Per CNN: J&J falsely claims Moderna and Pfizer also linked to blood clots.

[JohnSJ]

On April 9, 2021, citing studies, J&J claimed blood clots have been reported "with all COVID-19 vaccines"

CNN spoke to the lead author of that study, Dr. Eun-Ju Lee, from Weill Cornell Medical College, and said: "We didn't find anyone with blood clots....We didn't find any of those scary things that are happening with Johnson & Johnson"

While the blood clots associated with the J&J vaccine are rare, the fact they they falsely cited a study to misrepresent the other vaccines is not only reprehensible and unethical, but contributes to vaccine hesitancy among some groups.

They are not reporting their previous false claim, but at the minimum they need to come out an apologize for the misinformation they conveyed on April 9

[underpants]

1. Link? These pharmas are not used to playing nice with each other.

Just saying

[JohnSJ]

3. No link, was watching it on CNN with Poppy Harlow and Jim Sciutto

[MisterNiceKitty]

2. That's interesting - also noticed this article published by CNBC

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/04/16/jj-asked-pfizer-moderna-to-help-study-blood-clots-but-they-declined-wsj.html

From the article:

"Johnson & Johnson privately asked Covid-19 vaccine rivals Pfizer and Moderna to join a study looking into the potential risk of blood clots but the companies declined, The Wall Street Journal reported Friday, citing people familiar with the matter.

Executives at Pfizer and Moderna said their vaccines appeared safe and they didn’t see the need to duplicate the efforts of regulators and companies already looking into the rare blood clot issue, according to the Journal report.

Only AstraZeneca, whose vaccine has also raised concerns from regulators over blood clots, agreed to join the effort, the Journal said."

Also the NY Times is reporting more cases of blood clots from J&J:

"On Tuesday morning, U.S. federal health regulators recommended a pause in the use of Johnson & Johnson’s Covid-19 vaccine while they investigated six reports of blood clots in women ages 18 to 48. One has died, and a second is hospitalized in critical condition.

On Wednesday, two more cases were added to the list: a seventh woman who received the vaccine after it was authorized, and a man who received it during a clinical trial.

Seven of the eight had blood clots in the brain."

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/13/health/blood-clots-johnson-vaccine.html

[JohnSJ]

4. That is interesting

[womanofthehills]

5. Blood clots as prevalent with Pfizer and Moderna vaccine as with AstraZeneca's: study

(They said this because the CDC lied and said the other two vaccines caused no blood clots when there have been reports of blood clots in NYT and on VAERS. Is the CDC favoring one vaccine over another?) Remember last week when the CDC director Walensky came out on Rachels's show and said you could not get the virus if you are vacinated and then quickly took it back the next day. Sounds like the CDC is getting too political.)

A study by Oxford University found the number of people who receive blood clots after getting vaccinated with a coronavirus vaccine are about the same for those who get Pfizer PFE, 0.51% and Moderna MRNA, -3.96% vaccines as they are for the AstraZeneca AZN, 1.62% vaccine that was produced with the university's help. According to the study, 4 in 1 million people experience cerebral venous thrombosis after getting the Pfizer or Moderna vaccine, versus 5 in 1 million people for the AstraZeneca vaccine. The risk of getting CVT is much higher for those who get COVID-19 -- 39 in a million patients -- than it is for those who get vaccinated. AstraZeneca's vaccine use has been halted or limited in many countries on blood clot concerns.

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/blood-clots-as-prevalent-with-pfizer-and-moderna-vaccine-as-with-astrazenecas-report-2021-04-15

[Pobeka]

6. I know that's a block quote but please pull the stock %change values out, very confusing.

[MisterNiceKitty]

7. Cerebral venous sinus thrombosis

Also, this blood clot type is not what might occur with people who, for instance, sit for several hours straight on a plane flight.

The Marketwatch article calls it "cerebral venous thrombosis."

In that NY Times article it says:

"In the United States alone, 300,000 to 600,000 people a year develop blood clots, according to C.D.C. data. But the six cases that led to the pause involved a rare combination of symptoms. The clots occurred in the brain, in a condition called known as cerebral venous sinus thrombosis. The clots were accompanied by low levels of platelets, a component of blood that helps form clots that normally help heal wounds."

[JohnSJ]

11. It is a similar issue that has been observed to happen with some on heparin therapy

[Ms. Toad]

13. Precisely -

Not just clots - but a specific location AND low platelets (which make hitting it with heparin dangerous)

(In addition, all who have developed this disorder have the same antibody as the heparin-induced variety)

[NH Ethylene]

8. Well that's interesting!

Last edited Mon Apr 19, 2021, 07:15 PM - Edit history (1)

ON EDIT - see reply #8

So people who have Covid had clots at the rate of 39/million and those who had an mRNA vaccine within 2 weeks had clotting at a rate of 4.1/million.

In comments on this site:
https://www.sciencemediacentre.org/expert-reaction-to-preprint-looking-at-incidence-of-rare-cerebral-venous-thrombosis-cvt-following-covid-19-infection-compared-to-incidence-after-vaccination-or-influenza/

One commenter suggested some people may have had Covid at the time of vaccination.

Another said, "the whole virus is more thrombogenic than the spike protein alone ... I have previously expressed my opinion that the thrombogenic interactor CD147 of the spike protein could be involved.”

[Ms. Toad]

14. Completely different disorder.

What caused the pause is the combination of cerebral venous sinus thrombisis WITH thrombocytopenia (low platelets).

https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/acip/meetings/downloads/slides-2021-04/03-COVID-Shimabukuro-508.pdf

While a couple of commenters mention it, the article itself focuses on thrombosis - not the much rarer disorder, since the main article does not even mention the thrombocytopenia. It is the combination of the two that dictated the pause.

It is incredibly irresponsible for J&J to attempt to muddle the two - as evidenced by the discussions here, it is clear that people are confused about the distinction.

[NH Ethylene]

15. Thanks for clarifying that! n/t

[hamsterjill]

9. This!

No one is saying the vaccines aren’t a great thing, but we still need honesty and transparency. Only with that can there be confidence.

[JohnSJ]

10. Oxford has lost a lot of credibility with their puffing up their vaccine before it was even released

Also the April 9th study that JNJ referenced, the person behind that study said no such link was observed with the Moderna and Pfizer/BionTech vaccine. JNJ falsely attributed something to a study that wasn’t there. This was reported on CNN this morning

The CDC didn’t lie

They never said it did or didn’t

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/different-vaccines/mRNA.html?CDC_AA_refVal=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.cdc.gov%2Fvaccines%2Fcovid-19%2Fhcp%2Fmrna-vaccine-basics.html


The fact is there has been a link found with the Oxford adenovirus vaccines, which hasn’t been observed with the mRNA vaccines is what the issue is. The mRNA vaccines are based on a different mechanism

Because a person gets a stroke doesn’t mean it was caused by a vaccine

There is a rare, but definite mechanism observed with Oxford’s vaccine.

The mRNA vaccines are revolutionary. The adenovirus vaccines are evolutionary

[Ms. Toad]

12. That is a DIFFERENT issue with clots, as I have repeatedly corrected misinformation

AstraZenca and J&J are the only two associated with the specific clotting disorder that triggered the pause:

Cerebral venous sinus thrombosis COMBINED WITH thrombocytopenia.

Page 15: 0 reports of CVST in Pfizer; 3 in Moderna - BUT none with thrombocytopenia

Cerebral venous thrombosis (note: this is a different thrombosis from CVST), in the absence of thrombocytopenia, can be treated with heparin - and occurs following vaccinations regardless of provider, and at roughly the same rate as in the general population.

In contrast, it is deadly to treat the rare disorder with heparin (page 25)- and this rare disorder occurs post vaccination with an adenovirus vector (AstraZeneca and Johnson and Johnson) at a rate of 3.5 - 15 times the rate in the general population page 6

Why is it so hard to understand the distinction between generaly clotting - and a specific deadly disorder that becomes more deadly if treated as ordinary thrombosis.