From the sane Kennedys

[bigtree]

Rory Kennedy @roryekennedy 11h
Please read and share statement from my family regarding today’s recommendation of parole for Sirhan Sirhan.

Link to tweet

[WheelWalker]

1. Even the wise cannot see all ends.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

5. What is the wise course that the prescient amongst us should be seeking?

Last edited Sat Aug 28, 2021, 04:45 PM - Edit history (1)

[Hekate]

75. Well, Gandalf, this little Gollum has been prevented from further murders by watchful elves...

Right up until now, when apparently some of them let their brains go to sleep.

[Irish_Dem]

2. Sirhan has shown no remorse, pretends he doesn't remember the incident.

On what grounds can he be released.

[former9thward]

31. The same as any other murderer in CA who has no remorse.

They are released at the 12-20 year range depending on their record in prison. How come no one complains about them?

[Leith]

40. Because this one is different

I imagine that almost all of the other murderers committed their crimes in the commission of other crimes or in the heat of emotion.

This murder rose above that and into the political assassination of a promising leader. Millions supported the election of RFK to the highest office in the land and the good that it would bring to the country (the defeat of Richard Nixon, for one example).

I have known people who were killed and I mourned with their families. I will not, however, equate those tragedies with the harm done to an entire country. P. T. Barnum was an unrepentant conman, but he never caused anywhere near the harm that that fucking goon did and Barnum isn't vilified like the orange monster.

That's why I never complain about Barnum. And that's why I oppose releasing Sirhan Sirhan.

[former9thward]

44. Murder in the "heat of passion" is not murder.

It almost always is manslaughter. A lesser crime with a lesser sentence. No, almost all people convicted of murder are cold blooded and certainly premeditated. And they are released in CA in the 12-20 year range. You can't get around that.

BTW people keep saying RFK would have defeated Nixon. No he would not because Humphrey had the delegates wrapped up even after RFK won CA. People forget we had almost no primaries back then and delegates were chosen by the party regulars like LBJ and Mayor Daley. At the time of RFK's death HHH had twice the number of delegates RFK had (including the ones from CA) and had the nomination locked.

[Hekate]

54. "No one"? The families of the dead remember & "complain" -- some attend every Parole Board mtng

… as long as they can, the rest of their own lives. They don’t have famous names, though.

[honest.abe]

111. They would only be the same if they killed someone with same prominence and importance as RFK.

No parole.

[former9thward]

115. So if you are not "important" then it matters not if you are murdered.

Your killer will be released after a certain term. But if you are deemed "important" then no parole or death. That is a system monarchies use. Our justice system is a step above that.

[honest.abe]

121. There are degrees or murder.. this one is beyond 1st degree.

No parole.

[former9thward]

122. In your view.

Not the court's. We are a country of law, not of individual views or mob action.

[honest.abe]

123. Parole isn't automatic.

Its a judgement call. And based on the severity and impact of this crime he won’t be paroled. Check back here when his parole is denied. Have a good evening.

[dsc]

116. assassination isn't mere murder

it is the literal killing of the state and a crime against us all. And an unrepentant murder who didn't finish his or her term would also not be paroled.

[former9thward]

118. You are wrong.

CA does parole unrepentant murderers (and so do almost all states). Its a factor but only a factor in parole. The prisons would be overflowing if they didn't. The state considers any murder a crime against us all. Law school 101 at least when I went. That is why there is no statute of limitations.

[Hekate]

131. Please give some links to proof of that claim, which you repeat throughout this thread..

As a Californian, I would like to know just how many unrepentant murderers have been paroled and are walking around this state. Especially those who are political assassins and first-degree murderers.

Thank you in advance.

[former9thward]

136. You want me to link to the transcripts of every parole hearing in CA.

Uh huh....

[Hekate]

138. Statistics. State report. Investigative reporting by the SacBee or LA Times. You know...

…that kind of thing.

[former9thward]

139. I am a criminal attorney who practices in the real world.

So I see what goes on in my world. If you have different experiences in your world so be it. I doubt any state keeps statistics on how many "unrepentant" murderers they let loose.

[Devil Child]

124. Easy solution. Life sentence with no parole for 1st degree murder.

Or the death sentence.

I see no societal benefit for their release.

[intheflow]

55. According to WaPo, he is remorseful and has been eligible for release since 1975.

The original case was badly handled and there are valid concerns that he wasn't the one who shot Kennedy, that there were multiple gunmen; the coroner reported at the trial that RFK was shot through the back while multiple witnesses said Sirhan approach from the front.

Excerpts:

“'Over half a century has passed,' Sirhan told the two parole commissioners, 'and that young, impulsive kid I was does not exist anymore. … Senator Kennedy was the hope of the world and I injured, and I harmed all of them, and it pains me to experience that, the knowledge for such a horrible deed.'”

...

"Famed coroner Thomas Noguchi found that Kennedy had been shot three times at point-blank range from the back, with a fourth shot passing through his jacket without striking him, though witnesses said Sirhan was in front of Kennedy. Noguchi determined that the shots were fired from a distance of three inches."

...

"Paul Schrade was one of five people who were wounded in the shooting as they walked behind Kennedy, and Schrade has long believed that Sirhan shot him but did not shoot Kennedy. After the ruling, Schrade said, 'I’m pleased that we’ve done this for Sirhan because he didn’t deserve all of the very bad behavior from the prison system,' meaning repeated parole denials, 'and prosecutors and police. He was innocent and didn’t deserve this for 53 years.'”

...

"Only one journalist, Julie Watson of the Associated Press, was permitted to observe the hearing and distributed an account of what happened. She reported that Commissioner Robert Barton pointed out that Sirhan qualified as a youthful offender for purposes of parole consideration — he was 24 in 1968 — and the board is required to give that 'great weight' under the law. Sirhan also qualified for 'elderly parole' for being 77 and having served more than 20 years."

https://www.washingtonpost.com/dc-md-va/2021/08/27/sirhan-parole-hearing/

Our justice system is supposed to be reformative, not punitive. If no one is above the law (i.e., lock up TFG), then no one should be below the law (i.e., people who murder famous people should not be punished more severely than people who murder regular people). Plus, both the prosecution and the defense agreed during the trial that he was mentally ill at the time of the shooting. I usually think MAGA types are authoritarians who think mentally ill people should be locked away for life, but I guess I'm just a naive dreamer.

[Maraya1969]

76. I read that this time he did show remorse. If it was my parent that he killed

I believe I would be over it by now, just for the sake of my own mental health and I would want him to be released if he is deemed safe for society.

This is what is different in Europe and why I think their system is much better. Holding on to judgement for years and years is not a healthy thing. Forgiveness, on the other hand is associated with peace of mind.

[rockfordfile]

93. BS. "if it was my parent that he killed"

That pos is a murder and most likely involved with bigger fish during those years. That pos un-American should've been given the death penalty, which was the penalty. So no he should never be let out just like Manson..

[DemocratSinceBirth]

3. Orwell said "Some ideas are so stupid only an intellectual could believe them."

Letting Sirhsn Sirhan walk among the free is one of them

[Hekate]

60. Agreed. The little fckr got what he wanted: he changed the world. nt

[Devil Child]

125. Perfect quote for this madness n/t

[spanone]

4. K&R

[Haggard Celine]

6. Sirhan Sirhan should never get out.

As the letter said, he took Bobby Kennedy away from America. Sirhan Sirhan killed a lot more than Kennedy that day.

[liberalhistorian]

130. Indeed, when I think of

what could have been had RFK been prez instead of motherfucking fascist paranoid warmonger Nixon, it's almost unbearable. The damage Sirhan inflicted on both RFK's family and the nation, and perhaps even globally, is incalculable and irreparable.

This motherfucking cold-blooded assassin should never see the light of day to his dying breath and I'm in utter disbelief that the parole board would even consider such a recommendation. I have to wonder if it was a political decision.

[lagomorph777]

153. We are all still suffering from the damage he caused.

Let the asshole rot.

[mgardener]

7. I remember that morning

Waking up and hearing Kennedy had been killed.

[Hekate]

71. So do I. The only reason I didn't know in real time was my transistor radio gave out...

Gene McCarthy had lost. Bobby Kennedy won. We closed up the McCarthy HQ on the main street and went home to bed. That’s when my radio gave out, as I was glumly getting ready for bed.

The next morning, the world had shifted forever — we had lost a shining light, and Richard Nixon was going to be president.

[ShazzieB]

91. Me, too!

My parents had the TV on in the living room, and I remember lying in bed listening to it and thinking WTAF? (Or rather the equivalent of that; I don't know if that expression even existed yet lol.)

Sidenote: That was the year I turned 18, but 18 year olds were still not allowed to vote yet. I was really bummed not to be able to vote in that election. When the next presidential election rolled round, I was 22. The voting age had been lowered to 18 in the meantime. Talk about falling through the cracks.

[electric_blue68]

128. I turned 18 in '71. Of course I voted, but was disappointed that...

my first vote wasn't in the Presidential year of 1972!

[electric_blue68]

127. Being in NYC (and still so), and a HS Junior in '68, I was marched off to bed...

...I also had my dad's little transistor radio.

I'd also spent time listening in Fall '67 onward to a radio talker who had had a lot of JFK's people on, and some of Bobby's people. Was he going to run, etc.

I guess I went to sleep around/before midnight.
But I woke around 4AM with the strangest
stomachache I'd ever had. I turned on the radio, and
found out he'd been shot not that long before.
Well, I never really went back to sleep.

Most of us walked around in school in a daze. Back to sleep at night.

I woke up with that same strange stomachache around same tme as the night before. On went the radio
only to catch Frank Makowitz saying "...he was 42..."
"...was!!????!..."

No more sleep, even more dazed than the day before.
Went to St Patrick's with a friend. My dad took me down
to see the motorcade to Penn Station because my mom said I looked too blitzed to go by myself.

Then I had to study for my PSATs while watching the Funeral Train, etc.

We who were old enough all know how horrific it all was.

I do remember someone saying some years later that there were more bullet holes in the hotel kitchen, hallway walls than what Sirhan had in his gun
So, yeah, mysteries still linger.

And the sadness, and for some feeling like we'd been shunted to Alternate Timeline sits quietly inside
until something reawakens it. 😔

He shouldn't be released. Still want find out if there was
another assassin. 😑😭🤬🤬🤬

[Tomconroy]

8. I stand with them.

[calimary]

23. So do I. Firmly with them.

This is an OUTRAGE!

[ashredux]

9. I was totally shocked with the news.

I recall the day. They are correct, it was not just some crime, it was a crime against the entire nation. I just do not understand the thinking behind this decision. We, as a nation actually showed mercy by not having him executed. He should never get out of jail

[SCantiGOP]

11. He killed a great man

and gave us Richard Nixon.
He should die in prison.

[OverBurn]

84. Yes

[Cuthbert Allgood]

147. RFK would not have received the nomination

Nixon would still have won. That's not even complicated historical analysis.

[True Blue American]

149. I do not agree.

I watched Walter Cronkite take off his glasses, tears in his eyes, looked up ate the clock, announced,”” The President died at**** today.” I was so shocked I do not remember the time. My mind went blank.Bobby Kennedy was much too popular.

There are still doubts to this day!

I have both of my newspaper books on the Kennedy assassination. Bobby replaced John.

[SCantiGOP]

150. That's your opinion

I think his nomination was inevitable, and I have heard that analysis from many historians. The Democratic Party knew that Humphrey's campaign was going to be problematic, and the party bosses still controlled the process back then.

[Traildogbob]

10. The only way

I could accept his release is to fill his cell with Trump family, Barr, Gooliani, all those pardoned by trump, all Fox prime time AND the morning couch tumors, Alex Jones and every single insurrectionist. Maybe then. Just maybe. IF Kennedy’s approve. Maybe throw in DeSatan and Abbott to sweeten the deal. And Murdocks, all of em.

[Escurumbele]

12. I read somewhere else that this letter was not actually written by the Kennedy but instead by

some group.

I read statements from Robert Kennedy Jr where he favours the parole...What is true here?

https://nypost.com/2021/08/27/prosecutors-wont-challenge-rfk-assassin-sirhan-sirhans-bid-for-freedom/

And this:

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/08/27/us/sirhan-sirhan-parole-rfk.html


Douglas Kennedy, one of Kennedy’s sons, attended the hearing on Friday and urged the commissioners to release Mr. Sirhan, a Jordanian citizen who would likely be deported, if they did not think he was a threat.

[treestar]

17. RFK had 9 children

So that's not all of them. Two others were the ones in favor of parole, Douglas and RFK Jr.

[SunnyATT]

19. I'm thinking RFK, Jr.'s cheese has taken a slide off his cracker!

He's a very prominent anti-vaxxer who was recently booted off Instagram for vaccine misinformation.

[NurseJackie]

27. It has. Off the cracker, bounced on the chair, rolled onto the floor and under the refrigerator...

... where it sits... drying, molding, covered in bits of floor-crumbs and dog-hair. Even the mice don't want it.

[secondwind]

65. LOL.

[BannonsLiver]

72. Is he the one that's anti vax?

[NurseJackie]

78. Yes. RFK, Jr. is an anti-vax idiot.

[LeftInTX]

80. He probably watches too much Ancient Aliens and Oliver Stone movies...

[H2O Man]

34. Eleven children.

[ShazzieB]

97. He had 11 kids.

The last one, Rory, was born after her father's death.

In a family that large, i don't find it surprising that everybody's not on the exact same page.

[TNNurse]

26. It appears to be on the Twitter page

of Rory and Kerry. Pretty sure it is real.


Robert and Douglas support. Robert is a HUGE anti-vaxxer. I stand with the others.

[ShazzieB]

100. Rory says right there in the tweet that it's a statement from her family.

I see no reason not to take her word for it.

[bringthePaine]

13. WTF? time for the names of the incompetents putting this forward

[NoMoreRepugs]

14. Some people, like memories, are best kept locked away never

again to see the light of day.

[Upthevibe]

15. Thank you for this post.....

I hadn't read this....

[hlthe2b]

16. Thank you for this. Those (inexplicably) supporting Sirhan's parole here keep citing RFK JR

and the youngest Kennedy, Douglas (just a year old when RFK was assassinated)--convinced by RFK JR to join him in supporting parole.

Yet they ignore the rest of the family, as if only the opinion of the unfortunately increasingly unhinged RFK JR matters . While the issue of a second shooter has not been resolved for some, there is no doubt of Sirhan's involvement. Hell, Sirhan Sirhan was tackled by Rosie Greer (then protecting Ethel)-- with a gun, for heaven's sake. Sirhan is not some innocent wrongly imprisoned.

No one is more well versed in criminal justice and the law than Laurence Tribe. Again, he speaks for millions of us alive during this time (and those who have actually taken the time to learn from history).

Governor NewsomPLEASE LISTEN TO THESE : SIX CHILDREN OF SIRHAN SIRHAN’s UNFORGIVABLE ACT. THEY WERE AMONG THE HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS OF HIS VICTIMS

Link to tweet

Link to tweet

The plea by two of RFK’s sons to release Sirhan Sirhan should count for nothing. RFK’s assassination was a crime against the people of California and America, not just against the Kennedy family. Justice and the safety of potential future victims aren’t theirs to give away.

Link to tweet

Laurence Tribe
@tribelaw
I fail to see why Bobby Kennedy’s assassin should ever be released from prison. Even at 77, he could be a threat. And the enduring harm he inflicted was incalculable. But for his vicious act, the rest of U.S. history would’ve been different.

Link to tweet

[moondust]

21. +1

Agree with Prof. Tribe.

[dflprincess]

119. Just a correction, Rory is the youngest Kennedy, she was born 6 months after RFK's assassination.

Douglas is the youngest boy.

[hlthe2b]

120. Yes...I meant the youngest boy (Douglas)...

[luv2fly]

18. That it was a Kennedy is irrelevant

If others convicted of murder served decades in prison and were paroled then Sirhan's parole is just as valid a consideration for both the Board and the Governor. The Kennedy name should be irrelevant in the discussion.

[stillcool]

42. Political assassination

the only Kennedy name that matters is the one who was killed on the cusp of becoming the President of the United States. Not at all in the same category as 'others convicted of murder', or those that get the death penalty, or those that are cut a deal and walk. Not that it matters. There is no longer justice in this country, and people are just fine with it, as long as they are not personally affected.

[luv2fly]

50. A human being... ONE human being

Not more or less valuable to those who cared. People are people, rules are rules.

[Hekate]

74. Political assassination is a special crime because it disrupts the course of government & replaces i

… with violence. We see this in Mexico and all over South America, where mayors and judges dare not pursue their callings honestly against the cartels or the government lest they join myriads of their fellows in the grave.

We thought we were better than that. We thought we were different. Political assassination was a once in a generation event, so I thought when I was 16 and shattered by the assassination of Bobby’s older brother Jack.

I don’t know when it finally dawned on me that maybe we aren’t better than that any more. But I will tell you this: the insurrection of 1/6/21 is the far end of an arc that started in the Civil War, carried forward by people who believe violence is the answer. Those who assassinated the Kennedy brothers are only markers on that bloody arc.

Political assassination doesn’t just bereave a family: it kills a culture. Them’s the rules.

[honest.abe]

112. +1

Well stated.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

85. He robbed rhe voters of the chance to vote for the candidate of their choice

Not only was it an assault on a human, it was an assault on our very system of self-government. When Sirhan Sirhan chose the bullet over the ballot he robbed Americans of their vote. One can argue that besides murder it was treason. And if you want to go by the "rules" the "rule" is the governor has the final say on paroles.

[stillcool]

109. nice bedtime story

sorry...that was rude. It's hard to even imagine that there is true justice anywhere on this planet. It's just not what humans do.

[Boomerproud]

89. Bobby WAS very relevant.

Nt

[luv2fly]

90. You made my other point, thanks

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=15792296

[rickyhall]

20. IMO: He's why we Nixon, Raygun, Bush, Bush & TFG. Never less SS out.

Die in prison like Ray & Manson.

[marieo1]

22. Agreement

I agree 110%.......I loved your dear Dad and felt he would have been great for our country. I will never forgive Sirhan for what he did, young or not!!! He took away from me and my country someone I loved and respected, he broke our hearts. A life sentence should mean exactly that, a person cannot just kill someone and ever be forgiven. He is lucky to not have received the death sentence, which he should have gotten. I stand with Robert Kennedy's family and Lawrence Tribe.

[TNNurse]

24. I think whether he is a threat is irrelevant.

He did indescribable damage to this country. He needs to stay in prison for the rest of his life.

[nvme]

25. Mercy

Hey has served 53 years in prison. He served a lifetime. The man that may walk out of that prison will not be the same man that walked in. If Hinkley can be released, then perhaps mercy can avail itself. He leaves an old man all he knew, except for his blind brother, are dead.

[ashredux]

28. We spared his life...he has no rights any longer. It was a cold blooded murder in plain site.

He should never go free

[former9thward]

35. So we should have no parole?

What about all the other cold blooded murderers put on parole by CA every year?

[ashredux]

36. We currently have people in jail who aren't able to be paroled. A real life sentence.

We currently have people in jail who aren’t able to be paroled A real life sentence.

Yes we should have payroll. But we have to make decisions about who should we return to society and who should not. In this case I think the majority of people will say he should not be released back into society.

Do you want Charlie Manson to be let out of jail?

[former9thward]

37. Sirhan is not in that category.

He is eligible for parole as a term of his sentence. If we went by the "majority" no one would ever be released from prison. He has done 53 years, far longer than anyone else in a similar situation. Which mean he is a political prisoner which we should not have in this country.

[ashredux]

38. How old are you? Were you around when he got shot? Do you understand what it meant to our nation?

[former9thward]

41. None of those things are factors in parole.

You are adding things which are not legal in the consideration of parole. Which effectively means you are against all parole.

[ashredux]

45. One, you did not answer my question. How old are you?

One, you did not answer my question. How old are you? I’m venture to wager you were not living during that time period.

Parole is always subjective. Period.

Apparently we will just have to agree to disagree, strongly.

[intheflow]

63. I was alive when RFK was shot and I agree with the poster you're replying to.

What you are in effect saying, by questioning the DUer's age, is that your feelings and emotional attachment to something that happened over 50 years ago is more important than a fair meting out of justice under current US law.

[ashredux]

66. Fair justice is keeping him in prison.

Again, would you want Charlie Manson let out of prison because he’s been a good guy for the last 50 years?

[intheflow]

70. First of all, Charles Manson is dead, he died in 2017.

Secondly, Charlie Manson was more dangerous to society from the get-go than Sirhan. He spent at least half his life in prison before the murders, founded a community of murderers and assassins, committed nine murders at four locations, and wanted to start race riots. Sirhan had no priors and no followers, and he was deemed mentally ill by both the prosecution and the defense during the trial.

Apples and oranges.

[ashredux]

73. This is really useless. He's not getting out of prison.

[electric_blue68]

129. When it had/has incalculable ripple effects for the USA, and the World - yes

[Mysterian]

48. Granting parole is discretionary

No convict is entitled to a grant of parole. There is no constitutional right to parole. Simply because one objects to the release of Sirhan does not mean they are "against all parole." The circumstances and nature of the offense can most certainly be considered by the officials involved in granting parole.

[former9thward]

61. And they have been in this case.

Yet people are still objecting -- for political reasons. That is not a legal factor in parole.

[Mysterian]

64. What is your evidence that anyone objects for political reasons?

And not simply because of the nature and circumstances of the crime?

[former9thward]

67. I guess you have not read the posts.

Only mine. Weird? You missed all the posts about SS being responsible for Nixon, Reagan, etc. I guess you did....

[Mysterian]

99. Sirhan assassinated the leading candidate for President of the USA

That's the nature and circumstances of his crime. No one claims Sirhan should be denied parole because of his political beliefs. People claim he should be denied parole because of the impact of his crime. Perhaps you are unwilling or unable to distinguish the difference.

[former9thward]

114. Parole in the U.S. has nothing to do with those circumstances,

Nothing. And a good thing because there are always circumstances with every murder. Lock em up and throw away the key for all criminals. Where have I heard that philosophy before?

[Mysterian]

117. You really don't know what you're posting about

Your claim that Sirhan is a "political prisoner" pretty much clued me into that.

[Cuthbert Allgood]

148. How was RFK going to get the nomination?

HHH has the votes in the bag already.

[Mysterian]

152. Humphrey did not have the nomination locked up

RFK had all the momentum and a good chance to get the nomination at the convention.

Humphrey was a good man but a weak candidate.

[ShazzieB]

102. It was a political crime with huge political ramifications.

[True Blue American]

134. The Kennedy Children are objecting for political reasons? I doubt that.

[former9thward]

137. Two supported it.

So don't be too inclusive with your The Kennedy Children.

[Hekate]

59. I think it is germane to this discussion. How old were you on that night?

[former9thward]

62. That is the most "ungermane" factor in whether SS shoud have parole.

[ashredux]

47. Irrelevant.

[Hekate]

57. How old were you on that night? Tell me.

[ShazzieB]

101. It's very interesting they don't want to answer your question, isn't it?

[Hekate]

110. Indeed. It's not like we're holding a petty grudge; we watched the course of history change

Whoever backs political assassins — the damage is very intentional.

[True Blue American]

135. Outside of the last 4 years that was the worst time

Of my life. President Kennedy, Martin Luther King and Robert Kennedy!

All gone!

[electric_blue68]

146. Certainly one of my worst!

[rockfordfile]

96. It was suppose to be the death penalty. So no the pos doesn't get out. You're just trolling

[radical noodle]

126. That's exactly my feeling

He was sentenced to death and there's no parole for that. It's accidental that his sentence of death was reduced. Only death came off the table when California ended the death penalty. Obviously, that seems not to be a legal interpretation, but it's simply my belief.

[nvme]

140. Not trolling anyone

I am expressing an opinion. I do not believe in the death penalty. I believe in mercy that is it. nothing more nothing less. 53 years of punishment.

[left-of-center2012]

30. If he had not killed a Kennedy

If he had not killed a Kennedy,
most people would agree 53 years in prison is long enough.

In my humble opinion, of course.

[BobTheSubgenius]

33. Obviously, I fully agree.

My post just below makes that pretty clear, I think.

[ashredux]

46. It wasn't just a Kennedy, it was most likely he would've been the next President of the United State

It wasn’t just a Kennedy, it was most likely he would’ve been the next President of the United States

We ended up with Nixon. They had already killed his brother, who was president. Just saying

[left-of-center2012]

56. "he would've been the next President"

Well, that's conjecture.

[ashredux]

58. Good Lord man just go away

[left-of-center2012]

69. Please, no personal attacks

Nobody knows if he would have been elected president.

Nobody. We will never know.

And stop with the personal attacks.

[BobTheSubgenius]

32. There could well be numerous reasons to not grant Sirhan Sirhan parole.

A "victim impact statement" should not be one of them. In fact, I oppose them in all cases. First, how many of these statements are going to recommend leniency? It's to be expected that the survivors will oppose parole or any other consideration for "their" murderer, so nothing is learned from them.

A far greater reason, to me, is that it can lead to an unequal treatment under the law, that being the 14th Amendment. If a survivor happens to be very eloquent, should the framing of their argument be a reason to oppose parole? How about persistence?

Consider the case of a family too poor to travel to parole hearings. Should the murderer of their loved one receive less prison time than the killer of a member of a family able to devote significant resources to keeping "their killer" incarcerated?

[gordianot]

39. I agree with the family.

There is more to this story than we know. To be fair I was not in favor of Hinkley’s release for similar reasons.

[Jon King]

43. He should be treated exactly like every other parolee candidate.

I am not into the whole celebrity thing, especially celebrity politicians and political dynasties.

If other prisoners who had good behavior, passed the mental evaluation, are 77 years old, put in 50 years, got released, he should too. If not, he should not.

It is irrelevant whether he killed a Kennedy or a homeless women no one knew.

[luv2fly]

51. Exactly right

Many are replying out of emotion, yet despite the name he was but a man.

[ashredux]

49. I am sadly disappointed In so many on this thread

I will wager that those who believe he should be paroled we’re not living at the time. You do not understand the period of time, the death of his brother, and the political implications of the assassination. It change the course of American history, and I believe for the worst. It was not just some murder. It was the assassination of the Man who would most likely be the next president of United States.

This is not some average murder. He should never be paroled, and only in America would his life have been spared as it has been.

[H2O Man]

52. Interesting.

I think that the six children of Robert Kennedy should have a say. And that is six of his eleven children, and of the nine still living. I also respe4ct the opinions of the others, and think they deserve consideration, too.

The discussions and debates on DU:GD are interesting. Both the anti- and pro-parole groups combine emotional and rational reasoning. The emotions involve anger on one side, compassion on the other. The rational debate focuses on what a life sentence demands, and what role the parole system should play in the potential releasing of those convicted of murder.

I think that both sides are able to make solid cases based upon rational thought. I also understand, as well as any one, that emotions are strong when it comes to murderers. Yet, as Ben Franklin suggested, when passions run high, it is essential to let reason hold the reins.

[bigtree]

77. I don't think Robert Jr.'s reasoning is sane

...I think it reflects on his overall saneness.

I'm not very inclined to both sides things I feel strongly about - don't suffer long anymore folks who defend against those principles.

from Lisa Pease's book "A Lie Too Big To Fail" :



In this case, I think Sirhan's incarceration is actually the only compromise to be made between the folks who want him dead, and those who don't believe in state-sanctioned, cold-blooded killing. I wouldn't want to unravel that thread.

As the sane Kennedys argue, there's more than their own strong feelings or fears, which are substantial enough, imo, to reason against release.


*sorry for the editing, on the run back and forth today.

[H2O Man]

88. That reasoning

is shared by many others, including some who were there that awful night, including some law enforcement that investigated the murder. Not that Robert's reasoning is limited to that. But most people really don't have an accurate picture of his thinking on a variety of issues. Having been friends with him for over 30 years, I think I have a more accurate idea of his views than people who have only read about or watched tv/internet stories. That doesn't imply that we agree on everything, of course.

[iemanja]

105. the argument is not that Sirhan was innocent

Last edited Sun Aug 29, 2021, 04:22 PM - Edit history (1)

the murder was filmed on camera. The concern is the possibility that other/s might have been involved. It has no bearing on Sirhan's early release.

[H2O Man]

108. I agree.

Robert knows Sirhan shot at his father, and that two shots hit his father. The one behind the ear is the one people question. People can think he made that shot, or that he didn't. And that's fine. What no one here can say for certain is if he.

The police were looking to solve the case without leaving room for serious doubt, and that was a good thing. However, not everything that investigators did erased doubt. The judge that heard the trial put in a great effort to make sure it was a fair trial. It remains among the ugliest chapters in our nation's history. It continues to haunt my generation with the question of what might have been.

[MrModerate]

53. I see no good reason for the guy to ever leave prison. n/t

[gulliver]

68. Hopefully Newsom will put the kibosh on the parole

That's why we have duly elected leaders. They get to make decisions.

[left-of-center2012]

79. Nine Things You Probably Didn't Know About Parole

1. Life sentences don’t necessarily mean life.
Unless they're sentenced to life without parole, people serving life sentences are eligible for parole eventually.

The minimum date by which they can go before the parole board varies by state:
in some states it's as little as 15 years; in other states it's as many as 50.

(Sirhan Sirhan has been in for 53 years)

https://www.themarshallproject.org/2015/07/10/nine-things-you-probably-didn-t-know-about-parole

[LeftInTX]

81. Sirhan was sentenced under a different law (rules) than now....

We had a serial killer who was going to get out in 2018 due to mandatory minimum sentencing. She was one of the most high profile cases...
Parole was not even an option..

The law under which she was sentenced was due to prison overcrowding.
So, they built new prisons and got rid of the law.

Meanwhile in 2017, she was charged with five more murders and plead guilty to one.

Her murders were horrific and heinous. She murdered newborns and sick kids. I believe the only reason the death penalty was off the table in 1984 was because the case rested on novel tests for succinylcholine.
https://kfyo.com/texas-serial-baby-killer-lvn-genene-jones-final-conviction-upheld/

https://murderpedia.org/female.J/j/jones-genene.htm

[left-of-center2012]

94. apples and oranges n/t

[iemanja]

104. Your the one introducing oranges

with your Cosmo list of nine things. He was not sentenced to death, not life until he got old and prison seemed unpleasant.

[left-of-center2012]

107. Nah

I prefer tangerines.

[iemanja]

86. Sirhan Sirhan was sentenced to death

not life. His sentence was later commuted to death based on a SCOTUS ruling.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

92. During the initial sentencing the Kennedys asked for life imprisonment, not the death penalty

They never asked that he would be free in the future.

[left-of-center2012]

95. And now he's being paroled from that life sentence n/t

[iemanja]

103. which evidently pleases you

while it repulses those of us who despise the descent of the US following Nixon's election. He changed the course of history for the worse. I don't think that is anything to applaud.

When it comes to parole, I'm much more concerned about the black men facing life sentences for non-violent drug offenses. Murderers DESERVE to spend a lifetime in prison.

[left-of-center2012]

106. Whatever

[Hamlette]

82. it depends on if you see prison as protecting the public or revenge

The question should be will he do it again, not I loved Bobby and I want him to pay.

[pnwmom]

133. It's also whether you should protect the public from copycats who might be deterred

by the knowledge that if they kill a President or Presidential candidate, they could spend the rest of their life in prison.

[Hamlette]

141. If you believe in deterrence, 53 years behind bars ought to be enough.

Should be enough for revenge too.

I don't believe deterrence is a legitimate reason for punishment because it doesn't work.

There are four reasons for punishment for crimes: retribution, rehabilitation, protection of society and deterrence. I was a criminal defense attorney for many years, in both juvenile and adult courts. From what I read and observed, people don't think about what happens if they get caught when they commit a crime. I went to law school with Ted Bundy. It didn't deter him, IMHO. In fact, I think you could make an argument he went to Florida because it had the death penalty and he wanted to be stopped.

I also don't believe all prisoners can be rehabilitated, but some can so we should keep trying that. For the same reasons I don't believe in the death penalty, I don't believe in retribution (except as it would stop victims from taking the law into their own hands and "getting even&quot .

Sirhan is 77 years old. There is no greater lover of RFK than me. He was killed on the night I graduated from High School.

We cannot understand monsters. We can only protect ourselves from them when possible.

[pnwmom]

142. For a crime that serious, life in prison without parole is appropriate.

I don't support the death penalty, but I don't think we should take life in prison off the table. Some crimes are too serious to warrant any leniency.

[Hamlette]

143. based on the fact it was RFK and not John Doe?

I don't want a system like that. To me the worst crimes involve multiple deaths and/or torture and/or kids.

And who decides? Republicans would let Sirhan go early, and throw away the key on Trump's killer.

Life without the possibility of parole is punishment based on revenge. I had an emotional reaction when I heard of the possible parole but that's why we need to try to find people who don't base their opinions on emotion.

[pnwmom]

144. Based on the fact that he was a candidate running for US President.

If his name was John Doe, and he was a candidate for President, yes.

Sirhan Sirhan possibly changed the course of history, when he killed the Democrat in that election. His crime was as serious as that of a serial murderer or a child killer. His crime threatened Democracy.

[electric_blue68]

145. Absolutely! The alternate timelines SF authors could write...

[Hamlette]

151. point taken

[Hekate]

83. Political Assassination is a different kind of murder, for it kills the future of a nation. ...

Sirhan gave us Nixon, and Nixon gave us Vice President Dick Cheney. Got that, people who insist no man is more important than any other, and murderers are paroled all the time?

The list of those who had zero interest in maintaining a democratic republic and who were incubated within the Nixon administration is appalling. Cheney was just one young man among many.

It gets worse. When Cheney and his sidekick Dubya were installed by the SCOTUS, another list of bright young up-and-comers assembled for the Brooks Brothers Riot. They’ve done very well for themselves and the Party: so far there are two Supreme Court Justices out of that bunch.

Mercy? Mercy is giving Sirhan three hots and a cot on the taxpayers’ dime for the rest of his life.

[VGNonly]

87. The children of RFK

Against parole:

Joe Jr
Courtney
Kerry
Chris
Max
Rory

For Parole:

Robert Jr
Douglas

Kathleen hasn't stated an opinion. David and Michael are deceased.

[rockfordfile]

98. No. He stays in jail. Letting him out rewards him for the murder.

He should've died years ago.

[BigmanPigman]

113. I have the feeling that Newsom will say, "No"

the same way he said "No" to the Manson murderers when they have come up for parole in the past. Newsom denied two of them parole.

[RockRaven]

132. A lot of talk in this thread about Sirhan2 and Kennedys and assassination, but a big question

hasn't been touched upon as far as my skimming of the replies goes: if one accepts the Kennedy kid letter as truthful about basic facts...

WHY THE FUCK IS THERE A TWO-PERSON PAROLE BOARD? At all, I mean. In any conceivable way.

Even as a preliminary step, that is a fucking insane system to have on purpose. WTH is going on with this parole system?