Live round in gun Alec Baldwin fired. Let the conspiracies begin.

[Cattledog]

https://nypost.com/2021/10/22/prop-gun-used-by-alec-baldwin-in-shooting-contained-live-round-union/

The prop gun Alec Baldwin used in the accidental shooting that killed a cinematographer on his upcoming movie “Rust” and wounded the director reportedly contained a “live round.”

A union that covers prop masters sent an email to its members Friday morning in which it said “a single live round was accidentally fired on set by the principal actor,” according to Indie Wire.

[montanacowboy]

1. How did one bullet

shoot two people? WTF? and who put a live round in it?

[TwilightZone]

6. Bullets can travel through people.

It's possible that it went through one of the victims and struck the other.

[ItsjustMe]

10. If the weapon

Was a shotgun, one round could hit two people.

[Irish_Dem]

2. How does a single live round hit two people?

[Auggie]

4. Ask the Warren Commission?

[Irish_Dem]

8. Right, their arguments were so convincing.

[roamer65]

12. You won this thread.

[TwilightZone]

9. Bullets can travel through people.

It's possible that it went through one victim and then struck the other.

[Irish_Dem]

11. That is what I wondered, did the bullet go clean through one victim and then hit the other person?

But I am not a weapons expert, so was not sure.

[Zeitghost]

23. It's definitely possible

With this being a western, they would be using period appropriate firearms with ball ammunition, not modern hollow points which are designed not to over penetrate.

[Irish_Dem]

24. Can you explain this a bit more for me? Thank you in advance.

I know nothing about guns.

So the gun in question is likely a period piece, perhaps an antique? It shoots with ball ammunition as opposed to current modern hollow point bullets?

What does it mean that hollow points don't "over penetrate?"

Does this mean that a old fashioned ball bullet is more likely to penetrate two bodies than modern ammunition?

Thank you for the information!

[Zeitghost]

41. No problem

First, I'm going on the report that a real (not a dummy or blank) was accidently used. If this was a dummy/blank incident as in the Brandon Lee shooting, none of what I'm about to explain really matters. But i find it hard to believe that type of accident could kill one and seriously wound another with a single shot.

That said, modern hollow points are designed to expand upon impact. This serves to keep the bullet from over penetrating it's target and also creates a larger wound channel and transfers all of the energy of the bullet into the target. So while possible, it's less likely that a hollow point would pass through one victim and then hit another. Hollow points can be fired from old firearms, but it would not be period correct. So if real, live ammunition was mistakenly used, it would in all likelihood be not be a hollow point.

Ball ammunition (or other non-hollow point ammo) does not expand which makes it more likely for it to punch a narrow hole through the target and continue on it's path.

Of course all of this depends on where someone is hit, etc.

However it happened, a series of tragic mistakes were likely made.

[Irish_Dem]

47. Thank you, I understand now.

It didn't make sense at first that modern bullets would be not powerful enough to kill two people.

But as you describe, yes if the bullet is meant to do as much damage as possible to one person, then the energy would be focused upon that injury.

Yes I think there is going to be a series of mistakes when the evidence comes in.

Thank you for the information.

[marble falls]

15. Single round hitting two people is not an unusual occurance. Please. Conspiracy, really?

[Irish_Dem]

18. I was asking a serious question, I had no idea if hitting two people with one round was possible.

I know nothing about guns.

But someone up thread was kind enough to explain how it was quite possible.
One bullet shoots clean through one body and hits a second body.

We have no idea what happened until the evidence comes in.

[Sympthsical]

44. I read an article detailing it

Apparently the bullet went straight through her abdomen and into the director's clavicle. He must have been crouched behind her.

It does happen, with some bullets more than others.

[Irish_Dem]

49. Thank you for the information!

Right the trajectory does point to the positions you state.

AB must have been pointing the gun right at the camera woman?

[El Supremo]

17. I happens in movies:

&ab_channel=Movieclips

[Irish_Dem]

27. Jebus God.

Amazing.

[marybourg]

28. And in murder novels.

[Beachnutt]

5. A prop gun should not hold a live round

very sad situation

[fescuerescue]

43. many times prop guns are real guns

That have had the ability to fire a live round disabled.

[rsdsharp]

13. It would appear there were multiple mistakes here.

1. Having live ammunition on set.
2. Loading live ammunition.
3. Failure to verify all rounds loaded were blanks (especially with live ammunition on set).
4. Violation of at least three of the four rules of firearm safety.
a. Treat every gun as loaded.
b. Never point a gun at anything you aren’t willing to destroy. (Obviously, this is different on a film set, but the two people shot weren’t acting in a scene.)
c. Keep you finger off the trigger until your sights are on target.
d. Be sure of your target and what’s behind it.

[exboyfil]

34. I think he was firing at the camera with a "cold gun" (but not actually cold)

When they do it with a blank, then they are supposed to use ballistic shielding in front of the camera and crew. I wonder if he was mistakenly given a blank gun that either that had some sort of foreign material in it or part of it failed and was projected out of the barrel. Brandon Lee was shot with a "blank" gun that had been previously loaded with an improperly manufactured dummy round (to show someone loading). The projectile from that dummy round got stuck in the barrel. I think good productions don't ever even aim a blank gun at an actor anymore for just this reason (or only with shielding).

[El Supremo]

14. Wait a minute. According to this story, a "live round" can be a blank:

https://news.yahoo.com/alec-baldwin-rust-camera-crew-193409810.html

A source close to union said Local 44 does not know what projectile was in the gun and clarified that “live” is an industry term that refers to a gun being loaded with some material such as a blank ready for filming.

But something is fishy here. The union camera crew walked out earlier in the day? And why was Baldwin pointing the gun at someone? Actors are trained to point them away from people.

[Zeitghost]

20. The article also mentions...

The article also says that this was during a rehearsal of a scene. Which makes me wonder why a prop gun would need to be loaded with anything at the time if they were only rehearsing.


I'm sure after an investigation we will learn that a series of mistakes lead up to this tragedy.

[exboyfil]

36. I bet it is going to be a lot like Brandon Lee's death

The major difference was it wasn't supposed to be a blank gun but a cold gun.

[Kaleva]

25. Actors are trained to point guns at people.

[exboyfil]

35. Local 44 who include the armorers

also pointed out that they didn't have any members on that production crew because it was locals (this from another source that I have since closed).

[Marthe48]

16. I saw a Midsomer Murders episode

In the episode, a community theater was putting on the play Salieri. One of the characters was going to kill himself by slashing his throat with a razor. The razor was supposed to have tape on the edge and the actor would gush fake blood. The murderer switched the taped razor with an untaped one, so the worst happened. Just watched it recently, so it came to mind when I heard this sad news from real life.

I hope what happened on the movie set was a tragic accident. Mr. Baldwin will have to live with the results of the accident for the rest of his life. An investigation will, I hope, determine what happened, and maybe bring some peace to the survivors.

[dweller]

19. A BCD scenario

(B)aldwin is set to fire a shot at the camera that the (C)inematographer is filming, while the (D)irector is poised over C’s shoulder observing the filming/shot.
Bullet travels straight at C’s thoracic area (soft tissue/kill shot) and travels through to strike D, posed higher than C, by a bullet slowed down by the first encounter with C’s body …
🤔


I rest my case …

✌🏻

[LiveToLurk]

22. What I have read so far....

The woman was shot in the stomach area. The bullet went through her and hit director in the clavicle. I believe he has been released from the hospital already.

So someone who does not like Baldwin, somehow gets a live bullet in the gun? I didn't think live ammo was allowed on movie sets these days?

[dweller]

26. dammit ... now what am I gonna do with

twenty seven eight-by-ten colour glossy photographs with circles and arrows and a paragraph on the back of each one explaining what each one was to be used as evidence ?

🤨

✌🏻

[Irish_Dem]

32. I could not make sense of the trajectory, one hit low, the other hit high.

But your explanation makes sense.

[Merlot]

33. Sounds plausable - except the director wouldn't be over the shoulder

of the cinematographer - he would be lower and behind her at the monitor.

[Irish_Dem]

53. For these kinds of wounds, would the gun have been pointed right at the woman?

To hit her and then go through her body to the director behind her?

[sarisataka]

21. They began at the first report

Now they will multiply exponentially

[BlackSkimmer]

29. I'll wait until someone other than the Post reports it.

Not saying I disbelieve it, I’ll just wait.

[malaise]

31. Was there a Slobfather goon on the set?

Asking for a friend

[fescuerescue]

45. You really think that Trump sent someone there

to setup Baldwin?

[malaise]

50. The OP said Let the conspiracy theories begin

Why not? These days I rule out nothing.

[fescuerescue]

56. lol! ok. good point

[malaise]

57. On the other hand it's looking more like

low budget anti0union workers shit and lots of unsafe goings on

[malaise]

58. On the other hand it's looking more like

low budget anti0union workers shit and lots of unsafe goings on

[nolabear]

37. Really bad addendum to the story.

“Hours before actor Alec Baldwin fatally shot a cinematographer on the New Mexico set of ‘Rust,’ a half-dozen camera operators walked off the set to protest working conditions.”

https://apple.news/AO2qxHw-fQNGAu7npofX-Pg

[exboyfil]

38. Which brings the question of sabotague

by potentially the crew or a false flag made to look like it is the crew. I think personally that it was a mistake where a cold gun was mistaken for a hot gun, and the hot gun malfunctioned in some fashion (foreign material in the barrel or a portion of the gun was projected from it).

[nolabear]

40. I think it was a mistake too, but wonder about shoddy work.

It was a cheap production, sounds like crew wasn’t happy with the standards being, or not being, upheld. It’s a mess.

[regnaD kciN]

42. Really bad, indeed...

…especially since the slain cinematographer was apparently arguing for the union camera operators against the producers…which include Baldwin himself.

It may just be a tragic coincidence, but the very Hollywood convention of murder mysteries means that a lot of people will jump to the conclusion that Baldwin arranged an “accident” that would take out a non-cooperative D.P. and intimidate the crew against any further revolts.

[nolabear]

48. Yeah, but he wouldn't do it himself.

This is pure fantasizing; I have no reason to and am not at all inclined to believe in conspiracies, so it’s moot. But if I was doing it I sure wouldn’t put myself in the middle.

[AngryOldDem]

52. Well, this is what they nearly walked out over.

Totally plausible that conditions played a role.

[SoCalNative]

39. Live round does not mean an actual bullet

"A source close to the union told The Times that it does not know what projectile was in the gun. The source also clarified that “live” — in reference to a “live single round” — is an industry term that refers to a gun being loaded with some material such as a blank ready for filming."

https://www.latimes.com/entertainment-arts/movies/story/2021-10-22/rust-shooting-live-single-round-killed-cinematographer-union-says

[marie999]

46. What is he doing firing a weapon without checking it out first.

[AngryOldDem]

51. Fucking around with it? Thinking it was harmless?

Was told it was safe?

[Straw Man]

54. His job is acting.

There are (or should be) people on set whose job is checking out the weapons. No weapon is supposed to be placed in an actor's hand without having been checked by an armorer first.

[gldstwmn]

55. The union crew left 6 hours before

the incident and we're replaced by a non union crew according to the LA Times. Also according to LA Times live round also refers to blanks.

[Dr. Strange]

59. I wonder how it must feel to wrongfully kill someone...

Link to tweet

Now that's some serious conspiracy fodder.