Interesting discussion in EmptyWheel about possible disinformation on Putin/Trump

[erronis]

https://www.emptywheel.net/2021/07/15/paul-oetken-eliminates-lev-parnas-last-attempt-to-weaponize-the-former-presidents-former-lawyer-in-his-defense/#comment-897176

Part of another discussion but worth watching.
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Fran of the North says:
July 15, 2021 at 10:06 am

Apologies for the WAY O/T post.

The Guardian is reporting this morning that leaked secret Kremlin documents reveal that Putin authorized an operation in Jan 2016 to help Trump get elected in November. That probably isn’t news to regular readers.

The interesting part is the very clear assessment of Trump: “impulsive, mentally unstable and unbalanced individual who suffers from an inferiority complex”.

Of course, this could also just be more efforts to stir the pot, but according to the article, western intelligence agencies have examined the docs and they have strong indications of being genuine.

More here: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/jul/15/kremlin-papers-appear-to-show-putins-plot-to-put-trump-in-white-house
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earlofhuntingdon says:
July 15, 2021 at 10:29 am

For sure, the Former Guy had a historically unique and abjectly dependent relationship with the Russian president. How and why is another matter. But no one is better than Putin at stirring his opponent’s pot with his disinformation spoon.

The Guardian is far from perfect. This material should first be established as legitimate. If not, we lay ourselves open to what Marcy described a couple of days ago. That these clams are subsequently deemed to be fraudulent, which imperils other legitimate claims to the contrary. Think Dan Rather and the Bush National Guard gambit.
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earlofhuntingdon says:
July 15, 2021 at 10:42 am

The story’s lead writer, Luke Harding, is regarded by his critics as a creature of the security services. The second author, Julian Borger, is right behind him. There are parallels among the WaPo’s national security columnists.
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BobCon says:
July 15, 2021 at 10:31 am

From the article:

“The papers, seen by the Guardian, seem to represent a serious and highly unusual leak from within the Kremlin.”

I wish The Guardian had dug more deeply into the implications of that sentence. What is the purpose of the leak? Damaging Trump? Smokescreen? Discrediting anti-Trump allegations by later release of contradictory information?

If the Guardian doesn’t know, they should at least spend more time noting that Kremlin leaks tend to have agendas behind them.
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drouse says:
July 15, 2021 at 10:39 am

What’s not really clear is exactly who is trying to stir the pot. My first take was that it was an attempt by Putin to toss a large rock into the mud puddle that is our politics. Then again, the article says that our intelligence agencies have been aware of it for months. So at this moment I’m more inclined to believe that it was somebody from our intelligence services who gave it to the Guardian. The motivations behind the leak aren’t really clear.

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[sboatcar]

1. Its pretty obvious to me

Putin hates Trump and was only nice to him to accomplish what he wanted. Now its time to burn him. I expect more leaks in the coming months.

[gratuitous]

2. Any leak out of the Kremlin must have Putin's imprimatur

That's how the system works there. Is the information reliable? That's a very good question, and one that must be answered before anyone goes haring off on what could be a fool's errand. My suggestion is that the media ask the former guy if the leak is true. Put the screws to him on this. Let him deny it, if he can. We don't have to believe a word of it, but the former guy should definitely be asked about it.

[Beetwasher.]

3. Yes, This Game is Played in Deep, Dark, Murky Waters

With multiple competing cross-currents and predators.