If we lose control of Congress in these upcoming midterms, do not assume that there will

[Atticus]

be a "next election" that means anything. I think it likely that a Trump Party Congress would impeach, convict and remove President Biden and possibly also Vice President Harris. The 2024 "election" would be decided by Congress as they simply would refuse to confirm ANY Democrat.

That the Trumpies are intent on stealing the midterms is no longer really a subject of debate. GOP state legislators are working tirelessly across the nation to make it as difficult as possible for people who might "vote wrong" to cast their ballots. Taking their cue from their Dear Leader, they no longer hesitate to "say the quiet part out loud" and have adopted shameless arrogance as "the Republican way". They are ready and willing to do ANYTHING---no exceptions or restrictions--- to win control of the Congress, the next and last election and the nation's future.

Those citizens who are able to stay registered or get re-registered and make their way to the long lines at the new distant polling places chosen by Trump loyalists may find themselves confronted by angry partisan Trumpist "poll watchers". And, you know what? They've got to do that and we've got to help them.

As long as we are healthy, we will be voting early in Illinois so we will be free to canvass again in Ohio or Wisconsin or WHEREVER we can help get our voters out on election day. We will be contributing financially to help fund a legal strike force capable of responding to the Trump cults theft attempts. If we lose the Congress in 2022, I don't want it to be because I was sitting on my ass whining about how "mean" those damn Trumpies are. Stuff needs doing.

Again---don't assume there'll be another election if we lose this one. All our chips are on the table.

[Pobeka]

1. The 67 votes in the Senate hurdle won't let them remove Biden or Harris.

But you're right, they'll impeach multiple times just for the sound bytes.

On edit: Yes, with minority votes suppressed in 2024, I see no way to retain a DEM in the WH, we got there in 2020 by margins that were too narrow to lose any votes to suppression.

[andym]

2. 67 Senators (2/3) NT.

[Pobeka]

3. Yep, corrected, thanks. n/t

[Atticus]

16. You are correct. My bad as to conviction. I was thinking of the 60 vote threshold for

a filibuster and assumed they would kill that in order to oust Joe. But, it is a 2/3 or 67 vote requirement per the Constitution.

Intercranial flatulence.

[FBaggins]

22. They can't get to 60 either

Only 14 Democrats are even up for re-election next year and ten of them aren’t competitive races.

[Atticus]

25. Understood. I was incorrectly assuming that they could get rid of the "60 vote threshhold"

and convict with a simple majority. As I said, my bad.

[Pobeka]

34. " Intercranial flatulence." Thanks for making me laugh.

No worries -- I have my share of that brain condition too

[Silent3]

26. They can also refuse to confirm the 2024 election results

...if Biden wins, and a simple majority is required for the vote to be confirmed, not 2/3 against the confirmation.

That should be, as it always has been, simply a ceremonial act, but if a Republican majority simply refuses to confirm a Democratic presidential victory, we'd be in uncharted territory, with a 6-3 Republican SCOTUS deciding the outcome.

[mountain grammy]

32. Exactly..

wonder how Manchin will feel about that?

[Lancero]

38. He prefers bipartisanship...

So he'll support it, it'd be to partisan for his tastes otherwise.

[uponit7771]

4. K&R, there are still people who think you're being hyperbolic despite the evidence that is in front

... of the world regarding the intentions of the GQP and voting access.7

People think the dems can just brute force our way into winning elections after GQP reduces access to voting when that hasn't worked anywhere in the world consistently after a reduction to voting access.

We need to push our representative to turn up the rhetoric and themes against voter suppression and put this a top of the list of threats to America along with 1/6 terrorist.

Where is Bloomberg or the other wealthy dem candidates when it comes to our democracy being threatened ?!!?

[Mad_Machine76]

5. Does this assume

That these new voting laws won’t be challenged with some elements likely overturned?

[Mr.Bill]

6. I think the courts are our best

if not only option for fighting this.

[FoxNewsSucks]

10. 6-3 Roberts SCROTUS?

and all the lower courts packed by Moscow Mitch?

Not good odds. I don't trust them to preserve democracy.

[Mr.Bill]

11. They all came through against

all the Trump post election bullshit, didn't they?

[FoxNewsSucks]

13. That was such pure bullshit, there was no way to uphold any of it

Besides, while MF45 may have something on them all, they do hate him.

John Roberts will find ways to get the outcomes the fascist corporate right wants.

He has a history of that. Including sending back a case telling them specifically to refile in a different way so he could use the ruling to set the precedent he wanted.

The increased fascist control will lead to more of that.

[Mr.Bill]

15. I'm betting they also hate the idea

of a state legislature being able to overturn the results of an election, too.

[FoxNewsSucks]

18. Well, I sure hope you're right

I'm just not a big gambler and don't like the odds given the importance

[onetexan]

33. Yea i dont see the courts upholding that either

[Crunchy Frog]

7. The DOJ and the House may want to consider getting their acts together.

(There need to be Bengazi type hearings in the House, and SOON.)

[gab13by13]

19. I'm still waiting for the DOJ

to show up in Arizona where federal election laws are being violated.

This thread tells it like it is, people don't realize how serious this shit is. Schumer should be bringing up bills every day, every week to break the filibuster. He should be bringing up S1 every day.

What makes people think that the new GQP will adhere to the Constitution for impeaching Biden and Harris? They don't play the same game that Democrats play.

[SledDriver]

8. The Trump side only has to win one election to end the American experiment.

[Mad_Machine76]

12. It does?

Please show your work

[Elessar Zappa]

9. Biden wouldn't be convicted.

It takes 67 Senate votes.

[gab13by13]

20. Why do you think the GQP will follow the Constitution?

They are breaking federal election law right now in Arizona and our DOJ does nothing.

[Elessar Zappa]

35. If they tried to say Biden

is convicted with 51 votes, the entire administration as well as DOJ and Secret Service would laugh in their face. Mitch McConnell is not all powerful.

[Mad_Machine76]

14. While I know that we are treading into dangerous waters with Trumpism infecting the GOP writ large

Can you please explain how this is the end to all free and fair elections in this country? Some of the GOP voting laws are likely to be successfully challenged in court.

[gab13by13]

21. Not according to the top lawyer

who has been filing appeals in court. He said that much of what the GQP is doing is legal and he also said that he can't stop them by merely challenging them in the courts. He said it is up to Congress to pass minimum standards that the states must follow - S1.

[Atticus]

23. As Max Boot just said on CNN as I type this at 9:09 p.m. in Illinois, it is "very possible"

that we are witnessing the death of American democracy.

Yes, what I said is alarming and extreme and it "has never happened before", but the assumption that "it will all work out" because "it always has" is what Germans and Czechs and Russians said before autocratic regimes replaced their governments. "On Tyranny" by Timothy Snyder details this.

"You don't know, when you make love for the last time, that you're making love for the last time. Voting is like that."

[Dan]

24. The Ballot or the Bullet,

Their choice.

[roamer65]

27. The Hartford Convention of 1814.

The only thing that saved the republic was the quick and decisive victory by Gen Andrew Jackson at the Battle of New Orleans in early 1815.

If we had lost at New Orleans or it had resulted in a protracted conflict, New England was ready to secede.

It can happen again.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hartford_Convention

Fascism or freedom? What will be YOUR choice?

[live love laugh]

28. And yet I keep seeing someone post with certainty the # of seats we will pick up in 2022.

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1100&pid=4603

https://www.democraticunderground.com/11004605


Nothing can be taken for granted.

[Pepsidog]

29. Shit Atticus I didn't think of this which is entirely plausible. Rs will

claim, as they do now, that the first 2 years of Trump’s presidency was stolen by the fake Russian investigational so they will rightfully impeach Trump. We have to get the word out. These devious bastards play on a whole different level than Dems. They are evil to the bone.

[twodogsbarking]

30. Will they put their pants on backwards?

Probably.

[Ferrets are Cool]

31. "All our chips are on the table"

Seems like I have heard this before.

I am not saying it's not true, just that I am reminded of the story of the boy who cried wolf.

As long as "we" have people like Manchin on our side "so to speak", things are never going to change.

[Voltaire2]

36. It is more likely that in the 2024 election republican legislatures override the voters.

That is what they are really setting up. Impeachment and conviction are unlikely to succeed. Instead, they will put forth electors selected by their legislatures for the states they control that vote the wrong way.

That in turn will result in a constitutional crisis and the end game of our republic.

[RegularJam]

37. I'm not as concerned about congressional Republicans as I am the states.

I don't think your argument with respect to congressional Republicans holds much water.

The states, that's where it is at. How are they going to certify moving forward? We know some states are going in the direction of pre-registration and ID at the polls for every election. That's going to end up being a tough one for them as many rank and file don't want it. It takes time for these rash moves to backfire.

We keep easing access as they keep making it more difficult. We will keep taking them to court. We are in an all out battle and it started over a century ago.

[Atticus]

39. I think there's a problem with both the states and a Trumpy Congress. You are correct that the

Republicans may very well be able to certify their losing candidate as the winner, but then Congress would have to confirm the result as they eventually did on Janusry 6th.

IF we manage go keep them from "legally" refusing to certify a winning Democrat, a Trumpian Congress could refuse to confirm our winner. In 2020, some rogue Republicans actually sent forged and totally bogus "certifications" to Congress. Next time, the counterfeits may be good enough for Hawley, Cruz, Jordan, Greene and their ilk.

[RegularJam]

40. Here is where you really lose me.

I have been fighting this battle for decades. Congressional Republicans, outside of about six to ten new overzealous members, have always been like this. Always. There is nothing Trumpy about it. Wanting to suppress the vote, including with aggressive ID laws, has always been their MO.

I want federal legislation that pushes constitutional bounds. It's not that I don't. I just know right now it's the states where the damage is being done.

This is not a new battle. Including the extremism from the right and it's always our "last chance." I'm not going anywhere. Still fighting and still winning. Just like progressives have since the inception of our country.

[Atticus]

41. Where you "really lose me" is your apparent belief that nothing different is happening; nothing

any more extreme than you have fought "for decades".

These Republicans are "a different breed of cat" and, IMHO, there is a lot that is "Trumpy" about them and their naked sedition. They seek to RULE, not govern.

[RegularJam]

42. Women didn't have the right to vote.

Blacks didn't have the right to vote.

We have had draconian voter ID laws on the books forever.

Poll taxes.

This crop is not a different breed outside of a couple of knuckleheads.

I get that you don't think those things are as bad as what you face today.

We will win. Just as we historically do. The other option is unthinkable.

[Atticus]

43. I'm sure you believe your comparisons apt. I don't. nt

[RegularJam]

44. I believe my comparisons are worse than what we are currently facing.

And what we are facing is major.

This battle isn’t going away unless one side lays down. Thankfully my side is full of fight.