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Baitball Blogger

(52,506 posts)
Thu Apr 8, 2021, 10:52 AM Apr 2021

That pulmonalogist in the Chauvin case is providing lethal evidence against Chauvin.

Very credible, and easy to follow. The shallow breaths that Floyd was allowed to take wasn't enough to allow his bronchial pathways to push oxygen into the body.

Now they're talking about the positioning of Chauvin on Floyd's neck, and it does appear that he supports that Chauvin was indeed applying a knee to the neck.

Also says that the handcuffs combined with the street provides a crucial part in obstructing Floyd's breathing. He was pancaked. Even the way the other officers raised the handcuffs high on Floyd's back became a factor.

63 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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That pulmonalogist in the Chauvin case is providing lethal evidence against Chauvin. (Original Post) Baitball Blogger Apr 2021 OP
He certainly is impressive and interesting to listen to...very clear. Frustratedlady Apr 2021 #1
He is very very credible. I'm having a hard time breathing just listening to him. He is so clear. Ninga Apr 2021 #2
They killed George Floyd. All of them. Budi Apr 2021 #3
This Dr is really fascinating & credible. Budi Apr 2021 #4
It will be interesting to see how the defense... 3catwoman3 Apr 2021 #5
CNN "he is describing torture" Budi Apr 2021 #6
+1 Baitball Blogger Apr 2021 #8
Will be interesting True Dough Apr 2021 #7
All he's got is, " would illegal drugs in Floyd's system ALSO ...bla bla Budi Apr 2021 #10
Yes... My guess is that they will show that drugs cause same effect? Laura PourMeADrink Apr 2021 #32
Well, he certainly blew the blame-fentanyl argument out the window. calimary Apr 2021 #35
Indeed. Dr Tobin educated the world today. Budi Apr 2021 #39
No kidding! calimary Apr 2021 #42
Me too. . And reviewing Chauvin on the clips, you know HE knew exactly what he was doing too. Budi Apr 2021 #45
"His shoe is off the ground. His body weight was on Mr. Floyd's neck." nolabear Apr 2021 #9
And his hand in the pocket forcing his weight harder on Floyd's neck Budi Apr 2021 #12
Chauvin's face while he was doing it is just chilling. Baitball Blogger Apr 2021 #14
From the first time I saw that video Bettie Apr 2021 #22
So True. And you never see a glimmer of fear. Fear of Laura PourMeADrink Apr 2021 #34
Right, they weren't even marginally alert Bettie Apr 2021 #37
There was no humanity in that face. Not a drop. secondwind Apr 2021 #38
Dr. Martin Tobin's textbook is referred to as the "bible" of AnotherMother4Peace Apr 2021 #11
Imagine Dr Tobin's initial reaction when he 1st watched the clip of that moment Budi Apr 2021 #15
He is not getting paid & is testifying because he felt he has something to contribute. AnotherMother4Peace Apr 2021 #17
Because he knows exactly how Floyd died. He watched every second Budi Apr 2021 #18
Yes - he knew. Dr. Tobin, as a pulmonary expert, scientifically calculated AnotherMother4Peace Apr 2021 #23
Thankful that there are actually good people who make pulmonary studies their passion Budi Apr 2021 #26
Bless him wryter2000 Apr 2021 #31
K&R, I didn't know Chauvin lifted his feet off the ground. Murder in plain sight uponit7771 Apr 2021 #13
Not watching, would you explain that more, please? n/t OneGrassRoot Apr 2021 #16
Chauvin lifted his foot off the ground putting his whole body weight on Floyd while Floyd was losing uponit7771 Apr 2021 #20
Video/still pictures clearly show the bent toe/foot of his kneeling leg was off the ground. AnotherMother4Peace Apr 2021 #21
Thank you both! n/t OneGrassRoot Apr 2021 #41
Floyd pressing his knuckle up against the tire, trying to "crank" himself upward to take a breath sop Apr 2021 #19
No video, Chauvin gets away with it... Even keeps his job JCMach1 Apr 2021 #25
There is video of this. nt AnotherMother4Peace Apr 2021 #62
The best part MOMFUDSKI Apr 2021 #24
That's how I saw it too. His testimony was so detailed & he missed nothing. Budi Apr 2021 #30
Budi - what an excellent observation about chauvin's pose or posture in that pic... like a hunter liberalla Apr 2021 #47
Yup. He knelt there, posing like a big game killer after the hunt Budi Apr 2021 #58
Today's witnesses are excellent malaise Apr 2021 #27
He's totally ruled out drug use and heart disease wryter2000 Apr 2021 #28
Yes. Dr. Tobin addressed & dismissed Fentanyl's affect on respiration in this case. AnotherMother4Peace Apr 2021 #40
That's not stopping the defense from keeping on it like a dog with a chewtoy. Crunchy Frog Apr 2021 #63
lethal for Chauvin or Floyd? LymphocyteLover Apr 2021 #29
For Chauvin. Nt wryter2000 Apr 2021 #33
Hopefully. calimary Apr 2021 #36
EXACTLY LymphocyteLover Apr 2021 #49
good LymphocyteLover Apr 2021 #51
The whole world saw this murder, enough already, too much in fact. MasonDreams Apr 2021 #43
I missed the first few minutes of his testimony. I was mesmerized by him. I can't put Tess49 Apr 2021 #44
Dublin mcar Apr 2021 #48
Don't you just want to hear more from him? Budi Apr 2021 #53
I could have listened to him all day mcar Apr 2021 #54
His findings should be a required part of restraint trainings (all levels of restraint). AnotherMother4Peace Apr 2021 #57
Thank you! I love listening to him. Tess49 Apr 2021 #59
He was born in Ireland. Studied/worked(s) in Ireland & UK & US Budi Apr 2021 #50
The defense is attempting to cross examine him. Not going well. Tess49 Apr 2021 #60
Its awful.. There's nothing more to say. Budi Apr 2021 #61
Pool reporters said that the jury was following intently mcar Apr 2021 #46
Paraphrased: It was as if a surgeon removed one lung. Ilsa Apr 2021 #52
Did they also have knowledge that the position would be terminal? LiberalFighter Apr 2021 #55
Were any of them in the military and received torture training? LiberalFighter Apr 2021 #56

Frustratedlady

(16,254 posts)
1. He certainly is impressive and interesting to listen to...very clear.
Thu Apr 8, 2021, 10:56 AM
Apr 2021

His explanations shouldn't be difficult for the defense atty. or the jurors to understand. Not too sure about the defense atty., though. He sure doesn't impress me.

It will be interesting to see what questions the atty. comes up with, though.

Ninga

(9,023 posts)
2. He is very very credible. I'm having a hard time breathing just listening to him. He is so clear.
Thu Apr 8, 2021, 10:57 AM
Apr 2021
 

Budi

(15,325 posts)
4. This Dr is really fascinating & credible.
Thu Apr 8, 2021, 11:11 AM
Apr 2021

He is giving the step by step anatomy of death by knee-on-neck.

True Dough

(26,961 posts)
7. Will be interesting
Thu Apr 8, 2021, 11:22 AM
Apr 2021

to see if the defense attorney can make a dent in his testimony. Doesn't seem likely.

 

Budi

(15,325 posts)
10. All he's got is, " would illegal drugs in Floyd's system ALSO ...bla bla
Thu Apr 8, 2021, 11:30 AM
Apr 2021

I don't see the Defense as matching knowledge & intellect with the Dr.
He'd look like a fool. All he's got is "drugs!"

 

Laura PourMeADrink

(42,770 posts)
32. Yes... My guess is that they will show that drugs cause same effect?
Thu Apr 8, 2021, 01:12 PM
Apr 2021

Same as suffocation? But, what does that prove? Could be either?

calimary

(90,327 posts)
35. Well, he certainly blew the blame-fentanyl argument out the window.
Thu Apr 8, 2021, 01:16 PM
Apr 2021

Right out the window.

I don’t know how the defense excuses or confuses this one.

Extremely credible witness. They’re saying his testimony was so good and so clear that it could be used for police training.

calimary

(90,327 posts)
42. No kidding!
Thu Apr 8, 2021, 01:46 PM
Apr 2021

I was actually feeling my own neck and throat as he described the different physical elements and the impact of pressure on the trachea and larynx and more.

Courtroom becomes school room.

 

Budi

(15,325 posts)
45. Me too. . And reviewing Chauvin on the clips, you know HE knew exactly what he was doing too.
Thu Apr 8, 2021, 02:04 PM
Apr 2021

I can't imagine the defense entering anything to suggest reasonable doubt after Dr Tobiin's classroom education today.

nolabear

(43,850 posts)
9. "His shoe is off the ground. His body weight was on Mr. Floyd's neck."
Thu Apr 8, 2021, 11:30 AM
Apr 2021

He was in an upright position and half his body weight plus half his gear weight was on the back of Mr. Floyd’s neck.

My God. How can someone do that, just grind a man into the ground until he dies?

 

Budi

(15,325 posts)
12. And his hand in the pocket forcing his weight harder on Floyd's neck
Thu Apr 8, 2021, 11:35 AM
Apr 2021

This. As you said, nolabear

"How can someone do that, just grind a man into the ground until he dies?"

Baitball Blogger

(52,506 posts)
14. Chauvin's face while he was doing it is just chilling.
Thu Apr 8, 2021, 11:36 AM
Apr 2021

Like he felt he had the right to kill him.

Bettie

(19,787 posts)
22. From the first time I saw that video
Thu Apr 8, 2021, 12:07 PM
Apr 2021

the image I keep flashing on is Chauvin's face. He was just calm and smirking at the crowd of people begging him not to kill Mr. Floyd.

I've seen that face before, on the kid in our neighborhood who used to torture animals, on my own abusive father when he was ready to "punish" us for whatever.

 

Laura PourMeADrink

(42,770 posts)
34. So True. And you never see a glimmer of fear. Fear of
Thu Apr 8, 2021, 01:16 PM
Apr 2021

crowd or fear of Floyd. If they were indeed afraid of Floyd recovering and going wild... You would think the other cops would have been poised and ready.

Bettie

(19,787 posts)
37. Right, they weren't even marginally alert
Thu Apr 8, 2021, 01:26 PM
Apr 2021

they were just having a good time, watching their co-worker kill a guy. Nothing to see here, just another day at the "office".

AnotherMother4Peace

(5,159 posts)
11. Dr. Martin Tobin's textbook is referred to as the "bible" of
Thu Apr 8, 2021, 11:32 AM
Apr 2021

mechanical ventilation by the Lancet medical journal.

Dr. Tobin presents himself as both brilliant and humble.

 

Budi

(15,325 posts)
15. Imagine Dr Tobin's initial reaction when he 1st watched the clip of that moment
Thu Apr 8, 2021, 11:42 AM
Apr 2021

When he watched Floyd, with Chauvin's knee pressing down.

He must have been horrified, even with all his professional & clinical knowledge.

He knew exactly what was happening to Floyd, as those 9 long minutes ticked by.

AnotherMother4Peace

(5,159 posts)
17. He is not getting paid & is testifying because he felt he has something to contribute.
Thu Apr 8, 2021, 11:51 AM
Apr 2021

This according to Dr. Tobin's testimony. The State did contact him, & it sounds like he offered his services for free.

 

Budi

(15,325 posts)
18. Because he knows exactly how Floyd died. He watched every second
Thu Apr 8, 2021, 11:56 AM
Apr 2021

He is a man loyal to his professional oath.

AnotherMother4Peace

(5,159 posts)
23. Yes - he knew. Dr. Tobin, as a pulmonary expert, scientifically calculated
Thu Apr 8, 2021, 12:12 PM
Apr 2021

the factors that externally contributed to Mr. Floyd's inability to breathe & get oxygen throughout his body.

 

Budi

(15,325 posts)
26. Thankful that there are actually good people who make pulmonary studies their passion
Thu Apr 8, 2021, 01:02 PM
Apr 2021

Tobin is undisputable. And fascinating to listen to, which is what the jurors need to focus on the gist of this case.
How & Why George Floyd died

wryter2000

(47,940 posts)
31. Bless him
Thu Apr 8, 2021, 01:11 PM
Apr 2021

I’ll bet the sleazeball defense attorney will try to use that to claim he’s biased. But I bet the jury loves the doctor. I know I do.

uponit7771

(93,532 posts)
20. Chauvin lifted his foot off the ground putting his whole body weight on Floyd while Floyd was losing
Thu Apr 8, 2021, 11:57 AM
Apr 2021

... oxygen levels

AnotherMother4Peace

(5,159 posts)
21. Video/still pictures clearly show the bent toe/foot of his kneeling leg was off the ground.
Thu Apr 8, 2021, 11:58 AM
Apr 2021

Picture Chauvin's lower leg bent horizontally at the knee, with the toe bent against the ground for support. But his toe wasn't against the ground, it was off the ground. Which meant much more of Chauvin's weight was on Mr. Floyd's neck.

sop

(18,897 posts)
19. Floyd pressing his knuckle up against the tire, trying to "crank" himself upward to take a breath
Thu Apr 8, 2021, 11:56 AM
Apr 2021

as he was slowly being asphixiated. The shocking image of Floyd's face being ground down into the dirty pavement by Chauvin's entire weight. These will haunt me. Thank God for the bystander's video.

 

MOMFUDSKI

(7,080 posts)
24. The best part
Thu Apr 8, 2021, 12:55 PM
Apr 2021

was when he said he is taking no pay for his testimony although he has in the past. WOW He has got to be SO PISSED at what he watched that he just had to speak up.

 

Budi

(15,325 posts)
30. That's how I saw it too. His testimony was so detailed & he missed nothing.
Thu Apr 8, 2021, 01:11 PM
Apr 2021

The knuckle on the tire went unnoticed until Tobin made the point.
The most chilling thing about those pics & video is the psychopathy of Chauvin's demeanor, like he was proudly posing for a pic of a big Game kill.
He's sick.

liberalla

(11,152 posts)
47. Budi - what an excellent observation about chauvin's pose or posture in that pic... like a hunter
Thu Apr 8, 2021, 02:13 PM
Apr 2021

proud of his 'trophy' and hunting skills. His attitude, confidence, cockiness... Perfect analogy.

 

Budi

(15,325 posts)
58. Yup. He knelt there, posing like a big game killer after the hunt
Thu Apr 8, 2021, 02:37 PM
Apr 2021

I hate him & what he represents
I hope he suffers a lonely life with no one to pose for again.
He should be alone on death row till he stops breathing.

Remove him from the world's view.

Ya know what else?
If Chauvin hadn't been locked up, his psychological fit says he would have been the 1st one beating down the doors to our Capitol building carrying zip ties & dressed in riot gear.

Rant off...

wryter2000

(47,940 posts)
28. He's totally ruled out drug use and heart disease
Thu Apr 8, 2021, 01:05 PM
Apr 2021

That’s it. No doubt, reasonable or otherwise

calimary

(90,327 posts)
36. Hopefully.
Thu Apr 8, 2021, 01:21 PM
Apr 2021

Chauvin needs to be convicted. BADLY needs to be convicted. He needs to become a cautionary tale for future policing.

A graphic warning and, hopefully a “THOU SHALT NOT do a “Chauvin”.

LymphocyteLover

(9,957 posts)
49. EXACTLY
Thu Apr 8, 2021, 02:16 PM
Apr 2021

it does seem like there's an effort being made to do this -- hopefully the jury will go along!

MasonDreams

(777 posts)
43. The whole world saw this murder, enough already, too much in fact.
Thu Apr 8, 2021, 01:51 PM
Apr 2021

He was murdered because the cop thought he could escape justice. In fact, before 1865 this killing would not be a crime. 1865 was a long time ago. Please make murders like this one just as illegal and punishable by law as other murders. NOW !!!

Tess49

(1,623 posts)
44. I missed the first few minutes of his testimony. I was mesmerized by him. I can't put
Thu Apr 8, 2021, 01:53 PM
Apr 2021

a finger on his accent. Did he say where he is from originally?

 

Budi

(15,325 posts)
53. Don't you just want to hear more from him?
Thu Apr 8, 2021, 02:21 PM
Apr 2021

He needs his own lecture series on Prime Time TV.

I can think of A LOT of time slots he could easily replace.

 

Budi

(15,325 posts)
50. He was born in Ireland. Studied/worked(s) in Ireland & UK & US
Thu Apr 8, 2021, 02:17 PM
Apr 2021
https://loyolamedicine.org/doctor/martin-tobin

https://www.atsjournals.org/doi/full/10.1164/ajrccm.159.2.15920

Who's going to argue with Dr Martin Tobin!
His creds span a lifetime.

The prosecution chose the absolute best in the business for this case, for Justice for George Floyd.

mcar

(46,173 posts)
46. Pool reporters said that the jury was following intently
Thu Apr 8, 2021, 02:12 PM
Apr 2021

even to touching their throats and necks during the Drs. lesson.

Ilsa

(64,432 posts)
52. Paraphrased: It was as if a surgeon removed one lung.
Thu Apr 8, 2021, 02:20 PM
Apr 2021

That was a devastating comment, and not even the most damning.

LiberalFighter

(53,544 posts)
55. Did they also have knowledge that the position would be terminal?
Thu Apr 8, 2021, 02:25 PM
Apr 2021

It sure seems like they may have received training or information on how to maximize it.

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