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WhiskeyGrinder

(22,467 posts)
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 04:04 PM Apr 2021

Adam Toledo Video Shows Chicago Police Shooting 13-Year-Old As He Raised His Hands

https://blockclubchicago.org/2021/04/15/adam-toledo-video-shows-chicago-police-shooting-13-year-old-graphic-video/

CHICAGO — Video released Thursday shows a Chicago police officer fatally shooting 13-year-old Adam Toledo as he raised his hands in a Little Village alley on March 29.

The videos come from body cameras worn by police when an officer fatally shot Toledo on March 29 in Little Village. The Civilian Office of Police Accountability — which is investigating the shooting — also released third-party video, transmission from the city’s Office of Emergency Communications, ShotSpotter recordings, case incident information and tactical response and arrest reports.

Mayor Lori Lightfoot, the Toledo family’s attorneys and local leaders have asked people to remain peaceful as the footage is released.

Lightfoot said it is “excruciating” to watch the videos, particularly footage that shows Toledo mortally wounded after an officer shot him. She and Little Village community leaders held a news conference where they said the video will raise strong emotions in people and urged people to protest nonviolently.


Please protect yourself. There is a distressing photo at the link and the video, further down at the link, is deeply grievous.

FTP.
119 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Adam Toledo Video Shows Chicago Police Shooting 13-Year-Old As He Raised His Hands (Original Post) WhiskeyGrinder Apr 2021 OP
Thanks. I was just checking to see if it was posted yet. hedda_foil Apr 2021 #1
😢 13 years old. His hands up. This is just fucked. n/t TDale313 Apr 2021 #2
"All you have to do is cooperate with police and you will be fine " luckone Apr 2021 #35
"Leaders have asked people to remain peaceful" gratuitous Apr 2021 #3
that's it for me for today... stillcool Apr 2021 #4
Oh gee, maybe he didn't mean to kill him. Officer sounds shocked 1!!1! He only fired once11!!1 Arazi Apr 2021 #5
May be. The suicide rate after officers have killed kids is pretty high. Hortensis Apr 2021 #6
I. Don't. Care. Arazi Apr 2021 #8
Perhaps at least you can understand how trumpist extremists feel then. Hortensis Apr 2021 #102
I don't understand your post. And if you won't watch the video why comment? Arazi Apr 2021 #108
delete... Stuart G Apr 2021 #90
Kick demmiblue Apr 2021 #7
Yep one of the tweet replies - They murdered that child for complying with police orders luckone Apr 2021 #36
Minutes later, a police supervisor radios in to officers on the scene to turn their body cameras off Demovictory9 Apr 2021 #9
We need huge consequences for turning off body cams TDale313 Apr 2021 #11
+1 live love laugh Apr 2021 #96
He should be fired immediately. Hassin Bin Sober Apr 2021 #17
Yep murder uponit7771 Apr 2021 #21
well probably... "let's get our stories straight" Demovictory9 Apr 2021 #24
+1, body cams off equals instant guilt imho. They lost the benefit of the doubt uponit7771 Apr 2021 #26
Absolutely. Body cam needs to be on 100% of the time. joshcryer Apr 2021 #98
Plus body cams need to be on 100% of all police officers. IMO KS Toronado Apr 2021 #111
That is a very bad shoot. cinematicdiversions Apr 2021 #10
Was the youth armed? superpatriotman Apr 2021 #12
The reporting is indeed shitty and inconsistent. /nt spudspud Apr 2021 #22
"Toledo does not appear to be holding the gun as an officer shot him," ... uponit7771 Apr 2021 #27
Yes, sarisataka Apr 2021 #29
There's nothing in the video showing the kid had anything in his hands before getting shot ... uponit7771 Apr 2021 #41
Watch the 2:03-2:04 range sarisataka Apr 2021 #45
That's not a gun, its part of the fence behind him. Even if they found a gun at the scene they uponit7771 Apr 2021 #59
It isn't a part of the fence sarisataka Apr 2021 #68
No we don't have those views and no one is confirming he had a gun but a few people uponit7771 Apr 2021 #99
They did find a handgun with the slide locked back next to the fence. SYFROYH Apr 2021 #109
+1, The cop turning off his camera pisses me off to no end uponit7771 Apr 2021 #112
What prompted the pursuit Deminpenn Apr 2021 #54
+1, uponit7771 Apr 2021 #57
Shots fired. The kid did have a gun. He dropped it. He did NOT have it on him when he was killed mucifer Apr 2021 #105
Thanks Deminpenn Apr 2021 #107
This message was self-deleted by its author DiamondShark Apr 2021 #113
See the photo in my reply w#28 fright before shooting Empty hands up as they approach him luckone Apr 2021 #38
When the cop pulled the trigger? When the bullet hit him? No. WhiskeyGrinder Apr 2021 #53
He tossed the gun behind the fence and then turned to face the officer. Dustlawyer Apr 2021 #65
. WhiskeyGrinder Apr 2021 #67
"Put up your fucking hands" then blam! Hands up, no gun Arazi Apr 2021 #71
Oh, might he have been armed at some point? Then please tell me why bullwinkle428 Apr 2021 #92
omfg, they murderd this kid !!! Then requested body cams turned off!!!! uponit7771 Apr 2021 #13
Covering up evidence. sheshe2 Apr 2021 #32
+1, uponit7771 Apr 2021 #39
Why even bother to raise hands in compliance anymore? pandr32 Apr 2021 #14
This child was murdered malaise Apr 2021 #15
YES! +1000 Duppers Apr 2021 #69
Absolutely. Bristlecone Apr 2021 #89
We MUST overhaul the way we police...too many senseless killings....this is insane ashredux Apr 2021 #16
Reform after reform is what got us here. Reform got us George Floyd. Brooklyn Center, whose cops WhiskeyGrinder Apr 2021 #52
Well, you cannot abolish "it all". ashredux Apr 2021 #73
I would argue that we don't. WhiskeyGrinder Apr 2021 #75
So....someone steals your TV...who do you call? ashredux Apr 2021 #80
A crisis team from my insurance company. WhiskeyGrinder Apr 2021 #81
Well, it is obvious that you really don't have a clue and really are not able to debate the issue ashredux Apr 2021 #83
. WhiskeyGrinder Apr 2021 #85
Maybe we should get rid of guns? apnu Apr 2021 #103
Do everything in your power to avoid EVER crossing paths with a police officer. nt Binkie The Clown Apr 2021 #18
This right here is the answer. Afrocat Apr 2021 #25
In the last 25 or 30 years I spoke with the police only once... Binkie The Clown Apr 2021 #60
Do everything in your power to abolish the police. WhiskeyGrinder Apr 2021 #51
It appears you are here to disrupt...not have a frank discussion ashredux Apr 2021 #87
What would you like to discuss? WhiskeyGrinder Apr 2021 #88
My late brother was a cop...he was not perfect but I saw it up close. ashredux Apr 2021 #86
Situation Appropriate Response Binkie The Clown Apr 2021 #93
Its the guns. apnu Apr 2021 #104
That's a split second call. BlueTsunami2018 Apr 2021 #19
No it's not The kid was unarmed and if it was that split second stay the fuck away uponit7771 Apr 2021 #23
I don't think you watched the same video. BlueTsunami2018 Apr 2021 #48
I watched the video, there was no gun in kids hand and there has been no still pick with a clear gun uponit7771 Apr 2021 #61
I agree. I personally don't have enough information to even remotely judge the officer's response. Chakaconcarne Apr 2021 #30
There's a video from the body cam and nothing in the video shows clearly the kid with a gun and uponit7771 Apr 2021 #63
Adam Toledo Did NOT have a gun! Lokee11 Apr 2021 #62
Do you have a video of the tossing? The body cam of the LEO doesn't show anything clearly ... uponit7771 Apr 2021 #64
In an instant. BlueTsunami2018 Apr 2021 #94
Keep his distance, easy peasy. What is the alternative? Bad shooting hands down uponit7771 Apr 2021 #101
The Executioner yelled for him to stop and show me your hands - Lokee11 Apr 2021 #110
This message was self-deleted by its author DiamondShark Apr 2021 #114
He had his hands up. spanone Apr 2021 #20
This has to stop. luckone Apr 2021 #28
F**kin media is half the damn problem, anyone reporting that story should be sued for taking the CPD uponit7771 Apr 2021 #40
SCOTUS established guidelines when deadly force is justified Deminpenn Apr 2021 #46
Simple answer. Moostache Apr 2021 #70
Looked like murder to me. world wide wally Apr 2021 #31
His hands were up. Amazing how untrained our officers are, with itchy trigger fingers AZLD4Candidate Apr 2021 #33
"Amazing how untrained our officers are," WhiskeyGrinder Apr 2021 #50
Part of me wants to argue with you. CrackityJones75 Apr 2021 #56
. WhiskeyGrinder Apr 2021 #66
Yea I have read that. And I live here in Minneapolis CrackityJones75 Apr 2021 #76
OMG how did I miss you were in Mpls. WhiskeyGrinder Apr 2021 #78
Yeah all options are on the table for me in fixing our world. CrackityJones75 Apr 2021 #91
Bad training is still no training. This coming from a teacher of 16 years in four AZLD4Candidate Apr 2021 #72
The system sustains itself. People are trained this way because it upholds the system. WhiskeyGrinder Apr 2021 #74
He had his hands up Jilly_in_VA Apr 2021 #34
"I've had about all I can take of these cops who are not people." WhiskeyGrinder Apr 2021 #49
cameras off demand instant assumption of guilt, loss of pension & insurance - make it so bringthePaine Apr 2021 #37
+1, ... and why did they get close if they had to shoot ?! uponit7771 Apr 2021 #42
20 seconds Deminpenn Apr 2021 #43
"While 13 is still kid age, but, jmho, but 13 yr olds are much more sophisticated today." WhiskeyGrinder Apr 2021 #47
Didn't say that at all Deminpenn Apr 2021 #55
Y'all, this can't be reformed. WhiskeyGrinder Apr 2021 #44
Just saw the video. I am so fricking mad and crying. Shell_Seas Apr 2021 #58
There was a clear attempt at cover-up dalton99a Apr 2021 #77
Appeared to me the boy was following the command of the PO to show his hands. Kaleva Apr 2021 #79
Agreed. Not fast enough, apparently. WhiskeyGrinder Apr 2021 #82
I can't even... Nevilledog Apr 2021 #84
.... but it appears he did have a gun a split second before the shooting and tossed it (which the co riversedge Apr 2021 #95
I'm not convinced the kid had a gun to begin with but he complied with the LEO order uponit7771 Apr 2021 #100
At 2:30 am in a dark alley after shots were fired someone armed live love laugh Apr 2021 #97
This message was self-deleted by its author mucifer Apr 2021 #106
This message was self-deleted by its author DiamondShark Apr 2021 #116
If you have a gun and you're around cops at all, assume you're getting shot gulliver Apr 2021 #115
This message was self-deleted by its author DiamondShark Apr 2021 #117
Two different societies, true, but also context gulliver Apr 2021 #118
This message was self-deleted by its author DiamondShark Apr 2021 #119

gratuitous

(82,849 posts)
3. "Leaders have asked people to remain peaceful"
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 04:27 PM
Apr 2021

Have you ever heard that advice from our leaders when a cop is shot and killed? How about from the cop's family? His friends? Cohort on the police force?

Arazi

(6,829 posts)
5. Oh gee, maybe he didn't mean to kill him. Officer sounds shocked 1!!1! He only fired once11!!1
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 04:30 PM
Apr 2021

Must be an accident!!11! It was a "stressful" situation11!!1

Sickening.

Utterly sickening.

Fuck these fucking racist cops. Really. Just fuck them all the way to hell



Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
6. May be. The suicide rate after officers have killed kids is pretty high.
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 04:32 PM
Apr 2021

I'm not going to watch this dreadful tragedy.

Arazi

(6,829 posts)
8. I. Don't. Care.
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 04:34 PM
Apr 2021

Other than this pig shouldn't get off so easily by killing himself. He should rot in prison for the rest of his life

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
102. Perhaps at least you can understand how trumpist extremists feel then.
Fri Apr 16, 2021, 07:51 AM
Apr 2021

Coming from different directions to a point of commonality where..., what? Whatever, understanding in itself is good.

Demovictory9

(32,482 posts)
24. well probably... "let's get our stories straight"
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 04:58 PM
Apr 2021

it's up to experts to determine category of action but the supervisor turns off cameras to stop providing addition info and get stories staight

joshcryer

(62,277 posts)
98. Absolutely. Body cam needs to be on 100% of the time.
Fri Apr 16, 2021, 05:51 AM
Apr 2021

OK, because some crybaby cops will cry that they can't take a piss or shit with it on, turn it off when they go to the bathroom.

superpatriotman

(6,253 posts)
12. Was the youth armed?
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 04:41 PM
Apr 2021

Can’t tell by reading the shitty reporting:

The body-camera footage appears to show Toledo standing near the fence with a gun in his hand, holding it behind his back.

Immediately after commanding Toledo to show his hands, the officer shot the boy at close distance. Toledo’s hands were raised when he was shot, the footage shows.

Toledo collapses into the parking lot.

Footage released by police does not show Toledo point or raise a gun at the officer at the end of the chase. Toledo does not appear to be holding the gun as an officer shot him, though video does not clearly show him dropping the gun.


If he WAS armed, it may be hard to justify not using force.

sarisataka

(18,821 posts)
29. Yes,
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 05:06 PM
Apr 2021

He had a gun in his right hand when he arrived at the fence. It seems he dropped it while turning so he did not have it when the cop fired.

uponit7771

(90,367 posts)
41. There's nothing in the video showing the kid had anything in his hands before getting shot ...
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 05:34 PM
Apr 2021

... I'm looking at video below and pause starting at 2:00 at .25 ... there's no gun shown in the kids hands.

The LEO also turned off bodycam ... whatever he says in his favor is bullshit now



sarisataka

(18,821 posts)
45. Watch the 2:03-2:04 range
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 05:43 PM
Apr 2021

Here is a still pulled from there where the gun is in his hand behind his back. I need a bigger screen than my phone to see if it can be determined when he drops it.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EzCsSOVXMAoWDPQ?format=jpg&name=900x900

uponit7771

(90,367 posts)
59. That's not a gun, its part of the fence behind him. Even if they found a gun at the scene they
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 06:03 PM
Apr 2021

... can't be trusted because they cut the video on the body cam.

The officer shouldn't be given the benefit of the doubt when they do flaky shit like that.

sarisataka

(18,821 posts)
68. It isn't a part of the fence
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 06:19 PM
Apr 2021

There is nothing corresponding to that shape after the kids falls.

They body cam captured the pursuit, shooting and some of the aftermath. We have the views we need although the supervisor who gave that order should be disciplined

uponit7771

(90,367 posts)
99. No we don't have those views and no one is confirming he had a gun but a few people
Fri Apr 16, 2021, 06:07 AM
Apr 2021

.... there's no solid picture of a gun before the shooting and no account of a gun afterwards

SYFROYH

(34,185 posts)
109. They did find a handgun with the slide locked back next to the fence.
Fri Apr 16, 2021, 09:53 AM
Apr 2021


I think it is very possible that he had the gun in his hand at that time in the above picture, swung it behind the fence, continued turning, and showed his hands. The above picture with what looks like a gun appears to show the first 1 1/2 inches of the barrel as would be the case with a typical handgun with the slide locked back.

Although a close call, it appears the kid did not have a gun in his hand when the cop made the decision to shoot, but it does appear he had a gun a second earlier.

mucifer

(23,576 posts)
105. Shots fired. The kid did have a gun. He dropped it. He did NOT have it on him when he was killed
Fri Apr 16, 2021, 08:43 AM
Apr 2021

I don't think this is the same as George Floyd's murder.

The cop immediately called 911 and started CPR.

It's bad. But, it's not the same.

Deminpenn

(15,290 posts)
107. Thanks
Fri Apr 16, 2021, 09:04 AM
Apr 2021

Agree that this is different from the Floyd death. This cop did call for an ambulance immediately and rendered aid. Still bad, though.

It also makes you wonder where are the parents that their 13 yr old son is out in the middle of the night? I know it's different today what with many single parent households and people working multiple jobs to make ends meet. Kids can be sneaky, too, fooling their parents about what they are doing. Still...

Response to mucifer (Reply #105)

Dustlawyer

(10,497 posts)
65. He tossed the gun behind the fence and then turned to face the officer.
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 06:15 PM
Apr 2021

I think the cop knew he had a gun but fired too quickly before he could see the kids hands were now empty. The cop made a fatal mistake.

We do ourselves no favors when we claim all killings are with racist or murderous intent. Chauvin wanted George Floyd dead and should have been charged with 1st degree murder. Here I do not believe it was the case. It is really tough when it is a kid but this is more manslaughter absent facts showing he wanted to kill for other reasons than self defense.

WhiskeyGrinder

(22,467 posts)
67. .
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 06:19 PM
Apr 2021
We do ourselves no favors when we claim all killings are with racist or murderous intent.


Except Adam Toledo's death came at the very end of a series of decisions made within a white supremacist framework. We don't need to "claim" racist or murderous intent. The very existence of the police is racist and oppressive.

Arazi

(6,829 posts)
71. "Put up your fucking hands" then blam! Hands up, no gun
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 06:28 PM
Apr 2021

How can that not be racist and murderous on the face of it?

Officer gives the order then shoots instantly. This is shades of 12 yr old Tamir Rice who similarly got shot within a second of the officer arriving.

The assumption is black people are dangerous.

The default by the police is black people are dangerous

bullwinkle428

(20,631 posts)
92. Oh, might he have been armed at some point? Then please tell me why
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 08:33 PM
Apr 2021

Kyle Rittenhouse is walking around and breathing today.

sheshe2

(83,967 posts)
32. Covering up evidence.
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 05:09 PM
Apr 2021

Why have body cams if you turn them off? The supervisor should be fired for that command as should the officer.

pandr32

(11,631 posts)
14. Why even bother to raise hands in compliance anymore?
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 04:46 PM
Apr 2021

What the hell do these police want from their 'suspects'? There is no way to appease their hatred and fear of Black men and boys.

I read something years ago (cannot recall the source) that claimed that slave owners feared the males because of their muscular power and presumed sexual superiority. Plantation owners were not in the same kind of physical shape--mostly due to their easy life of excess. The only way to feel superior was by taking the means of power at their disposal to control the 'beasts' they imagined their slaves to be.
It appears the same irrational fears still exist.

WhiskeyGrinder

(22,467 posts)
52. Reform after reform is what got us here. Reform got us George Floyd. Brooklyn Center, whose cops
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 05:48 PM
Apr 2021

killed Daunte Wright, was held up a year ago as an example of successful reforms. Reform isn't enough. Abolish it all.

WhiskeyGrinder

(22,467 posts)
75. I would argue that we don't.
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 06:32 PM
Apr 2021

Community policing is still policing, and turns the community against itself.

WhiskeyGrinder

(22,467 posts)
81. A crisis team from my insurance company.
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 06:44 PM
Apr 2021

Why did someone steal my TV? What need of theirs was not being met?

ashredux

(2,609 posts)
83. Well, it is obvious that you really don't have a clue and really are not able to debate the issue
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 06:46 PM
Apr 2021

I’m not saying that the policing as we know it now is good. I’m saying we need a police force, and we can do that with community based policing where the police officers know the people in the community and the community knows them. I’m really not sure what you’re trying to say, but it appears you have some issues.

WhiskeyGrinder

(22,467 posts)
85. .
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 06:55 PM
Apr 2021
Well, it is obvious that you really don't have a clue and really are not able to debate the issue
How so? What do I need after someone steals my TV? I need a new TV, for one. That's what insurance is for. What do I need after that? Maybe some advice about how to keep my home safer, which my insurance company should be able to provide.

I’m saying we need a police force
For what?

we can do that with community based policing where the police officers know the people in the community and the community knows them.
Brooklyn Center, Minn., was held up as an excellent example of community policing. Guess what happened? Daunte Wright was murdered. Community policing turns communities against themselves.

I’m really not sure what you’re trying to say,
I'll spell it out. I'm saying that the police cannot be reformed, that as a white supremacist institution it exists to protect only itself and white supremacy, and that reform is impossible, so it must be abolished.

but it appears you have some issues.
So I've been told.

apnu

(8,759 posts)
103. Maybe we should get rid of guns?
Fri Apr 16, 2021, 07:57 AM
Apr 2021

Then the cops won't be in a state of total fear. Or, at least, have that excuse.

Also, bonus to getting rid of guns, less children will have access to them. Imagine that, children who don't have guns. Crazy right?

Binkie The Clown

(7,911 posts)
60. In the last 25 or 30 years I spoke with the police only once...
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 06:05 PM
Apr 2021

...when a neighbor passed away and I found her body. They were very polite and understanding. Outside of that, I stay far away from them. If I walk into a store and there's a police officer there, I turn around and walk back out and wait in the parking lot for them to leave. Police officers make me VERY nervous. Just the sight of a pistol on their belt ties my gut in knots. And I'm an elderly white male. I can only imagine how the young, the non-male, and non-white must feel. One twitch of an index finger and you're entire life can be taken away from you. Guns are supremely evil inventions. I learned to shoot in the Air Force, but I also learned to throw a grenade. I don't wish to ever handle, or even see either one again. Ever.

ashredux

(2,609 posts)
86. My late brother was a cop...he was not perfect but I saw it up close.
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 07:18 PM
Apr 2021

It’s difficult...it can be demoralizing...we have many now who do not belong in our community police force. We need to change it. Not “demolish it”....

I’m not sure WHAT you would have in its place....

Binkie The Clown

(7,911 posts)
93. Situation Appropriate Response
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 08:58 PM
Apr 2021

Here in Eugene, OR we have an organization called "Cahoots" https://www.eugene-or.gov/4508/CAHOOTS

For example, when someone is having a mental health crisis, DO NOT send armed thugs to shoot the victim, as has happened here in the past. Instead, send someone trained to deal with mental health crises. Come with the intention of de-escalating and helping, not with guns blazing like mindless militarized robots trained only to shoot first and ask question, maybe, later.

apnu

(8,759 posts)
104. Its the guns.
Fri Apr 16, 2021, 08:02 AM
Apr 2021

Cheap easy access to guns and poor human decision making is the problem. If there are no guns, cops won't presume every perp has one and do this stuff.

No amount of training will change the fight or flight reflexes we all have.

BlueTsunami2018

(3,505 posts)
19. That's a split second call.
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 04:53 PM
Apr 2021

This may be an unpopular opinion but I’m not so sure I can fault the officer here. The kid did have a gun. He may have dropped it before he turned around but it’s hard to see because his hand is partially behind the fence. The picture shown there, which is sure to be plastered everywhere very soon, doesn’t really tell the story of the video I watched. That’s a millisecond of the event. My opinion can change with further evidence but, from what I saw on the video, this is a neutral shoot.

Regardless, it isn’t going to turn out well.

uponit7771

(90,367 posts)
23. No it's not The kid was unarmed and if it was that split second stay the fuck away
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 04:56 PM
Apr 2021

... what's the kid stopped it's damn common sense not to get closer

Every single time we see one of these shits happening these bastards are escalating and doing stuff that's not even common sense to civilians

BlueTsunami2018

(3,505 posts)
48. I don't think you watched the same video.
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 05:45 PM
Apr 2021

And certainly not with an unbiased perspective.

But I expect this to be a thing. And the police have asked to be judged that way for so long that it’s difficult to feel sympathy.

This wasn’t the sort of blatant police murder we’ve seen before. Not to my eye.

uponit7771

(90,367 posts)
61. I watched the video, there was no gun in kids hand and there has been no still pick with a clear gun
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 06:06 PM
Apr 2021

... from his hand ether.

The LEO cut the video right after the shooting and does not deserve the benefit of the doubt.

If the leo didn't cut the vid I can see peoples perspective about a close call, they don't get one when there's nothing OPENLY CLEAR CUT and they stop video

uponit7771

(90,367 posts)
63. There's a video from the body cam and nothing in the video shows clearly the kid with a gun and
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 06:08 PM
Apr 2021

... the leo cut video after the shooting so they lose the benefit of the doubt afterwards.

The leo cut the video is stupid, if things were on the up an up or even close why cut video?!?!

Nah, murder

Lokee11

(235 posts)
62. Adam Toledo Did NOT have a gun!
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 06:08 PM
Apr 2021

He tossed it right before the executioner got there and not as he was turning. And I presume the reason he dropped it was so he would NOT get shot. Hands are clearly up WITHOUT a weapon.


There is another video from behind the fence that shows before - I repeat BEFORE - he even started to turn he tossed the gun some feet from him.


I hope you can find it for I have to log off because I am too infuriated right now.

He turned with his hands clearly up without a weapon and was shot dead - WHAT THE FUCK - Seriously🤬

✊🏼!

uponit7771

(90,367 posts)
64. Do you have a video of the tossing? The body cam of the LEO doesn't show anything clearly ...
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 06:10 PM
Apr 2021

... and I still wonder why the LEO would get close to the kid if he was still in a situation to pull the trigger.

These guys do stuff that makes no sense on its face

BlueTsunami2018

(3,505 posts)
94. In an instant.
Fri Apr 16, 2021, 01:42 AM
Apr 2021

How is the cop supposed to know he didn’t still have it? I’m sorry but take your emotion out of it.

Lokee11

(235 posts)
110. The Executioner yelled for him to stop and show me your hands -
Fri Apr 16, 2021, 10:08 AM
Apr 2021

If that "instant' is too much for him to understand the kid is complying with his directions and he is in such fear he needs to shoot the kid who clearly turns "showing his hands" with his hands up WITHOUT a gun - then HE SHOULD NOT BE A LEO AND FURTHERMORE HE NEEDS TO BE PROSECUTED FOR MURDERING WHAT WAS AN UNARMED 13 YEAR OLD CHILD!

But maybe my emotions is what is making the video show that he does not have a gun when he turns with his hands up, maybe it is my emotions that is making me come to the conclusion that when I watch this video below and at the 1:34 mark they find a gun laying up against the fence - it is the object that at the 2:24 mark of the video Adam is seen tossing in that exact area behind the fence -

[link:

|

it shows, it is blurry, but shows him toss something behind the fence in that area. So yeah, maybe it is my emotions that comes to the conclusion that if in the video it is seen that Adam tossed something in the exact same area where the gun was found - prior to turning around, it was the gun he tossed, and thus when he turned around he did not have the gun.

No matter how much the cop wanted, needed, assumed, thought, feared, concluded, and so on and so forth, that he had a gun at that moment - Truth is - he did not!

But yeah you're right, I mean who am I going to believe the Chicago Police Department or these emotional lyin' fuckin eyes of mine?

✊!

Response to BlueTsunami2018 (Reply #19)

luckone

(21,646 posts)
28. This has to stop.
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 05:00 PM
Apr 2021

?
How long has the local media here been feeding us the police story that yes, it’s a shame but he had a gun and pointed it at the police ?.?.?... I have to give them props on this one the myth is so solidly implanted in many Chicago citizens by now as fact on the news that if they do not see the video they may not believe it is so different from the story we were told here . It was all fake to keep down protests
We have the video camera now and unfortunately had to demand it after Laquan McDonald’s killing that CPD can’t stall like that for too long before releasing
Thanks to all active groups working with the family to release this terrible truth
Adam Toledo

uponit7771

(90,367 posts)
40. F**kin media is half the damn problem, anyone reporting that story should be sued for taking the CPD
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 05:30 PM
Apr 2021

...word for ANYTHING.

Why would a LEO get close to someone who he thinks he needs to plug, when the kid stopped he should've gotten further away vs up close.

Damn

Deminpenn

(15,290 posts)
46. SCOTUS established guidelines when deadly force is justified
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 05:44 PM
Apr 2021

Every time one of these shootings happens, you get the boilerplate from LE about the cop "fearing for his life" because that is what SCOTUS defined as justification for using deadly force.

Moostache

(9,897 posts)
70. Simple answer.
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 06:24 PM
Apr 2021

If anyone is actually so afraid for their life, they do not get a badge and a gun. Let them "serve the force" as a janitor or secretary or riding a desk and filing paperwork...they lack the ability to be trusted to handle a life threatening situation with the appropriate level of calm and bravery.

These cowards fire first, fake the scene second (call to turn OFF cams? yea...THAT is sure kosher...) and then they lie about being afraid.

He chased that kid, he drew his weapon and decided as soon as they were in a pursuit situation that he was going to shoot first, fake the reason later and claim fear last. That is standard operating procedure for LEO when they do this shit.

That kid may or may no have had a weapon at one time, but those ARE EMPTY HANDS WHEN HE TURNS and they are raised as he attempts to comply. That POS coward officer acted as judge, jury and executioner on that kid and that is NOT the duty of LEOs. Who did he protect there? Who did he serve? HIMSELF. He was an officer unfit for duty, an officer with deep prejudices and preconceived notions of conflict resolution and he was an officer that has seen too many reruns of "Lethal Weapon", thinking he is a latter-day Martin Riggs or Roger Murtaugh.

AZLD4Candidate

(5,798 posts)
33. His hands were up. Amazing how untrained our officers are, with itchy trigger fingers
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 05:11 PM
Apr 2021

and a "I am the law" mentality. Amazing how people will defend the officer.

WhiskeyGrinder

(22,467 posts)
50. "Amazing how untrained our officers are,"
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 05:46 PM
Apr 2021

They are trained to have this kind of reaction. This is a feature, not a bug.

 

CrackityJones75

(2,403 posts)
56. Part of me wants to argue with you.
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 05:59 PM
Apr 2021

Part of me wants to say “Then what?”

But then I have to stop and think... How many crimes do cops solve? How many do they actually deter? And then I have to ask “How many do they commit?l

Is the social contract enough to hold our society together? I am not sure it is. But I DO know that how we police is NOT working and needs ti fundamentally change. What we have is not the answer and is likely not doing us a hell of a lot of good.

WhiskeyGrinder

(22,467 posts)
66. .
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 06:15 PM
Apr 2021

If you're sincerely wrestling with these questions, I encourage you to read up on police abolition. www.mpd150.com has a ton of resources, using the Minneapolis Police Department, which has been "reformed" over and over again since its founding, as a case study. If we take the resources we throw at the cops, and instead use them to build a society that meets everyone's needs, then we can discard the concept of policing entirely.

 

CrackityJones75

(2,403 posts)
76. Yea I have read that. And I live here in Minneapolis
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 06:33 PM
Apr 2021

In parts of the city and in some suburbs there are national guard troops on every corner. To say that MInneapolis PD has been reformed is a damned joke. They may have said some shit that it was being “Reformed” but it never was. Same shit different decade. I completely agree with the concepts of building societies differently through redirecting police monies. I do think that there needs to be some form of “police”. What I don’t think is that we need to try to put people on the streets to try to “police” and expect that they can be prepared to deal with every aingle situation. They can’t because no human beings can do that. Regardless of how much we pay them or more to the point regardless of how much you arm them.

I have no problem with police pulling people over for speeding. Just do it fairly and you don’t need a damn gun to do that. I have no problem with checking peoples tabs as ling as thats where it ends. The person writing a ticket doesn’t need to be the one that is dealing with a warrant situation. They need to be dealing with traffic situations.

I even have no problem with a police in charge of handling warrants. But make that group of people trained and responsible for THAT job.

And fir christ same we nee people responding ti disturbances where a mental health situation is happening instead if a person with a gun.

Police have to tru to account fir EVERY damn possibility under the sun. And some of them are going to be racist assholes. At least if we limit the number of cops carrying heat we can look at that group of people more closely. Screen them better, and will not need that many cops armed and roaming around....


This shit is nuts. People that are pulling people over for expired tabs are locked and loaded for what??? To write a damn ticket? Shit needs to end.


Sorry I went off on a tangent. I am not arguing with you at all and thanks for giving me a lonk to that. Much appreciated.

WhiskeyGrinder

(22,467 posts)
78. OMG how did I miss you were in Mpls.
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 06:37 PM
Apr 2021

I must have mixed those gin and tonics stronger than I thought! (I've lived in Minneapolis, and now live in northern MN.)

Sorry I went off on a tangent. I am not arguing with you at all and thanks for giving me a lonk to that. Much appreciated.
No apologies needed, and no argument at all. I do believe that if we want to do things "fairly," "responsibly" and "better," to use words from your post, we can abolish it all. And I know it's a big step, and one that brings a lot of resistance. But I firmly believe the police cannot be fair or responsible as an institution, and as such should be abolished.

AZLD4Candidate

(5,798 posts)
72. Bad training is still no training. This coming from a teacher of 16 years in four
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 06:28 PM
Apr 2021

different countries.

In China, the only teach what's on the government tests, so they make good test takers and lousy students.

In our police academies, they are taught to shoot first, view people as the enemy, us v. them, and a Javert complex. Lousy training is no training.

Jilly_in_VA

(10,016 posts)
34. He had his hands up
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 05:14 PM
Apr 2021

His hands were EMPTY. You. Do. Not. Shoot. People. Whose. Empty. Hands. Are. Up. EVER!

Dumbass cop. Murdering dumbass cop. I've had about all I can take of these cops who are not people.

WhiskeyGrinder

(22,467 posts)
49. "I've had about all I can take of these cops who are not people."
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 05:45 PM
Apr 2021

They are people. They are people in a system we're told we need to be safe.

Deminpenn

(15,290 posts)
43. 20 seconds
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 05:41 PM
Apr 2021

IIRC, it was just on Deadline:WH that the entire encounter was 20 seconds. What stood out to me was how fast the cop escalated to losing his temper and swearing at Toledo. That in itself says to me this cop did not possess the requisite self-control to be a patrol officer.

While 13 is still kid age, but, jmho, but 13 yr olds are much more sophisticated today.

WhiskeyGrinder

(22,467 posts)
47. "While 13 is still kid age, but, jmho, but 13 yr olds are much more sophisticated today."
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 05:45 PM
Apr 2021

They're still 13 and don't deserve to be murdered by cops.

Shell_Seas

(3,336 posts)
58. Just saw the video. I am so fricking mad and crying.
Thu Apr 15, 2021, 06:02 PM
Apr 2021

THIRTEEN. He was just a baby. Enough is enough. I certainly won't be mad if Chicago burns it all down tonight. When is it going to end?

riversedge

(70,354 posts)
95. .... but it appears he did have a gun a split second before the shooting and tossed it (which the co
Fri Apr 16, 2021, 02:19 AM
Apr 2021

First time have seen this. ???



?s=20


Jesse Singal
@jessesingal
·
5h
1/ This is REALLY misleading. Almost dangerously so. He appeared to have a gun in his hand one moment before the shooting. I don't think anyone should be stating, with confidence, exactly what happened here, but it's a vital detail to leave out.

https://chicago.suntimes.com/news/2021/4/15/22383392/adam-toledo-shooting-video-released-chicago-police-bodycam
Quote Tweet
AJ+
@ajplus
· 9h
UPDATE: Chicago has released bodycam video of the police killing of 13-year-old #AdamToledo:

Black small square
The video shows Adam had his hands up when police opened fire, killing him.
Black small square
Cook County now says prosecutor made an error when they said Adam was holding a gun.

Tsukkomi
@ljenkins314
Replying to
@jessesingal
Yeah, I was convinced it was murder when I saw the video, but it appears he did have a gun a split second before the shooting and tossed it (which the cop likely didn’t know). It all happened in a second.



?s=20

uponit7771

(90,367 posts)
100. I'm not convinced the kid had a gun to begin with but he complied with the LEO order
Fri Apr 16, 2021, 06:18 AM
Apr 2021

... then got shot anyway.

If the cop was in danger then step away not get closer

Response to live love laugh (Reply #97)

Response to live love laugh (Reply #97)

gulliver

(13,197 posts)
115. If you have a gun and you're around cops at all, assume you're getting shot
Sat Apr 17, 2021, 10:45 AM
Apr 2021

... and be pleasantly surprised if you aren't. I don't know the kid had a gun for sure, but if he did, reality and probability aren't friends.

Response to gulliver (Reply #115)

gulliver

(13,197 posts)
118. Two different societies, true, but also context
Sat Apr 17, 2021, 11:53 AM
Apr 2021

True, had Rittenhouse been Black, he would now be a resident of the great beyond. But, also true, had Rittenhouse done what Toledo "might have" done, Rittenhouse would also likely be dead (less likely, but still likely).

Response to gulliver (Reply #118)

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