Seth Moulton attacks Biden, demands congressional investigation: 'A Total F*cking Disaster'

[dalton99a]

https://nymag.com/intelligencer/article/inside-seth-moulton-secret-kabul-trip.html

“The thing that everybody needs to understand, even if you completely agree with the Biden administration’s decision to withdraw, the way they have handled this has been a total fucking disaster,” said Moulton, who traveled to the country with Republican representative from Michigan, Peter Meijer. “It will be measured in bodies, because a lot of people are dying because they can’t get out.”

Moulton said he doesn’t know why the evacuation didn’t begin earlier. However, it’s something he’d “absolutely” like to investigate as part of a congressional commission. With deadly violence outside the airport and thousands of potential refugees stranded, Moulton is adamant that “the administration has created a disaster of epic proportions.”

blah blah blah

Self-promoting asshole is auditioning for a Fox News gig

[TreasonousBastard]

1. Moulton's a fucking disaster. Just mouthing off for the crowd.

[TheProle]

9. Sure

A former Marine officer with a Harvard physics degree… just some mr. know it all rube…

[kcr]

22. Harvard degrees

aren't rube-proof.

https://www.logical-fallacy.com/articles/appeal-to-authority/

[TheProle]

27. this is rich

since my post was in response to a textbook ad hominem attack.

[Cha]

2. FO Moulton

Wonder what Nancy has to say about that?

[Ocelot II]

3. Isn't he the one who tried to get rid of Pelosi as House speaker?

Maybe some judgment issues there, even besides sneaking off to Afghanistan?

[dalton99a]

5. Pelosi AND Hoyer AND Clyburn

“We need to make room for a new generation of leaders," Moulton said. "This election was a call for change from the American people, and we have an extraordinary freshman class that includes a lot of young people, LGBT candidates and an extraordinary number of women and veterans."

Moulton isn’t only calling for Pelosi to step down. He also thinks Representatives Steny Hoyer and Jim Clyburn should step down from their respective positions of House Majority Leader and Majority Whip.

“This is not about her. It’s about being a party that is focused on the future,” Moulton said. “I don’t think anybody looks at the top three leaders in the House right now and says, ‘Oh yeah, that’s the future of the party.’”

[vanlassie]

4. GRANDSTANDER.

[Baked Potato]

6. I think he's compromised. Nt

[Hoyt]

7. Do we feel same about Schiff who also criticized Biden, although

not as severely, a few days ago.

How about the majority of Democrats who are not coming out in support of this mess? Most support withdrawal, but not this messy way?

[BannonsLiver]

13. Key words: "not as severely."

Not apples to apples or a very convincing point, frankly.

[Grokenstein]

14. Oh, do they support the clean, perfect, spotless withdrawal?

Gosh, one wonders why Biden selected "Messy Way" when he ordered on the app.

[Hoyt]

25. I do wonder why he tried to do it without much planning. What's so special about 9/11 as

far as getting everyone out. Sounds like something a publicist dreamed up.

The signs were there and Schiff said just that.

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=15775029

[dsc]

21. Did Schiff go to Afghanistan and take seats on a flight out?

[Wingus Dingus]

26. I wonder what the alternate non-dangerous non-messy way to withdraw is, that they

keep referencing, as if there was another playbook for extracting citizens and refugees and troops after 20 years with no stable partners left in the country. Once the Afghan government and army collapsed, it was going to be an irreversible shitshow no matter what.

[Hoyt]

29. Put in more troops earlier, rather than waiting until people were falling off an airplane, Taliban

had taken over the country, including another airport.

Make sure the WH, military, State Department, etc., were not telling conflicting stories.

Making sure the National Security Advisor didn't have to say, "It's your responsibility to get to Kabul," even if you have to transverse 300 miles of Taliban controlled dirt roads.

Make sure we didn't tick off Britian, Germany, France, etc., trying to meet some deadline a publicist dreamed up to be out by 9/11.

When the chit hits the fan, don't start pointing fingers at military, State Department, intelligence, trump (who is thankfully out of office), etc.

Listen to Hillary Clinton, she said this is what would happen in May and she has been helping "at risk women" out, people that our main team totally forgot.

More later.

Besides, we both know that if trump had been in office -- gawd forbid -- we'd be calling for a 3rd Impeachment with this performance.

[Wingus Dingus]

32. Honestly, that shit about a kid falling from a plane...

media eats that up but that's no different to me than all the previous 20 years of Afghanistan-war awfulness. It's a terrible place where terrible things happen, and we have little control over it. People who worry about dirt roads where the Taliban can attack them should have been worried about that a long time ago and planned accordingly. People who ignored warnings to leave, what can I say? The US can't always save you. Miscommunication among agencies is common, I don't care about that. To me the big failure at the foundation of this withdrawal was the planned reliance on the Afghan government and army to hold and keep the city secure as we departed. As soon as we packed up they whipped off their uniforms and fled or changed sides. Intelligence failure? Assurances by overconfident generals in their training and loyalties? I'm sure that will be dissected in the future. But the rest of it: it is what it is. Easy to pick apart from the sidelines, but not helpful.

[Hoyt]

33. Such optics stick around, unfortunately. Have a hard time blaming the people we put there

for not making it to the one patch of land we protected, the people we told we'd protect if they helped us, etc.

[Wingus Dingus]

36. We have been flying those people out. Many thousands of helpers and refugees

in addition to Americans. That's been an impressive effort, despite the opportunistic terror attack. But once we and the Afghans lost control of the city, the end-game was going to be fraught with danger and chaos, end of story. You can blame the US military and Biden for that, but now is the time rally behind the evacuation efforts. I wish Dem congress critters would do that instead of running to cameras and Twitter to get their critiques on record. I'm actually not a big Joe Biden fan (but I did vote for him, of course)--but the attacks on him during this very dangerous moment make me sick.

[Act_of_Reparation]

39. What?

"Rally behind the evacuation efforts?"

What on Earth does that even mean? What will it accomplish? Will the evacuation stop if we don't grab the pompoms and start cheering the administration on?

Dude, this is nonsense.

[Wingus Dingus]

41. No, it means government officials, ESPECIALLY Democrats, not

going on tv and twitter and calling this "a fucking mess" and a catastrophe and "I wouldn't have done it this way" etc. and demoralizing the participants in the effort while it's ongoing. This operation is only going to last weeks, not years--plenty of critique-time later on. I think that's shitty/petty point-scoring for their own purposes. They can communicate their concerns within the appropriate channels, but then they won't get air-time and attention, I guess.

[question everything]

34. I agree that setting the symbolic date of 9/11 without, apparently

considering all facts on the ground was a mistake.

[treestar]

35. Yes

It's just plain stupid. There is no way for this not to be a "mess." And it won't get them re-elected.

[Demsrule86]

37. Yes I feel the same about all of them...loyalty matters...I will not support any of them in

a presidential primary and although I can't vote against them in a primary, I will l send money to their opponent should they face a primary for their current seat.

[Budi]

8. He claims they went to Afghanistan because they couldn't get answers from Biden

So how much time did Moultin actually spend there to assess the situation, who all did he talk with to conclude as he did?

He should be sanctioned & censured for this bullshit stunt. Did he discuss the situation with State & Military leaders here in the US before deciding to just go do a quick review on his own?

Did he approach Biden for a discussion on the matter before heading off on his own?

[dalton99a]

10. Doubtful. He's just a vainglorious, self-important, pompous ass

[Ocelot II]

11. They were there only about five or six hours. What could they have possibly learned

in such a short time that they had to go to Kabul to learn it?

[Tony_FLADEM]

12. I heard him once say he voted for George W. Bush in 2004.

[Lemon Lyman]

15. STFU

He's such a douche. And he's got a kavanaugh-looking face.

[arthritisR_US]

16. So projection is his defence mechanism

against his selfish and callous actions…alrighty then…

[belpejic]

17. This guy needs to pipe down

I would use harsher language, because that's how I really feel, but I have been punished by the moderators for doing so. He's clearly our party's Elise Stefanik, or Josh Hawley, and it is not helpful.

Right now we have an active mission in Afghanistan, and thousands of our troops are in harm's way. We need to be supporting them 100%. There will be plenty of time once this is all over to examine what happened.

Edit: correct spelling error.

[Bev54]

18. Send him back to Kabul to guard Abby gate.

asshole.

[emmaverybo]

19. Now we know who Moulton is. Exactly as the post says.

[OnDoutside]

20. Judgement and timing has never been Seth's strongest strengths...

[Hortensis]

23. Glad to see Moulton being his conservative asshole self.

Voters with lives to live and short memories end up being suckered by campaign sales pitches into electing too many over-ambitious and underprincipled Moultons.

[Klaralven]

24. Low ranking Marine officers shouldn't lie

“I wouldn’t be alive today without people like Mohammed. I put my life in their hands every single day I went out the gate, and I knew that they put their lives in mine,” Moulton said of his time in Iraq. “I promised him, ‘I will have your back. We will protect your family … and we will never leave you behind.’”

He had no power to keep such a promise.

[dalton99a]

45. +1. There is no contractual obligation for the U.S. to grant immigrant visas to translators, drivers

cooks et al.

There is no such clause in their employment agreement

The visas are allowed by Congress under a special program that they have to apply for (the Afghan Allies Protection Act of 2009)

(FWIW Throughout history, local helpers and collaborators were typically left to their fates by retreating armies)

[Tracer]

28. I'm tired of this guy's endless self-promotion.

How long was he in Afghanistan earlier this week anyway? 4 hours?

Glad I don't live in his district.

[kairos12]

30. If he took 1/10th the interest in 6 January he would some credibility.

[question everything]

31. Will at least primary challenge Biden (or Harris) in 2024

[Demsrule86]

38. And he will lose badly against Biden...I don't know if Harris wins a primary in 24 but I do not

believe Seth does...he has destroyed any chance he had. I would of course vote for him in a General.

[GoCubsGo]

40. His and Meijer's Jaunt to Afghanistan needs to be investigated first.

We need to know their stunt affected yesterday's bombing.

[Sogo]

42. The disaster was his attempted photo op in the midst of a very dangerous mission in Afghanistan.

Moulten wants to run again in 2024.

But he just shot down his prospects....

[Baitball Blogger]

43. History will see several things at once.

It will show that people were forewarned when Trump made a contract with the Taliban. They should have known that the end was in sight.

It will show that the State Department issued warnings months in advance, but people refused to heed the warning and, instead, put it on the military to evacuate them.

It will show that Republicans in Congress intentionally stymied attempts to pass bills that would have facilitated VISAs for the interpreters.

It will show the number of people successfully evacuated -- over 100,000 people.

Anyone who thought that something of this caliber could have taken place, is not realistic. Not in a country where every man and boy has a gun. Not where tribe fights against tribe. Not when so many individuals are willing to strap on bombs and surrender their lives for a cause that we can't even understand.

[Johonny]

44. 100000+ bodies have been evacuated so far. Far greater than anyone would have thought possible

those first 24 hrs when the news media crapped in their pants.

If you want to judge body count, judge the whole fucking war and the aftermath to come. Anything else is just political theatre.