Fully Vaccinated Man Contracts Delta

[WHITT]

Fully Vaccinated Ambridge Man Contracts Delta Variant Of COVID-19

AMBRIDGE, Pa - A local man was diagnosed with the Delta variant of COVID-19, and, according to his wife, he was fully vaccinated against the virus.

According to the Beaver County Times, 73-year-old Joe Pucci was hospitalized on his birthday a few weeks ago with COVID-19 symptoms.

He was sent to the intensive care unit (ICU) of the Pittsburgh VA Medical Center and is still there.

Scientists say the Delta variant is 50% more transmissible than the dominant variant of COVID-19.

https://pittsburgh.cbslocal.com/2021/07/05/fully-vaccinated-ambridge-man-gets-delta-variant/

Crap.

[BittyJenkins]

1. And now there is Lambda varient.

This is not over.

[Pobeka]

18. Serum studies look good for mRNA vaccines vs lambda

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=15596399

[BannonsLiver]

21. I was a Tri Lambda in college.

Here’s a shot of our spring function in 1986

[NCDem47]

23. Best.

Movie.

Ever.

[DFW]

26. Best line ever:

まあ、本当に？私はあなたに部屋を借りることは決してないだろう！NERD!!

[IrishAfricanAmerican]

43. 👍🏼

[OnDoutside]

31. I heard someone call it the Lambada variant.....

[womanofthehills]

34. On Twitter someone said it should have been named Delta Plus Pro

Before going to Lambda.

[Person of Interest]

41. You are absolutely correct: this pandemic is far from over!

[Orrex]

2. I was in Ambridge about five days ago. Small world.

Without disparaging the patient specifically, this region is big on anti-vax zealotry.

[chowder66]

3. It would be nice if we knew if he wasn't wearing a mask or

what the details are surrounding how he may have contracted the virus.

I wish more detailed reporting would be done on these breakthrough cases.

[Midnight Writer]

6. Or what health co-factors he may have had before contracting the virus.

[Ms. Toad]

10. Since I care about community health -

I'm much more interested preventing infection (which can be transmitted to others), than in comorbidities - which might make infection more deadly in a specific individual.

[Ligyron]

28. What if one of those comorbidities Allowed the virus to slip through

At his age he may well Have had one or two.

[Ms. Toad]

29. The comorbidities are more likely tomake it a severe case.

From a community health perspective I'm actually more concerned about people who catch it and have no symptoms who are running around spreading it than those who happen to have a severe case.

I'm not aware of anything (other than a disease that directly or indirectly results in immune suppression) that increases the likelihood that someone will catch it.

[forgotmylogin]

47. Right. Even with the vaccine under best circumstances there's a dice-roll.

That doesn't mean the vaccines don't work. They do, but they're not 100% and no person's constitution stat is perfect.

It's probably good for our peace of mind to know stuff like "oh he didn't wear a mask so it's inevitable, I'm still safe" but this guy was in his 70s and could have been taken out by the regular flu if it hit him right. Or any of us could be taken out by the flu even if you're perfectly vaccinated, masked, handwashing, etc.

MAGAts will seize on something like this to say "Well, see the vaccine won't protect you! Masks don't protect you!" but they're wrong - it does, but you're always gonna roll the dice and there's always a chance of a critical failure. (sorry, D&D/RPG nerd) It's a lottery you don't want to win, and there's nothing wrong with stacking the odds in your own personal favor via safe behaviors.

[misanthrope]

45. Sure, but information isn't the aim

Rational thinking doesn't drive consumerism, fear and insecurity does.

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

65. I agree.

I think actual underlying risk conditions are simply not being mentioned. One DUer keeps on posting that her child, who is a physician, reported 8 young, healthy, fully vaccinated adults dying of COVID in an ICU all in about one week. I just find it hard to credit that they were all young, healthy, and fully vaccinated. If that many happened in one place, then I'd expect similar such to be dropping like flies everywhere.

[PortTack]

4. Pfizer-BioNTech sees drop in protection to 64% from delta variants

https://news.yahoo.com/pfizer-vaccine-protection-against-infection-220657490.html

Keep wearing your masks!!

[Ms. Toad]

7. I still haven't seen detailed enough information from Israel

to know for sure what is going on there.

If the effectiveness of the vaccine is really 64% against infection that is an overall effectiveness rate against Delta (for the same esposure that created 100 regular COVID cases) of 42.4% (i.e. it would be expected to produce 57.6 breakthrough cases).

Until I see more detail, I'm not adopting that effectiveness rate. But if accurate, it does not bode well for us.

[Happy Hoosier]

25. The data set from Israel is pretty small.

Although the initial data is cause for some concern, the number of cases is still very low and I don't think the efficacy numbers should be taken as reliable just yet.

Never-the-less, this bears watching closely.

[Ms. Toad]

27. Sounds like you've been able to sort out more than I have

I'm definitely in the "this bears watching closely" camp.

[womanofthehills]

35. A young woman recently posted that she took her nursing baby

To her all vaxed book club and her baby caught Covid and then she did . One of the vaccinated women called everyone to tell them she tested positive. This interested me because my book club is now meeting in person but we are outside and spaced.

[FBaggins]

51. The UK may be a more useful comparison

They are reportedly seeing Delta as the overwhelming majority of cases and have seen a much larger surge of total cases (up over tenfold over the last two months).

Looking at their data and comparing it to the similar infection surge last Sep/Oct, Delta appears to be much more infectious, but also much less deadly (at least under their vaccine regime). While infections have climbed tenfold, deaths are up from the high single digits to the mid teens per day.

[misanthrope]

46. From The Hill's version of this story:

Some health experts expressed skepticism about the Israel study, saying mRNA vaccines like Pfizer have been shown to offer strong protection against COVID-19 infection.

"Speaking to colleagues in Israel, real skepticism about 64% number," Brown University School of Public Health Dean Ashish Jha wrote on Twitter. "Best data still suggest mRNA vaccines offer high degree of protection against infection."

"And superb protection against severe illness," Jha added. "Lets await more data but as of now If you're vaccinated, I wouldn't worry."

Jha clarified that he was not saying the results of the study were incorrect, but stressed that most data has suggested a high efficacy rate in protecting against the delta variant, pointing to a British study that found it was 90 percent effective.

[SergeStorms]

56. The numbers from the U.K. are at 90% efficacy.

And they have a much larger case study. I'd be very suspicious of the Israeli study until more data is shown.

Still, I'm wearing a mask everywhere until this new spike evens out, and beyond.

[Ms. Toad]

5. This is to be expected - and why some of us continue to advocate mask-wearing.

Vaccines are not 100%. There will be breakthrough cases (approximately 5% for original COVID, and 12% for Delta with the mRNA vaccines). Because Delta is more contagious, the 12% is equivalent to about a 19.2% breakthrough rate for the original virus (the same exposure will create more cases). J&J is even worse.

Those breakthrough cases will include the same range of symptoms as one might expect in cases in unvaccinated people, in roughly the same proportion. Around 2% will be fatal, and significantly more will require hospitalization or will become long-haul COVID.

WHO recommends, and Dr. Fauci is now recommending. that those who place themselves in situations with increased exposure (i.e. low vaccination, high infection, indoors - especially with crowds) wear masks indoors, even if fully vaccinated.

Some of us never stopped recommending it. Not sure why there is such resistance to a step that costs next to nothing and can go a long way toward preventing cases like this from occurring.

You don't need to be terrified or stop living - just take reasonable precautions, including wearing masks and social distancing - especially if you are in a low vaccination/high infection area.

[MissMillie]

8. Thank you. I was just going to post this.

It is a mathematical certainty that a small number of fully vaccinated people will catch the virus. Precautions are still a good idea.

We're not out of this yet.

[CaliforniaPeggy]

9. Yes, there is resistance to resuming the mask.

Because we see re-masking as moving away from normality.

And that is hard.

Of course, you're right. It's just hard on the face of it.

[Ms. Toad]

19. We need to learn to think of the new normal.

It might not be a forever new normal, but it needs to be for now - and it will stop being so hard if we stop expecting normal to look exactly like what it looked like before.

I've got a ton of injuries to my right side that keep me from sleeping in my "before" normal. (breast cancer on my right side, rib removal that damaged my neckmuscles, sarcoma on my right forearm, spiral fracture in my leg, and a 4-decades old persistent muscle spasm). I don't even think how restricted my sleeping is to accommodate those injuries so I'm not constantly in pain (or creating lymphedema) until I have to explain it to someone who is suggesting I change how I sleep. It's just my "new" normal.

But I know it's hard to adjust to a new normal - and I definitely get the reluctance to change my definition of normal. - I'm still fighting the new normal I have with sarcoma. It feels as if I've got a pressure bandage on my right forearm 100% of the time. It pisses me off. And as often as not I forget to use my talk-to-text program.

But there is a cost to insisting normal has to be the same as it was before. For my sarcoma - it's carpal tunnel syndrome and increased swelling. For COVID - if tossing the masks has to be part of normal, it's personal increased risk of infection and community-wide risk of surges and more variants.

The sooner we can wrap our minds around new normal, the easier it will be to do what we need to do to get through this - rather than just see-sawing back and forth between surges and troughs.

[uponit7771]

17. "...There will be breakthrough cases.." this is case for a multitude of viruses no? If so then why

... are people recommending the cv19 vaxed taking mask precautions against cv19?

Thx in advance

[Ms. Toad]

24. Because COVID has not fundamentally changed

It is still an extremely unpredictable disease - with both deadly and disabling consequences in patterns we do not yet understand. It's like I tell my bar exam students: You have to give it the respect it deserves. If you pretend it is trivial, you are going to get wholloped. Although it is not uniformly disabling - when it is, it is. There is no way to predict whether you (or your loved ones) will catch it - so the only way to protect yourself from the disabling/deadly consequence except for preventing the disease itself. Personally - given the deaths and long-haul symptoms I've seen I'd put it closer to polio than the chickenpox or flu as far as diseases I'd go way out of my way to avoid.

Most other viruses are not contagious before there are symptoms (or only very modestly so). COVID 19 may not even produce symptoms - but people will still be contagious. That means COVID poses an invisible threat in ways that other viruses don't

The only way it has fundamentally changed is in how contagious it is. The Delta variant is about 60% more infectious. That means when it gets a toehold, it will be out of control far faster than the original variant was. There are several countries currently up 100+% overthe previous week.

Finally - none of the other viruses for which vaccines are available are circulating with the density COVID is. The density has decreased (but is on the rise again), and given how contagious it is it isn't stable. (Influenza is the only one that is close, and it is nowhere near as deadly/disabling.)

[SWBTATTReg]

22. Good advice!

[BlueWavePsych]

36. THIS

100% agree!

[wnylib]

57. I think there are 2 possible reasons

for the resistance, closely related. One is what I call covid fatigue. People are just tired of precautions.

The other is that the paralyzing fear of the unknown that affected so many people at the beginning of the pandemic has subsided. We have developed treatments that are effective in many cases. We learned that there were ways to cope with the pandemic. We learned who is most at risk. We have seen people with asymptomatic and mild cases survive. So we have adapted. People who are not at high risk have become tired of restrictions and desensitized to the original fear. They are accustomed to hearing about older people or people with underlying conditions getting serious cases, being hospitalized, and dying. So long as they are not in that demographic, they are willing to accept that "That's just the way it is. This is the new reality. Old people and sick people will die."

So, why feel restricted any more? Go on with life, drop the precautions, and adapt to tbe new reality.

I don't agree with those views, but I am seeing evidence that many people hold them now. Their coping patience is worn out.

[Ferrets are Cool]

61. Bingo!!

[Klaralven]

11. None of the vaccines were 100% against any of the variants.

So there was always the possibility of infection following exposure, even though it might have only been 5% with the best vaccines.

So not protecting yourself by masking and social distancing and encountering a solid exposure to an infectious person is like playing Russian roulette with three revolvers, one of which has one bullet.

I'm continuing to be careful and wear a mask.

[IronLionZion]

12. Good reminder that vaccines aren't 100%

CDC tracks hospitalizations for breakthrough cases. Unfortunately for the patient in the OP, most are older people.

https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/covid-19/health-departments/breakthrough-cases.html

In US: 4,686 breakthrough cases, 879 deaths

[alphafemale]

13. No one ever claimed the vaccines were 100%

Is ringing terror alarms necessary?

[uponit7771]

15. +1, vaxed doesn't mean 100% inoculated

[Ace Rothstein]

32. DU is addicted to fear porn.

[BlueWavePsych]

38. Being cautious keeps you alive!

nt

[Native]

44. I agree. And the opposite was happening in the beginning. I advocated for mask wearing at the start,

as a few others did too, and we were slammed. You'd think that following the science wouldn't be a hard sell on DU. LOL.

[misanthrope]

49. Why would you make that assumption?

I see irrationality embraced by people across the political spectrum. No one has a lock on it.

[Native]

50. True, but there is typically less of it here.

[Native]

40. +1 - England is an excellent example of mRNA vax's effectiveness against the Delta variant...

I know it's Fox News, but this is a reprint from the WSJ and a very good article. Why people still get excited when they read about a vaccinated individual winding up in the hospital with Covid is beyond me. We've got solid numbers coming out of England now.

Why some vaccinated people are dying of COVID-19
Vaccines aren’t 100% effective, so some people will be vulnerable to the virus even after receiving two shots
https://www.foxnews.com/health/why-some-vaccinated-people-dying-covid-19

[uponit7771]

14. IHM says vaxes are 93% effective against hospitalizations and death shame that..

... any of the extremely few who are getting it vaxxed are hospitalized

[spinbaby]

42. I have a friend who treats covid

She’s a respiratory therapist in an Orlando hospital. She says that she hasn’t seen a fully vaccinated covid patient admitted to her hospital yet.

[Azathoth]

16. Covid is the new flu

It's going to be with us for the rest of our lifetimes. There are going to be periodic boosters for the foreseeable future, and there will be a constant, inevitable margin of breakthrough cases every year.

We live in a different world than we did in 2019.

[madville]

20. Yep, there is no way to get rid of it and still have a functioning economy

People just need to individually decide the amount of risk that is acceptable to them. If you are elderly, obese or have immune system problems or other issues then extra precautions and isolation should be a given.

[Happy Hoosier]

30. I think we are just about to that point.

COVID is still deadlier than the flu, but if we can get death rates down to about that level, it will become one of those things that is just part of the environment. I get a flu shot every year. I may have to get a COVID shot every year. I know some folks are saying they will mask up on the regular now, and that's fine, but I'd prefer not to do that.

[roamer65]

33. Wear your masks, folks.

Two doses and possible booster plus and a good mask will be the savior through this coming fall and winter.

[Maggiemayhem]

37. I read this on Reddit Pittsburgh yesterday

[Red Pest]

39. Can we tone down the hysteria, please?

Some points to consider:
1. No vaccine is 100% effective. The most effective vaccine is against measles at ~95% effectivity. The mRNA covid vaccines both (Moderna & Pfizer) give protection that is close to that at ~91%.
2. Larger studies suggest ~88% effectiveness against the covid delta variant, but data continues to be collected and we shall see whether it is 88% or 64% or what.
3. Most people mount excellent responses to vaccines, but some do not. This is dependent on whether someone is immunosupressed (from illness or treatment).
4. Covid is not the new flu. Influenza viruses evolve very quickly because the RNA genomes of influenza viruses are segmented and if different strains infect the same host, the genomes can sort out with mixing of various segments giving a new strains with mixed parentage. Plus RNA viruses (SARS, MERS, SARS-CoV-2, Influenza, etc.) replicate their RNA in a more error-prone way, thus giving rise to more nucleotide changes than viruses and bacteria and all other organisms that use DNA as their genetic material. In other words, RNA-dependent RNA polymerases are more error-prone than DNA-dependent DNA polymerases.
5. Masks - if you are going into a high density setting, by all means wear a mask. It will protect you from a variety of air-borne infections from covid to the common cold. I just returned from a visit to physician and the medical building had a sign posted telling everyone who entered the building to wear a mask. This is a good precaution to protect everyone.

[grantcart]

53. Where is the fun in that?

[ShazzieB]

67. Thanks for this.

It's very informative and helpful!

[Snackshack]

48. We are back to...

Square one with this Delta variant. Being vaccinated helps but it is not a guarantee against being infected.

If you are not vaccinated you should really think about doing so. The transmission rate of this new strain is unbelievable. if you are vaccinated you should still mask up when around others and still practice social distancing and only make trips to places that you need to...i would not suggest going to a concert at this time.

[misanthrope]

60. Square one would be no vaccine at all

And a federal government that refuses to recognize the threat. That isn't this.

[Snackshack]

68. Yea- we kind of are...

1.- None of the vaccines make one immune. There are people becoming infected who have been vaccinated. It gives good protection but there is already discussions about a booster being needed and not a yr from now.

2.- It’s good that the government cares and has done the outstanding job it has in 6 months but the fact is there are millions all across the country who have chosen not to get vaccinated.

So you a free to throw caution to the wind but I would not recommend it since this Delta variant is basically a new version of the virus that is even more transmissible then small pox is.

[misanthrope]

70. Were I throwing caution to the wind

Last edited Wed Jul 7, 2021, 01:17 PM - Edit history (1)

I wouldn't be relying on science and educated opinion. That's why I acquired full vaccination as soon as possible, why I have confidence in advice from the CDC, WHO and other experts and why I am not stoking irrational paranoia.

Evidence shows vaccinations protect against the worst outcomes for Delta variant. That is not where we were in January 2020.

[Snackshack]

71. Your entitled to your opinion.

[Native]

52. Fully Vaccinated Florida Senior Travels to NashVegas...

...the Bachelorette Capital of the World, and during the busiest weekend seen there thus far, parties at bars and restaurants completely maskless and lives to tell about it (and no hangover).

[GoodRaisin]

54. I think I was the only one inside my Lowes store this morning wearing a mask

when I went to buy paint. Not even the employees were wearing masks.

[beaglelover]

55. OMG!!!!!!!

[NickB79]

58. He is 73

If it weren't for the vaccine, he'd be dead.

[LittleGirl]

59. Listen, Stop freaking out!

This single incident is going to happen with this virus mutation and vaccine.
Ya know, headlines like this feed the fear that the vaccine isn’t enough, but it is!
This incident is getting media coverage because it’s so rare!
That’s the media model of hysteria inducing headlines. Don’t give it air!
Thanks for coming to my TED talk.

[USALiberal]

72. Who is freaking out?? Nt

[Cryptoad]

62. ummm,,,,,seems Mother Nature is,,,,

getting ready to eliminate our species from this planet with a mutant Virus,,,,,,, can u really blame Her?

[Texin]

63. Okay, this is getting scary. I'm going to start curtailing some activities now.

Back to online ordering of grocery, etc. pickups.

[soldierant]

64. 99.2% is not 100%.

Of course there would be some. One is a tragedy for him and his family, but not a cause for panic to the rest of the nation/world.

[Chakaconcarne]

66. kind of depends on which vaccine he got

the mrna vaccines are going to provide greater protection from variants compared to the j and j vaccine which has a different mechanism of action.

it also depends on wherher he falls into the % that won't have protection regardless.

[pansypoo53219]

69. sigh. we need a delta booster toot sweet.