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applegrove

(132,185 posts)
Tue Nov 2, 2021, 04:39 PM Nov 2021

Pete Buttigieg says no-fly list is "on the table" for violent anti-maskers on planes

Pete Buttigieg says no-fly list is “on the table” for violent anti-maskers on planes

With a sharp increase in violence on planes this year, Transportation Secretary Pete Buttigieg said there's "absolutely no excuse for this kind of treatment of flight crews in the air."

By Molly Sprayregen Monday, November 1, 2021    

https://www.lgbtqnation.com/2021/11/pete-buttigieg-says-no-fly-list-table-violent-anti-maskers-planes/

"SNIP......

In the midst of a rise in violent incidents on airplanes, out Transportation Secretary Pete Buttigieg said adding violent and unruly passengers to the no-fly list  “should be on the table.”

During an interview on CNN’s State of the Union, Buttigieg emphasized that “it is completely unacceptable to mistreat, abuse, or even disrespect flight crews.

“These flight attendants have been on the front lines of the pandemic from day one,” he continued, “and they’re up there, as the announcement always says, for your safety. There is absolutely no excuse for this kind of treatment of flight crews in the air, or any of the essential workers, from bus drivers to air crews, who get people to where they need to be.”

In the interview, State of the Union co-anchor Dana Bash asked Buttigieg about the possibility of a no-fly list in the context of a recent American Airlines flight that was diverted when a flight attendant suffered broken bones, including in her face, after being assaulted by a passenger.

......SNIP"

33 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Pete Buttigieg says no-fly list is "on the table" for violent anti-maskers on planes (Original Post) applegrove Nov 2021 OP
If they use violence to oppose a rule then they should be permanently banned. LiberalFighter Nov 2021 #1
Glad to hear this! SheltieLover Nov 2021 #2
"On the table"? lagomorph777 Nov 2021 #3
That was my reaction wryter2000 Nov 2021 #4
If he's real polite, might even leave him an air hole under the duct-taped mask. lagomorph777 Nov 2021 #6
I know, move it off the table now into reality. Irish_Dem Nov 2021 #5
I imagine that there are procedures in place for how changes like this are made... NurseJackie Nov 2021 #11
Passenger violence is clearly a threat to crew and passengers, needs to be emergency action before Irish_Dem Nov 2021 #13
Nobody said otherwise. My post was to offer a reasonable explanation as to why... NurseJackie Nov 2021 #14
Exactly. The Administrative Procedure Act sets out a process Ocelot II Nov 2021 #17
Tank you for that clear explanation. niyad Nov 2021 #27
It is already illegal, maybe a federal offense, to disobey flight crew. HUAJIAO Nov 2021 #33
Absolutely Rebl2 Nov 2021 #18
Because there's a process. Ocelot II Nov 2021 #10
And that helps to explain why some airlines are taking a bit of a shortcut... NurseJackie Nov 2021 #22
Delta is asking other airlines to share their no-fly lists, Ocelot II Nov 2021 #24
THIS!!!!! SLAM it on them immediately! calimary Nov 2021 #29
Everyone that's violent should be on a no fly list. nt Raine Nov 2021 #7
What are they waiting for? BlueIdaho Nov 2021 #8
See #10. Ocelot II Nov 2021 #12
It should BE the table. DeeNice Nov 2021 #9
Agreed Deuxcents Nov 2021 #15
More power to you new dad! Budi Nov 2021 #16
Here is novel idea,,, Cryptoad Nov 2021 #19
Precisely Sherman A1 Nov 2021 #28
Alcohol has become a problem too. Lonestarblue Nov 2021 #20
I thank god I mostly got over my fear of flying róisín_dubh Nov 2021 #23
No Dah! Pepsidog Nov 2021 #21
On the Table? Dystopian Optimist Nov 2021 #25
Or push it right in their faces. Zero tolerance. calimary Nov 2021 #30
Let's take it off the table and kacekwl Nov 2021 #26
Pete you need to pick that up off the table and put it Maru Kitteh Nov 2021 #31
I think getting on an airplane without a mask is a violent act. TNNurse Nov 2021 #32

wryter2000

(47,940 posts)
4. That was my reaction
Tue Nov 2, 2021, 04:45 PM
Nov 2021

I guess individual airlines are creating their own "no fly" lists, so it is being done to a certain extent.

My very favorite, though, is the idea of duct taping an idiot to his seat.

Irish_Dem

(81,215 posts)
5. I know, move it off the table now into reality.
Tue Nov 2, 2021, 04:46 PM
Nov 2021

I don't understand why there is even a question about it.

NurseJackie

(42,862 posts)
11. I imagine that there are procedures in place for how changes like this are made...
Tue Nov 2, 2021, 05:06 PM
Nov 2021

... and it's not as simple as "Hey! I'm in-charge here and I've got an idea! Here's a memo... add this rule to the no-fly-list requirements!"

Irish_Dem

(81,215 posts)
13. Passenger violence is clearly a threat to crew and passengers, needs to be emergency action before
Tue Nov 2, 2021, 05:13 PM
Nov 2021

there are deaths on board, or worse.

NurseJackie

(42,862 posts)
14. Nobody said otherwise. My post was to offer a reasonable explanation as to why...
Tue Nov 2, 2021, 05:21 PM
Nov 2021

... those types of rule-changes or additions don't happen overnight or with great speed. I imagine that it's a complex procedure with checks/balances/reviews and a legal staff to make sure that the wording doesn't run afoul or conflict with other rules/laws/procedures; or that what sounds good now, doesn't turn out to have some loophole or other technicality that can be abused. I'm sure the process is not as simple as we imagine it to be (or would like it to be.) That's all I'm saying.

Ocelot II

(130,506 posts)
17. Exactly. The Administrative Procedure Act sets out a process
Tue Nov 2, 2021, 05:34 PM
Nov 2021

for reviewing and approving federal agency rules. The Constitution requires that the process for the enactment of any regulation that has the force and effect of law (as agency rules do) provide for notice and the opportunity for potentially affected people and entities to be heard. The proposed rule has to published in the Federal Register, and the public can submit comments. In some cases there will be hearings. But an agency head can't just say, this is what we're going to do and it magically becomes law, no matter how much the rule might be needed.

HUAJIAO

(2,730 posts)
33. It is already illegal, maybe a federal offense, to disobey flight crew.
Tue Nov 2, 2021, 07:42 PM
Nov 2021

I am quite sure it is a federal offense to 'tamper with' the smoke detectors in the 'lavatories."

Why are they called lavatories? They're bathrooms, or rather the toilet..

Ocelot II

(130,506 posts)
10. Because there's a process.
Tue Nov 2, 2021, 05:04 PM
Nov 2021

It would have to go through the required rulemaking procedures according to the Administrative Procedure
Act for federal agencies. They (presumably the FAA) would have to publish a notice of proposed rulemaking with the text of the rule, and allow a period of time for public comments before enacting a rule.

NurseJackie

(42,862 posts)
22. And that helps to explain why some airlines are taking a bit of a shortcut...
Tue Nov 2, 2021, 06:05 PM
Nov 2021

... and enacting their own policies that allow them to ban passengers within the realm of that which they have control. Namely, their own airline (and feeder airlines). It's imperfect and the banned passenger can certainly fly on another airline, but I imagine that being banned from ONE airline can have a humbling effect on some individuals (especially if they don't want to risk being banned for life on another airline).

The "OMG, do something right fucking now" is certainly an understandable emotion, but along with that are frequent insinuations (here and elsewhere) that our leadership, cabinet, and agency heads are twiddling their thumbs and gazing at their navels... either frightened or incompetent... well, it's just too much. Sigh.

--

Hi, Ocelot II!! Have a great week!

Ocelot II

(130,506 posts)
24. Delta is asking other airlines to share their no-fly lists,
Tue Nov 2, 2021, 06:12 PM
Nov 2021

and if that happens there won't be an immediate need for a federal one. It's currently a crime to interfere with an air crew, and the FAA can assess a large civil fine for in-flight maskholery, but that doesn't seem to be stopping some people, especially if alcohol is involved. I'd be all in favor of a system-wide no-fly list, which already exists for suspected foreign terrorists, but motivation doesn't matter when somebody is beating on a flight attendant or otherwise interfering with the safety of a flight. If the airlines share their asshole lists while the government enacts a federal rule, so much the better. What airline would even want those passengers anyway?

And a good week to you, too!

calimary

(89,997 posts)
29. THIS!!!!! SLAM it on them immediately!
Tue Nov 2, 2021, 07:14 PM
Nov 2021

What you said, lagomorph777! Times a MILLION! Or at least, times 700-thousand-PLUS. That’s how many Americans have died of the virus.

Period.

BlueIdaho

(13,582 posts)
8. What are they waiting for?
Tue Nov 2, 2021, 04:58 PM
Nov 2021

Flying violent anti-maskers should be serve a felony sentence and be put permanently on a national no-fly list. STARTING NOW!

DeeNice

(579 posts)
9. It should BE the table.
Tue Nov 2, 2021, 05:01 PM
Nov 2021

The only table. Do violence on an aircraft for any reason, you're out for good.

Sherman A1

(38,958 posts)
28. Precisely
Tue Nov 2, 2021, 07:11 PM
Nov 2021

No vas, no mask, no get on airplane. Create problem on airplane, get immediate exit no matter what altitude.

Lonestarblue

(13,470 posts)
20. Alcohol has become a problem too.
Tue Nov 2, 2021, 06:01 PM
Nov 2021

We’ve probably all been on flights where someone had a few too many in the airport and then tanked up once on board. Until Trump released the crazies to behave any way they please, they mostly went to sleep. Now they attack flight attendants.

On the flights I’ve been on over the past few months, I have definitely noticed a decrease in the amount of alcohol served. With lots of frequent flyer miles saved up, I’m often able to upgrade to Business Class where alcohol was freely available in the past. Now flight attendants make themselves scarce at the front of the plane after an initial serving. Not a big issue, but alcohol-fueled rage has caused changes that affect other people.

róisín_dubh

(12,334 posts)
23. I thank god I mostly got over my fear of flying
Tue Nov 2, 2021, 06:12 PM
Nov 2021

I always needed a drink on board. But I’m the “have a beer and go to sleep” type.

Maru Kitteh

(31,759 posts)
31. Pete you need to pick that up off the table and put it
Tue Nov 2, 2021, 07:20 PM
Nov 2021

on the drawing board - we've located the issue, time to remove it.




TNNurse

(7,539 posts)
32. I think getting on an airplane without a mask is a violent act.
Tue Nov 2, 2021, 07:36 PM
Nov 2021

There would not be in other action necessary,

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