sexual-harassment-campaign.page|

[George II]

42. It's a contrived "political crisis", quite possibly created by Cuomo's political adversaries....

If we force him to resign, they win.

[treestar]

57. Trump was "wounded" worse

We should not let this happen to our officeholders and candidates! Makes it too easy for the Republicans.

[Voltaire2]

45. "There appears to be a common thread connecting some if not all of the accusers.."

yeah the connection is that they all worked with Cuomo.

[George II]

46. That's not true, and you left out the second half of that sentence.

[Voltaire2]

47. yes it is true.

[George II]

48. One of them was a reporter.

[Voltaire2]

49. I leave it as an exercise for the reader to decide what

" connecting some if not all of the accusers " could possibly mean.

[pnwmom]

7. That's too much logic and common sense for many here to handle.

We'd be infinitely better off to run incumbent Gov. Kathy Hochul in 2022, than the guy who fudged the Covid numbers in the nursing homes and has been accused of taking liberties with his female staffers.

And who now pretends to welcome an investigation (knowing that all current staffers who might be called as witnesses are still working for him!)

[Demsrule86]

52. No, we would be better to run a person who we know can win a statewide race in New York.

I would bet the GOP have plans to take down the Lt. Governor as well. She ran with cuomo not alone. She will be pilloried as having known and taken no action closer to the election or who knows what else they will use. I would prefer a primary where the candidate shows they can win a statewide race. Don't kid yourself, a Republican can win New York under the right circumstances and we must be very careful.

[pnwmom]

55. Lt. Gov. Hochal won her statewide race by 24 points on her own right. This is from last September

before Cuomo's troubles.

Hochul's back as New York's campaign warrior

https://www.politico.com/states/new-york/albany/story/2020/09/30/hochuls-back-as-new-yorks-campaign-warrior-1319086

Hochul was briefly sidelined from her breakneck travel schedule during the peak of the coronavirus pandemic in New York, but she has now resumed a version of it — zipping around the state for economic development events and small business (re) openings. She’s maintained a newfound radio presence, conducting upwards of 400 media interviews since the start of the pandemic.

In recent months, a separate but equally loaded campaign schedule shows up alongside her daily events, though she is not running for anything in 2020. As her boss, Gov. Andrew Cuomo, remains close to home and focused on public health issues, the nation’s longest serving female lieutenant governor is the highest elected official rallying New York’s Democrats for November's elections.

State Democratic Chair Jay Jacobs said that’s part of the pair’s yin and yang, especially as Cuomo’s energy remains focused on maintaining control over the virus that ravaged the state earlier this spring and may yet do so again.

SNIP

Tom Perez, chair of the Democratic National Committee, described Hochul as a "force of nature," adding that "she has been essential to building a deep bench of strong Democratic leaders in New York State and across the country."

[Dem4Life1102]

19. Why let facts and logic get in the way

of a good conspiracy theory.

[uponit7771]

23. Or why risk letting the investigation conclude? ...and because b******* happened in the past

[pnwmom]

25. It's a sham investigation as long as he's in a position that allows him to

intimidate and retaliate against witnesses -- i.e., their supervisor.

[uponit7771]

27. No it's not, history shows different

[treestar]

58. So it is impossible for him to have any due process

geez.

Accusation alone is enough.

and yet it does not apply to Republicans.

Too bad, he still should get a chance to defend himself. Witnesses "could" be affected in any case of any type tried in any tribunal. we don't let that mean accusations are all it takes.

[pnwmom]

59. What does due process have to do with a political position supervising others?

The EEOC says that managers accused of harassment need to be separated from employees making the claims, and that can't be done by making all these potential-witness-employees move.

[treestar]

60. I'm not in favor of accusations alone meaning much

but if that's what is required by law, then it will have to be done. Or challenged. But no one should be penalized in any way over mere accusations! That's inherently unjust, unamerican. Politicians especially. There can be a motive here where there isn't for private businesses.

[pnwmom]

65. The EEOC guidelines say that employees should be separated from the person being accused.

And the EEOC they can't be involuntarily transferred because that could be retaliatory. But they say it's okay to put the manager on a paid leave while the investigation is going on.

In Cuomo's case, I don't see how they can conduct an investigation without interviewing lots if not all of his staffers. How would they make sure that none of those people feel uncomfortable testifying, with him still being their direct supervisor? Having to interact with him every day?

Just today there was a story about a state representative who'd gotten a call from someone on Cuomo's vaccine team, asking their opinion about the Cuomo situation. That person felt intimidated, and was concerned their district's access to vaccines could be affected by their answers about Cuomo.

https://thehill.com/homenews/state-watch/543144-cuomo-vaccine-adviser-gauged-loyalty-of-county-officials-amid-sexual

[treestar]

66. So how does he get a fair hearing?

There is no justice in merely saying it is impossible to conduct a fair hearing, so he has to go.

[pnwmom]

67. He gets a fair hearing in the same way that the EEOC advises for other managers

He takes a paid leave while the investigation is ongoing.

[Kaleva]

26. The evidence that T is an incompetent, clueless boob and no criminal mastermind is large.

The argument that he is behind the scenes orchestrating the downfall of Cuomo so that in 2 years, a Repub will be elected governor in the very blue state of New York who will pardon him is rather silly IMHO.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

41. Not a hill I would die on.

Just an observer.

[Dorian Gray]

43. No

Cuomo is extremely disliked by the democratic apparatus in ny state. He’s a jerk. Always has been. He did a good job communicating in the spring/summer, and now he’s got a lot of fans who never knew how unliked he was by many.

It’s frustrating. The democratic mayor on nyc is often critical of him. Like just this mornkng:

Link to tweet

?s=21


The conspiracies about Republican operatives doing this are not that different than the MAGA Q nuts making shit up.

This is simple. Cuomo has been a jerk for a long time. He does some good things a governor. Also has been ineffective with some things. That NOBODY is stepping up to defend him right now is super telling. NOBODY. Except online groups who believe this is a right wing smear against a super democrat. But he’s not that.

Logistics in ny state are weird. The justice dems amd maybe even deblasio will try to take advantage of this for the primary. And I don’t think they can win a state wide election. Cuomo has been more moderate with a well known name. But. Ow that may work against him.

I don’t know where we are at doe next election but I hope we figure it out soon.

[George II]

44. Bill DiBlasio has been bashing Andrew Cuomo since the first day they were both in office....

They have been like water and vinegar for years.

Courtney Gross has it right -" @NYCMayor (not surprisingly) going after @NYGovCuomo this morning..............."

And I believe you have it right, too, about Justice Democrats. That's all I'll say, though.

[Dorian Gray]

61. He has

And honestly, most of the time, I was team Cuomo. Until the pandemic, where it became apparent that they never really had conversations and Cuomo undercut most decisions de Blasio made. And while de blasio made some bad ones in there.... Cuomo as governor should have set the tone and worked with the mayor of the biggest city in his state, not against him.

BDB as Governor would be a disaster, tho. I don't want that. I'm mad at Cuomo for fucking up so badly. He could have been much better if he worked better with others.

[George II]

62. There have been 10 mayors since I was born (first was Dwyer) although the first one I remember....

....was Robert Wagner.

To me DiBlasio is the worst, overtaking both Beame and Dinkins.

The best that I remember were John Lindsey (a republican, then Liberal, then Democrat!) and Ed Koch.

Poor Lindsey was hit with a transit strike his first day in office, then a garbage strike, then a blizzard, but he still got re-elected. Koch was very good until scandals brought him down in his third term, even though he wasn't directly involved in them.

[Dorian Gray]

63. I agree that BDB

has been terrible. When he ran for president, I was mortified for him. But the pandemic he rolled up his sleeves and the city is doing okay in some respects. I just think he and Cuomo at odds was bad for everyone, and Cuomo comes off as more petty in the exchange because he has more power.

[Demsrule86]

51. There is no evidence that she will be a stronger candidate and I would expect the GOP to have

something on her. She ran with Cuomo last time...as a pair. I want a primary at the very least. And I want an investigation. The first accuser's actions are very suspicious IMHO.

[Kaleva]

54. The candidates for governor and lt. governor run individually in the primary

The winners of each then run as a pair in the general. In 2018, Lieutenant Gov. Kathy Hochul defeated New York City Councilman Jumaane Williams in the primary.

[Treefrog]

53. Ha, it's funny to watch the twisting and turning people are doing to somehow excuse Cuomo.

I’ve certainly learned who here thinks sexual harassment is basically just ‘flirting’.

[LanternWaste]

56. Certainly don't blame Hamas.

[Dorian Gray]

64. This article is a great read:

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/13/us/politics/andrew-cuomo-scandals.html