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Chainfire

(17,757 posts)
Thu Jun 17, 2021, 07:06 PM Jun 2021

Missouri bans state enforcement of federal gun law in state. (NPR Story)

https://www.npr.org/2021/06/17/1007690138/can-missouri-declare-federal-gun-laws-invalid

The Feds are going to have to take a stand against these rouge right-wing states and this looks like the perfect opportunity. If it were me, I would start with withdrawing all Federal law enforcement funding for state and local police agencies and aggressively prosecute the people who violate Federal gun laws. Examples need to be made.
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Missouri bans state enforcement of federal gun law in state. (NPR Story) (Original Post) Chainfire Jun 2021 OP
Just to play Devil's advocate, Mr.Bill Jun 2021 #1
I get your "well what about" point, but Chainfire Jun 2021 #3
I'm pretty sure Zeitghost Jun 2021 #17
Miles of difference... paleotn Jun 2021 #9
Read the article in the link in the OP. Mr.Bill Jun 2021 #14
No, states can't invalidate federal law, but like so many others... paleotn Jun 2021 #19
GOP campaign stunt. The FEDS will end this. nt Progressive Jones Jun 2021 #2
They can't do it soon enough and they need to bring Maxwell's Silver Hammer when they come Chainfire Jun 2021 #4
States are under no obligation to use state or local resources, MarineCombatEngineer Jun 2021 #5
They wanted to withold federal funds from sanctuary cities Mr.Bill Jun 2021 #15
So that avenue is closed to the Feds also? nt MarineCombatEngineer Jun 2021 #20
Oh, it's nullification again. paleotn Jun 2021 #6
The difference is that it is no longer a tiny minority of idiots Chainfire Jun 2021 #10
um... that's not how things work in this country Takket Jun 2021 #7
Yeah, great idea, Gov. Heehaw . . . hatrack Jun 2021 #8
Unless they think they can also repeal the supremacy clause ... 11 Bravo Jun 2021 #11
Exactly. No state can invalidate a federal law. n/t Mr.Bill Jun 2021 #16
They know exactly what they are doing Zeitghost Jun 2021 #18
Jesse James struggle4progress Jun 2021 #12
Garland already told MO ...DO not ignore federal gun laws!! PortTack Jun 2021 #13

Mr.Bill

(24,470 posts)
1. Just to play Devil's advocate,
Thu Jun 17, 2021, 07:10 PM
Jun 2021

because we are dealing with the Devil here, how is this different from states refusing to enforce Federal immigration laws? Federal law enforcement can just go there and enforce federal laws themselves, like they do with immigration.

 

Chainfire

(17,757 posts)
3. I get your "well what about" point, but
Thu Jun 17, 2021, 07:29 PM
Jun 2021

An example in the story was the the theoretical arrest of a felon and, in the process, recovering an illegal firearm, if the cops charged on the illegal possession of the firearm they could be subject to a $50,000 dollar state fine. It would not matter to me what the people of the state do, except that what happens in Missouri will not stay in Missouri. The Feds should not continue to fund police agencies that work against them. Let Missourians pay for their own policing. They already have one of the highest violent crime rates in the country, I guess that they just want to share the love with the rest of us.

If Missouri is allowed to proceed as they wish, they will become the gun store for criminals all over the nation. Need a machine gun? Pop over to Missouri.


Zeitghost

(4,141 posts)
17. I'm pretty sure
Thu Jun 17, 2021, 11:09 PM
Jun 2021

Missouri has laws that ban things like felon in possession of a firearm. And anybody trying to sell NFA items is going to find the BATFE at their door real quick. This will have little to no real world implications.

paleotn

(18,474 posts)
9. Miles of difference...
Thu Jun 17, 2021, 07:44 PM
Jun 2021

between leaving enforcement up to the Feds with immigration verses declaring federal law invalid within the state of Missouri. We've been down this road since the founding. It doesn't end well for nullifiers.

Mr.Bill

(24,470 posts)
14. Read the article in the link in the OP.
Thu Jun 17, 2021, 10:04 PM
Jun 2021

It makes it clear that a state can't declare a federal law invalid. The constitution says so. So that part won't hold up in court.

But they can refuse to have their state enforce the law, just as my state has refused to enforce immigration laws or have any state or local law enforcement officer cooperate with federal authorities that are enforcing those laws.

What's important is I don't want the federal government to be in command of my local police. They are welcome to come here and enforce federal laws, but that is all. And it's been through the courts that they can't withold federal funding from states who refuse to help them.

We've just had a Fascist tyrant in charge of our federal government for four years. He tried to take control of our state and local police and we stopped him. Look what his henchmen likely did with the Capitol Police and the National Guard on 1/6.

We have Federal Law Enforcement Agencies to enforce Federal laws, and that's how I'd like to keep it. If anyone is okay with the likes of a Donald Trump telling your local police what to do, then have at it.

paleotn

(18,474 posts)
19. No, states can't invalidate federal law, but like so many others...
Fri Jun 18, 2021, 10:36 AM
Jun 2021

Missouri Republicans are saying they can. It's the framing that matters. CA never considered immigration laws invalid. Law enforcement across the country many times picks and choses what they will enforce. When I lived down south, our local sheriffs department wouldn't go out of their way to enforce immigration laws either. Not that they felt said law was invalid. They simply didn't have the manpower.

 

Chainfire

(17,757 posts)
4. They can't do it soon enough and they need to bring Maxwell's Silver Hammer when they come
Thu Jun 17, 2021, 07:29 PM
Jun 2021

If or when the Feds deal with the issue, it will further inflame militia groups all over the country. Perhaps that is the point of the State.

MarineCombatEngineer

(12,979 posts)
5. States are under no obligation to use state or local resources,
Thu Jun 17, 2021, 07:34 PM
Jun 2021

IOW, the states can tell the Feds that they won't let them use any state/local facilities nor any personnel to help them, what the states can't do is interfere in the enforcement of those laws by the Feds.
The Feds have ways of countering this, they can withhold Fed funds until they change their minds.

Mr.Bill

(24,470 posts)
15. They wanted to withold federal funds from sanctuary cities
Thu Jun 17, 2021, 10:06 PM
Jun 2021

in California, and the feds lost that one in court.

paleotn

(18,474 posts)
6. Oh, it's nullification again.
Thu Jun 17, 2021, 07:36 PM
Jun 2021

This shit has come up every generation since the founding. Ugh. Idiots. And not even original idiots. Just garden variety idiots.

 

Chainfire

(17,757 posts)
10. The difference is that it is no longer a tiny minority of idiots
Thu Jun 17, 2021, 07:46 PM
Jun 2021

Arkansas and nearly another dozen states are considering similar legislation.

11 Bravo

(23,965 posts)
11. Unless they think they can also repeal the supremacy clause ...
Thu Jun 17, 2021, 08:01 PM
Jun 2021

of the US Constitution, they need to fuck right off.

Zeitghost

(4,141 posts)
18. They know exactly what they are doing
Thu Jun 17, 2021, 11:11 PM
Jun 2021

States are under no obligation to enforce federal law, but they can't interfere with the Feds enforcing it.

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