If your first response to yet another shooting of a PoC by a cop

[TDale313]

Is to explain how “all they had to do was comply” you’re part of the problem.

[Watchfoxheadexplodes]

1. Or your a thinking person

Looking at the ENTIRETY of the situation.

[Ms. Toad]

8. If your FIRST response is to blame the victim

that makes you a thinking person?

No. If that is your first response to, "yet another shooting of a PoC by a cop" is to explain that all they had to do was comply, you are admitting that you starting assumption was that they were not complying.

While I agree that, ultimately, all factors need to be considered - the question posed was about your first reaction.

[unweird]

10. Really? That's your take?

The “entirety” of the situation would take in the systemic racism of our policing that enables and has tacitly condoned these executions. Perhaps that is what you meant but it didn’t sound like it.

[Skittles]

11. you're

[uponit7771]

16. ... involving a black person, you forgot that part again.

[The_REAL_Ecumenist]

47. DAFUQQ? Really? You think that being shot by cops who claimed that they meant to use their

tasers, (just happened in Minnesota this weekend & is almost complete duplicate of the Oscar Grant MURDER in Oakland, 'amemba him?), Breonna Taylor being MURDERED in her OWN home while sleeping not to mention the outright murder of Atatianta Koquce Jefferson shot IN HER OWN HOME through a window while playing w/her 8 year old nephew following a welfare call from 1 of her neighbors in response to lights and open doors in the early morning hours?

Hell, what the fuck do you have to say about George Floyd, WHO WAS COMPLYING & STILL died, you know, the subject of the criminal trial of the ignorant asshole who needlessly tortured him to death? Do I have to remind you about Philando Castile, who was shot a number of times even though he was NOT doing anything wrong nor was he accused of anything AND going so far as to inform the cop that he had a LEGAL firearm in the car? Did I mention that he was in the car with his fiancee AND his little girl?

What about 22 year old John Crawford who was shot & killed by a police officer ON SIGHT, without ANY warning nor confrontation because some asshole called and lied saying that he was walking the the local wallyworld threatening folks with a gun when he WASN'T and he was holding a toy bb gun?

What about Ezell Ford who was 25 years old & mentally ill, (but everyone knows, black folks are NEVER children no are we ever mentally ill, :sarcasm He was UNARMED but was shot 3 times, 1 of them being in the back! Oh yeah, just like most of these situations, the cops who shot him weren't charged with diddly squat!

What about Rumain Brisbon, 34, was shot and killed by a Phoenix police officer who mistook a pill bottle for a weapon? A pill bottle was mistaken for a weapon?!! The officer, Mark Rine, was not charged following a probe by the Maricopa County attorney's office because OF COURSE he wasn't!

We don't even have to be Male for this to happen to us. Allow me to present 37 year old Tanisha Anderson who was MURDERED by cops in Cleveland Oh after her head was slammed into pavement! Did I mention that she was both Bipolar AND Schizophrenic? So there's that...
What about Akai Gurley who was 28 year old UNARMED young man when he was shot & MURDERED by rookie cop, Peter Liang, while walking with his girlfriend in a dimly lit stairwell of a NYC public housing building. Muthafucka who killed him tried to claim it was an "accident". Now in this cop's case, he was charged w/second-degree manslaughter, criminally negligent homicide, second-degree assault, reckless endangerment, and two counts of official misconduct. HE WAS CONVICTED but I wonder if this had anything to do with the fact that he was NOT white? hmm?

Ever hear of 12 year old Tamir Rice who was shot & killed in a PUBLIC PARK by cops whose salaries are paid by the taxes his parents paid because he had a toy gun? Now, what about Kyle Rittenhouse whose mammy drove him across statelines to Kenosha WI, where he used an AR15 style gun right under the noses of COPS to MURDER 3 people? First of all, he was a teen who legally cannot own such a gun, he WAS armed but not only did the cop not do jacksh!t but at least one of them high fived him!!! Hell, dylan roof walked into my families' ancestral AME church, (on my father's side), slaughtered 9 people & injured 1 more who had the fucking nerve to pray and study the Bible while black but guess what? AFTER A MANHUNT, he was taken in alive & given a sweet meal at the Burger King....& oh yeah, did I mention that he was well known the the local constabulary for drug use, walking into the local mall, (Columbiana Mall) while dressed in black, ala, Columbine style. He was banned BUT he arrested for trespassing. The question however, is how TF did he get that gun in the first place because as liveral the gun laws are in that area, people with drug addiction &/or possession of unlawful drugs. Funnily enough, What happened to Philando Castile & John Crawford didn't happen to him...Imagine that


BTW, 3 of my greatgrandparents were white & my husband of 20 years is too. Bae is from central Texas and I cannot tell you how many times I have literally had to calm him down when we learn of yet another innocent,in general but POC in particular by cops who almost NEVER are charged, let alone convicted of flat out murder. He has a highschool friend who wrote about a middle school Latino classmate of his who was only 15 years old when he was arrested for s reason that was never clarified, handcuffed with his hands behind his back and told to run from the cruiser only to shoot him in the back. Bae had heard the recounting of this horrific murder of a child from the local cops how laughed about what had happened to his father, (he was Justice of the peace at the time) but didn't know who it was. He was able to put 2 & 2 together when his classmate wrote about what happened in his hometown paper.

My father was arrested because though he was 6'6.5" in height, fairly slim at the time & dark complected, somehow LAPD cops said that he fit the description of a bank robber who was approx. 5'10", had quite a gut, was high yellow! He was held for 6 hours, even though they'd caught the actual criminal. Did I mention that he was on the way to pick up my Grandmother from the airport. She'd flown in to comfort my mom who'd lost my sister 15 hours after her birth.




Please compare & contrast just this handful, (and I DO MEAN a small thimbleful), of what amounts to crimes against humanity that's been happening here in the Americas for at least 600 years. This sh!t is old, NOT just for POC but for all decent people everywhere. I have to ask you 1 last question

DAFUQQ does your cheeky comment mean? What the fuck are you trying to say because it's not only asinine but it incredibly and intentionally obtuse. TBH, it seems to be willfully so...Take your time, I'll wait.

[Arazi]

54. Righteous rant. I'm just gonna sit right here next to you

[LanternWaste]

51. That sounds like self-righteous sanctimony.

Not saying it in fact, is. Merely that it certainly sounds that way... as you appear to be ignoring the very thing you lecture.

[whopis01]

56. If that is your first reaction, you are (at best) not a thinking person

If your first response to a PoC being shot by police is to explain that “all they had to do is comply”, then there is no thinking involved at all. Your first reaction was to jump to a conclusion without any other information.


If after looking at the ENTIRETY of the situation, you come to the conclusion that “all they had to is comply” then there is an even bigger problem.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

2. Bootlickers gonna lick boots

[Watchfoxheadexplodes]

4. How grown up

Smdh

[intheflow]

58. And yet, accurate. n/t

[2naSalit]

3. K&R

[stillcool]

5. Damn straight...

I can not imagine what getting pulled over must feel like. Fight or Flight big time.

[Claire Oh Nette]

31. I've had speeding tickets in 8 states

Not 8 speeding tickets. 8 states.
I've been pulled over dozens of times.

Never once, in any traffic stop, in any of those 8 states have I ever been asked to get out of the car. Never.

I've talked my way out of tickets I deserved.

No officer in CA, AZ, NV, IL, VA, NC, KS, and IA, city police, conty sheriff, or high way patrol has ever approached me with a gun drawn.

I have tinted windows, too. Never been tased, except by my own defibrillator.

That is white privilege. If cops are so fearful they pull out pepper spray and tasers for tag checks, they need to be in a different line of work.

[stillcool]

49. yeah...I had cops in my family

and could do no wrong. Lots of alcoholism and violence, but get out of jail free card for life.

[TDale313]

13. Of course, that ignores the fact

That we’ve seen plenty of these cases where excessive force, often leading to deal, was used where the “suspect” was doing absolutely everything right. For many people of color, there is no way to react that shields them from this. And it’s not about any one case. It’s a huge systematic issue. Cops aren’t supposed to be using lethal levels of force if it’s avoidable. They’re not supposed to be executing people for passing a sus $20 bill or having a tail light out, but these things are happening way too frequently.

[DenaliDemocrat]

21. I completely agree

Although I do not understand why people still resist arrest. Cops are obviously undertrained and over aggressive. I treat them like an angry dog. Move slow, speak softly, and avoid eye contact. Seriously, they are loose cannons waiting to go off.

[KS Toronado]

32. Yes, treat them like an angry dog, move slow & speak softly

But make eye contact, people avoiding eye contact too often are hiding something. Just my 2 cents.

[intheflow]

60. Black folks are damned if they do and damned if they don't.

Consider the Freddie Gray case: Looking While Black: When eye contact with police is considered a crime

Or John Felton: Ohio officer in video says ‘direct eye contact’ one reason he pulled over driver

[KS Toronado]

61. There's exceptions to everything....

I still believe eye contact with a smile & a head nod put most people at ease with strangers.

[intheflow]

64. Oh, no! Do NOT smile at cops!

Will Smiling at the Police Get You Arrested?

An Ex-Cop's Guide to Not Getting Arrested

Video emerges of LA police arresting Black man who smiled at them as they searched for white suspect

Texas Man Says He Was Choked for Smiling in Mug Shot

Again: Black folks are damned if they do and damned if they don't.

[Merlot]

43. People don't resist arrest, cops just yell that as justification,

[KatK]

26. Agree 1000%. There's no safe way for a POC to respond. Must be scary as hell. n/t

[uponit7771]

17. ... or not be black, you forgot that part .. seems to be going around on DU these days.

[Claire Oh Nette]

33. Bingo

I've never been confronted with a gun.
Ever.
White. Suburban LA & SF Bay Area, now rural Western NC.
Never.

Even 'complying' is subject to the officers' determination of fast enough...

[meadowlander]

20. That doesn't help disabled people or people with mental illnesses.

Cops should be trained in the first instance not to shoot people to kill unless someone's life is actually in danger.

What percentage of people in the US have diabetes, dementia, autism, schizophrenia, etc. that mean sometimes they're not capable of "never getting confrontational with someone carrying a gun"?

It's the responsibility of the person carrying the gun not to use it when there is any other possible way of resolving the situation.

[TDale313]

24. Deadly use of force should be an absolute last resort.

Too often it’s very clear it isn’t.

[Ligyron]

57. They'll typically empty their entire clip into them too.

Overkill just seems to be SOP w many police departments.

I've been privy to off duty conversations due to mutual sport related activities and cops don't really like or trust anyone not a brother officer with rare exception. Like someone who can cover right field and can be a mean pinch hitter when needed with better than average batting skills.

But my gawd, the things they say and no doubt do when it comes to dealing with anyone not white are borderline psycho. Oh sure, they consider it good sport to stop and give them a ticket for whatever as they usually have a certain quota to fill every month anyway.They relate stories of these encounters almost trying to out do one another and they have a jolly laugh about it.

I've thought about doing something like taping these conversations and handing them in to higher ups but my next door neighbor on vice hosts a lot of these get togethers and I have to live next to the guy and play ball with the rest and didn't "want to make trouble" . Besides, the higher ups are no doubt aware of this and part of the culture themselves and while they might be forced to take some action against the younger officers, it probably wouldn't accomplish much in the long run except endanger myself or members of my family for years and years.

But I'm feeling angry and somewhat of a coward now as we see this type of thing and way worse has been happening all over the land and if something doesn't change real soon, I might do some changing myself.

That's my unearned white privilege story anyway.

[littlemissmartypants]

35. Hearing Impairment. It's hard to comply when you don't understand the instructions. nt

[Caliman73]

48. Therein lies the problem.

In many people's eyes, including police, Black means dangerous, armed or unarmed. Anything that Black people do is likely to be perceived as a threat because we have all been conditioned to see Black people, especially young Black men, as a threat. So when you are conditioned to respond with force and authority to a situation that does not require that, and on the other end, you have a person who perceives You (the police officer) as a life or death threat, you have the makings of a disaster. You are operating on emotion and that means that critical thinking is out the window.

What gets me, and I know this is only anecdotal, is watching video after video where White men are armed with loaded guns or knives, and are making angry and confrontational movements toward police, but they take the time to calm them down and talk them into custody. Compare that to pulling up on a 12 year old boy and shooting him within 10 seconds, or kneeling on a handcuffed guy for 9 minutes to "get him under control".

I know White people get shot too, and I know that they may also be unarmed, but you cannot realistically deny that there is a big difference in perception between White people and Black people when it comes to how law enforcement reacts.

[NickB79]

45. So the US medic that just got sprayed and threatened with death while in his car

Arms out the window, was confrontational how?

[LakeArenal]

7. Sounds very fascist. Or 1984.

Comply, conform, obey, or die.

[HAB911]

9. THIS

[padah513]

12. Now the officer meant to shoot him with the taser

Hell of an epitaph for the young man's gravestone, don't you think? Here lies Daunte Wright. The officer meant to shoot him with the taser.

[TDale313]

14. 😢

[stopdiggin]

15. my first response was to look for more information

hopefully dash and body cam footage will come along shortly (hopefully).

[Stinky The Clown]

18. AMEN!!

[Hugh_Lebowski]

22. I think one should have to DRASTICALLY not comply in order to get shot

Like, you charge them with a weapon, or ACTUALLY pull a gun from your waistband, or are actively firing on cops.

Possible exception if you're running and it's known with 99% certainty that you've killed other people and might legitimately be armed and seeking to kill more. Talking a mass shooting type scenario, or you're armed with hostages, or similar.

Other than that NOBODY should be shot by cops, ever.

[TDale313]

23. Agreed.

Most of these cases could be resolved without deadly use of force.

[Bev54]

28. And cops should not be flying the thin blue line flag at their precinct.

Might actually make people think there is a problem with the cops that work there.

[48656c6c6f20]

25. My first thought is why do we have a death penalty for expired

Registrations?

[Sympthsical]

27. My first response is to see if there's video

I don't trust, "Well, this is what the cop said happened." Nah. I want video if there is any first thing. Then we can hear the rest.

[Mr.Bill]

29. They just showed the video on MSNBC.

The cop with the gun yelled "TASER TASER TASER!" just before she shot.

It's going to be a low level manslaughter and end of career at the most.

[barbtries]

38. i'm cynical.

she didn't have a throwaway gun so she yelled, "Taser!"

I really don't see how you don't know you are pulling the trigger of a gun.

watch though, she won't even be charged. just another Black scofflaw who didn't deserve to live anyway.

[Mr.Bill]

41. I am also cynical,

and you make a valid point. But I don't think they will ever find 12 jurors who think so.

I also worry about sending a message to every cop in the country that all they have to do is yell TASER! and there will be no murder charge. The public transit shot that killed that kid in Oakland used this defense and I think he got two years in jail for manslaughter. And he didn't even yell TASER before he shot.

[uponit7771]

53. +1, ... and they earned your cynicism seeing PDs in that area don't want REALLY want relationships

... in that area that are progressive and cooperative.

[Hekate]

30. It is very much the kind of victim-blaming rape victims experience & I have had it up to my teeth

No, really. If you are a white woman — or any woman, but I just mention the ones who live with the privilege of whiteness, AND YET hear the same garbage from the age of puberty on through old age about how THEY are responsible for being assaulted.

By the same token our culture places the majority of the blame for black men being targeted and killed by white cops squarely on the shoulders of — the victims.

If only she hadn’t been walking down the street in a cute dress. If only he hadn’t been driving a brand new car that didn’t have metal plates yet. If only she hadn’t gone to that party and unwittingly ingested Rohypnol. If only he hadn’t been jogging. If only she hadn’t let the cat out at 2 a.m. If only he’d put his hands on the steering wheel and hadn’t asked the cops why they pulled him over. If only she hadn’t been jogging.

Jesus Christ on a Trailer Hitch. These are not merely crimes of opportunity — predators will make their own opportunities, and we seem to have a culture just full of predators.

Don't give me that line about “Not all Men.” Fix it! You fix it! It isn’t up to the victims and targets to endlessly alter their behavior until there is no possible mode of being in this world at all.

[TDale313]

34. It is very much the same mentality. n/t

[Mr.Bill]

39. You know what I ask people who say if only they had done what the cop

told them to do?

I ask them what would they do if the cop asked them for a blow job. And if you think that's obtuse, I guarantee that's happened to women before.

[crickets]

40. Excellent rant. nt

[littlemissmartypants]

44. ❤ nt

[barbtries]

36. that's never my response.

it's cold-blooded murder until i learn otherwise; that's my standard first response and imo it's not unreasonable.

[nykym]

37. I find a bit of irony in the 2 terms

POC and COP - POC is COP backwards

[geardaddy]

42. Bingo.

I've heard too many people say, "They should have just did what the officers were telling them to do."

It's a load of bollocks.

[The Jungle 1]

46. Unless you have broken a law police have NO authority over you.

You do not have to obey them like a dog.
First question: What law have I broken? Ask it over and over.
If they say they are investigating explain that you are not willing to help their investigation and ask are you being detained. Then shut up.
This is still America, land of the free and all.

If you have broken a law SHUT UP and then shut up shutting up!

[Caliman73]

50. While that is true in theory, in practice, especially if you are not White, you can be killed.

You may ask, what law have I broken, while they try to pull you out of your car, then if you even try to reposition yourself while you figure out what the hell is happening, they are saying you are resisting and becoming violent, then they shoot you dead. Sure it will be totally unjustified but that won't stop you from being dead.

Of course if you are Ammon Bundy, you can keep getting arrested for taking over public lands, pointing weapons at police, making threats, etc... because well, he has rights, and he is not Black.

[The Jungle 1]

52. True all true

We as Americans have a civic responsibility to make this fascism STOP.
Listen I am a pasty white old guy but I am outraged at where policing is headed in this country.
We must take all opportunities to point at bad police.

Scum bag Bundy gets freedom because of jury nullification. WE NEED TO START PLAYING THAT GAME.

[misanthrope]

62. You can be killed if you're white too

although the incidences are far less. The ultimate reality is that as long as a LEO has the badge and gun, they can damn near do whatever they want and they are going to get the benefit of the doubt with the legal system.

[Caliman73]

63. Yep.

which is why the word, "especially" is in there. That is on purpose to denote a non-exclusive, but significantly more likely situation.

I love Mexican food, "especially" enchiladas.

Life is "especially" hard on trans people of color

See? Both are broader statements including a wide range, but then emphasizing a more specific item or group.

[Hekate]

55. Sure. And if you are a black man, then they yank you out of your car, say you were "resisting," ...

....and shoot you for being lippy or just existing. The police have all the authority they need in their partners, their guns, fists, and now we discover, their knees.

Read my rant above. I’ve had it up to my teeth with this.

[TCJ70]

59. Not my first response...

...which was “cops need to stop killing people”.

As for my further thoughts “comply” isn’t the right word. Just...why fight? In no instance that I can think of has fighting the police at an arrest ever made things better for someone. It’s a mindset I can’t understand.

Would we have one less police killing if he hadn’t fought and tried to get back in his car? I can’t know that. But it certainly didn’t improve his chances.