General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsNo, we don't have evidence for boosters at this point (STAT News)
Here, in response to J&J (from article):
One key question in the United States has centered on whether people who received the one-dose Johnson & Johnson shot should get a booster of one of the mRNA vaccines, those made by Pfizer-BioNTech and Moderna. Some lab experiments have indicated the antibody levels from the one J&J shot are sufficient to stand up against Delta, though another study that garnered headlines this week suggested those antibodies werent all that protective against Delta. Perhaps, one hypothesis went, two doses of J&J or a combo of J&J and another shot would be needed to build up protection levels to guard against Delta akin to how studies have shown that just one shot of some of the other vaccines is not all that effective against the variant.
But the conflicting results highlight the limitations of what can be extrapolated from these lab studies (for one, they just look at one of several components of immune protection). There will certainly be more research into this question, such as whether Delta is breaking through J&J shots more frequently than other vaccines or is more likely to cause breakthrough disease in those people. But federal officials reiterated Thursday that right now, they do not recommend that people who got the J&J shot get an mRNA booster.
and more importantly, do we know at a population level that the Delta variant is causing more disease:
(all 3 points excerpted from the article)
1. Weve never really had a good estimate for how frequently breakthrough infections occur.
2. [we hear about them because] they make news someone contracting the coronavirus even though theyre vaccinated makes for an easy headline.....
3. Its also possible that breakthrough infections are happening more frequently for reasons that have nothing to do with how well vaccines are working. For one, many of us have returned to activities we had put off. Having more, unmasked contact with others at bars, weddings, family gatherings, whatever increases the risk that well come into contact with an infectious person. (Its no surprise that the place with the highest rate of new cases in Massachusetts is summer tourism hot spot Cape Cod.) Plus, as cases increase, theres just more virus around, so were more likely to be exposed.
Theres a statistical reason that could also be playing a role. The higher the percentage of a community thats vaccinated, generally the lower the absolute number of cases will be which is what everyone is aiming for. But as a greater proportion of that community becomes vaccinated, breakthrough infections will actually account for a greater share of overall cases. Think about a scenario where 100% of people are vaccinated 100% of cases would be among the vaccinated.
https://www.statnews.com/2021/07/23/burning-questions-delta-next-phase-covid-19-pandemic/
And from me - it's important to keep the focus on the real science of the pandemic. We might need boosters (I got the J and J, so I am watching the data with some personal interest). But all these anecdotal stories are not science. They are interesting, and might add to our questions about what is happening. But real science has to be done in the labs and anecdotes need to be translated to population and laboratory studies.
underpants
(182,603 posts)Im contacted my doctor about it a few days ago. She said no need.
zuul
(14,624 posts)breakthrough infections by vaccine manufacturer.
How many got the J&J vaccine?
How many got Moderna and Pfizer?
I got J&J and Im scheduled for a medical procedure next week, for which I will have to be admitted to the hospital. Im pretty concerned.
janterry
(4,429 posts)we don't need the raw numbers as much as they need to be weighted statistically. Then we can compare them.
To be honest, though, the best outcome at this point in the pandemic isn't that you don't have a breakthrough infection - but that if you do get an infection, the symptoms are mild as a result of having the vaccine.
From the article:
Remember, the long game with the virus is that our bodies become so used to recognizing it and warding it off that, over time, it becomes little more than a nuisance. With each exposure to the virus, either through an infection or an exposure-mimicking vaccine, our bodies get retrained to fight it. Eventually, SARS-CoV-2 is likely to join the ranks of respiratory viruses that cause occasional colds, with rare exceptions of serious illness.
In a way, weve started the journey to making the coronavirus less of a big deal. Given how many people remain unprotected, weve still got a long way to go. But in areas where lots of people are protected including the vast majority of older adults, who are most likely to die from Covid-19 even if infections are going up, deaths are not. Its the first step toward putting the pandemic behind us.
zuul
(14,624 posts)I have so damn many health problems that a cold would push me over the edge.
janterry
(4,429 posts)I think that is what gets us out of the pandemic.
I wish that for all of us - and especially for you
lagomorph777
(30,613 posts)What will stop the spread is vaxxing AND MASKING. BOTH. ALL THE TIME, EVERYWHERE WE GO.
Numerous vaxxed DUers have gotten "mild" COVID despite being vaxxed (would have been worse otherwise, no doubt). Some have admitted that they dropped the mask after getting vaxxed. That's a mistake. Delta will find you if you don't take EVERY precaution available to you.
janterry
(4,429 posts)n/t
lagomorph777
(30,613 posts)janterry
(4,429 posts)I have no issue with wearing a mask. (I do, often). And I'm okay with further mandates.
But I agree with the hypothesis that this will become endemic - that's what has happened in all other pandemics.
I guess we'll see