Is there any possibility that Cumo may be innocent?

[Nexus2]

It really doesn't look good. There's several accusers with corroboration of their experiences, a seeming mountain of document evidence and he really appears to have no evidence or anyone saying that the accusation don't seem like him. His defense/explanation doesn't hold to examination.

Overall, it seems pretty airtight.

[dsc]

1. about the same as my 5' 10" 240 lb self winning the Boston Marathon

and turning around and climbing Mt Everest.

[mucifer]

2. They have email threats so no

[no_hypocrisy]

3. Possibility, yes. Probability, no.

[bullwinkle428]

4. 40 witnesses testified under penalty of potential imprisonment, to

what they had observed regarding this case. It seems rather difficult to try and "FAKE NEWS!" this away, as Comb-over Caligula had attempted to do in the Ukraine impeachment case.

[PJMcK]

5. Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha... ha ha ha ha!

Nope.

Not a chance.

By the way, I voted for him 3 times for governor. It's time for Cuomo to go.

[kentuck]

6. Is there any possibility...?

...that Andrew Cuomo has created several political enemies and some people may have seen him as a threat to the power structure of the Party? They may have thought he was going to run for the Presidency in 2024?

I suppose anything is possible but people are going to believe what they are going to believe.

[Percy]

32. I think all of that is true.

Depending on how this goes he could still run for the presidency. It's unlikely, but he'd make a very good president.

[pwb]

7. I still like him. Do a criminal investigation and I may change my mind.

A Report does not prove anything legally. IMO.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

8. Oh come on.

[Deminpenn]

9. There is a generational and cultural gap imho

Cuomo grew up in the 1950's and early 60's when men were still supposed to be the breadwinners and women were just starting to become more independent. Add to that he grew up in a very traditional Italian Catholic family where there was a lot of affectionate hugging, touching and kissing. Today's young women, they are very independent and expect to be treated as equals. I can easily see things Cuomo did where it never even crossed his mind that his action would be considered offensive to a younger woman.

FTR, not a fan of Cuomo's especially after reading a New Yorker profile story on him.

[mopinko]

11. it's the retaliation and the hostile work environment that got to me.

the touchy stuff, i half way agree w you, but come on. #metoo #timesup
that's just not an excuse any more.

but i'm about that age. and yeah, we expected it. we put up w it. we survived it.
except for those who didnt. it wasnt the guys w the fast hands that were the problem, it was the ones who couldnt take no for an answer. those are the ones that crushed people.

so, fuck him. step down.

[Deminpenn]

13. Where I worked, women

gave as good as they got. The message got through.

[ariadne0614]

12. He also grew up in a time when husbands got away with beating and raping their wives.

If he was able to make those two cultural adjustments over a period of half a century, I'm sure he's smart enough to see the entire picture.

[kskiska]

19. I grew up in that time, too

and worked in a fairly large office where there was an office manager for the female employees, as well as one for males. Women weren't allowed to wear pants to work until around 1970. Secretaries went along with their bosses on business meetings in places like Puerto Rico. I was hit on all the time by men, even senior VPs, but never would have dreamed of making an issue of it. You'd just handle it.

Many women today have agendas. I hope Cuomo hangs in there and doesn't resign.

[Mary in S. Carolina]

22. Please don't minimize the Abuse of Women

The women are handling it, you didn't "handle it", in fact, you enabled abuse if you did not sue.

[Deminpenn]

28. No one was filing lawsuits back then

and wouldn't even have thought about it. In the office there was a place for women (secretaries, clerks, filing) and a place for men (being the bosses). It's still that way in more places than maybe you realize.

[cbabe]

41. There were no legal

protections back then. So even the concept of harassment didn't exist much less the ability to file a lawsiut.

The choice was to quit. Or take it.

To ignore our lifelong degradation only makes the silencing so much worse.

[Mary in S. Carolina]

58. Got it!

I forget about those women that came before me that had no recourse. I am sorry for what you had to go through.

[Deminpenn]

27. Everytime I watch an episode of

"I Love Lucy" or "The Honeymooners" or even "The Dick Van Dyke Show", I think "wow, that would not be happening today".

[Deminpenn]

39. Thanks

I don't think this is a hit job on Cuomo, though.

[MotorCityBeard]

40. My reaction is the same watching Mad Men

I started working in offices in the mid 80's. This was around the time of the Anita Hill hearings, and those had a big impact on office culture.

We had a department meeting, and my boss asked everyone around the table if they believed Ms. Hill. And yes, I thought it was a horribly inappropriate question for work.

Anyways, all the females believed her; all the males, except for me, did not believe her. Being the lone male hold out, I was asked why. I said she stood to lose a hell of a lot by coming forward (her reputation, job, etc.). If she was willing to risk all that, I really felt (and still do) that she was sincere.

[LeftInTX]

53. Don Draper would have been old enough to be his father...

Cuomo was born in 1957...He was too young to go to Woodstock, he probably smoked pot at times, had a stack of Led Zepplin records, and probably was into Saturday Night Fever....

I was born in 1956.

There was nothing like Mad Men going on with my peers...

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

26. He was born in 1957. By 1970, the year he turned 13,

women were beginning to make vast strides in the workplace. Women's Lib was a thing by the late '60s.

He grew up along with the changes. No excuse. None whatsoever.

Trying to cut him some slack because of his age is wrong, just as wrong as the things he did.

[leftyladyfrommo]

30. I started working in a bank in 1970.

i was right out of college.

All kinds of shit went on. Employees just thought it was business as usual.

It wasn't just the men. A lot of women liked the parties, too. The thinking was just completely different then.

The man who owned the bank was a huge Nixon supporter. He. Went on to become an ambassador.
He liked pretty young blondes. The women that turned him down lost their jobs.

We just learned to deal.

[kskiska]

49. I concur.

In the office I worked in, the women were complicit in so many of those situations, or just laughed off the innuendo. I don't recall even one incident, though maybe it wasn't spoken of, where a man became physical or forced himself on a woman. I remember a girl jokingly saying, "Hey, John, when are you gonna take me to bed?"

[Deminpenn]

31. While that's true although the 50's ran into the mid-60s,

you cannot discount Cuomo's cultural upbringing in a very traditional Italian Catholic home. I'm sure treating women with respect was a key part of that. But there are also many Italian homes where hugging, kissing, caressing, touching, patting are signs of affection and love. Sometimes you don't stop to think not everyone was raised the same way and might see things differently.

Not defending Cuomo, but just noting that the perceptions of actions by one person aren't always the same as the perceptions of the other person. And those perceptions can be influenced by age and upbringing.

[LeftInTX]

52. No..please stop with that

He's Italian-American, but he is savvy enough to know what the norms are in American culture...Sure there is more of that in that in the Italian culture, but that's not what's going on here....
You're confusing affection with a power grab..Huge difference.

[Treefrog]

38. Thank you.

[Raine]

55. EXACTLY! nt

[Cuthbert Allgood]

29. He's 9 years older than I am and your assessment is bullshit.

Are you seriously saying he isn't capable of learning cultural norms because he was born in the 50s. What else is he incapable of adapting to?

[Polybius]

33. Gotta change with the times

It's like an older person dressing like it's still 1987. It's just not right, and makes them look bad.

[Deminpenn]

35. That's true to a degree

I think people adapt more than they actually change.

[Treefrog]

37. I'm the same age as Cuomo. I'm a woman, and this has NEVER been acceptable.

Especially at the professional levels in which he’s worked.

Many of us pushed back about this behavior, and it’s been known for years that it is wrong. Screw these excuses for a serial abuser.

[Sur Zobra]

43. I'm Cuomo's age

I was born in 1959. We grew up in the 1960s and the 1970s, not the ‘50s.

I always felt offended by groping men. The difference for young women today, is that it is a little harder for men to get away with such behavior and more women are calling them out for it.

I also grew up in a Catholic family. Not one of my 4 brothers sexually harassed women, but they aren’t arrogant, power hungry, nor did they feel privileged to act the way that Cuomo acted. My brothers knew it was wrong to act that way, and Cuomo knew it was wrong also, but he did it anyway because he felt entitled to act that way. He still does

[LeftInTX]

45. It's about power

[Sur Zobra]

47. Yup

[LeftInTX]

44. Cuomo is a year younger than me...He turned 18 in 1975

No...unless he was from another country, he grew up with modern norms....

My husband is Mexican-American and the same age..He always knew better.....
I grew up in a very traditional family also...It was probably more traditional than Cuomo's. My dad's parents were immigrants.

Cuomo grew up in a powerful family, so I'm thinking that's where this might stem from.
Sexual harassment is often a "power play" in work settings.


I really don't see the Italian-Catholic-breadwinner-hugger-kisser as part of this.

I experienced some harassment in the late 70s and 80s, but every man was always alot older than me. The worst offender was a guy from India....(This was 1980) That guy was in his late 30's and was hell bent on getting what he wanted...
Also guys from the middle east were problematic, but I did not work with them, but went to school with a lot of them. (Iranians)..They were pretty bad, but I could avoid them.

Cuomo knew better.....

[Phoenix61]

10. Nope, not a chance.

The odds of getting that many people to lie about the same thing is ridiculously small. They would all have to be motivated by something and if it’s money, think of how much they could make by blowing the lid off a conspiracy that big? And with that many people involved one of them would go for it.

[Demsrule86]

15. Yes. The AG found these women credible, but I do not. they should have been willing to

go under oath. And I believe this is politically motivated by those who want a different candidate. So I say to Cuomo do not resign. Make them try to impeach you because more will come out during this process.

[Polly Hennessey]

17. I agree with you.

[Mary in S. Carolina]

24. Who said the women would not go "Under Oath"??

Where are your sources??

[BradAllison]

46. Biden says he should resign

OH NO WHAT TO DO NOW????

[Sur Zobra]

48. Don't worry

They will impeach him

[Tom Rinaldo]

16. Yes. This may all be part of a dream that you are having

And I, along with the rest of this board, and all of Cuomo's accusers are all just a part of it. When the alarm goes off and you wake up you will realize that none of the shit that Cuomo is accused of actually happened.

Hey, it's possible

[Polly Hennessey]

18. Anything is possible. 😚

[Percy]

42. Ouch.

C'mon -- mean humor won't get you anywhere.

[Tom Rinaldo]

54. I didn't mean it to be mean, honest

I just thought it was a playful way to express the opinion that eleven women (most if not all of them Democrats) a Democratic Attorney General who herself campaigned with Cuomo, and elected Democrats at all levels of government in NY State are unlikely to have it wrong. I have no gripe with the OP's author (who was asking for opinions) and did not mean it as a dig.

[ansible]

20. Everyone who had their posts constantly deleted for criticizing Cuomo deserve an apology now

He's scum

[alphafemale]

23. How about you ask those women. Or you can just demean them as overreacting.

Like he did.

[Nexus2]

56. I don't know them nd have no way to reach them, besides they have said what they think.

As I said in my OP, the case seems pretty airtight, tons of corroborated testimony and documented evidence. Cumo appears to be guilty of what he was accused of as far I can tell barring some huge cinematic (bordering on fantastic) conspiracy or a M. Night Shyamalan level twist/reveal.

But I wanted to get other opinions to see if anyone had, perhaps, read or seen something I missed or had some different thoughts or observations.

[Bucky]

25. There's two ways he could be innocent

1) There was no sexual harassment... and just by coincidence all 11 women who accuse him are just terribly mistaken
2) It's a frame up job by... um... his arch nemisis Dr. Evil

Failing either scenario, I'm pretty sure 11 accusations of sexual harassment is a slam dunk.

[Jose Garcia]

50. It would mean everyone else is lying and he alone is telling the truth

[MustLoveBeagles]

51. I don't know

As you said it doesn't look good. I was in favor of the investigation hoping he'd be exonerated but that's not how it turned out. I don't think the allegations against him were made up but found the timing of the leaks suspicious and the fallout from this will be politized. I don't see how he recovers and predict he will be forced out one way or another. I'm now very afraid that the California recall could go badly for us. I predict that the Republican governors who've done similar or even worse things will get away with it without consequences. That's just the way it is.

I'm sorry that some posters chose to mock you in their replies.

[Nexus2]

57. Thanks. It happens. I think some folks thought I was saying Cumo WAS innocent. [nt]