Alec Baldwin fired the prop gun that killed cinematographer, injured director on "Rust" film set

[Nevilledog]

Link to tweet

https://www.thedailybeast.com/alec-baldwin-film-rust-stunt-gun-misfire-kills-crew-member-wounds-another


Alec Baldwin cocked and fired a gun meant to be loaded with blanks on the set of a Western movie in Santa Fe on Thursday, hitting the film’s director and cinematographer.

Halyna Hutchins, 42, was airlifted from the set of Rust, which began filming at Bonanza Creek Ranch this month, mid-afternoon to the University of New Mexico Hospital in Albuquerque, where she succumbed to her injuries.

Baldwin also hit the film’s director, Joel Souza, 48, according to the Santa Fe County sheriff. Souza remains in intensive care. The sheriff said in a statement the two “were shot when a prop firearm was discharged by Alec Baldwin, 68, producer and actor.” Baldwin reportedly did not know the prop contained live rounds.

The International Cinematographers Guild confirmed Hutchins’ death in a statement: “We received the devastating news this evening, that one of our members, Halyna Hutchins, died from injuries sustained on the set... This is a terrible loss, and we mourn the passing of a member of our Guild’s family.” American Cinematographer

*snip*

[meadowlander]

1. How awful for everyone involved.

What was live ammo even doing on set?

[regnaD kciN]

11. It probably wasn't live ammunition...

...it could well have been a defective blank that shattered when fired, discharging fragments of the metal casing -- much like shrapnel -- at high speed. The effect would be similar to a shotgun blast.

I especially suspect this was the case because it's the only reasonable explanation why two people were hit simultaneously.

[Chuuku Davis]

51. I think it probably was

Because the bullet went completely through her and into the upper chest of the man behind her.

[LisaL]

69. Gun was loaded with a live round.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/entertainment/movies/2021/10/21/alec-baldwin-film-rust-woman-killed-after-prop-gun-incident-set/6128073001/

[hlthe2b]

32. Horrific tragedy and will affect Baldwin the rest of his life.

He apparently was in tears when seen leaving the police office. A talented cinematographer killed and the director injured.

[PatSeg]

55. I cannot imagine living with that

What a totally senseless death.

[Xolodno]

2. Brandon Lee died in a similar way.

After that, you would think better measures would be taken and demanded. But, you get some who demand "realistic" effects.

[lagomorph777]

45. So depressing that they are still cranking out all these gun-nut movies.

Deaths on set are horrible; even worse, they continue to create more generations of gun-nuts.

[SergeStorms]

3. Good grief.

How can a "prop" gun have live rounds in it? Why would a "prop" gun ever have live rounds in it?

The property master has a lot of 'splaining to do.

Baldwin must be a basket case right now. It's not his responsibility to check the gun for live rounds, but there's still a bunch of guilt he'll be shouldering just the same.

[Hassin Bin Sober]

4. See Brandon Lee's death for just one example how this can happen:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brandon_Lee#Death

In the scene preceding the fatal scene, the gun was loaded with improperly-made dummy rounds, cartridges from which the special-effects crew had removed the powder charges, so in close-ups the revolver would show normal-looking bullets. However, the crew neglected to remove the primers from the cartridges. At some point before the fatal event, one of the rounds had been fired; although there was no powder charge, the energy from the fired primer was enough to push the bullet into the gun barrel, where it got stuck (a condition known as a squib load). For the fatal scene, which called for the revolver to be fired at Lee from a distance of 3.6–4.5 meters (12–15 ft), the dummy cartridges were replaced with blank rounds, which contained a powder charge and primer, but no bullet, allowing the gun to be fired without the risk of an actual projectile. When the blank round was fired, the bullet lodged in the barrel was propelled forward with almost the same force as if the round were live, and it struck Lee in the abdomen.[99][100]

[GPV]

19. Also Jon Erik Hexum

[eShirl]

23. his gun had blanks, but he jokingly "shot" himself in the head with it at point blank range

and apparently that's dangerous

[Wounded Bear]

24. Blank ammo can be dangerous for several meters away from the muzzle of the gun...nt

[SergeStorms]

40. For muzzle flash, sure....

Powder burns are no laughing matter, but to have live rounds in a supposed prop gun is totally senseless.

[Wounded Bear]

43. Blank rounds expel more than just "muzzle flash"...

the rounds have a wadding of plastic or paper that is stuffed into the end to contain the powder and provide the back pressure for the powder to do more than just burn and fizzle out like a dud firecracker. That paper/plastic wadding is expelled when fired and takes some space to break up into 'harmless' fragments.

Certainly, live rounds should not be anywhere near a movie set, but blanks aren't very 'safe' either.

[Gruenemann]

66. In his case,

the force of the blank exploding blasted a fragment of his skull into his brain, killing him.

[former9thward]

5. He is the producer.

Ultimately it is his responsibility.

[USALiberal]

38. Not really, producers do not check gun status. Nt

[former9thward]

60. That is what CEOs say when an employee screws up.

Crourts don't buy it.

[eShirl]

41. He's one of a dozen producers

on IMDB it lists 5 executive producers, 6 producers, and 1 co-producer

[former9thward]

61. But he is the producer than fired the gun that killed someone.

[eShirl]

63. no kidding

[SergeStorms]

72. The prop master...

is in charge of all props, and making certain they're in proper working order.

My guess is the prop master for this production has worked his/her last movie.

Producers are the people who finance the production. That's why there's always a dozen or so producers, associate producers etc. Steve Mnuchin (remember him and his "trophy" wife?) produces movies. I've actually seen his name in pre-credits and wondered if I should still watch the movie, but he's actually produced some great pictures. His only contribution to any movie is money though. He has no input into the script, actors etc.

[former9thward]

73. There was film of this.

We will see when it is released what it shows.

[regnaD kciN]

12. And not just a bunch of guilt...

Although it pales next to the suffering of the victims and their families, Baldwin, as the film's producer, bears ultimate legal responsibility for whatever happens on-set. It's not inconceivable that, even if it can clearly be shown that he had no knowledge that the gun could cause the tragedy, he could still be charged with unintentional manslaughter or negligent homicide. In fact, I suspect it's likely. And, obviously, even if it doesn't result in criminal charges, his career is certainly over.

[babylonsister]

26. Why would his career be over? It sounds like a tragic

accident to me.

[hlthe2b]

35. Spielberg was co-producer of '92 movie where helicopter accident killed adult & two child actors....

Despite ten years of lawsuits that held many responsible, I think Spielberg had quite the career thereafter.

Let's get the facts. The media is cruelly piling on Baldwin, who is apparently devastated--as all of us would be.

[fishwax]

48. It was the Twilight Zone film in 1983

Spielberg was a producer, and John Landis (also a producer) was the director of the segment in question. (The film has four stories, each with a different director.) The child actors shouldn't have been involved, as it was a violation of California law.

Landis, as the director, was charged legally, as were some others. They were acquitted. (Spielberg wasn't charged, though I assume he would have been involved in the civil litigation.) Landis's career suffered, I'm sure, but he still made several films after that. As you say, the idea that this will end Baldwin's career is pretty unlikely.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twilight_Zone_accident

[USALiberal]

39. Not true! Nt

[Elessar Zappa]

49. I doubt it.

He won’t be charged unless they can show negligence.

[Niagara]

52. How is it only Alec Baldwin's ultimate legal responsibility for whatever happens on set?

Actors and stunt people get injured and fatally wounded during film production. It's not one persons fault or responsibility.


Michael Massee's acting career wasn't over when he accidently shot Brandon Lee with the prop gun that he was using during the filming of The Crow. Nor was he ever charged with unintentional manslaughter or negligent homicide.


Everyone knew that it was an accident even before the investigation. Michael never got over the tragedy, but he still continued to work as an actor.

[obamanut2012]

58. Not a factual statement whatsoever

Why would you say something so obviously incorrect?

[mucifer]

6. Why do real bullets even fit in a prop gun?

[lindysalsagal]

7. I know zero about guns, but when I see one in a film or tv show, I always imagine

that if I were the actor, I'd have to go outside and fire it at a wall to make sure it was safe. I'm a little paranoid about safety, so, I have wondered if this might ever happen. Not an Alec fan, but he's probably a total mess. This story will be huge for a long while.

[regnaD kciN]

14. Even "firing it at a wall" might not be enough...

...because that would only check the one blank, and not whatever else was loaded in the gun, and fired "for real."

FWIW, when I made my "no-budget" indie feature back in 2003, we simply used a never-loaded Airsoft pistol (to get realistic slide action), and then added the muzzle bursts and gunshot sounds in post-production. It was super-easy, and convincing enough that our sound editor later told me he was shocked at my "bravery" in operating the camera while, as he assumed, bullets were whistling a few inches past my head! If I could get enough realism from that with, frankly, prosumer-level production tools eighteen years ago, I would think that Hollywood would be able to do it with CGI and Foley in a much-more-convincing manner nowadays! Personally, I think there's no excuse after this for studio professionals to ever use the sort of "prop guns" which are merely regular firearms loaded with blanks.

[lagomorph777]

47. Thanks for that real-world input.

While I'm not thrilled that gun nut movies continue to indoctrinate new generations of kids into the cult, they could at least use a bit of common-sense in the production process.

Looking at the utterly amazing CGI, etc that's been available for many years, it really is inexcusable to use actual guns and any kind of ammo on set. Completely insane.

[UTUSN]

8. Alec Alec Alec oh good grief

[dweller]

9. This sounds like the plot

of a good murder mystery …

Will Baldwin be charged?


✌🏻

[BannonsLiver]

10. That's going to be interesting.

John Landis was directing the twilight zone movie when Vic Morrow and 2 young children were cut in half by a helicopter blade. It took a decade to sort out those legal entanglements. Ultimately Landis never did jail time nor did the explosives guy who was also found to be at fault, though he was tried for manslaughter.

If Baldwin was fucking around on set and decided to play a joke with a prop gun (which I’m guessing is a big no no in the industry) and shot them even accidentally that’s a big problem for him. If it happened while filming a scene and someone else fucked up the gun situation and put live ammo in the gun by mistake that’s a different story. Lot of questions.

[regnaD kciN]

13. Since he's the producer, it's not a "different story"...

He bears ultimate legal responsibility for any "accidents" like this. I would think a D.A. located outside of Hollywood would be chomping at the bit to bring this to trial -- particularly if he has aspirations for higher office, and by doing so could lock up the votes of Trumpers delighted that the "Hollywood liberal" who slandered their hero was brought to justice.

[WHITT]

17. Doubtful

Criminally, if Baldwin were charged, he will assert that because he's not a firearms specialist, his production company hired a professional expert, and I suspect a jury would agree.

Civilly, his production company will be sued, but again, they will turn around a say we hired professional experts, who are liable.

[WHITT]

68. Of Course

But it will be the 'firearms expert' company.

There was an American director on the BBC this morning who said there are VERY strict protocols for firearms on set. The firearms are locked in a case until the expert unlocks it and prepares it. Then they explain to the actor how to use it. When the director yells 'cut', the firearm must be handed directly back to the expert, who then once again locks it in the case.

[regnaD kciN]

15. Of course, in a fictional murder mystery...

...it would turn out to be a disgruntled crew member, maybe carrying out revenge for some grudge over an event long ago, who surreptitiously substituted live ammunition in an attempt to frame the producer.

But, as we all know, real life doesn't usually play out like the movies. Especially when the deaths on set aren't acted-out.

[Shanti Shanti Shanti]

16. Totally on special effects people, no actor is responsible for a prop gun put in their hands

There must be more to the story

[LeftInTX]

18. Brandon Lee was killed when the "blanks" weren't prepared properly

I don't know enough about guns, so I should keep quiet, but something got stuck in the barrel, (a slug??) then blanks were loaded (blanks contain gun powder)

[obamanut2012]

29. The dummies were made incorrectly

Basically, the primers were left on the cartridges, allowing the bullet casing to separate and then be propelled with great force, killing Brandon Lee.

A friend in Wilmington's father was actually on set that day, and said it was confusing as hell when it happened. Folks thought Lee was goofing around.

[LeftInTX]

31. Thanks...I don't know enough about guns or bullets to articulate this correctly..

[Straw Man]

70. Close, but not quite.

A dummy round is usually a cartridge containing a bullet, but from which both powder and primer have been removed. In a close-up of the front of the revolver, it needs to loaded with dummy rounds for the sake of realism because the tips of the bullets need to be visible. Dummies are also used when someone needs to be shown loading a gun.

You are correct that these dummies were prepared improperly, with the primers left in, but the force of the primer alone is usually not great enough to propel the bullet out of the barrel. Instead, it may propel the bullet into the barrel, where it can get lodged; that's what happened in this case.

The gun was subsequently loaded with blanks, cartridges that contain primer and powder but no bullet. When the blank was fired, it propelled the stuck bullet out of the barrel, killing Lee.

This should never have happened, and was the result of negligence, both in the creation of the faulty dummies and in the failure to make sure that the gun was clear before loading it with the blanks.

I don't really know what happened in Baldwin's case, but I suppose we will find out. One other point: I'm seeing a lot of references to a "prop gun." To the best of my knowledge, a prop gun is a non-firing replica. That doesn't appear to be the case here. This was a real gun. Also, the notion that blanks are completely safe is a dangerous one that needs to be dispelled. At very close range, they can be deadly; although there is no projectile, there is a tremendous amount of force coming out of the muzzle. That force dissipates quickly over distance, but if it is contained, such as by placing the muzzle against something solid, it can be devastating. This is how the actor Jan-Erik Hexum died; he essentially fractured his own skull by "simulating" suicide with a blank-firing gun.

[marie999]

20. Don't these people in charge of weapons check out the weapon and ammo?

[LisaL]

21. So why was the gun pointed in the direction of the cinematographer?

The people shot weren't the actors in the movie.

[Irish_Dem]

28. He was either joking around with them or they happened to be in the line of fire while filming.

[newdayneeded]

37. Good question

this answer could make thing go from bad to worse for him. There was no malice, but manslaughter would seem to come up here.

[NightWatcher]

42. Could've been a head on shot where the actor shoots directly into the camera

to look like a point blank shot. That might explain how the DP and Director got hit with possibly only one round.

[pfitz59]

22. Waiting for "the rest of the story"

If it was an accident or technical flub. One legal outcome. If Baldwin was fooling around another legal outcome. The LLC running the production would have insurance. Very likely the incident was recorded or filmed.

[Dial H For Hero]

44. Exactly so. We don't have enough information at this point.

[Paladin]

46. As am I. Nowhere close to enough information, yet. (nt)

[rampartc]

25. this sounds like a case for perry mason

[edhopper]

50. It was

his final case as a matter of fact.

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0673265/

[BlueStater]

27. Baldwin is 63, not 68.

Unless he’s been lying about his birth year all these years, which I suppose is possible.

[obamanut2012]

30. He was born in 1958

[hlthe2b]

34. Yes. So, 63.

[hlthe2b]

33. Yes this caught me too.

[SYFROYH]

36. I blame the NRA for loose regulations of prop guns

Isn’t this what we do when there is a tragic gun incident?

[Wingus Dingus]

53. Really?

[jcgoldie]

54. Or some of us make jokes to cover for the fact that they oppose all gun regulation it seems...

[Music Man]

59. Uh... what?

[kcr]

62. Is that what we do? Completely make stuff up?

[Niagara]

56. ....

R.I.P. Halyna Hutchins.

[Tommymac]

57. With all the digital audio and visual special effects technologies available

Why the hell is Hollywood still using guns that actually fire ANYTHING

A realistic flash bang could be easily produced with electronics in a gun like body.

It would cost a few $$$...but these events, even if they only happen once every 10 or 20 years, happen TOO MUCH. It is a HUMAN LIFE that was lost...that is worth developing technologies so this NEVER happens again on a major studio set.

The bean counters need to be held just as accountable - but they won't be.

[Sogo]

64. After hearing about this incident,

I had the thought that the live ammunition could have been loaded by someone on set who is a Trumpster and who was out to get Baldwin for all his parodies of Trump. I mean, even though it was an accident, couldn't there be some kind of manslaughter charges and perhaps prison time for Baldwin?

[Catherine Vincent]

71. Just horrible

Rest in peace to the lady that lost her life.

Baldwin's critics and haters is loving this all the while not giving a damn about the woman that died.