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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsThe Squad defends infrastructure "no" vote, AOC fact-checks Biden claims
Axios via YahooWhy it matters: AOC, the rest of The Squad and two other progressives were the only Democrats to vote against the bill. That prompted criticism from their colleagues and social media followers, since the road-and-bridge spending will so directly impact their constituents. Thirteen Republicans helped cover their lost votes.
We did not fund the replacement of every childs [lead water] pipe & we shouldnt tell people we did," Ocasio-Cortez tweeted about Biden.
The other five Democrats who voted against have released their own statements and explanations on Twitter.
The placed blame on other factors like the president, "corporate polluters," conservative Democrats, procedural issues and agreements, as well as a refusal to "choose" between supporting union workers or childcare and health care workers.
BGBD
(3,282 posts)now she has to live with it.
SCantiGOP
(13,869 posts)A lot of folks here might disagree, but I feel certain each of them would have voted for the bill had their vote been the deciding vote.
Tomconroy
(7,611 posts)happened last Friday night. It was interesting.
Hoyt
(54,770 posts)Im not a blind supporter of the squad or other groups, but dont/hope believe they would have let BIF go down.
tritsofme
(17,377 posts)and contrived.
Demsrule86
(68,556 posts)is a liar...with the lead thing and other parts of her statement. Perhaps a primary is in order?
PatSeg
(47,418 posts)It is hardly healthy for an elected Democrat to accuse a Democratic president of being a liar. Disagreeing is one thing, but saying he is not truthful is another.
Add to that throwing around "Corporate Democrats" as a slur about members of the same party undermines Democrats and could cost us elections. The political inexperience and naiveté of some representatives couldn't be more obvious. You can "respectfully disagree" with a colleague, but leave the petty mudslinging to the republicans.
Cha
(297,180 posts)whether anyone has a problem with the vote.
but, there are some who spend a whole lot of time bashing her no matter what she does.
lame54
(35,287 posts)Today no one would give a shit "why"
Just that you voted against it
That's your legacy
They could have voted Yes and still point out the areas that need improvement
Sneederbunk
(14,290 posts)They didn't.
Skittles
(153,150 posts)Tomconroy
(7,611 posts)Something that was obvious since August.
jcgoldie
(11,631 posts)Which is why they were free to vote the way they chose to.
Tomconroy
(7,611 posts)They knew they didn't have the votes?
PatSeg
(47,418 posts)More air time on TV?
leftstreet
(36,106 posts)They come into office on a wave of hard work, small donations, and amazing grassroots support, worn shoe leather blah, blah, blah. But when it comes time to rally and excite those same supporters to stand up and behind them - nothing.
They tweet a lot about the unfairness of things and turn their designer gowns into memes.
whatever
"Turn their designer gowns into memes." Too much social media performance art and not enough serious legislating. I couldn't quite figure out why that dress stunt bothered me, but you nailed it. What on earth did that accomplish?
Tomconroy
(7,611 posts)From a party at Mar a Lago a week ago. Two women are wearing AOC dresses. One says: Be the Rich!
The other says: Marry the Rich!
Some people really don't get it.
CentralMass
(15,265 posts)Demsrule86
(68,556 posts)Shellback Squid
(8,914 posts)Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin
(107,946 posts)Too many progressives either don't know how or don't want to play the long game. Republicans unfortunately do and that's why we're in a lot of the mess we're in.
PatSeg
(47,418 posts)tirebiter
(2,536 posts)Celerity
(43,333 posts)Following your logic, every single one of the 14 Democratic Senators who voted against a waiver allowing Lloyd Austin to become Secretary of Defense also then
The waiver passed (69-27)
I never see the same claimed for Jared Golden, who has the lowest Biden score of ALL Democratic caucus members in either chamber
Among his multiple votes against Biden, Golden was one of only two Dems (the centrist conservative Ron Kind was the other) who voted against the George Floyd Justice in Policing Act (which passed 220-212)
What about Manchin?
He literally de facto blocked Neera Tanden's OMB head nomination when he publicly went on the record and said NO, he is opposing her officially
That was NOT symbolic, that directly caused Biden to withdraw her nomination after he could not find a Rethug Yes vote to count Manchin's 'No' stance.
and lastly
what about
the curtsy that helped kill off the $15/hr minimum wage
The last two, Manchin and Sinema, ARE actively against vast swathes of Biden's agenda, they have already, just on two of his major bills, ripped out $3.8 trillion (and counting, as that BBB is going to very likely getting shredded even more now that all leverage is gone) in new spend and vital, centrepiece whole Biden programmes
The same cannot be said of any of the progressives, who have been fighting for Biden's programmes for ages now, and have blocked nothing from passing at the end of the day.
LizBeth
(9,952 posts)Then bash on Dems heads later or a lordly holier than thou fashion. His Iraq vote was merely a contrived symbolic vote being in a safe position to vote against it knowing the others had to vote it then in a manipulative way use it for 2 decades manipulatively bashing Dems. All his other votes with that war were with the group, but that one vote was a contrived symbolic vote because it was safe for him to do it. Pure theatrics and then we suffer the repercussions after.
Celerity
(43,333 posts)get back to me.
Selective outrage.
Also
Do you have some evidence of this?
I would love to see it. (not being flippant)
LizBeth
(9,952 posts)Celerity
(43,333 posts)the progs non stop, often falsely, and over time (and because I really love AOC except for her false labelling as a democratic socialist when she is simply a bog standard social democrat) I tired of seeing all of the disingenuous attacks on them, and decided to become a defender and a debunker (within reason), much to the chagrin of some.
I was (and still am) a huge Buttigieg supporter, I was the first poster in his primary group here on DU:
https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=forum&id=1293&page=4
Many of the red rose twitter people and other non DU trolls (fucking TYT were SHIT, they camped in South Bend for months and months and smeared him with local malcontents and nutcases and made up fake news) as well as some posters on here, (mostly long ago banned), viscously and falsely attacked him, so there is no love lost between me and them.
But AOC and Sanders never said anything over the top against him, they just disagreed on policy at multiple points, and I respected that. I always thought and said that Sanders was unelectable for POTUS, but he has many good ideas and certainly is not the great satan some paint him as.
I also do not think that AOC can win a NY Senate seat atm, nor NY Governor (likely ever, as that takes a different type of political animal than she is) and of course, she is far too young and inexperienced (even though she technically makes the age to become POTUS 99 days before the January 20th, 2025 swearing in date) to be elected POTUS any time soon. The country is still too reactionary to elect an AOC/Sanders type. It may be so for decades to come, but I love her in the House.
Demsrule86
(68,556 posts)vote for BBB in the end. The same can not be said of all members in the squad at this point.
Celerity
(43,333 posts)Manchin and Sinema have massively gutted Bidens's agenda, $3.8 trillion and counting on just the BIF and the BBB, and Manchin forced Biden to withdraw Neera Tanden's OMB head nomination when he came out publicly as a No vote and Biden could not find a Rethug Yes vote to counter Manchin.
The progressives have not blocked anything or anyone from passing/being confirmed at the end of the day, and most certainly have not gutted Biden's agenda.
All you and a few others others do is to repeat the same old failed false framings and spin ad nauseum.
You really need some new material.
Manchin and Sinema had better or we are well fucked in 2022, if the BBB is a complete fail and doesn't pass at all due to one or both of them. At that point, it means they will have crushed over NINETY PER CENT of Biden's 2 bill agenda proposals. $5.55 trillion gone from Biden's initial 2 bill new spend totals of $6.1 trillion. Most all of his major centrepiece programmes from those bills gone, done, dusted.
Same for those two Senators allowing a carve out on the filibuster for the voters rights/protection bills.
If they do end up blocking it all (blocking both the BBB and all the voter bills), we are headed for a historic wipe out in 2022 and likely 2024, with a crazy RW white nationalist christofascist Congress and multiple State Houses and Senates and Governorships of the same ilk and bent firmly ensconced power. All that will be on their hands if they are indeed the ones who end up blocking it all..
iemanja
(53,031 posts)the difference is that they have few defenders, and certainly none who put their careers above policy, legislation, or the party.
I for one never even heard of Jared Golden before your post.
Celerity
(43,333 posts)of Biden's (and most all of the rest of the Dem Caucus) agenda. They have already had deleterious impacts, actual ones, such as a de facto blocking of a Biden nomination (Manchin with Neera Tanden for OMB head) and then, FAR more importantly, shredding off a combined $3.8 trillion (and counting) between the 2 infrastructure bills, shredding out vast parts of Biden's centrepiece programmes, and in multiple cases, the entirety of those programmes.
They have the potential to destroy our chances in 2022 (and thus likely 2024) IF they actually end up completely blocking the BBB and also refuse to allow filibuster carve-outs on the voter rights/protection bills. For all our sakes, the US and indeed the world's, let us all hope they do not go the full block route on the BBB and all the voter bills.
iemanja
(53,031 posts)Obstructing the Democratic legislative agenda IS the issue.
Nixie
(16,950 posts)their own revolutions are okay, i.e,, Sinema and Manchin. Thats probably just another way of saying what you said, but youre exactly right.
WHITT
(2,868 posts)Quite true.
As I've recently posted, UNFORTUNATELY, the POTUS, several of his cabinet members, numerous Senators and members of the House, are making dangerously inaccurate statements in regards to what is, and what is not, in the bill. This, what I assume is unintended sloppiness, can come back to bite them.
betsuni
(25,475 posts)cancelling all student debt, abolishing billionaires, etc. Things that wouldn't be passed without compromises like anything else and be disappointing. Why?
Sherman A1
(38,958 posts)As she is my Representative. Im not at all pleased with her grandstanding and told her that her predecessor Lacy Clay who she accused of being a corporate good old boy, would have never made such a mistake.
I will never vote for a Republican, but that doesnt mean I will vote for her in 2022 or beyond. I will certainly send my money to other Democratic candidates, but she will see not a dime.
This reminds me of my County Council District Rep who as a Democrat voted to overturn the St. Louis County mask mandate in July of this year. She will never get my vote or support in the future for such a stupid grandstanding act.
luv2fly
(2,475 posts)In my opinion, posting articles like this does nothing to help anyone. Our big tent sometimes blows in the wind, threatening to collapse, and there's no need to pull at the stakes.
Scrivener7
(50,949 posts)bill. One that would actually get somewhere and would actually do something.
They voted no.
luv2fly
(2,475 posts)Nor do we know how needed their votes were. That they held out and don't trust some folks in the Senate to support their/Biden's agenda, well... hard to blame them given how things often work out. Hard for me at least, and many others.
Biden's agenda, which is much of Bernie's in a more moderate sort of way, has been championed by progressives all along, even as the money was cut from 6 trillion to 3 trillion to almost half of even that. I don't see the other two doing much beyond complaining and grandstanding.
When push came to shove, the numbers needed from the progressive caucus once again supported President Biden.
Scrivener7
(50,949 posts)No. We don't know what went on behind the scenes. But we know they didn't vote for it.
The solution to not trusting people in the Senate is to vote against needed legislation?
And no, they did not support President Biden. They called his bill bullshit, they called him a liar, and they voted against it.
Demsrule86
(68,556 posts)happens with BBB.
luv2fly
(2,475 posts)Not to mention grandstand and play victim, and heaven forbid they displease their corporate funders.
Walleye
(31,017 posts)Fewer stunts for the benefit of social media and a little more serious governing. Maybe a refresher course in Political Science to see historically how meaningful legislation was passed.
Kahuna
(27,311 posts)Johonny
(20,840 posts)The squad will all be asking for it for their district. We all know that, right?
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)They're not being regarded as the Heroic Squad they were trying for. Good. She's too busy trying to make the good achieved seem like nothing, and thus excuse their opposition.
You won't hear from her that the Biden plan did initially include $45 billion to finally replace lead pipes across the nation. And still does!!! Or that the $15 billion we were able to pass will replace lead pipes for a million homes, plus other billions for other tragically delayed clean water projects. The "failure."
ripcord
(5,372 posts)It doesn't matter that they may have supported the bill if it were close because we will never know, the only thing we do know for sure is they voted against the President's agenda and then called him a liar.
Demsrule86
(68,556 posts)PatSeg
(47,418 posts)Their political stunts benefited no one and their behavior undermined the President's agenda, as well as his credibility.
Kahuna
(27,311 posts)jalan48
(13,862 posts)mathematic
(1,439 posts)They voted no to all that too.
jalan48
(13,862 posts)karynnj
(59,503 posts)Consider the argument of the right - there are times the wind does not blow or the sun does not shine. With a well designed grid, electricity can be sent from one place to another - even if far away. It is hard to make the case that there is a time when neither the wind blows or sun does not shine everywhere. I know that better batteries has been a solution to the timing problem, but a better grid is a more elegant workable solution.
A better national grid has been a very prominent demand for decades including by John Kerry, Gina McCarthy and AL Gore - to name three. Texas showed what happened with their stand alone privately owned grid.
bikernks
(7 posts)She literally voted no on a bill that taxed the rich. Good God.
jcgoldie
(11,631 posts)The intentional conflation of that very normal legislative process with the obstruction engaged in by Manchin and Sinema in the Senate is pure gaslighting and a large group of DUers are engaged in it.
mathematic
(1,439 posts)Like many people, I'm totally over "at least they stick to their guns" as the paramount moral virtue of government.
You vote against the most important infrastructure investment bill in decades? Your principles suck. I don't care that you stuck to them. You need to change them.
ProfessorGAC
(65,010 posts)If their principles require perfection, they are inappropriate principles.
karynnj
(59,503 posts)their votes were essentially votes of no confidence for the HOUSE Democratic moderates who signed that if the CBO score was good they would vote for BIF. No good and it further hurt Biden getting credit for what should have been a major win.
Demsrule86
(68,556 posts)Some folks value conformity more than others.
karynnj
(59,503 posts)Assuming that they were not chosen to exclude all areas where POC predominate - and argument that is both unlikely and not made - that bill is VERY important for everyone getting water over those pipes. It makes more sense to look at each bill to determine whether it - as written - makes things better.
Replacing lots of lead pipes is an issue that is asinine to complain about. The demand should be that other bills are needed to replace the rest of them. The BIF is the type of bill the Democrats have backed at least since 2000.
The DUMBEST comment I heard was that had the ORDER of the votes changed, they would have voted for it. This is a slap in the face to the moderates who pledged - that if costs were as expected - they would vote for BBB. This attacked their integrity and honesty while gaining them NOTHING. Yet, on all bills these are the people they will be negotiating with! To attack your own party's President, who very very clearly wants both bills is crazy.
At various times, I was impressed by AOC. She is charismatic and articulate, but here I question her diplomatic skills - skills needed to be an effective legislator.
Politicub
(12,165 posts)Its not that partisans disagree with AOC and the squad; thats politics. Its the dripping disdain for progressives generally that happens in the pile-on.
I am proudly progressive and liberal. Im grateful that there is an infrastructure bill, too. But that doesnt mean that Im not disappointed about how the social spending bill is getting discounted.
Many progressives, me among them, see the decoupling of the two bills as dooming the social spending bill. I hope I am proven wrong. I really do.
So while there is good reason for a victory lap for infrastructure, there is also real frustration about the social agenda.
jcgoldie
(11,631 posts)Demsrule86
(68,556 posts)president and your party in a 50 50 senate or anytime really. You get the best deal possible and then vote for it. I am very displeased and it has nothing to do with their political beliefs which I share.
Politicub
(12,165 posts)to fact check the president.
While what she wrote wasnt incorrect, it could have been said later in a way that wasnt inflammatory.
That still doesnt justify throwing all progressives under the bus.
PatSeg
(47,418 posts)And you don't undermine your party and your President in the process. More experienced legislators know how bills get passed, which is why new members of congress often keep a low profile until they learn the mechanics of the job. That tends to be true with most jobs. My way or the highway rarely ever works, but meaningful compromise can accomplish an awful lot.
Meanwhile with a 50-50 senate and a slim majority in the house, this is no time to play games for effect. We may lose one or both houses in 2022, so we have to get as much done as we can right now. Also the more we CAN accomplish, the better our odds that we will win in 2022.
iemanja
(53,031 posts)So why would you identify yourself entirely in relation to the few that didn't?
Politicub
(12,165 posts)Dont put words in my mouth. Just dont.
I didnt say that at all.
iemanja
(53,031 posts)criticism of the squad as an attack on all progressives. Why is that?
Why do you assume that no one criticizing the squad might themselves be progressive? It's as though those six lawmakers are the bar for what is considered progressive. I don't understand that.
Cha
(297,180 posts)progressives did the progressive action of actually voting For the bill.
Happy Hoosier
(7,295 posts)Of a "Democratic" Congress unable to get it's shit together and PASS something.
It's fed a perception of fecklessness and meandering leadership.
I probably agree with "The Squad" on most individual issues. But their political sense absolutely SUCKS. The inability to bring the progressive and centrist wings of party together to pass SOMETHING has been killing us. And any Democrats unable to adjust tactics in the face of that are damaging the prospects of being able to accomplish ANYTHING of value, even if imperfect.
In my view, the option wasn't between compromise and getting all the goodies. It was between compromise and getting jack shit.
Happy Hoosier
(7,295 posts)They can't tell the difference between the ideal and the possible, IMO.
And they seem to be completely ignoring the actual political environment.