Just an observation early this morning:

[PCIntern]

I am sitting in the parking lot of the shopping center in which my part-time job as a dentist is located, and the one thing common to virtually every store, small restaurant, and franchise is that there is a “help wanted” sign or a “now hiring” sign in the window. All of my patients who are in management tell me that they can’t get anyone to work in decent reasonably high paying quality jobs which used to be coveted. I am puzzled by the psychology of all this, given that if I recall correctly the last federal unemployment checks were sent out in August or September and I don’t know what these people are living on. I for one who came from a very progressive, liberal, humanistic family was told that I had best better work every day of my life and there was no Such thing as time off to find myself or to explore my consciousness.

When I say I don’t understand, that’s a rhetorical statement. I personally think this is bad decision making on the part of what I suppose are millions of people. Just an observation…

[Walleye]

1. I think a job dealing with the general public might be difficult right now.

Seems like people aren’t acting very civilized. Maybe some of the people would rather stay at home and “do their own research”on the Internet than work for a living. It’s an addiction. And the right wingers have been telling them all these years that we want to give everybody free stuff

[gab13by13]

2. Do the employees in those small stores wear masks?

[snowybirdie]

3. They just opened an Amazon facility nearby.

Hundreds of decent paying jobs requiring few advanced skills. The little businesses in the area that paid less than minimum wage with less than idea working conditions are now looking for employees. My bet is they are at the Amazon warehouse.

[traitorsgalore]

4. "decent reasonably high paying quality jobs" says management stooges

So why don't the management people do them?

[rurallib]

7. yeah, that phrase kind of grabbed me

what do management types think are "high paying jobs" and "quality jobs." I'll bet their ideas are different from mine

[Joinfortmill]

5. I think a lot of folks found work from home jobs

In tech and telephone customer service.

[padah513]

9. That's my guess

Why deal directly with the public if you don't have to

[Sherman A1]

6. There are as many reasons as there are people

*Retail and service jobs dealing directly with the public have mostly increased their pay but many are still going unfulfilled as these jobs in I believe many cases have burned through many candidates already having used the disposable workforce model for decades.

*Child care is an issue for many women who would like to be back in the workforce but simply cannot do so.

*Covid has claimed some workers through death or long term affects from the virus as not everyone who affected was the stereotypical senior citizen in a nursing home.

*We see the videos posted such as the one yesterday of the "Karen" tossing hot soup in the face of a young restaurant employee and that along with the general BS that service level jobs entail do not enhance recruiting. A similar incident occurred at that grocery store from which I retired just last week as a manager was doused with a cold beverage by a customer because he would not accept a return of $100.00 in spoiled meat without a receipt.

*Some folks have switched jobs or opened their own businesses.

*Some folks who saw the disaster brewing in the early stages simply retired if they could do so and have no intention of returning to the workforce. (If I wasn't already out by then I certainly would have pulled the plug. A friend's wife who was a Respiratory Therapist working in a hospital said enough and retired in April of 2020).

*Some folks may just very well be burned out. I know that several with whom I used to work in Grocery are just exhausted having been short handed before the pandemic started and needless to say things did not improve over these last 18+ months. I am sure that delivery drivers and other service sector folks who have seen increasing workloads with little if any increase in help are worn out.

So the reasons vary, but the available unemployment really wasn't one of them.

[llmart]

8. I would add one more reason.

Being short-sighted as Americans usually are, during boom times shopping centers and malls sprouted up like mushrooms after a rain with no thought to future recessions (they're always cyclical) and the aging baby boomer population leaving the workforce. Do we really need a drug store on every corner? A gas station on every corner? Is it really that inconvenient to drive three miles to a drug store?

This was bound to happen at some point, even without a pandemic. Demographers predicted it would once the boomers got older and started dying off.

[Sherman A1]

19. I understand your point, but must disagree

The mall building boom of the 1970s - 90s is not likely the culprit beyond straining the communities where once vibrant malls once stood having been in too many cases supported by tax increment financing. The boom did indirectly bring about the demise of many a Retailer who overstretched themselves and loaded up with debt to build stores or fill these behemoths. I don't however see a correlation between the labor force and the demise of the Mall/Retailer. It should make more labor available as these facilities failed and those working there sought other employment if anything.

[llmart]

20. I think you misunderstood my examples.

I didn't mean huge malls specifically. I meant the boom in putting up stores everywhere, whether they be huge malls or small strips of several retailers. The baby boomers leaving the work force means there aren't enough people to work at them. The unemployment numbers show that we are basically at full employment. I was taught that an unemployment rate of less than 5% is considered full employment. Maybe there isn't a labor shortage but too many places.

[Sherman A1]

22. I don't believe this is simply a baby boom issue

Certainly that is a factor, but many in the baby boom did not work at Retail or Service jobs. I for one did, doing 43 years in retail grocery, but there were many in that generation who worked in many other fields. Retail did become oversaturated as you indicate and the shakeout has been a painful one from the failure of the malls, strip centers and alike to the advent of online shopping.

I would believe that as I mentioned the burn through of the disposable workforce model (thanks to Walmart) has just as much if not more to do with the shortage than an aging baby boom.

[Mariana]

37. ... many in the baby boom did not work at Retail or Service jobs.

I think it's still a big factor. Lots of younger people have been stuck in retail or service jobs, even though they have skills and qualifications to do something different. Now many of those jobs in other fields have become available to them.

[Haggard Celine]

10. Yes, I think you've hit all the main reasons.

There are a lot of opportunities to work from home right now. I get email from my employment search engine about those jobs all the time. I would do it, but I don't have a working computer right now, and that is a must.

People are pretty fed up with a lot of the traditional jobs out there. They get treated like shit by the customers and the management, and the pay isn't nearly enough to put up with all of that. So a lot of people are pooling their resources and learning to live with less.

I'm trying to find a job now, but I have a disability and I'm having a hard time finding someone who can accommodate me. I'll be glad to have a job, but I'm not going to put up with a lot of shit from people, either. I can live off of very little, and I'll do it for as long as I have to until I find the right job.

[brush]

11. Covid is still a reality. Parents have to contend with that and the...

unresolved schools/vaccine/masks situation in many localities. Just the uncertainly of that then the expense of childcare. Can they even afford it?

Which parent stays home in an economy that requiredd two incomes to make it? Not to mention the single parent households who were barely able to make it before covid.

It's still a rough time for many out there. No wonder help wanted signs go unanswered.

[Philosophizing Fool]

12. Reshuffling of the order

A persistent problem, such as this, will need a new vision of how small businesses are run. A small company will need to outshine its competitors, using new incentives, be it higher wages, better benefits, or a combination of both. Adapting to the new climate will need ingenuity, compassion, and integrity.

We may witness the convenience of shops on every corner come to an end. While we see a new age of businesses that appreciate the employees and communities more.

[Johnny2X2X]

16. This

The small business owner has been put on a pedestal in our country for a long time. Too many small business owners just assume owning any small business is a ticket to being rich if you just get your workers to work for as little as possible.

I know many small business owners, there's 2 types, 1 that view their employees as a means to achieve their own dreams, and 1 that views their workers as partners to share in a dream. The second ones are not having problems finding workers.

[IrishAfricanAmerican]

17. Exactly!

[Tree Lady]

30. So true the last part

My fav restaurants that treat people good have plenty of helpers still. Same with small shops where from the moment you walk in you can tell people enjoy working there. Also my zen tea shop last time I went in there still has a feeling of being ok to hang out, that feeling is gone from most places now, its no longer fun to chill anymore when you can tell waitstaff unhappy and stressed. I feel sorry for them the ones left in those places.

[llmart]

21. Exactly my point.

I watched all those small, individual places go up on every corner with a lot of trepidation that there would be enough people to work at them.

As an avid conservationist, I despised the diminishing green spaces and open spaces that filled up with mortar and brick structures on every corner.

[luv2fly]

13. That's because we are all too busy watching porn and playing video games n/t

[tazkcmo]

18. I don't play video games.

[doc03]

14. I don't understand it Ohio stopped the unemployment subsidies back in July. Myself I thought

maybe that was keeping people from taking jobs but the signs are still there. Some people say they got jobs working
on line or found a better job. That doesn't make sense because if there is 4.6% unemployment there are people
looking for jobs, are they not qualified or over qualified? It can't be because people are shopping on line and
retail shopping is out, because what retail there is all have help wanted signs on them? Earlier this year inside dinning was
closed at all the restaurants around here. This spring Chick Fil A opened their dinning area then eventually McDonald's and most of the rest. Now Chick Fil A has closed their dinning for about 2 months because of a labor shortage yet all the others are now open. What did everyone do quit Chick Fil A, I heard they paid much better than the rest. The Walmart, Cabelas and Cardinal Health distribution
centers all have billboards advertising for workers and they pay more and have benefits. Before all of this started the unemployment was 3.5% now it is 4.6% where the hell is that 1.1%?



LOL maybe they are all watching porn and playing video games.

[forthemiddle]

15. One problem I've heard is teenagers not having to work

It's not just regular workers not wanting to work fast food, retail, etc.
I have heard from a friend that owns a grocery store, that kids that used to staff a lot of his none traditional hours are just not applying. That makes things worse for the other workers having to staff nights and weekends, leaving daytime hours also needing help.
Many parents now a days don't want their teenagers to work. I'm not sure when this started happening, but the vast majority of my friends with kids in their teens are not expecting them to work during the school year.

[hunter]

24. Work damages Grade Point Averages which are all-important these days.

In high school and college I was always feeling the squeeze between homework and work. I once flunked organic chemistry because accepting extra hours as a furniture mover was easier than studying and in those days it paid well too.

These days it's impossible to cover the costs of college with a part time job and graduate without loans as I did.

My own children worked in college because my wife and I still had some notion it was good for them. But they didn't graduate without debt.

They didn't work in high school, other than a few summer jobs and high school mandated volunteer jobs, and were straight A advanced placement students. They might not have been straight A students if they's had more work or there'd been any expectation of them helping out with the household expenses. Their GPA, SATs, and unpaid volunteer work got them into top-tier colleges and universities with small scholarships. Their college degrees got them well paying jobs.

Personally I think that's a bad system. College and trade schools should be free. Teenagers shouldn't have to jeopardize their educational goals (realistic or not...) by working. There's no way to tell if the C-average high school student with a near full time job at the local fast food place isn't someday going to be the next Einstein or master diesel mechanic at the local shipyard. Educational opportunities should always be open.

[mcar]

26. My son applied for jobs all over the place

when he was in HS and community college. All the places had "help wanted" signs up. Friends' kids experienced this too.

They couldn't get jobs. Why? Because they needed flexible schedules - they were involved in band and other extracurriculars. The places would rather, it seems, do without employees than offer flexible scheduling.

Around here, in Florida, Publix has no problem attracting employees, including high school students and retirees. Why? Because they have flexible schedules.

[Mariana]

29. "I'm not sure when this started happening..."

I'm sure Covid caused a lot of parents to prefer that their kids stay home rather than go out and work among crazy and potentially violent anti-maskers and now, anti-vaxxers. My own daughter (adult, but she looks like a teenager) was physically assaulted during one of her shifts at the supermarket where she worked. If she had been in high school when that happened, I would have told her to quit.

ETA, she wasn't injured, but she could have been.

[Greybnk48]

23. My daughter works from our home,

and zooms each day with people (Docs) from around the world. She loves it! I don't think she will ever quit this job unless she is forced too. She doesn't have to drive, buy clothes, etc.

She had a meeting this am at 5:30 with people from all over: Spain, Romania, and India. She did not have to get up at 4:30 and shower, get dressed and drive somewhere. She wasn't on camera this a.m., so no make-up or nice top required. She makes 65k+ a year with no expenses to speak of.

[mcar]

25. The unemployment rate is 4.6%

All of my patients who are in management tell me that they can’t get anyone to work in decent reasonably high paying quality jobs which used to be coveted.

What are the jobs? I suspect your patients are not being completely honest with you.

Job seekers have choices. I doubt they are deliberately not taking these jobs because they want to stay on unemployment. Also, IIRC, one must be actively seeking work to stay on unemployment and it doesn't last forever.

In Florida, it's 12 weeks and a maximum of $250/week. People can't live on that.

[Mariana]

28. The unemployment rate is pretty low, 4.6%

https://www.bls.gov/news.release/pdf/empsit.pdf

How does that translate into "I personally think this is bad decision making on the part of what I suppose are millions of people"? Why do you assume that these particular jobs are better than the jobs most workers already have?.

[llmart]

31. My economics professors...

always taught that an unemployment rate between 4 and 5% is considered full employment.

So, 4.6% can be considered full employment.

I think the GOP and media want to play this up to find anything they can to pin on Democrats.

[phylny]

32. I wonder how many people had two or three part-time jobs

before the pandemic and now have one full-time job making about the same money.

[dalton99a]

33. It's like that pretty much everywhere

Good thread

[Vinca]

34. I've been puzzled by this, too. I was talking to an acquaintance the other day who told me she'd

been ill the day before because she was so tired working 13 hour shifts at her job. She said there were plenty of jobs available and no takers. When I go to the grocery store - which I understand pays pretty decent wages - there are signs all over the parking lot and store advertising for help. The hardware store across the street can't find help either and assorted businesses along the main drag have signs out. At the same time, the mostly young people panhandling at the entrance to the grocery store parking lot are still there. I don't get it.

[Mariana]

35. How much exactly is the "pretty decent wage"

the grocery store pays to new employees with no experience? I don't mean the number on the "Pays up to $X per hour" sign. What do they actually offer new hires?

[Vinca]

36. I don't know, but the current minimum wage in the state is $11.75, going up in Jan.

[Mariana]

38. You also don't know if those young people applied and were rejected. nt.

[Vinca]

40. Well, that's another matter. I know the grocery store doesn't have the highest

of standards because I recognized one fellow who works there as a person with a rather long criminal record. (Source: me. I was a police officer for a few years back in the 80's. I'm very happy this guy turned his life around.) And the woman I was talking with who had been working 13 hour shifts told me that store has no drug testing of employees (she used to work there). As for the hardware store, the manager told me once they wouldn't hire one of the panhandlers because he had been kicked out of the store for shoplifting. There are so many job openings right now in our area I find it hard to believe anyone can't find a job doing something. I know I've worked a number of really lousy jobs over the course of my lifetime. Of course, maybe they're holding out for CEO of Apple or something.

[Elessar Zappa]

39. The businesses need to offer higher wages and better benefits.

Businesses aren’t entitled to employees.