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Pbs1914

(147 posts)
Wed Oct 17, 2012, 07:15 PM Oct 2012

Mitt Romney Reminds me of a Nazi

Not the rabble rousing and/or fighting in the streets manifestation. Nor am I saying that as hyperbole either or Godwins law. I am honestly and sincerely saying that he reminds me of an educated Nazi in the mold of an Adolph Eichman during the third reich. Someone who could cold heartedly and methodically write laws and policies for exterminating an entire race of people with nary a second thought, and with a clear conscious. The same type who could run a death camp then go home to their own family and talk to them about values (remember Romney is/was a high ranking Bishop) and be a quote on quote "family man."

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Mitt Romney Reminds me of a Nazi (Original Post) Pbs1914 Oct 2012 OP
Yep. The correct term is psychopath. n/t Avalux Oct 2012 #1
+1 Pbs1914 Oct 2012 #27
You know that there are people who would be highly offended by your comments, don't you? madaboutharry Oct 2012 #2
This kind of trolling is especially insidious. Nye Bevan Oct 2012 #3
If Romney looks like a duck, smells like a duck, quacks like a duck... n/t backscatter712 Oct 2012 #6
I was thinking of using the term National Socialist Pbs1914 Oct 2012 #12
Yep. Then there are the remote "Dr Frist" dianoses of mental illness that are just as dumb. NYC Liberal Oct 2012 #53
I think evaluating the character of those who would lead us is quite important. backscatter712 Oct 2012 #60
The word you are looking for is... fascist nadinbrzezinski Oct 2012 #4
Not really Pbs1914 Oct 2012 #15
Trust me that is the word you are looking for nadinbrzezinski Oct 2012 #20
Historian as well Pbs1914 Oct 2012 #29
Well genocides are not exclusively nazis nadinbrzezinski Oct 2012 #30
Absolute truth here! backscatter712 Oct 2012 #34
Yup, that is true nadinbrzezinski Oct 2012 #35
RWA/SDO Double-High. Hitler was one too. backscatter712 Oct 2012 #5
Naw PD Turk Oct 2012 #7
Hitler was also a huckster. backscatter712 Oct 2012 #24
That's bullshit. TheCowsCameHome Oct 2012 #8
I'm sure the Mittster would look damn snappy in one o' them uniforms. Iggo Oct 2012 #14
Stop trivializing the horrors perpetrated by the Nazis. GodlessBiker Oct 2012 #9
It's not trivializing, it's making a valid comparison. backscatter712 Oct 2012 #18
It's not a valid comparison. GodlessBiker Oct 2012 #41
It is not likening his conduct Pbs1914 Oct 2012 #42
The only reason Romney hasn't ordered the murder of millions is he hasn't had the opportunity, yet.. backscatter712 Oct 2012 #46
Calling Romney a Nazi, a psychopath, a Hitler, or a fascist rock Oct 2012 #10
I guess you must have met many "educated" Nazis during the third reich in order to compare... cherokeeprogressive Oct 2012 #11
How is that relevant Pbs1914 Oct 2012 #44
Sorry. Not going to trap me into agreeing. Barack_America Oct 2012 #13
I didn't compare him to Hitler Pbs1914 Oct 2012 #23
I'll say it again - the psychology is the same. backscatter712 Oct 2012 #28
Obama said Romney is a good man.. ananda Oct 2012 #16
Obama has to say such things because he's the President. backscatter712 Oct 2012 #19
+1 Pbs1914 Oct 2012 #26
Obama has a hard time acting marions ghost Oct 2012 #54
The use of the word H2O Man Oct 2012 #17
"Nazi" is a trigger word, but I think we need to make the comparison nonetheless. backscatter712 Oct 2012 #21
I was responding H2O Man Oct 2012 #25
Fair enough. backscatter712 Oct 2012 #31
At it's most base level H20 Pbs1914 Oct 2012 #36
That study is the Milgram Experiment. backscatter712 Oct 2012 #40
Thanks Pbs1914 Oct 2012 #43
Definitely has the whole Joseph Goebbels thing down. JaneyVee Oct 2012 #22
Romney is perky and flexible. Nazis are neither. Bucky Oct 2012 #32
"Perky and flexible"? backscatter712 Oct 2012 #33
lol Pbs1914 Oct 2012 #37
flexible? marions ghost Oct 2012 #38
I agree 100% EnviroBat Oct 2012 #39
I wouldn't agree with anybody making Hitler look better Pbs1914 Oct 2012 #45
Romney reminds me of the guy who can win the next election Herlong Oct 2012 #47
If my navel weren't so much fuzzier Herlong Oct 2012 #48
When you brought up Eichmann, you reminded me of some of my grad school work from last year. backscatter712 Oct 2012 #49
Another reason why I am with the OP and Going Godwin... backscatter712 Oct 2012 #50
I despise mittshit, but this is just lazy. cali Oct 2012 #51
whatever Pbs1914 Oct 2012 #55
Oh please. Romney may be a cold-hearted asshole, but to say he would murder millions of people NYC Liberal Oct 2012 #52
This op is insensitive and stupid Jersey Devil Oct 2012 #56
No. Personalities like Hitlers are not unique, or even particularly rare. backscatter712 Oct 2012 #59
Very stupid op. NCTraveler Oct 2012 #57
Only for lack of opportunity. backscatter712 Oct 2012 #64
Foolish nonsense. nt. NCTraveler Oct 2012 #65
What a brilliant logical rebuttal! Care to give details? backscatter712 Oct 2012 #66
Really no need. If that is why you believe he is..... NCTraveler Oct 2012 #67
Ah, you're not interested in logical debate. backscatter712 Oct 2012 #68
No doubt Romney is a fascist B Calm Oct 2012 #58
You sure about that? backscatter712 Oct 2012 #61
Like you, I wouldn't trust him either. B Calm Oct 2012 #63
mittens is a sociopath, isn't that enough? Javaman Oct 2012 #62
This OP Reminds Me... WiffenPoof Oct 2012 #69
Republicans and Nazis Texas-Limerick Oct 2012 #70
So? Coyotl Nov 2012 #71

madaboutharry

(42,033 posts)
2. You know that there are people who would be highly offended by your comments, don't you?
Wed Oct 17, 2012, 07:19 PM
Oct 2012

But, I am not one of them.

I think you make excellent points. There is a certain personality type that fits into the mold of this type of Nazi.

Nye Bevan

(25,406 posts)
3. This kind of trolling is especially insidious.
Wed Oct 17, 2012, 07:23 PM
Oct 2012

Because there are quite a few DUers who will eagerly jump in to say yes, Romney *is* the second coming of Hitler. And then there is an idiotic embarrassing "Romney is a Nazi" thread that makes DU look stupid.

backscatter712

(26,357 posts)
6. If Romney looks like a duck, smells like a duck, quacks like a duck... n/t
Wed Oct 17, 2012, 07:31 PM
Oct 2012

Last edited Wed Oct 17, 2012, 08:37 PM - Edit history (1)

Pbs1914

(147 posts)
12. I was thinking of using the term National Socialist
Wed Oct 17, 2012, 07:47 PM
Oct 2012

in order to tone down any perceived appearance of a knee-jerk hyperbolic child-like observation, but the term "socialist" has been used so much to describe Obama that I just shortened it to Nazi.

NYC Liberal

(20,453 posts)
53. Yep. Then there are the remote "Dr Frist" dianoses of mental illness that are just as dumb.
Thu Oct 18, 2012, 06:23 AM
Oct 2012

backscatter712

(26,357 posts)
60. I think evaluating the character of those who would lead us is quite important.
Thu Oct 18, 2012, 10:54 AM
Oct 2012

Call me Dr. Frist, but I see signs of psychopathy, narcissism, sadism, paranoia, most of the Big Six personality disorders that are seen in dictators like Stalin or Hitler.

When I see Mitt on TV, the way he acts, in those debates, or towards people has power over, as executive of Bain or Mormon bishop, I see the signs.

Pbs1914

(147 posts)
15. Not really
Wed Oct 17, 2012, 07:55 PM
Oct 2012

Mussolini would qualify as a Fascist. Mussolini, allies with Hitler along with Japan, Hungaria, Austria, Romania, and Finland, did not create nor act out the final solution. The "National Socialist" were a special breed unto themselves. Many Doctors and physicists, elite in their differnent fields of study. Methodical, cold, and ruthless with sociopathic efficiency. Mussolini was just (tongue in cheek) a Fascist.

 

nadinbrzezinski

(154,021 posts)
20. Trust me that is the word you are looking for
Wed Oct 17, 2012, 08:06 PM
Oct 2012

Speaking both as a historian, and also as a child of a holocaust survivor.

Fascism took different forms. The Nazis were just more ruthless in some respects, but the word you are looking if fascist.

Willard Mitt Romney is a fascist... and a plutocrat...

Telling me that he would be a camp commandant... sorry if I will not go there with you.

Words matter.

by the way, a few other fascists, Franco, Pinochet, the whole Argentinian Junta...

Pbs1914

(147 posts)
29. Historian as well
Wed Oct 17, 2012, 08:30 PM
Oct 2012

in an informal sense, and working on a PhD in a different field. So I respect your creditials and we are simply talking semantics in regards to tomatoe and tomaaaatoe (whichever spelling it usually goes). Nazi's were obviously facists, and so where the others you mentioned, but there was only one final solution/Holocaust, and to the level it existed, so that is why despite being Fascists, the Nazi's went beyond that. We can agree to disagree, I just feel that Romney reminds me more of Adolph Eichman than he does Augosto Pinochet or Franscisco Franco. But we can move on..

I am very sorry to hear that your parents had to expeirence that, I can not imagine how that must have been for them to endure that, then to try and build their lives after losing so much of their spirit, loved ones, the pyschological burden of asking "why?".

It is hard to believe that human beings could do some of the things that they/we do to other human beings.

 

nadinbrzezinski

(154,021 posts)
30. Well genocides are not exclusively nazis
Wed Oct 17, 2012, 08:35 PM
Oct 2012

the Guatemalan Junta practiced it, just ask the Maya (some of the folks I debriefed as an 18 year old Red Cross worker, I could be hearing stories from Dad in another language, that is all)

In fact, as bad as the Holocaust was, it was not the only genocide of the 20th century.

Never again in my mind means also waking up to that disturbing reality, genocides are not that rare.

backscatter712

(26,357 posts)
34. Absolute truth here!
Wed Oct 17, 2012, 08:50 PM
Oct 2012

Genocides and atrocities certainly aren't rare.

And I would argue that scumbags like Hitler aren't unique, or especially rare either.

I would argue there here, today, in the United States, there are millions of people who would willing work as concentration camp guards if they were put to work guarding imprisoned Muslims, or liberals, or black people, or Latinos...

 

nadinbrzezinski

(154,021 posts)
35. Yup, that is true
Wed Oct 17, 2012, 08:54 PM
Oct 2012

it is personality based as you well know.

By the way, professional hazard, but I no longer have a knee jerk reaction when the word nazi comes up... but words do matter.

Now if you wanted to compare the Guatemalan Junta to the Nazis, by all means.

backscatter712

(26,357 posts)
5. RWA/SDO Double-High. Hitler was one too.
Wed Oct 17, 2012, 07:30 PM
Oct 2012

RWA=Right Wing Authoritarian - has high levels of the traits of authoritarian submission, authoritarian aggression and conventionalism.

SDO=Social Dominance Orientation - the traits that lead a person to exercise dominance over others, often through dishonest and unethical ways. They do not believe in equality - thinking it to be a sucker's game.

I'll dig up a link to The Authoritarians once I'm sitting in front of my PC.

UPDATE: The link is http://home.cc.umanitoba.ca/~altemey/ to The Authoritarians, by Bob Altemeyer. VERY GOOD BOOK, and you can read it free online! - Dr. Altemeyer has been doing research into authoritarian behavior since the 1970's. He really knows his shit. I've read much of his academic work - he knows how to back up his research. The book I linked to simply explains his research in layman's terms. It is quite good.

PD Turk

(1,289 posts)
7. Naw
Wed Oct 17, 2012, 07:35 PM
Oct 2012

He's a money grubbing opportunist, con man, huckster and cheat. He's motivated by adding to his wealth and little else. I think he sees the Presidency as a way to rake it in like never before.

backscatter712

(26,357 posts)
24. Hitler was also a huckster.
Wed Oct 17, 2012, 08:14 PM
Oct 2012

It's just that through an accident of history, he ended up in the position of being able to gain total dictatorial control over a powerful, industrialized nation, and he went nuts with that power and killed millions.

But in the end, he was a con-man. Who was lucky enough to pull the most destructive scam in history.

Iggo

(49,927 posts)
14. I'm sure the Mittster would look damn snappy in one o' them uniforms.
Wed Oct 17, 2012, 07:47 PM
Oct 2012

If I had the photoshop skills...

backscatter712

(26,357 posts)
18. It's not trivializing, it's making a valid comparison.
Wed Oct 17, 2012, 08:03 PM
Oct 2012

See my other post in this thread, linking to Dr. Bob Altemeyer's work on authoritarianism.

Because the psychology of Adolf Hitler and his cronies, and of Mitt Romney, IS THE SAME.

Right-Wing Authoritarianism and Social Dominance Orientation. I'm not talking out of my ass - I'm talking about the product of decades of psychological research.

Am I saying that Romney's going to automatically murder 12 million people in death camps? No. I'm saying the psychology is the same.

Look what happened the last time we let RWA/SDO double-highs take power - their names were George W. Bush and Dick Cheney. Thanks to them, we got the PATRIOT Act, the Iraq War, Gitmo, Abu Ghraib, "enhanced interrogation", The TSA and their pornoscanners... It will take decades to unfuck this country after what they did to it.

As the Israelis like to say, NEVER AGAIN!

GodlessBiker

(6,314 posts)
41. It's not a valid comparison.
Wed Oct 17, 2012, 10:54 PM
Oct 2012

And it is likening his conduct to that of executing millions upon millions of people. It is exactly that, and because of that, almost all analogies to the Nazies, except for, perhaps, groups like the Khmer Rouge, are completely over the top ridiculous, insulting, and disrespectful to the victims of Nazi atrocities.

Pbs1914

(147 posts)
42. It is not likening his conduct
Wed Oct 17, 2012, 11:41 PM
Oct 2012

It is likening his mentality/ideology. His basic overall idea of right wing social engineering. If the basic tenets of the ideologies are similar, what makes you think the policies carried out will be different. At one point in his rise to power Adolf Hitler was Time Magazines Man of the year. But all one had to do was read Mein Kampf to tell what his ideology was, and then the policies he would carry out once in power. The Neo-Conservative Project for a New American Century is that manual for this day and age.

backscatter712

(26,357 posts)
46. The only reason Romney hasn't ordered the murder of millions is he hasn't had the opportunity, yet..
Thu Oct 18, 2012, 01:08 AM
Oct 2012

I think the psychology is virtually identical between Mitt Romney and characters like Hitler, Stalin and Pol Pot.

When I look at Mitt Romney, I see in him authoritarianism, narcissism, lack of conscience or empathy, an insatiable craving for power, and intolerance of challenges to his authority. And he's the leader of a political party marked by authoritarianism, fanaticism, bigotry and barely-restrained violence. This is a dangerous combination.

Mitt Romney is very dangerous, and declaring that the Nazi comparison is off the table is, in my view, even more insulting to the memory of those killed in the Holocaust, than making the comparison frivolously. With the social norm against making the comparison or "going Godwin" is the implicit assumption that "It can't happen here."

I've got news for you. It can. America is not special, and we're just as vulnerable to falling to tyranny and being sucked into cruelty as any other nation in the world. Hitler wasn't a legendary demon of myth. He was a member of homo sapiens, expressing personality traits that are not only not unique, but not particularly rare.

Give Romney power, and people will experience injustice and violence, and very likely some will suffer and die. Will the number of people killed be 12 million like Hitler's death toll in his concentration camps? Maybe not, but at this point, we're only talking about degrees. Maybe only a few thousand will die, or go to prison unjustly, or get hurt. But I am certain that number is not going to be zero. That is Romney's personality. Give him power, and he WILL use it to hurt people.

It DID happen with Bush and Cheney. How many died in Iraq? How many people suffered at Gitmo and Bagram? How much of our morals did we flush down the toilet when our country started waterboarding? How safe do you think you are against indefinite detention, or police abuse?

rock

(13,218 posts)
10. Calling Romney a Nazi, a psychopath, a Hitler, or a fascist
Wed Oct 17, 2012, 07:43 PM
Oct 2012

is a little offensive to those groups.

 

cherokeeprogressive

(24,853 posts)
11. I guess you must have met many "educated" Nazis during the third reich in order to compare...
Wed Oct 17, 2012, 07:46 PM
Oct 2012

You obviously met a few death camp operators too, huh?

Pbs1914

(147 posts)
44. How is that relevant
Wed Oct 17, 2012, 11:49 PM
Oct 2012

We must touch and speak directly to anything we compare or have knowledge of. We can not compare any period in history to another to analyze if it happened before our birth? We can not compare and contrast similarities and differences in say the French Revolution vs the Bolshevik revolution because we weren't in Russia or weren't able to be in the court of Mary Antoniette.. Is that the gist of it? If I do not step foot in China, then China does not exist.. something along those lines...

Barack_America

(28,876 posts)
13. Sorry. Not going to trap me into agreeing.
Wed Oct 17, 2012, 07:47 PM
Oct 2012

I mean, c'mon, "exterminating an entire race of people"???

Pbs1914

(147 posts)
23. I didn't compare him to Hitler
Wed Oct 17, 2012, 08:14 PM
Oct 2012

I compared him to someone like Eichman. The person who signed off and implemented the policies and the plan delievered to him with ruthless business-like efficiency. All Grover Norquest wants Romney to do is place his signature on the legislation they pass to him. Has Romney ever stood up to the extremist in his party, or has he courted them?

"I mean, c'mon exterminating an entire race of people???"


Well I've read studies that estimate over 1 million Iraqi's have been murdered/exterminated (but referred to as "collateral damage) since GWB's war began. 17 of the 22 members are the Romney foreign Policy team are former Bush advisors. I don't believe I am as far off the mark as you may think (including crazy eyes emoticon ...

Also if/when Romney decides to go to war with Iran, which the neo-con chickenhawks in the project for the new american century are itching to do, then I really don't think, and tin foil hat asside regarding conspiracy theory vs. cause in affect relationtionships, that it would be a logical jumpt to theorize that a potential world war could very easily follow. I'm extrapolating sure, but history does repeat itself, and it doesn't take much to look at similarities at different points in time that compare with other critical points in time and say, hmmm "in 1914 with the rise of nationalism across the European continent, it seemed that at some point, war would be inevitable." Why would now be any different, theoretically. Have we evolved that much as humankind since the final solution in the 1940's, just 70 year ago..

backscatter712

(26,357 posts)
28. I'll say it again - the psychology is the same.
Wed Oct 17, 2012, 08:24 PM
Oct 2012

Romney's a RWA/SDO double-high, and in my opinion, he would be extremely dangerous as President.

ananda

(35,145 posts)
16. Obama said Romney is a good man..
Wed Oct 17, 2012, 07:57 PM
Oct 2012

.. because he's religious and loves his family.

How utterly and narrowly tribal that assumption is.

And yet, how are such "good men" towards others
outside their narrow circle?

backscatter712

(26,357 posts)
19. Obama has to say such things because he's the President.
Wed Oct 17, 2012, 08:05 PM
Oct 2012

He has to say these things in public because he's expected to - he has to put on the hat of statesman.

My impression is that privately, Obama can't stand the fascist bastard, and has absolutely no respect for him.

Pbs1914

(147 posts)
26. +1
Wed Oct 17, 2012, 08:21 PM
Oct 2012

That is simply Obama taking the focus away from a personal attack on the man himself, to a critique of the policies and ideologies of Romney simply because he has to. Democrats are held to a higher standard and aren't allowed to play gutter politics the way the MSM allows Republicans to. Thats just the way it is IMO. Barack Obama has to be statesmanlike at all times, while a GWB could be the beer guzzling idiot son fratboy neighbor, and that was just A ok for seven+ years.

marions ghost

(19,841 posts)
54. Obama has a hard time acting
Thu Oct 18, 2012, 08:42 AM
Oct 2012

when his instinct is to avoid the guy like the plague. That's what happened with the first debate IMO--Obama was tired & distracted, not up for debating the ass clown. He misunderestimated Bomney, out of disrespect. He loathes him, it's very obvious.

Diplomacy with sociopathic predators is not so easy for politicians who still have a shred of integrity.

H2O Man

(79,052 posts)
17. The use of the word
Wed Oct 17, 2012, 08:02 PM
Oct 2012

"Nazi" tends to get a strong emotional reaction on DU. The reason for this is obvious, of course.

Were we to remove either that specific word, or the emotional power it carries, and discuss the topic in another manner, your OP might fare better. For example, in 1973, Erich Fromm published "The Anatomy of Human Destructiveness." Fromm was one of the greatest thinkers of the last century, who fully understood and appreciated the horrors of Nazi Germany.

In this book, which is among his most important, he examines the personality-types that are most often associated with causing great suffering for others. More, he looks at the cultural dynamics that too often allow such people to rise to power in a sick society. And this includes chapters on the Nazis.

Not knowing you, I cannot possibly speculate on your intentions with the OP. It could be intended as an attempt for meaningful conversation; it could be intentional shit-stirring. Either way, I don't think it will work in its present form.

backscatter712

(26,357 posts)
21. "Nazi" is a trigger word, but I think we need to make the comparison nonetheless.
Wed Oct 17, 2012, 08:10 PM
Oct 2012

Yes, that means I'm asking you to shut off the emotional centers that trigger when you hear the word "Nazi", and make an academic-style comparison, as objectively as possible, between Mitt Romney and Adolf Hitler.

I can make only one conclusion. Both of the men display highly authoritarian personalities, a high level of disregard for ethics, law or fairness, a high psychological need to control people and exercise coercion upon those that won't obey them.

In my not-so-humble opinion, Mitt Romney is extremely dangerous, and must be kept away from the Oval Office at all costs. Maybe he won't send 20 million people to death camps, but he'll very likely destroy our civil liberties, rule in an extremely authoritarian way, possibly start yet more wars that will kill and maim countless thousands or millions, and drive this country into the ditch again.

H2O Man

(79,052 posts)
25. I was responding
Wed Oct 17, 2012, 08:16 PM
Oct 2012

to the identified author of the OP. I'm not sure if you are one-the-same, nor interested enough to make a closer comparison of writing styles.

I will, however, point out that my response was, like myself, without emotion. It was a 100% rational response which, if understood, encourages people to read an important work on the dangers that people like Romney pose to humanity.

backscatter712

(26,357 posts)
31. Fair enough.
Wed Oct 17, 2012, 08:36 PM
Oct 2012

I haven't read Fromm's work - I'm a fan of Altemeyer and his work on authoritarian personalities.

My style is to simply use words like "Nazi" often enough so as to push past the emotional response, desensitize people to the word a bit, which will enable people to discuss the subject sanely.

But yeah, I agree - Romney is indeed very dangerous.

Pbs1914

(147 posts)
36. At it's most base level H20
Wed Oct 17, 2012, 08:56 PM
Oct 2012

I am just calling a spade a spade from my own perspective. Yesterday's Jews would be today's Muslims. it could happen so easily and half the country in those red state areas could or would be willing enablers. "Bomb, Bomb, Bomb Iran".. said one of the very few, if/only semi-rational member/ss of the Republican party in the last election, and BEFORE the tea party became a polarizing extreem right force/movement setting the republican agenda even further right.

To answer your question, it was in fact intended as an attempt (that I believe succedeed in reading the responses) for meaningful conversation. Because Romney can come off as a doofus, or gaffe prone etc. at times I think (well his poll numbers are at or above 45%, so he's got the backing of a great deal of the populace) he is able to present as less harmful and sadistic than he is. But the actual policies.. (including the project for a new american century)... are so vile that in a moment of candor, even newt ginggrich called it/them right wing social engineering. I simply see the parellel/s and did not feel the need to sugar coat it in this instance.

From the top of my head I can not recall the actual name ascribed to it, but a study was done looking at the role of authority and order in regards to a stranger initiating an electric shock to anther stranger and continually increasing the voltage. It found that most of the people in the study, after being coerced, did in fact continually increase the electric shocks to the suppossed subject (there was none) despite the cries and pleas they heard. I am pretty sure you are familiar with that study, and with its correlation to "The Anatomy of Human Destructivenes."

backscatter712

(26,357 posts)
40. That study is the Milgram Experiment.
Wed Oct 17, 2012, 09:18 PM
Oct 2012
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milgram_experiment

Another study of interest is the Stanford Prison Experiment

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stanford_prison_experiment

You might find this interesting - Phil Zimbardo, the person responsible for the Stanford Prison Experiment, who also wrote the book The Lucifer Effect, gave a great TED talk!

Bucky

(55,334 posts)
32. Romney is perky and flexible. Nazis are neither.
Wed Oct 17, 2012, 08:39 PM
Oct 2012

Your comparison is worse than wrong; it's trite.

backscatter712

(26,357 posts)
33. "Perky and flexible"?
Wed Oct 17, 2012, 08:41 PM
Oct 2012

Well, Romney's certainly flexible with the truth...

Hitler had that sort of talent too.

EnviroBat

(5,290 posts)
39. I agree 100%
Wed Oct 17, 2012, 09:15 PM
Oct 2012

He's also a dangerous member of the New American Fascist plutocracy, aka PNAC. I'm having a very difficult time right now trying to talk myself out of the very distinct probability that these bastards are responsible for orchestrating the recent attacks on the consulate in Benghazi. i believe that this was done to create the ultimate "October surprise". These fascists pricks want to install this asshole into the presidency at any cost. Romney is connected to the Bush cartel, the CIA, Rumsfield, Cheney, the list goes on and on. These are people that make Hitler look like a Nobel Peace Prize contender by comparison. I am very afraid for the future of this country, and the world for that matter.

Pbs1914

(147 posts)
45. I wouldn't agree with anybody making Hitler look better
Wed Oct 17, 2012, 11:52 PM
Oct 2012

Not in the least, and strongly disagree on that point. But I agree with everything else you wrote. I would not put anything past the neo-conservatives.

 

Herlong

(649 posts)
47. Romney reminds me of the guy who can win the next election
Thu Oct 18, 2012, 01:29 AM
Oct 2012

Last edited Thu Oct 18, 2012, 02:08 AM - Edit history (1)

If we don't get our heads out of our asses. Who cares what he reminds you of?

 

Herlong

(649 posts)
48. If my navel weren't so much fuzzier
Thu Oct 18, 2012, 01:31 AM
Oct 2012

I'd spend time gazing into yours!


navel–gaz·ing /ˈneɪvəlˈgeɪzɪŋ/ noun
[noncount] somewhat humorous : the activity of thinking too much or too deeply about yourself, your experiences, your feelings, etc.

backscatter712

(26,357 posts)
49. When you brought up Eichmann, you reminded me of some of my grad school work from last year.
Thu Oct 18, 2012, 01:47 AM
Oct 2012

The concept I'm remembering is that of Administrative Evil.

Eichmann was a monster who engineered the Holocaust, but how did he do that? He was also a bureaucrat. He administered various parts of the Nazi government, came up with all sorts of procedures, like development of the legal definition of a Jew, for example, arranged to pay third class fare on the German railways for each prisoner loaded up in the cattle cars to Auschwitz by confiscating prisoners' property and billing Jewish communities.

And the really fucked up thing is that the real monsters at the top got millions of ordinary Germans to play along. For most people, it was the Elephant in the Room nobody would talk about, or that they'd even acknowledge to themselves. They use patriotism and religion to trick people into doing horrifically evil things while thinking they're doing good.

An individual in the Nazi killing machine might say "Why are you accusing me? I didn't personally throw anyone into the ovens! I just wrote up train schedules." They get individuals to do just little pieces. They desensitize people to the violence and cruelty. They mask it. They disguise it, make them think they're doing this nasty thing for the greater good.

You want to know how a Nazi sergeant would go about training a new guard in torturing prisoners? If you order him into the dungeon and order him to start working over the prisoners with the blowtorch and pliers immediately, the new guard would lose it. He'd hesitate. He'd question. He might even refuse. And in WWII, some soldiers ordered to murder people did refuse, at the price of their own lives. What to do? The sergeant would first order the new guy to stand guard outside the torture chamber, order him to stand at attention, keep his composure, make sure the prisoners don't see him lose discipline. The guard would hear the screams, and he'd get upset, but he'd tough it out. Make him do a few shifts like this, and if the guard's holding together, bring him in the torture chamber, and order him to watch. Lather, rinse and repeat for a few days. Then order him to start helping. Hold the prisoner down, lock him in restraints, but still make him watch as the sergeant uses the blowtorch. Then make the guard do some low-level torture, say use the pliers to mash fingers on a more pliant prisoner...

That's how they do it. Work ordinary folks up to insane cruelty a little bit at a time. Some desensitization here. Some dehumanization there. Before long, you're a war criminal and hardly realize it. It's the same as the Milgram Experiment. Start with little shocks. Increase the voltage. Give a little push when people hesitate. Most people will deliver that 450 volt lethal shock, even though before the experiment, they wouldn't consider it.

Eichmann represented the banality of evil. He made the Holocaust bureaucratic, and made its implementation into an industrial process.

backscatter712

(26,357 posts)
50. Another reason why I am with the OP and Going Godwin...
Thu Oct 18, 2012, 02:24 AM
Oct 2012

Did you think that the Third Reich was able to kill millions of people on Day One?

No. They got there in degrees.

Early 1920's Germany was a democracy. Flawed, messy, kind of like our own, with fanatics coming out of the woodwork. But Jews were able to live normal lives in the Weimar Republic, and members of the GLBT community found tolerance and sanctuary in Berlin.

Germany went from messy democracy to blood-soaked dictatorship a little bit at a time.

In 1933, Hitler still had to pay lip service to things like human rights. He couldn't just kill anyone he wanted - he had to build the power to do that. He started with the Enabling Act. His first victims weren't Jews, but liberals and communists - he consolidated power by harassing his political enemies. Then, he did things like firing Jews from government jobs, and denying them professional licenses. Later, the Nazis developed a legal framework - first defining who is or isn't "Jewish" - they had to cook up a formal legal definition. Then they came up with a rule that Jews who were naturalized, then left the country forfeited their property to the state. Seemed small enough, until the Gestapo started kidnapping Jews, driving them over the border, then seizing their houses. Even at their most monstrous, they were very legalistic, and made a show of acting "compliant" with the legal protections still in place in the 30's. Hitler knocked down those protections a little at a time.

The Holocaust didn't begin in earnest until the 1940's. Germany was coaxed into committing the Holocaust a little bit at a time.

Don't compare America to Nazi Germany of 1945, that had murdered millions. Compare America to Germany in 1928, which was still a democracy, but with crazy people jockeying for power. Hitler hadn't had anyone thrown into death camps yet in 1928. Back then, he wasn't a demon so horrible we hesitate to speak his name. He was just another asshole - an authoritarian narcissist with a silver tongue jockeying for power.

So far, Mitt Romney has only had the power coming from being a business executive, a religious leader, and a governor with very limited power over military assets. With the authority he had, he's has cost thousands of people jobs, destroyed companies, mismanaged a state government, and harassed women in the Mormon church who were pregnant & in medical distress, or who were single mothers. He's caused plenty of mayhem, but he hasn't had the power to order people killed yet. Without the power to kill, he's already left trails of destruction in peoples' lives.

Think of how he'd behave as Commander in Chief. Think of him having power over the CIA, the FBI, the armed forces. George W. Bush and his cronies killed hundreds of thousands in Iraq, seriously eroded our civil liberties, and drove our economy into the ditch when they had power.

I'm not saying Mitt Romney is a Nazi-esque monster. I'm saying he can become a Nazi-esque monster if he's given the power of the President. Not all at once, but he'd take us further down that road where we don't want to go. Mitt Romney is psychologically speaking exactly the kind of person who absolutely should not be given power.

NYC Liberal

(20,453 posts)
52. Oh please. Romney may be a cold-hearted asshole, but to say he would murder millions of people
Thu Oct 18, 2012, 06:21 AM
Oct 2012

"with nary a second thought" is over the top and trivializes the very real genocide committed by real Nazis in the 1930s and 1940s.

There are millions of cold-hearted assholes. Romney is one of them.

Jersey Devil

(10,833 posts)
56. This op is insensitive and stupid
Thu Oct 18, 2012, 10:37 AM
Oct 2012

Equating a bad politician to a genocidal maniac who exterminated over 6,000,000 people is asinine.

backscatter712

(26,357 posts)
59. No. Personalities like Hitlers are not unique, or even particularly rare.
Thu Oct 18, 2012, 10:50 AM
Oct 2012

Compare Romney to the Hitler of 1928 - remember that back in '28, Hitler hadn't really killed anyone yet (except in WWI), so he wasn't known as a demonic monster, he was just another asshole.

I would say the personalities are similar.

If Romney becomes President, I don't know that he'd kill tens of millions of people, but I am absolutely convinced the casualty count will not be zero. Romney is the kind of person that abuses power, and as President of the United States, he would have the power to kill thousands.

 

NCTraveler

(30,481 posts)
57. Very stupid op.
Thu Oct 18, 2012, 10:38 AM
Oct 2012

Romney is a piece of shit. That puts him no where near Adolph Eichmann. To compare the two shows you have a complete lack of knowledge with the subject you have chosen to write about.

backscatter712

(26,357 posts)
64. Only for lack of opportunity.
Thu Oct 18, 2012, 12:17 PM
Oct 2012

Last edited Thu Oct 18, 2012, 02:23 PM - Edit history (1)

As Bain's president, Romney was buying up Chinese factories for their slave labor - those factories come complete with guard towers and barbed wire. He trades in fucking slaves!

Think of what he'd be capable of if he got in the White House and had the power to kill thousands at will...

 

NCTraveler

(30,481 posts)
67. Really no need. If that is why you believe he is.....
Thu Oct 18, 2012, 03:21 PM
Oct 2012

similar to Adolph Eichman then there is no brilliance that could bring you back to reality.

You do realize that our current government gives people like Romney, Buffet, Jobs(ex), the right to use slave labor. Are they all like Adolph Eichman. If so, Adolph Eichman was more the norm than an extreme. I know that is not the truth. I am sure you do too.

 

B Calm

(28,762 posts)
58. No doubt Romney is a fascist
Thu Oct 18, 2012, 10:50 AM
Oct 2012

and so were the Nazi's, but I don't think he would go as far as
putting people in gas chambers.

backscatter712

(26,357 posts)
61. You sure about that?
Thu Oct 18, 2012, 10:56 AM
Oct 2012

He thinks nothing about buying Chinese factories full of slave labor. Oh wait, he thought the guard towers and the barbed wire were to keep people out, because that factory was such a wonderful place to work for a nickel an hour while living in trashed-out, overcrowded barracks!

So far, he's only had the powers of a business executive and a Mormon bishop, and a very limited amount of state coercive power as governor. As President, he would have the power to kill almost at will. Would you trust him with that power? I won't.

Javaman

(65,711 posts)
62. mittens is a sociopath, isn't that enough?
Thu Oct 18, 2012, 10:58 AM
Oct 2012

to compare him to the likes of Adolph Eichman is just complete ignorance of the highest order.

WiffenPoof

(2,404 posts)
69. This OP Reminds Me...
Thu Oct 18, 2012, 03:56 PM
Oct 2012

...of the kinds of posts you read in Freeper Land. Nice job making us look as silly as the other side. Unnecessary post...too much time on your hands.

Paige

 

Texas-Limerick

(93 posts)
70. Republicans and Nazis
Thu Oct 18, 2012, 05:45 PM
Oct 2012

Republicans and Nazis we should never compare
To do so would be outrageous and unfair!
But there's a question that continually keeps me awake
Would old Nazis good Republicans make?

Republicans could never be Nazis, for goodness sake!
But could Nazis, in the Grand Old Party, ever partake?
Could the founding fathers of the Thousand Year Reich
Adapt to the party of a Thousand  Points  of Light?

Given some thought, it's not so unfeasible 
Even President Eisenhower thought it conceivable
When he found SS  Wernher Von Braun hiding in the thistles
Only to make him father of NASA and our ballistic missiles

Given that example, why couldn't more rehabilitate their brand?
This time, be good soldiers for the Republican high command 
Wouldn't Rommel, a Panzer Commander of Field Marshal rank
Be equally comfortable running a right wing think tank?

Or Joseph Goebbels, charged to propagandize and flummox
Could become a talking head  with his own show on Fox
Eichmann and his concentration  camp guards
Would be pole watchers, checking our registration cards

And those entitlement programs that never really worked
Our leaders bold proposals they've flip flopped and shirked 
Would Nazis be like these windsocks and spin it?
Or would they throw grandma off the cliff?  ...In a Wehrmacht minute!
 

Coyotl

(15,262 posts)
71. So?
Thu Nov 22, 2012, 09:48 AM
Nov 2012

You need to do a bit more research on the Mormon faith because "Romney is/was a high ranking Bishop" is false information. Bishop's are just like local pastors, not even with a church attached.

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