DOJ notifies the court that it will appeal a judge's order to release a March 2019 memo

[Nevilledog]

Link to tweet

Tweet text:
Zoe Tillman
@ZoeTillman
Now: DOJ notifies the court that it will appeal a judge's order to release a March 2019 memo re: not prosecuting Trump for obstruction in the Russia probe. More to come shortly.
Image

Looks like it's appealing releasing ALL of the memo

Link to tweet

Tweet text:
Zoe Tillman
@ZoeTillman
·
May 24, 2021
Replying to @ZoeTillman
UPDATE: In an accompanying motion asking for a stay, DOJ explains that they're actually partially appealing — they're okay with releasing part of the OLC memo, but not all of it https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/20788086/5-24-21-doj-motion-to-stay-olc-memo.pdf…
Image

[FirstLight]

1. ohhh-boy! keep us posted...

I have not been watching the news this week, just picking out headlines here & there online.

[Grasswire2]

2. Just covered with Schiff and MSNBC

Biden DOJ will be appealing the decision --- they want to protetct the memo!!

[StarfishSaver]

9. They're not trying to protect the Barr memo

They're trying to protect all of their future memos.

[KPN]

38. Protecting the Presidency or Presidential power is the absolute wrong decision given the

circumstances. I understand the objectivity fully, but big mistake given the times and the recent abuses. Protecting power is the wrong impulse.

[StarfishSaver]

40. It's actually the right decision here

Trump soured us on so much. But there are areas where it is critical for the power and prerogatives of the presidency to be protected, especially where Trump crapped all over it. There will be times when matters need to be kept confidential. For example, we don't need to have everything the DOJ does wide open to public scrutiny (particularly internal decision-making). If that's lost, it can never be regained and it won't be pretty.

[Grasswire2]

3. Schiff says BIG MISTAKE

He's very disappointed.

[BigmanPigman]

19. So is Neal Katyal.

He was just on Lawrence O'Donnell. He said it will take a year for it to get to the next step.

[dflprincess]

4. Damn

I hope this isn't going to turn into one of those things that get swept under the rug "for the good of the country". (Which really translates into "for the good of the powers that be".)

[Grasswire2]

5. Biden DOJ is protecting the memo from release.

Neal Katyal up next on MSNBC

[Grasswire2]

6. Tune in now to hear Katyal response to this news. nt

[Takket]

7. some context before we burn Garland at the stake...

https://www.reuters.com/business/legal/us-attorney-general-garland-weighs-release-trump-era-obstruction-memo-2021-05-21/

There are competing interests that Garland must balance in making his decision even if he may personally disapprove of Barr's conduct, said Bradley Moss, a national security lawyer in Washington who has been following the litigation.

An appeal would signal to civil servants in the Justice Department that Garland will back them in court when they come under fire, Moss said.

"For Garland, one interest here is the need to defend the honor and integrity of the department," Moss said. "The competing interest, of course, is the desire for some transparency."

~snip~

Garland may simply be going through the motions on this to help eliminate any sort of appearance of bias by rushing to release the memo. I think he's wasting his time since the drumpf party will eviscerate him no matter what happens, even if an appellate court turns him upside down and shakes the memo out of his pockets.

As for defending the honor of the department, i have a hart time believing people in DOJ see it that way. They spent 4 years watching Session and Barr trample every norm, every matter of honor, and lifetimes of work or loyal public servants that were reticulated, humiliated, branded traitors and fired. I find it hard to believe they want to see this dragged out so they will know Garland "has their back". I would think they would see "having their back" as exposing what Barr did to their once beloved DOJ.

But that's just my opinion. I don't work within those walls.

[StarfishSaver]

15. I think this is right

They're also probably trying to protect their own prerogatives in the future.

[Snackshack]

43. Honor & Integrity

Of the Dept. No

It was the honor and integrity of a department that got trash when a special counsel said one thing and the a corrupt AG said another which is why Crew sued. Even the Judge said Barr lied. In any normal above board DOJ action there would be no lawsuit and a Judge ordering a release of internal DOJ workings because the judge concluded the AG lied to the Country.

This is about as Biden has stated the desire to look forward not backward just like we got with Obama which is half the reason we are in the mess. They even waited until the very last hour that was left to file.

[uponit7771]

53. +1

[calimary]

60. Even so, Takket, it does help a little toward a better understanding of possible motivation.

Building back better is something that’s gonna take TIME. Unfortunately, TONS of time.

Maybe more than we have.

[LaMouffette]

8. I wonder if the DOJ is doing this to try to keep the Biden administration above the fray.

They're appealing the order to release the highly damaging memo so that it won't appear as if Biden is going after his political enemies, which he wouldn't do (that being a dick move that only someone like Trump would do).

[StarfishSaver]

12. They're likely trying to protect their own and future administration's documents

There are good reasons to keep DOJ memos confidential. The problem is not that memos aren't public but that Barr and Trump so abused the process they have made it difficult for future administrations who aren't engaging in inappropriate, unethical and illegal behavior.

They are probably doing this to protect the prerogatives of future administrations. They're trying not to set a new precedent that will make it hard for them to keep things that need to be confidential out of public hands and away from opposing parties who will try to use them for the wrong reasons. But that is probably impossible now. Trump broke so many things for everyone who comes behind him.

[LaMouffette]

18. That makes sense. I bet you're right.

It's interesting that they are partially appealing the order. Hopefully the part of the order that is made public will be revealing enough.

[Grasswire2]

10. Neal Katyal: "This is the people's memo"

He's on MSNBC right now.

[Grasswire2]

11. "This is what Garland has done: Normalizing an abnormal framing and an abnormal memo"

Judge Jackson has READ the memo.

This is going to mean some trouble.

[GoodRaisin]

13. Not shocked at this appeal by Garland's DOJ

Disappointed though.

[Ocelot II]

14. I think they are appealing it (or part of it) in a largely performative attempt to show

they are serious about the principle of protecting executive communications in a nonpartisan manner, but with the knowledge they will probably lose. At that point the rest of the memo can be released and the DoJ can blame the GOP whining on the DC circuit. I don't think they have gone Trumpy.

[StarfishSaver]

17. This

[Ocelot II]

23. I just read the notice of appeal.

The DoJ's argument isn't unreasonable; they are pointing out, correctly, that the government sometimes needs to protect its deliberative processes, and once the cat is out of the bag you can't get it back in. The counter-argument, which Neil Katyal pointed out, is that this particular circumstance is extraordinary because of Barr's outright deception, and so the case shouldn't be decided under the usual rules about these situations. This also makes all kinds of sense.

I guess we'll just have to wait and see what happens.

[StarfishSaver]

32. This sounds good

They are obviously working toward getting this memo treated as an exception while protecting their prerogative to maintain confidentially on their memos in the future.

This is the correct and responsible approach, in my opinion.

[cilla4progress]

35. Yes,

I agree this is one likely explanation.

Hopefully, the right one and ultimately it will be released.

[Grasswire2]

16. This appeal will take A YEAR to process...

...and the memo will remain secret during that time.

So saith Neal Katyal.

[StarfishSaver]

20. I don't agree with Katyal that it will take a year

It would take that long if DOJ fights it tooth and nail, but I don't think they will.

[Grasswire2]

22. He, having argued cases before SCOTUS, has a little advantage here. nt

[StarfishSaver]

25. Yes, he knows a lot. It doesn't mean he's always right

I don't agree with him on this.

I have more legal experience than you have, but that doesn't stop you from regularly challenging me.

It's like that. Except I actually have experience with what Katyal is talking about.

[dem4decades]

24. Did you stay in a Holiday Inn Express last night?

[StarfishSaver]

27. Didn't need to

My 30+ years experience as an attorney and law professor is more than enough to enable me to form an informed opinion.

[Grasswire2]

31. Gee. Dershowitz has a similar CV. nt

[StarfishSaver]

33. Lol

Are you going for the most pathetic comeback of the day prize? If so, you aced it.

Looking forward to you dismissing Neal Katyal's opinion because Ted Cruz argued more Supreme Court cases than he did and Robert Bork was a "real" Solicitor General, unlike Katyal, who was only acting SG.

Keep digging, though. It's quite entertaining

[Ocelot II]

26. The plaintiff/appellee can ask for an expedited hearing, I think.

[StarfishSaver]

28. They can

They can also not drag it out with delaying tactics.

[Ocelot II]

29. Betcha they'll do it.

[Cetacea]

21. I hope there is a very good reason for this

wtf

[StarfishSaver]

30. I think we can assume the Biden administration has good reasons for everything they do

Or, at the very least, we shouldn't leap to the conclusion that they have bad motives for what they do.

[BobTheSubgenius]

41. That is certainly my default condition.

I have been shown absolutely zero reason to think anything else. These last 5 months have been like a revelation to me.

[Ocelot II]

34. They are kind of walking a tightrope - arguing that there are situations

where some deliberative processes by the executive need to remain confidential, while acknowledging that some parts of the memo can be released now. From a strictly legal/theoretical viewpoint this is not an unreasonable position. A question on appeal could likely be whether Barr's deliberative processes were so far outside the norm that they are not entitled to the usual protection. It's not unreasonable for the DoJ to want to bounce that question upstairs to an appellate court for a more definitive decision.

[Cetacea]

37. Thank you for your measured reply, Ocelot II

I was just a bit taken aback and a bit stunned.

[StarfishSaver]

39. Ocelot is dead on

[monkeyman1]

36. or , they just might re-open the Russia mess to get to the bottom of it ??

[Snackshack]

42. Well, I had hope...

* Garland won't release the memo on Trump and obstruction
* Yellen won't release Trump's tax returns
* Wray won't investigate the elites behind the attempted coup
* Biden won't restructure board to get rid of DeJoy
* Dems won't pass voting rights


But as I was told once hope is the minds way of phucking itself.

[StarfishSaver]

44. Why would you say "Dems won't pass voting rights"?

That's abjectly false.

Actually, most of your OP is false and the rest is misleading and suggests you don't understand how any of these areas of government work.

But your attempt to smear Democrats is noted.

[Snackshack]

46. Your.

Complete lack of any evidence to the counter is very persuasive.

The appeal in the last hour speaks for volume. As for protecting future workings/memo of DOJ unless they are anticipating another corrupt AG that completely contradicts a Special Counsel. There should be very little comcern about future internal workings at the DOJ ending up in court due to a lawsuit and having a Judge order a release of documents because the AG lied. But it happened once so...

Yellen has been Sec. of Treasury for how long? It is kind of a moot point since the NYT story. However it is still a point of contention. Maybe it would interfere with what Vance is doing although that seems unlikely.

Biden could have replaced the entire board. Given the nature and severity of what DeJoy did at the USPS during an election year (no less) there is a very compelling case to have done just that in order to replace him.

Perhaps I jumped the gun on Dems and voting rights they still some time. However I see no urgency on their part to address it or a will to upset the GOP. They are still trying to get the GOP happy with investigating an attempted overthrow of the Government. Not too mention there has been nothing about getting members of their own party Sinema/Manchin to agree with the party they are members of. That coupled with McConnells “scorched earth” threat. Killing the filibuster to pass voting rights seems highly unlikely.

I’ve been a Dem all my life. Since 2000 I have seen them cave over and over and over to the GOP from Gore to the Iraq War, Patriot Act, Katrina, Torture, Financial Collapse. Then 8 years of having no response to massive obstruction by the GOP to Obama. Then the last 4 years of the most corrupt president ever who has killed 600,000 Americans attempted a coup. Colluded with a hostile power, obstructed justice etc etc etc. Dems have had the majority in the house since 2018. GOP made all kinds of hay out of Benghazi had the Dems on defense forever. Dems had all of this above as far as holding people accountable and applying the rule of law... all they got was 1 vote of contempt against Barr and to this day I don’t think there was ever any real consequences for him due to that. I’m not smearing the Dems I’m stating the facts. A Paul Wellstone, Ted Kennedy or Al Franken would have never been so lackadaisical in defending rule of law, what’s right. The current Dem party is way too timid Pelosi and Schumer needs to be giving speeches like Tim Ryan the other but instead they tweet.

[StarfishSaver]

47. Nowhere in that hot mess of a word salad did you answer my question

[Snackshack]

48. The answer is there.

It’s a bit comprehensive but you should be able to grasp it if you read it.

[StarfishSaver]

51. No wonder you couldn't/won't answer the question

Apparently, you copied and pasted, verbatim, someone else's words without any link or attribution. I guess if I want an answer, I should ask the person who actually wrote the words, not the person who passed them off as theirs.

[moonscape]

50. It was Sarah Kendzior who tweeted that

earlier tonight. A direct lift.

[StarfishSaver]

52. Nice catch

Some people have no shame.

[moonscape]

49. Giving Kendzior, who tweeted this

earlier, credit:

Link to tweet

[uponit7771]

55. Right ... do all this is 4 months ?! The "phucking" is in the wrong information you got on how fast

... shit moves in the worlds 3rd largest country by population.

[Justice matters.]

45. "CITIZENS FOR RESPONSIBILITY AND ETHICS IN WASHINGTON"

With a name like that (and for transparency), they will win this appeal.

By the time this case will be resolved, Don McGahn will have shown up in the House (next week) at the Judiciary Committee.

[UCmeNdc]

54. Why???????

[uponit7771]

56. Good answers from StarFishSaver here (link)

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=15462788

Looks like Biden is dotting I's and crossing T's SFS has a decent hit record

[Fullduplexxx]

57. Happy fitzmas everyone

[kentuck]

58. Interesting comments.

Last edited Tue May 25, 2021, 06:48 AM - Edit history (1)

I do not believe the DOJ is attempting to cover up anything. There is a reason they do not want to release the entire OLC memo. (I'm not so sure it is to protect the future status of requests from the DOJ) I'm thinking it may be to protect possible future charges against Trump and his Russian connections?

I do not believe the "obstruction" charges from the Mueller investigation have been written off yet. In my opinion, some may be waiting for the testimony of Don McGahn, to finalize their strategy?

I do not believe it is totally about "precedent".

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

59. Kick