I am an American Veteran. My fellow Americans, you need to get out of rural areas

[maxrandb]

While I appreciate the message that "Dems need to talk to rural America", and I'm thankful that, on rare occasions, a State with more cows than people will send a Democrat to the Senate, I'm tired of this mythical "Dems need to reach out to rural America" bullshit.

I want to say "Fuck" a thousand times, because I'm about fed up to my latte drinking ass with this fucking "Dems need to talk to rural Murika" bullshit.

Alll this fucking country has been doing, EVEN 200 years before it was a country, has been talking to and catering to these white rural areas .

We can't even get a fucking Post Office in Columbus Ohio named without first considering how it impacts rural America!

I would not be so fucking pissed about this, if just ONCE since the creation of this country, ANYONE had suggested that "rural America needs to talk to urban America ...JUST ONCE!

Maybe rural America should visit some inner city schools, with their delapidated buildings, broken desks, faulty electrical systems, broken plumbing and broken windows.

Maybe rural America should come over and share a few pitchers of water with a Flint Michigan Family.

Maybe rural America should visit some poverty stricken areas of the city and, when they ask why people live there, they can find out that for 400 years, Banks and Real Estate Agents have "redlined" them into those areas and told them this is the ONLY place they were welcome.

Maybe rural America can visit an area of 20,000 that doesn't have access to fresh produce and groceries within 10 miles. Not by choice because they want to "live out in the country", but because the stores are all in the "good areas" of town.

Maybe rural America should sit down with that waitress serving $60 Steaks for 12 hours a day for minimum wage, who then has to drive an UBER for 4 more hours so she can afford her 400 Square Foot Walk-up and childcare for her kid.

Maybe the problem ISN'T that "Dems aren't talking to rural America". Maybe the problem is rural America doesn't give one fuck about anything but rural America .

Why is this always only a one-way street?

Why do I see thousands of these "Dems need to reach out to rural America" stories, but never even one "Retrumplicans need to reach out to urban America" stories?

Why is urban America expected to "understand" and "empathize" with rural America, but that expectation is NEVER reversed?

Is rural America the only ones that have a story to tell?

Are they ever asked to "understand" where 65% of Americans live?

Do we ever go to the corn farmer and ask him, or her, to understand what the Taco Truck owner in Los Angeles, or the single mom in Atlanta has to deal with?

Of course not.

Why would rural America ever give a shit about urban America when they're NEVER asked to?

Call me when Chuck Todd shows up to talk to voters in Pittsburgh instead of fucking Beaver County, PA.

[SallyHemmings]

1. You pretty much summed it up!

[jimfields33]

2. Ok. Point taken but,

If not for the Montana senator, we’d be in the minority. We used to have democratic senators in rural staes like iowa and others. I think some just want us to get as many seats in the senate as possible. It was nice when we had 59 or even 60 for a short time.

[Scrivener7]

5. I think, though, that rather than "What do the diner denizens think?" our question should be

"what does the math say?" Where have we lost by narrow margins? Remember, we lost by 70,000 votes divided among 3 states in 2016. Where is there a county in those areas that can be turned? What will it take to turn just that county and not alienate the existing Democrats and turn the state blue? You can make a splash in a county with relatively less money than you can among "rural voters" as a whole.

We certainly have the capability of looking at the data this way, and responding to the voters this way. But we don't seem to be doing it.

[certainot]

199. the math says at $1000/hr, RW radio is worth... about $5B/yr FREE (x15hrs/day x 1200 stations)

or $90M/ week! break that down into the counties and states where, unlike fox, those locally coordinated radio stations dominate.

without that, how many elections would the dumbfuck racist asshole sex on the wrong brain dittoheads be even close?

the way you destroy republicans in 2022 is point out, for instance, that mich state and university of mich are supporting/endorsing the NRA "guns don't kill people" bullshit from 18 fucking x-limbaugh stations in michigan by broadcasting sports on them (MICHIGAN 19 Michigan St. 11, Michigan 7, Western Michigan 1). what about the global warming and COVID denial in florida supported by 5 universities that broadcast on 20 RW stations (FLORIDA 20 Florida 10, Florida St. 4 Miami 2, South Florida 2, Central Florida 2)? or georgia where 14 x-limbaugh stations will spend every day till the election attacking stacy abrams (GEORGIA 14 Georgia 7, Georgia Tech 5, Georgia Southern 2)?

when the 87 universities start having discussions about supporting 260 major rw stations all over the country (all the schools, pro teams actually support many more than that), the ad industry will have to break up the monopoly or lose billions in radio advertising. clear channel/iheart and sinclair media empires will fall apart as sellers of sex on the wrong brain racist fascist republican bulllshit

there will be no way for republicans to get the house or senate in 2022 if democrats and progressives wake up and stop ignoring the giant pile of shit under the living room throw rug

it's the radio. it's not the "economy stupid" - dumbasses like carville and many of the high end analysts live in cities and have been steering the dem party wrong.

limbaugh killed more than hitler and stalin when you add up the global warming delay he created, the ironic "smoking doesn't cause cancer, the deregulation, the gun reforrm he stopped, and the afghan and iraq wars that the party he was intellectual and moral leader of for 30 years caused, before he died of lung cancer.....

[Scrivener7]

203. The radio is a problem, and I think it needs to be addressed, but that would take time.

As you say, it has been going on for 30 years and somehow we haven't noticed this. And frankly, I don't think we have the time or will or money dedicated to do that within the next year or three. Though your idea on how to break up the monopoly is MUCH more workable than most people's reaction, which is to try and make a liberal radio outlet that people will listen to. I think that boat has sailed for the time being.

But social media can reach those people effectively too. Q was entirely a product of social media. Social media is cheaper, it pinpoints the likely voter more easily and makes it easier to tailor the message to that pinpointed voter.

I agree with you about radio, but we need to get on this immediately. We aren't going to get our acts together to counteract rural radio in time to make a difference. But we can make a difference with social media.

I have read that 80% of misinformation about Covid originated with 78 posters.

Let's begin by getting ourselves 78 posters and training them how to do that shit. Only do it to spread the truth and bring people to vote for their own interests.

[certainot]

207. i think offense aimed at rw radio could have quick results. it would get media attn right away

and advertisers would light a fire under the ad industry

much of the social media component is based on established rw radio lies, such as q-anon and the attacks on clinton and now on biden and other dems in congress an senate.

add in the threat of artificial intelligence being used to digitize and analyze it on large scale, as prototyped at MIT and the UN

all it would take is a well known activist or politician or progressive group to announce it

[HariSeldon]

227. I think a "baited trap" campaign might be needed

We need an army of Democratic communicators to go "undercover", building a network of messages that make sneering references like "How dumb do they think we are?" or "Here those Democrats go again!" and linking to cogent, well reasoned, well written pieces. Use the "outrage hook" right-wing media has developed to lure the so-called "independents" to realize the Democratic position is not as radical as the right wing noise machine make us out. It also dilutes the right wing angst machine when the linked material isn't incendiary.

[Progressive Jones]

232. Great Idea !!! nt

[Scrivener7]

234. Definitely. This, though, should just be one prong of a multi-pronged effort.

[Scrivener7]

3. Kicking this one hard!

[stopdiggin]

4. righteous rant.

only one problem - Senate, electoral college, gerrymander ...

Ignoring the 'rurals' comes with a price tag.

[Freddie]

14. They have far more power than they should

It’s an unfortunate fact we have to deal with. We need systematic change so everyone gets an equal voice but it’s not going to happen in my lifetime.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

17. Point of rant is that they AREN'T ignored. Rather, they ignore urban conditions

To the extent they are aware of urban conditions, they often call them hellholes that Democrat(ic) control has run into the ground. Which of course is nonsense, except to the extent that control has catered to whites and rich areas and industrial sectors. Hmmm, white, like them. ....

[RobinA]

82. Yes, They Do Ignore

urban conditions. But that's not the problem. The problem is they ignore their own conditions. Or maybe it's better to say they misunderstand the causes of their own problems. Which causes them to hitch their wagons to false prophets like that well known Champion of the Common Man, Donald Trump. Who tells them they their problems are Mexican rapists. Which, even if they did exist, is not their problem.

[Celerity]

24. MUCH to the detriment of the nation and the world.

Great short summary.

[appalachiablue]

168. STATES: The GOP Knows They Matter: 'Laboratories of Autocracy' David Pepper- Alec Kochs Gerrymanders

- The Wealthy Are Creating Labs of Autocracy, Conversations With Great Minds, David Pepper. Nov. 30, 2021.

Democracy has a big problem isn't in Congress... it is in YOUR state capitol. David Pepper joins Thom Hartmann to discuss the laboratories of Autocracy the rich and the GOP are creating in your state capitol.

David Pepper is a lawyer, writer, political activist, former elected official, and adjunct professor-University of Cincinnati College of Law / served as Chairman of the Ohio Democratic Party between 2015 and 2021.

His new book Labs Of Autocracy.

[Maeve]

6. I came from rural America

And I have to go there once or twice a week and I am also sick of being told to listen to them.

I may get blasted for saying this, but for generations the "best and brightest" of rural America have been told to go to the cities and make a better living than we could have down home. Yes, there are good, smart, decent people back there, but I meet a helluva lot more yahoos and resentful idjits.

[FoxNewsSucks]

70. same here

And you couldn't be more right.

[catrose]

7. Yes

[BlueJac]

8. k&R

[Deminpenn]

9. Being a resident

of Beaver County, while there is still a good bit of agriculture, it's not all rural. What the county is, is overwhelmingly old, white, church-going and conservative.

[Hotler]

10. Kicking nt

[Biophilic]

11. Yes!! You just said what I've been feeling for a while, but wasn't able to articulate.

Why is it always a one way street?

[LiberalFighter]

12. Considering how rural America likes to shop and vacation in the bigger cities.

[Aviation Pro]

20. I think you'll find

That most rural Americants don't venture beyond the border of their local Walmart.

[LiberalFighter]

46. I disagree.

Many in the rural areas here come to our city for shopping and the attractions.

[FoxNewsSucks]

77. There are some

Who shop and eat, mainly at the chains. Few go to downtowns or the really great unique parts of cities.

For every one of them, I guarantee there are hundreds back home who will never go to a city, or go further than the suburban outskirts.

[DBoon]

136. Many rural americans despise cities

and are afraid to visit one because they are so sure they will get mugged or something.

They take pride in never having been to a major urban center as though this was some sort of purity test.

[stopdiggin]

144. Nope. Going to have to disagree.

'Bout the only thing bringing Billy Bob into the city - is some variety of professional sports event, or maybe the high school playoffs. Ask him the last time he's been to a museum or a production - and get a blank stare. And there are plenty of Targets and J.C.Pennys within driving range, and his comfort zone.

[mountain grammy]

13. As an old woman living in red, rural America

I agree with everything you said here.

[secondwind]

15. You sure changed the conversation!!! Good for you!!!

And it was right under our noses!

[dalton99a]

16. But urban people are Antifa communists

[johnthewoodworker]

18. I'm a 'libtard', socialist from rural Wisconsin. This is s Republican area. Let me inform you that

Republicans are some of the dumbest shits in the world. You can't teach Republican morons ethics.

[Aviation Pro]

19. Because urban is just another dog whistle

For POC, which to the lily-white enablers of the battle beard terrorists means, "others."

(Never mind that urban America supports the welfare kings and queens in the heartless lands).

[GusBob]

21. Thank you for your service

Speaking of which, many rural folks served too. Their flags and emblems are prominent up here on the prairies. Does that sound like anyone who doesn’t care about America?

Now they ranch and farm. What did you have for breakfast? Growing up the bumper sticker out in the country was “ don’t complain about farmers with your mouth full”

In the other thread you compared rural Americans, your fellow citizens, many of them Veterans, to Nazis, your word. To use one of Bullocks words that’s pretty judgmental.

Thank you for proving his points. We hate and despise things we can’t understand

[maxrandb]

92. You are missing my point

Of course there are good and decent people in rural America, but you know what?

There are good and decent people in urban America too.

No one is suggesting that Retrumplicans get off their asses and try to "reach out" and "understand" cities where they lose by 70-80% of the vote.

The media, and in the case of Bullock, some Democrats, are quick to say;" let's see what the 'heartland' thinks and go talk to counties that voted 80% for Donnie Dipshit". Never once have I seen a "moderate" Retrumplican chastise his party for not reaching out to the people in downtown Chicago.

The media has had more fucking Focus Groups of Donnie Dipshit voters in Beaver County, PA than there are cows in Montana.

Not once have they shown up to talk to Democratic voters in Pittsburgh.

BTW - it's not hard. Beaver CO PA and Pittsburgh are less than 20 minutes from each other by car.

[scarletlib]

119. Two points

First I live in urban area. Doesn’t mean I don’t respect farmers and what the provide for our country.
Second I resent the implication that only rural American are the real Americans. I love my country and am just as American as anyone in rural areas.

[maxrandb]

128. OK, so you do get my point nt

[Maggiemayhem]

204. Boy, you are right about Pittsburgh

City proper is liberal but you go outside of the city and it is Trump heavy. I was just sent an article about the many hospitals filling up with the rural antivaxxers and not room for the vaccinated with non Covid ailments. The dumbest idea ever..kill your voting base morons.

[maxrandb]

205. How many rural hospitals and clinics would have gone bankrupt and closed without the ACA?

I guess this kind of "reaching out" is bad.

In rural America, we must have the "freedumb" to die. Those rural hospitals are just fucking with God's plan.

[we can do it]

106. Compared to Nazis.....if the shoe fits, wear it.

[GusBob]

110. uncalled for

unhelpful,
inaccurate,
uneducated,
and elitist reply

Do you mean me personally? Dude everyone out here wears boots, shoes are for city folks

[treestar]

112. Maybe extreme

But clearly there is racism in their views and In a bad attitude towards urban areas.

[treestar]

109. That's dumb. They get paid for their

Product line anyone else. We don’t owe them more than the price of what they grow. Yet they get even more than that. We give them subsidies.

[GusBob]

114. Their production costs and profits fluctuate based on many things

Fuel costs, weather. Trumps tariffs

[Progressive Jones]

167. The price of doing business. nt

[Progressive Jones]

166. Good points, but without the Chicago Mercantile Exchange, and the Urban dwellers who work there,

very little of what farmers and ranchers produce goes anywhere.

[haele]

22. Rural America would not exist nowadays without Urban America.

Simple Economics. It sounds harsh and elitist, but that fact is proven time and again. It has to do with the Economy of Self-sufficiency.

There is no frontier left for people to just set up large enough enclaves away from the rest of the world that can support the amount of people it takes to be self-sufficient as Americans understand it.

Even "culturally isolated" groups like the Amish need to trade goods with the outside world for items needed for survival that they can't make (smelting ore into metal, producing rubber), or can make enough of to keep their community safe and comfortable throughout the seasons.

Everything a rural citizen gets from "the outside" required a large urban population and those "out of touch with real folks elite organizations" (finance, education, science, regulatory) to support making and getting that product to them along with parts to maintain it and dispose of it once it's no longer useful.

Rural America needs Urban America to succeed just a bit more than Urban America needs Rural America to succeed. A sad truth but there's a whole lot of ghost towns and ruins of farms and ranches out there to prove my point.
Once there was no need for the product or service that small town or area could provide, it disappears as quickly as it was set up, if the larger, outer-world forces don't pool their resources to provide those rural areas with, say, new manufacturing and services needed by urban folks and re-training to support those new business opportunities.
Cities can always reinvent themselves, even as they might fade in importance when one economic base dries up or disappears. Very few rural areas can.

Haele

[GusBob]

42. Now we are going after the Amish? too easy

They are pacifists

But in the spirit of the OP:
Fuck the Amish!
Fuck the Hutterites
Fuck the Mennonites fuck them all with their religious freedoms
while we are at it:
Fuck rural Native Americans
Fuck rural Hispanic Americans
Fuck rural African Americans
Fuck the 25% of retired military veterans that choose to live in rural America

This is too easy, man

[haele]

131. Did I say that?

I'm only pointing out that Rural America has a symbiotic economic relationship with Urban America, whether they like to admit it or not.
And that we no longer live in a solely agrarian society where Jefferson an the like can pretend that America can survive and thrive by the Gentleman Farmer -when even back in the 1780's, farmers and frontier settlers needed the city slickers to get their tools and their customers.
Hell, even the indigenous tribes had massive city complexes to house the artisans and craftsmen to make the good tools necessary for a thriving civilization before the European diseases and conquests wiped out approximately 90% of the population by the 1600's.

My point is, even as we need to address rural American concerns, we can't pretend they're the only Americans that really matter. We can't put them up ahead of everyone else because, what? Corporate Farmers that killed family farms 50 years ago? Technology and Global Venture Capitalism that had decimated rural resource extraction jobs 30 years ago?
Grifter politicians, media, and religious leaders that preyed on strong rural traditions while cutting down educational and economic opportunities so rural America turned their backs on progressive society to dig themselves deeper in an economic hole over the past 50 years?

A few pocketbooks got significantly richer while the majority of Rural America Social Influencers slapped down the hands of those trying to help them and other rural Americans, because, as you say:
"Fuck those uppity city elitists trying to help us survive in the 21st Century - they can shove their education and help where the sun don't shine...'

Pride is a nasty weapon to hit oneself in the face with.

So, is pandering to butt-hurt snowflakes melting because of climate change the answer, or is treating people like grown-ups the answer?

After all, we're all on it together. Or we turn into a failed state with a bunch of little starving Sovereign (ha!) fiefdoms run by Country Club autocrats.

Haele

[inthewind21]

137. Why so hostile

It's a discussion. Clearly one you are not willing to even have. Which proves all the points of the original post.

[Wednesdays]

164. Now, THAT is the best-built straw man I've ever seen!

Bravo.

[treestar]

111. +1

Sick of the argument that we owe them because food. They could hardly starve us without starving themselves.

[Tommymac]

176. The Ghost towns and ruins are largely due to Corporate takeover of farming and ranching.

There are not many independent farmers left in this country.

Take a drive around North Western Iowa ... it looks like every farm building, every ranch house are the same for hundreds of square miles down to the color of the paint and landscape design... all owned by 'Co-ops', i.e. Corporate owned farms. Looks like the country of the Pod People. The people working them are basically sharecroppers.

It was kinda creepy dring there, I felt like I was in what I imagined to be 20th century Communist Russia collective farm country.

In between you will see a few small independent farms, but they are more impoverished and a lot are simply abandoned.

It's the same in the ranching country of the Dakotas.

Welcome to the 21st Century, Rural America. Corporate controlled and ripe for authoritarians to plunder.

[radius777]

216. +1. Districts Hillary/Biden carried account for 70% of GDP.

Without the metro (urban and suburban) areas there would be little economic activity or consumers to even buy the things rurals produce. And metros can import alot of that stuff from other countries (Canada, South America) if necessary.

[LiberalLoner]

23. Also kicking this one hard! 👍👏

[twodogsbarking]

25. I find most of your comment rather weird.

[Celerity]

32. I do not, I find it mostly spot on.

[twodogsbarking]

34. I care about everyone; almost.

[Gore1FL]

158. The OP wishes people would care about the majority urban dwellers from time to time. nt

[twodogsbarking]

172. I think that was made more than clear.

Guess I am not part of the club.

[Gore1FL]

190. That directly contradicts your last post.

Unless while you "care for pretty much everybody," you simultaneously don't think the urban set falls into the "pretty much everybody" category.

[twodogsbarking]

202. You are quoting something I didn't write.

The Club, DU.

[Gore1FL]

206. It is directly quoted from the title of your post I was replying to a couple posts above.

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=16121720

twodogsbarking (2,558 posts)

34. I care about everyone; almost.

[twodogsbarking]

208. I didn't write what you quoted.

The "almost" actually refers to people who choose to disparage others
because of where they live. I don't really care for those people.
If you are one of them then..........

[Gore1FL]

209. In any event, your posts logically contradict.

The OP is stating that rural are looked to at the expense of the otherwise ignored urban citizenry. You disagree with that OP, apparently, but in a way where you disparage urban voters.

I can't help you with that internal conflict, but I suspect it is more a misread of the OP.

[twodogsbarking]

211. You keep stating things that I did not write. I can't help you with that.

[Gore1FL]

212. Let's do some direct quotes:

"I care about everyone; almost."
https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=16121720

To which I said:
"The OP wishes people would care about the majority urban dwellers from time to time"

You then stated:
"I think that was made more than clear."
"Guess I am not part of the club"

Now let's apply logic to the words used.

You disagree with the sentiment "The OP wishes people would care about the majority urban dwellers from time to time"
But you state "I care about everyone; almost."

Ergo those excluded from those that you "care about everyone" would be the majority of urban voters.


What did I misquote? And why do you believe Urban voters should be ignored?

[twodogsbarking]

213. Have a nice day.

[Gore1FL]

214. You too!

I guess I am having as hard a time understanding you as you have in regards to the OP.

It's probably best to end my attempt to understand your point.

[IronLionZion]

26. Rural America has a lot of COVID and drugs and crime

but they like to pretend those are urban problems. Meth and opioids are very rural. Antivax antimask covidiots are more influential in rural areas.

Before COVID, people have been moving to cities for decades. I grew up in rural Appalachia and peaced out as soon as I turned 18. I'm definitely a city mouse.

[geardaddy]

86. Bingo!

[treestar]

113. It will get worse too

A tiny population spread out will control the millions.

[Celerity]

27. A huge pet peeve of mine is the rural, very white Midwest being called 'The Heartland'

As if that area and people are the desirable American archetypes.

[FoxNewsSucks]

75. I travel the rural Midwest regularly

And I can assure you they definitely are not.

Decent open-minded people are the exception, not the rule.

[dalton99a]

130. But they're the friendliest people!

When they're not talking behind your backs and pulling the lever for racists and fascists

[uponit7771]

228. +1

[marmar]

28. A-f**king-men

[Karma13612]

29. Telling it like it is! Eom

[Kaleva]

30. In MI, 75% of the people who voted for TFG live in urban or mostly urban counties.

More people in Wayne county (Detroit) voted for TFG then in all of Upper Michigan and much of northern lower Michigan combined.

[IronLionZion]

39. There are more people of all types in urban counties

Biden won 68% of the votes in Wayne county. Suburbs everywhere are often swing votes.

https://www.clickondetroit.com/decision-2020/2020/11/09/how-detroits-wayne-county-suburbs-voted-in-2020-presidential-election/#//

[Kaleva]

55. 43% of the vote TFG got in MI came from counties Biden won

I'd have to look at WI and PA but my guess is that TFG would have lost in 2016 without the urban vote he got in MI WI and PA

[progressoid]

31. Two Words: Electoral College

[Progressive Jones]

169. Four words: Eliminate The Electoral College.

[progressoid]

188. Four more words: Good luck with that.

[Progressive Jones]

195. I get it, but Never Say Die. nt

[msfiddlestix]

33. ✔️ ✔️ ✔️ ✔️ ✔️

[Fiendish Thingy]

35. The Electoral College is the only reason anybody pays attention to rural America.

If there were no Electoral College, rural America would be completely ignored in national politics.

[Kaleva]

57. It's the urban TFG voters in battleground state that's the problem

Winning rural states with few EC votes won't cut it

[ThoughtCriminal]

175. They wouldn't be ignored

Just given attention proportional to their actual population.

And they would still be over-represented in the Senate and gerrymandered Congressional Districts and state legislatures.

[Zen Democrat]

36. On the money. Beautiful post.

[chowder66]

37. Many people have left and continue to leave Rural America to go live in Urban America.

This has been going on forever.

[GusBob]

47. Interesting

Since the OP mentioned veteran status i had to look things up

20% of US population is considered rural
44% of military recruits are from rural america
25% of RETIRED military veterans live in rural areas

In short, many sign up and serve, and a significant number return to the country.

How ya gonna keep them down on the farm when they seen the slums of Baghdad I reckon

[Mersky]

126. There may be disproportionate recruitment from rural areas, but those numbers are dubious

In your effort to make sure recruitment from rural areas isn’t taken for granted, perhaps accidentally, you slight all service members who come from primarily poor backgrounds regardless of population density.


Would seem it’s more like 20% are recruited from the 16-17% living in rural areas: https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2011/08/17/139699631/white-house-overstates-rural-role-in-military (yeah, it’s an old source, but so is that 44% assumption).

Personally, I think there’s too much resentment flung between city and country dwellers these days. The truth is the interdependence is enormous, and I see nothing wrong in asking rural folks to challenge their assumptions about cities. Especially this as the Fox Views crowd has been told cities are the roots of all their problems over and over again.

Recently-ish when someone said they were afraid of getting shot while shopping in central Houston, and I had to lol. Was like, I was there last week! I’m fine. Now, how’s the new propane tank working out? (old one’s regulator failed during the Texas grid disaster, you see).

[totodeinhere]

163. Many people are leaving the urban centers of California.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/california-leaving-state-population-declines-first-time-n1266740

[chowder66]

180. But some of those originally came into California from rural areas.

A lot of young people move to the cities, some move back, some move around.

[womanofthehills]

187. But, many people are moving to rural areas when they retire

I live in a rural area of NM and many retired liberals now live here. They move here for the beautiful scenery, clean air, and a simpler way of living. I have good friends here who are both Dems and Republicans. And, our half and half town actually elected a Dem mayor.

[chowder66]

189. Yes. People move to and from rural areas.

[Karma13612]

38. We need rural America

To eat.

But, that shouldn’t hold us hostage when it comes to much needed legislation that will help ALL of the middle-class.

[GusBob]

48. Clearly Rural Americans are despised here

We should start a boycott of their products!

It wouldn't be that hard would it?

[azureblue]

161. Clearly

You are projecting your own fantasies on people and a subject you know nothing about.

[albacore]

49. Bill Gates owns the most farmland of any "farmer" in the US. nt

[Karma13612]

121. Seriously??

Gawd.. I had no idea…

Sigh….

[albacore]

125. Yup...

https://www.vox.com/recode/22528659/bill-gates-largest-farmland-owner-cascade-investments

[Karma13612]

170. Jeebus

[Operaweeble]

40. Bravo, spot on!

[modrepub]

41. We've Always Self Segregated

All of us tend to hang out and congregate with people who "share our concerns" or have a some type of common interests. Fox news (and MSNBC for that matter) don't define their audience, it's the other way around. They reflect the common interests of their audience. Which translates to ratings, which translates to add revenue, which reenforces the cycle. As much as I despise TFG, I know he's only tapped into a group consciousness that existed well before he decided to run for POTUS.

And you have to keep in mind, the folks who you despise or disagree with have chosen to congregate together because of their common interests. The differences have defined them, they heartedly congregate with the similar and despise the different. They're happy with their choice and the more you try to reconcile with them, the more they'll emphasize or hold onto what they think defines them (hell they'll invent characteristics if they want to just to enhance the differences or similarities between their group and the others).

I'm happy to be separated from them. Don't really need them. Follow the Satanic Principles; don't f-ck with me and I won't f-ck with you. And if you do f-ck with me, I'm justified in f-cking with you, times 10.

On that note, we need to insulate ourselves from the other. First step is to make the rurals live within their means. Most tax revenue is based on some type of economic activity. Between the suburban, urban and rural, economic activity probably ranks highest in the suburban, than urban and finally rural. Up to now the rurals have been able to tap into the suburban for political support, which allows them to divert money to the rurals.

Some real analytics would really be useful to demonstrate just how much urban and suburban area generated tax revenue goes to rural areas. That of course leads to higher local taxes to make up for the transfers of other tax revenue from urban and suburban areas.

[Jimbo S]

66. Book: "The Politics of Resentment"

Addressed your inquiry. The hypothesis in the book was the opposite: tax revenues flows from rural to urban (social programs, etc.). Not necessarily a scientific study, but the conclusion was give/receive in all areas were neutral.

[modrepub]

105. A Political Science Person

put that together.

Thought exercise: Who generates more state income tax revenue in PA. All the workers in the Comcast 1 building in Philadelphia (between 5-10k workers) or the entire population of Cameron County (2020 Census 4,547 people)? Without looking, I would estimate Cameron County's worker participation is somewhere near 70%. I'd also add that SS income is not taxed for PA income taxes.

It's real easy to figure out state contributions to revenue. Federal is a bit more difficult given our complicated Federal Tax system. But on a gross GDP level, suburban and urban counties out produce most rural. Who produces more economically measured output, a software engineer in Silicon Valley or an average dairy farmer in PA?

Anyone with some type of data analytics background can back numbers out but you'll never hear about it because the MSM and political folks are happy with the status quo.

[PoliWrangler]

43. K&R nt

[Elessar Zappa]

44. Excellent post.

I’m sick of the media putting rural Americans on a pedestal. They’re no better or worse than suburban and urban citizens.

[happy feet]

45. Yes, yes and yes!

I also have never heard them interview those who voted for Biden who won the election.

[Amishman]

50. except they do go into cities

Rural Democrat here, you can't live in a rural area and not have to go into a city periodically for goods or services that are not available in the middle of nowhere. Try finding a good patent lawyer, cutting edge cancer center, coffee bean importer, etc etc out in farm country.

rural Americans do end up going into cities - and most just don't like what they see. Full disclosure, i can't stand cities - I find them to be ugly, smelly, loud, and crowded. Its really hard to get past that repulsiveness.

[sagetea]

51. I live in a rural

and red state and agree with you 100%. People here are idiots. Most have never been outside the county let alone the state.

sage

[Trust_Reality]

151. My perception is that many or most rural (white) folks are racists. And...

that many or most have never even met a person of color, never talked to such a person, especially black.

You can solve almost all of the world's problems from the seat of a tractor in the middle of a corn field in Iowa - listening to radical right wing radio, of course.

[certainot]

197. yep, it's the radio. limbaugh killed more than hitler and stalin when you add up

the global warming delay he created, the ironic "smoking doesn't cause cancer, the deregulation, the gun reforrm he stopped, and the afghan and iraq wars that the party he was intellectual and moral leader of for 30 years caused, before he died of lung cancer.....

not to mention all the racism he made possible by helping people rationalize blaming many of their problems on brown people

[hay rick]

52. K&R

And they are overprivileged at the ballot box.

[Wounded Bear]

53. Righteous rant, K & R...nt

[scarletlib]

54. My feelings exactly, but you say it so much better than me.

[HAB911]

56. It boils down to a supremacist attitude

they feel their life(style) is better and most correct, everyone else is inferior

[tiredtoo]

58. Rural America Knows about this

They choose to ignore it or the latest is to call it fake news.

[Evolve Dammit]

59. excellent point

[Dyedinthewoolliberal]

60. You got it.

Rural is code word for white.

[CrispyQ]

61. Righteous rant & I agree completely.

This:

Maybe the problem ISN'T that "Dems aren't talking to rural America". Maybe the problem is rural America doesn't give one fuck about anything but rural America .

I'm sick of their attitude that only they are real Americans & the rest of us are not. ~insert flip-the-bird emoji here.

IMO, our country would benefit from a student exchange program much like the ones where international students exchange places with US students, only this would be a rural/urban exchange.

[Jimbo S]

68. Had an Assemblyman once tweet

"nice to drive through the real America." while driving back to his rural district. Was immediately called out for it.

A couple of years ago, can't find a link to the article.

[Bear Creek]

62. Rual Ohio

Is paying for your highways in Columbus while our roads needs to be replaced. Put up new electronic signs to mark the lanes while our roads have one of the lanes washed out.

[haele]

134. Really? I'm thinking all working people, rural and urban

And suburban, too, are paying for the highways.
Especially commuters, on the road, buying gas, paying income taxes, local taxes with bonds attached, gas taxes and auto fees, for the right to spend 2 to 3 hours a day to get to work.
Heck, even the wealthy pay for highways. Working Rural folks don't pay any more on government services (like roads, hospitals, and schools) than working Urban folks do.

And if any particular constituency (rural, suburban, or urban) want local improvements, they vote on bonds just like every other constituency in the state does. It's just that the taxpayer base in rural areas is smaller than in urban areas, which causes issues if you've got TeaParty or Libertarian asshole types running your local district or county. (Lower taxes - fewer services... can't get past that.)

Haele

[stopdiggin]

149. is the highway spending allocated

disproportionate to population (and/or tax revenues?)

I find this is a common refrain among rural denizens (lack of services in their own community) - but if I'm not mistaken, it just doesn't hold up to real pencil and paper analysis. (disclosure - I do not live in OH, so I don't know what the facts on the ground are there)

[Hekate]

63. "Maybe rural America should come over and share a few pitchers of water with a Flint Michigan Family

“Why would rural America ever give a shit about urban America when they're NEVER asked to?”

This is the crux of your righteous rant, imo.

[world wide wally]

64. Rural America is already over represented in our government.

Simply put, an individual vote in Wyoming is worth a lot more than a vote in California or New York. This is where the problem lies. Unequal representation.

[thesquanderer]

65. Except that Dems need to appeal to rurals to GET THEIR VOTES, and that's the name of the game.

Telling rural folks to vote, not based on what's best for them, but based on what's best for others is going to be a tough sell. Yes, you can probably swing some voters, based on things like empathy/compassion and unity (that in the end, we're all in this together), but it's probably a more difficult way to swing a state than by appealing to their own specific interests.

[Bettie]

132. Those people who vote for things based on empathy, compassion, and unity

we're called Rural Democrats and we live here too.

But, no one wants to talk to us. The news wants the MAGATs, the right wing nutjobs, the bomb throwers who declare their hatred for everything.

But we live here too and we're working as hard as we can with few resources and virtually no support.

[BMW2020RT]

67. I have lived in and ridden motorcycles through countless small towns.

Last edited Tue Dec 7, 2021, 01:35 PM - Edit history (1)

My experience has been the idyllic vision of small town America is way nicer than the reality of actually living there. I was just riding through Alabama over the weekend and encountered, in 21st century America, unpaved highways. They have signs, but no asphalt. Just dirt and, if they are lucky, some gravel. Many small towns also appear to be just this side of an economic cataclysm. If one significant employer in that town folds much of the citizenry will too. I have chosen to rest my head in a medium-sized city. It is certainly not perfect, but access to stable employment for 35 years and now, as I enter retirement, access to medical services make up for city shortcomings.

[3catwoman3]

69. Points extremely well made.

Thank you.

[brewens]

71. I was just reading about the Farmers Alliance and Grange movement. Making money farming was almost

illegal in this country at one time. The Farmers Alliance pushed for the graduated income tax. The Granges at one time set up farm machinery manufacturing co-ops. I suppose that's Critical Farming Theory. Socialism played a big part in those areas doing well for over a century.

The farm machinery business didn't go so well, but the odds were stacked against them.

[Bluethroughu]

72. I live in rural white right America in a blue state

Sometimes it's exhausting repeating facts to these people, I haven't given up, but it does get old.

I'd like to say once in awhile they agree with you, but the next day it's right back to rightwing talking points over facts.

[Karma13612]

122. Yup, I live in a similar scenario....nt

[LoisB]

73. Hear, hear!! Bravo. Excellent.

[mrsadm]

74. The TRUTH!!!!!

[Crunchy Frog]

76. Unfortunately, rural America has more electoral power than urban America.

We need them more than they need us, if we want to continue to have any representation. It isn't fair, but it seems to be the situation.

[housecat]

89. Cows vote

[Crunchy Frog]

90. Pretty much.

[pandr32]

78. K & R

Rural Americans are considered the meat and potatos of this nation. For a couple of hundred years they have been the white male landowners. For the last several decades at least they are 'god fearing', NRA supporting, right-wing, 'lib'ral elites' hating, low information rural and small town folk who consider themselves and their way of lives diminishing--not from the powerful corporations that are threatening their livelihoods, but from "urban America" and 'illegals' (even though they need their labor).

[dianaredwing]

93. No statistics

But, the city can repurpose many high rises and other abandoned sites for hydro and other forms of agriculture. Those in the country cannot build their own tractors, at least not without parts manufactured elsewhere.

Granted, we can't grow huge fields of wheat or soybeans, etc. in cities, but I think you'll find most of those farms are owned by large conglomerates and not the 'heartland rurals' that the writer notes we are trying to communicate with.

ALL PEOPLE deserve consideration and none deserve more than others.

I love the country and the semi-clean air, but the older I get the harder it is to live such an isolated lifestyle and I personally don't have the financial ability to support others who want to.

[maxrandb]

215. Yes, it's kind of like the "hard-scrabble", "salt if the earth" manly, he-man coal miner

Last edited Wed Dec 8, 2021, 07:57 PM - Edit history (1)

There are approximately 42K Coal Miners nationwide

There are 3.5 million teachers.
There are 670K Accountants (CPA)
There are 180K Bus Drivers

BTW-there are 48K Taxi Drivers, not counting UBER or LYFT

How coal mining became the job we elevate over others as the barometer of policy is beyond me.

FYI-My grandfather worked the coal mines in Corning, OH. He was a great man who died at 64 from Black Lung. Some said it may have been the Lucky Strikes he chainsmoked most if his life, but, point is, I am not anti-miner.

[pandr32]

221. Yup

Certain "salt of the earth" types are subject to being wrapped up in star-spangled revisionism while other hard-working Americans are under appreciated--for sure.

[CrispyQ]

80. If we had a marketing department we could respond that repubs are out of touch with the common good.

And then show the many, many examples. Alas, our side doesn't seem to value marketing.

[dlk]

81. Well-said

[Kali]

83. I kind of like your twist on who should be listening to who

I don't like the ignorance and resentment and hatred of anybody though I certainly understand the politics of it all and I feel my own irritation and hatred and resentment at the right wing elements of our country. But like it or not, we all need each other. Rural people provide the services that allow you to enjoy your vacations and recreating out in the rural areas. Most of your food is grown in the rural areas while most of the people purchasing that food live in the urban areas. Likewise, arts and culture and things that we need to grow and enjoy intellectually come from urban areas, though not all of course. Lots of good writers hiding out in the hinterlands. We are interdependent then we should stop paying attention to the people who constantly foment disagreement and chaos. Turn off talk radio and 24-hour"news" television entertainment.

[inthewind21]

141. Most of that food

Is produced by corporate farms. And farmers period, rural family AND Corporate get subsidies from the rest of us. And their lord and Savior Trump fucked them even worse with his asinine trade BS and so now we are subsidizing that as well. So pardon me if I don't share the BS spewed that the rest of us should be grateful because that's were the food comes from. Yes, food the rest of us already paid for.

[Kali]

222. The consumer benefits from the subsidies too

Food prices are stabilized by those subsidies and if you ever think food is expensive now, you probably should give some thought to what would happen under an open free market with no controls or subsidies.

[geardaddy]

84. K and effing R!

[FoxNewsSucks]

85. Amen!!!

Best thing I've read in a long time

[dianaredwing]

87. AMEN

and I have lived in and loved areas of rural America. I do empathize with their problems, but they are not the ONLY problems and if you don't care equally about the poor kids living without enough food in inner city or the veterans on the streets of LA, then you don't care about AMERICANS. PERIOD.

Thanks for the post. Its the first one since I signed on that I will keep.

[llashram]

88. I feel you

[twodogsbarking]

91. Keep rural America uneducated and poor.

[NCjack]

140. They don't need any help -- the problem is that they are dragging us down.

[twodogsbarking]

173. I see.

[Catherine Vincent]

94. Hear hear!

[reACTIONary]

95. K&R

[totodeinhere]

96. The reason why people say that Dems need to reach out to rural America is because we want the Dems

to win elections. Your profanity is not going to change that fact.

[maxrandb]

98. For 40 + years

Dems have been doing that, and putting forth policies that would help rural America.

At some point, you become like the nice guy chasing after the girl that prefers Meth Heads.

[Ex Lurker]

103. What's your solution?

If Democrats pull back into their urban enclaves they become a permanent minority party. The system was set up to give rural Americans an outsized say in the political process. You may not like it but it's a fact and it's not going to change in any forseeable scenario. You can complain about it or you can try to work within the framework you find yourself in.

[maxrandb]

129. Out work them and out vote them

I would love to see stats of how many urban voters that don't show up to vote and mine those areas. At the same time, dems could invest heavily in rural areas that are reachable and out some ground troops to work. I'd avoid areas where Confederate Flags outnumber American Flags.

What we can't do is do what a lot of rural areas demand that we do...sacrifice our values.

[Mariana]

118. Which parts of the Democratic Party Platform do you think should be changed

to better appeal to rural America? Please be specific.

https://democrats.org/where-we-stand/party-platform/

[onecaliberal]

146. We've been doing that. What has it gotten us? We are on the brink of losing democracy AND

2/3 of the country is fucking insane.

[maxrandb]

97. I would also like to point out

that the titular head and flag bearer of the Retrumplican Party repeatedly and relentlessly described urban America as "shitholes like Somalia".

Please post the links to Op Eds from Retrumplican Senators lecturing their party to "reach out" and "talk" to urban voters.

I am pretty sure that all you will find is their ideas to "reach out" with federal troops and guns.

[Dr. Shepper]

99. I totally get the frustration

I grew up in a metro area with a larger population that the entire rural, red state in which I currently reside. Even my “liberal” small city (the biggest city in the state) is purple to pink.

The crux of it all is that we really do need each other.

Out here, though, there is so much poison from conservative entertainment and religion. I can honestly say I see NO WAY to win these rural folks over. I deal with them every day and can feel their vitriol.

Most of the brightest kids have moved away and we are left with high concentrations of people who actively hate someone like me (female, educated, sympathetic to the marginalized). If/when the fascists take over, my blue neighborhood will be set aflame - figuratively and, likely, literally.

[Liberal In Texas]

100. Cool...Your post here has become a topic of conversation on Thom Hartmann's show.

Good going.
(And I agree with your post.)

[bucolic_frolic]

101. Not sure if this is warning for liberals, or advice to the press

[Ex Lurker]

102. Hate on rural America all you want

but whether you like them or not, you have to convince a nontrivial number of them to vote for your candidates if you want to have congressional majorities.. And correct me if I'm wrong, but continually telling them Fuck You doesn't seem like a good way to accomplish that.

[Mariana]

116. Which parts of the Democratic Party Platform do you think should be changed

to better appeal to rural Americans? Please be specific.

https://democrats.org/where-we-stand/party-platform/

[LiberatedUSA]

162. Well...

…I live in rural America, many around here will not vote for someone that thinks they have a right to stick their nose in a person’s gun safe and tell them they can’t have this or that gun they already bought with their money. Note will they vote for a person that will ban the sale of those guns.

As for me. I have to continue to vote for the side of good, but let me tell you something:

When a person says they want to ban a rifle for being a mass murder weapon, then introduce bills that ban them but let the same cops we protest for killing people keep them, that person is a very confused individual. It is insane to want the same group protested for murder to have a monopoly on the best guns.

My 2 cents

Not that gun control matters when you can’t expand the court or get elected in a rigged election. So…

[Progressive Jones]

171. You illustrate a huge problem regarding guns.

Since when do guns become an identity issue? For too many Americans, it is.
When did gun ownership become a religion? For too many Americans, it is.

[treestar]

104. The advantage they have in the electoral college

And the Senate, compounded by the filibuster.

I have argued this gives them a duty to their fellow Americans with that power. Put to them as a Christian duty since they claim that. They should consider their fellow urban citizens since they have power over their lives with their votes.

[RFCalifornia]

107. Agree 100% -- The Electoral College is determined by "rural Americans"

And dirt doesn't vote!

[GusBob]

108. I guess I am a lone voice in the wilderness

But I dont mind. Technically I am not even a rural person. Since where I live has less than 3 people per square mile, it is classified by most federal agencies as "frontier" I love it out here. There are a lot of hardships fer' sure, but I love it. I have no problems speaking up for rural folks since very few others will

So apparently folks got their hackles up because Bullock described the conservative perception of Democrats as "coastal, over-educated, elitist, judgmental" This thread has reinforced my perception of DUers as close-minded, sedentary and insular in their suburban first world enclaves, so I would add those descriptions. Region bashing, especially of the South, and now rural areas, has long been a DU trait.
I know for a fact there are very few, perhaps not one DUer, that could handle the lifestyle and occupations of this particular frontier, but that has to do with my dedication to Native Americans whom I live and work with and the remote frontiers they occupy. I could be wrong, all my colleagues are hard-core D, but they are all from little nowhere places. We are all in healthcare which is extremely challenging, but we clearly give more fucks about things other than rural America as claimed in the OP. About 1/3 of my coworkers are military vets, they have given a fuck and have more fucks to give.

In the 2 threads on this topic and the replies have we seen "elitist and judgmental" opinions ? I think so. The OP himself implied that rural folks were Nazis and seems unapologetic of that. I myself found that judgmental in the worst way, but profane and less than educated.

[GemState]

133. Thank you GusBob

I also work in healthcare in rural America. Most of the posts in this discussion thread illustrate the accuracy of the “moron” governor’s views. Rural people don’t hold a monopoly on bigotry and cluelessness.

[inthewind21]

142. No

You ARE there very thing you are complaining about.

[GusBob]

157. Yeah I am a fucking Nazi

Who lives and works on a rural Indian Reservation providing much needed health care for rural Native Americans. I live in a glorified chicken coop with crappy heat and little hot water and its 10 degrees out. I am such an elitist snob

ETA: at least Joe Biden knows how to help NA's as he is fighting to increase the IHS budget. Gosh, if we only had more Dem reps in Congress it wouldn't be such a battle. maybe I wouldn't have to work at a third of the salary I could make in suburbia

[Mariana]

160. Gosh, if we only had more Dem reps in Congress it wouldn't be such a battle.

We would, if most rural voters didn't enthusiastically vote for Republicans - including the born wealthy, "coastal elite", lifelong New York City resident Donald J. Trump.

[twodogsbarking]

174. I got the exact same impression. Certainly makes me question spending time here.

[markpkessinger]

179. I have a foot in both worlds . . .

. . . I grew up in rural, north central Pennsylvania, in a town of around 750 people, in a county of around 38,000. Two of my siblings and various members of their families still live there. I visit my hometown several times per year. But I have lived nearly 40 years in NYC, where I moved right after college.

Here has been my experience: Although I grew up believing that New Yorkers are pushy, rude, arrogant and condescending, because that's what everyone in my hometown believed, 40 years of living here has shown me otherwise. Mostly, New Yorkers are simply in a hurry much of the time. Being curt or businesslike with strangers isn't a matter of being unfriendly, it's just that in a given day in this city, one encounters a LOT of people, and so keeping exchanges to a minimum, and keeping them short and businesslike, is just a means of being able to get things done. Do they look down on rural folks? Sure, some do. On the other hand, if New Yorkers really see someone who is in immediate need of help, most will go out of their way to help them if they can.

HOWEVER . . .

AT the same time, a lot of rural folks who come here to visit arrive with something of a chip on their shoulder. They are automatically suspicious of people who don't look like the people they're used to seeing, who don't dress the way they do, or who speak differently from the way they speak. And when an urban type visits a small, rural town, it's often even worse. They are wary of "outsiders," and will often stare, or can be seen obviously whispering about someone. And yet they congratulate themselves nonstop about their "superior" way of life, their "values" and their families (as if they're the only ones who have any). Upon learning that someone lives in a big city, they often respond with some rude comment about that city. Or they speak of urbanites as if they were some kind of alien creatures. And all the while, they believe themselves to be such warm, friendly and hospitable types!

So, to the extent there is any rudeness or condescension between the groups, I would submit that the disrespect goes in both directions, and always has. And if anything, that disrespect is probably a little stronger among rural folks towards urbanites. Urban and suburban folks, for their part, are mostly just indifferent towards those they don't know. And as for judgmental, at least in my experience, rural folks are far more judgmental of city types than city types are of rural folks.

[OnionPatch]

220. You know for a fact that no DUer could handle the lifestyle you're talking about?

How could you possibly know this? Do you personally know all Democratic Underground members? If not, how are you making this assessment?

[uponit7771]

229. So how does any of that address the lopsided resources rural America gets from M$M, pols, and voting

... power?

thx in advance

[maxrandb]

244. Right

I served 29 years in the military, but I could never make it in the "frontier"

BTW - No where in my posts did I claim rural Americans were Nazis.

I am just asking that urban America be given a fair shake when we're castigating a lack of "reaching out".

I, for one, would love to see an OP ED from Susan Collins explaining how Retrumplicans just don't relate to urban Americans.

I won't hold my breath.

[Ziggysmom]

115. Do Urban businesses get subsidies to prevent their failure like rural farmers do? NO!

OMG the rural are getting socialism to bail them out!

https://www.ewg.org/interactive-maps/2021-farm-subsidies-ballooned-under-trump/

[twodogsbarking]

177. The richest farmers got a much higher percentage under Trump.

Good to read the entire article.

[Initech]

117. Agreed! The notion of "equal representation" is antiquated and outdated.

It has no context in modern society. How does a state like North Dakota or Montana, with 500,000 residents get to dictate to an area like California that has 25 times the population density? It does not make any sense whatsoever.

[LeftInTX]

120. I just got gerrymandered into a rural Congressional District

I live in an urban area. My district from 2012 through 2020 was 70% Democratic. The new district is only 40% Democratic

The DOJ is suing State of Texas over it.

The GOP slices urban areas and dilutes their voting power

[GoneOffShore]

123. This so needs to be spread far and wide.

[albacore]

124. The rural folks who are ranchers and farmers...

like to think they are independent and own their future as well as their land.
They neglect to recognize that the corporations own them ... right down to the last cow and corn stalk.
84% of the beef purchase and slaughter business is owned by 4 corporations. Those companies control the prices.
And Cargill and ADM and the other agribusiness giants control the commodity prices.

[Demsrule86]

127. You miss the point entirely. We are winning in the urban areas but given how our government

works...electoral college, Senate...we will have a very difficult time if we don't get more voters in red, purple states...we absolutely need to compete in rural areas and the suburbs or we will not hold a majority for decades...what Democrat besides Joe Biden and maybe Tim Ryan could win the rustbelt which is essential in order to win the presidency?

Where will our Senate seats come from when Sherrod Brown and Manchin retire? How will we ever have a Senate majority?...this is about elections...we have to base our expectations and plans on real-world conditions...and it is looking pretty dire for us in terms of winning majorities. And we need to do more to attract male African American voters and Hispanic voters as well...there was a decrease last election.

[Gore1FL]

159. The electorate is not between the 40 yard lines. nt

[radius777]

217. True, but the same tired argument about rurals

has been made forever in countless books and articles over the past 20 years. Bullock is day late and a dollar short. Biden (son of small town Scranton) did campaign in small town America yet did about the same as Hillary with that voting bloc. A deeper analysis is needed to truly understand what message/policies would work and which voters are truly gettable, and how that would affect our current voters and swing voters we can actually get.

[uponit7771]

230. Dems don't have a messaging infrastructure like the kGOP in rural areas, haven't invested in it

... much seeing we have a 10% deficit between PoC voting and whites in mostly ubran areas.

It does look like the future is shaving rural America votes away from the GQP

[The Jungle 1]

135. The majority of the rural red states are donor states.

We carry their asses. Yet they hate us. Well how about we stop carrying your asses!
Pull yourselves up on your own. Yea I am talking about you Kenfuckey!

[inthewind21]

143. I think you meant

Taker states.

[The Jungle 1]

185. I don't know I thought that is what they were called.

We donate to them way more than they contribute in taxes.

We are the donors.

[Hekate]

219. Donor means giver. California is a donor state: we send more taxes to the feds than we get back. nt

[LeftInTX]

138. RNC is setting up community centers in urban areas where they invite Democrats and target minorities

[cilla4progress]

139. Righteous.

Thank you!

I'm in rural America - a rural progressive holdover from the back to land movement of the 1970s!

I'm reclaiming MY country and MY patriotism: we raised our American flag - the RED WHITE and BLUE (not black; not upside down) and are flying it proudly and visibly on our home.

Fuck the rednecks around here. You want a piece? Come and get it.

[roamer65]

145. The depopulation of the rural areas has been nothing short of amazing.

My rural high school graduated only one half the amount of students they did when I was a senior in the early 1980’s.

If I resided there I would be pushing for school district consolidation to save money.

[bluecollar2]

147. Kick and rec!..n/t

[Skittles]

148. I too am sick being told I need to "understand" these folk

I understand them all too well.

[barbtries]

150. righteous

and so right! WTF is with that?!

[nolabear]

152. That's pretty righteous.

And I don’t think about it. Rural America thrives on feeling looked down on. “I’m just a poor country boy…” Personally I like to be respectful and firm in my beliefs, but it really would be good to have an exchange program. I loved Kamau Bell’s program, which was the urban black man reaching out. We need it to go the other way for real.

[Ruby the Liberal]

153. Whoa - that was a righteous rant

I had to read it twice to make sure every point sunk in - it really makes you think.

[soldierant]

154. It's not helpful to say "talk to rural America." About what?

Earlier today I saw a similar article elsewhere which included the suggestion that climate change doesn't mean much to rural voters.

I never yet heard of a farmer or a rancher who could raise crops or livestock without water. But there have just been several years ina row of low-to-no-snow. I'm not taling about snow in teh rural areas themselves, I'm talking about snow at the watersheds, which is what fills the rivers in the spring in time for planting.

All those rivers look pretty bad. Some have completely dried ip. One river in my state was literally destroyed by a forest fire several years ago. With snowpack it might have recovered But ...

This is climate change. Does anyone have any ideas about what to do about it? I mean this particular problem of no snow in the watersheds. Green energy is not going to solve that or address it at all. Yet it affects so many people. That might be a good thing to talk to rural America about.

For that matter, all those of us who like to eat could be interested. I don't myself live in a rural area, but in a small city. However, I do have occasion to drive through one a couple of times a month.

I do get it that when people say "talk to rural America," what they mean is more like "listen to rural America. But even people who are experts in their own fields don't necessarily have the broad knoweldge to identify larger problems. That is not condescending.

[Ferrets are Cool]

155. Wow, this didn't go the direction I expected. Bravo!!

[calimary]

156. I wish I could give this another 200+ recs of my own!

The majority lives in the CITIES. Are we to turn our backs on them and go chasing after voters we probably can’t reach in the first place, because they’re isolated, likely less well-educated, and cling to the old ways in dwindling numbers? Places where most of the young people can’t wait to move out and get away from?

In all honesty, I think we have to figure out how to out-screw the bad guys. I don’t know how many here still believe in being nice and playing nice. Just my opinion, but in politics, playing nice is the same as playing dead. That’s how the opposition sees us, and how they treat us. Like dead people they can just step on and walk all over, because they know it’s all okay and we won’t fight back at all.

How can you fight back when you’re already too busy sighing, moaning, and wringing your hands?

[BumRushDaShow]

165. Head of nail meets the hammer!

[Beartracks]

178. But there was that huge push in 2016 for Republicans to understand Hillary voters!

===========

[markpkessinger]

181. I don't know why people think Steve Bullock has anything to teach Democrats . . .

. . . After all, after making almost no showing in his presidential primary run, he then failed to win a Senate race in a state that is overwhelmingly populated by the very type of voter he now claims to know how to reach! How's that again?

[markpkessinger]

182. I don't know why people think Steve Bullock has anything to teach Democrats . . .

. . . After all, after making almost no showing in his presidential primary run, he then failed to win a Senate race in a state that is overwhelmingly populated by the very type of voter he now claims to know how to reach! How's that again?

[oldsoftie]

183. The Independent voter resides everywhere. And it is they who decide elections.

"rural" or "urban" whatever. Have a field day categorizing people based on geography. Most voters dont live there.
The problem is that too many democrats dont understand that a LOT of voters vote depending on how they feel at election time. They dont pay attention to the news like we do. They dont read the RW bullshit or watch rachel Maddow. They change the channel when political ads come on. They dont go to rallies. And THEY are the majority. So when the "squad" refuses to vote for a pretty darn GOOD bill because its not a PERFECT bill, its not the republicans or democrats opinions you have to worry about.

[albacore]

218. True independents are only about ...

12% of the voters. Nothing to sneeze at, but still. The rest of those "independents" are leaners. They SAY they're independents, but they vote one Party pretty much all the time.
And when was the last time you heard a Libertarian admit that he was anything more than an "independent"? They skew the polls..

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2016/01/11/independents-outnumber-democrats-and-republicans-but-theyre-not-very-independent/

[oldsoftie]

223. But you see the disowning here as well as on the Right.

How many pro life DUers are there? Do they ever post that they are? Members of the Democratic Congress? Do our party leaders say that the Democratic Party welcomes pro lifers? I cant count the number of times i've seen "you call yourself a Democrat if you dont support a woman's right to choose". There are many other hot button issues that hit the same reactions on the left & right. And ignoring them is how you lose elections.
Lord help you if you claim to be a republican but support a vaccine mandate or support abortion.
So these people may "lean" one way or the other but they're NOT reliably the base. And I believe they're still the majority. How else do you explain Obama voters voting for trump?

[albacore]

224. The Stupid abides... it over-rides Party. Or race. Or economic status. nt

[RB TexLa]

184. And there are states like Texas that we can win in a few years without a single rural vote

And it's how we should win Texas.

And how it should be governed.

Move money in Medicaid from elderly to children
State gas/recharging tax to improve urban mass transit
Congestion charges for entry/exit of urban areas by car
Priority to resettling asylum seekers and refugees in Texas cities
Protection for those crossing the southern border

[Sparkly]

186. Yes!!! Please write a Letter to the Editor or an Op-Ed

for any Newspaper. What you have written here is SO spot-on!!

[Joinfortmill]

191. Amen

[Joinfortmill]

192. Amen

[Smackdown2019]

193. Guns, Ammo, trucks and Gas Prices

That's what is rural America is concern about!

Why?

Second amendment to shot their 2 dollar gun shells because they can.

Trucks to get to town for feed, pull their fishing boat, take their coon dogs on hunts, or just pull their 4 wheelers on the weekends.

Gas? Distance requires a lot of gas to get to the next stop.

[oldsoftie]

225. Continuing to believe its just the rurals who worry about those things is a mistake.

Biden's numbers are low mainly because of those gas prices. Where is the gas highest? Not in rural areas. The more liberal areas have the highest prices too. We have 300 million guns in the US. Yes, many people own more than one. But there are a lot of gun owning Democrats too. As well as Independents. Probably a third.
Continuing to try to pigeonhole GOP voters is usually a costly mistake. And we'll probably see that mistake next yr

[Smackdown2019]

226. I just stated.....

I just stated what the rural conservatives only concerns about themselves.... They don't care one rip about those in cities.

I live in rural America as a non-trumper. Kinda scary!

Yes I agree urban areas pay more at the gas pumps, but they also have transit systems at low cost; whereas in the rural, you have to call for a ride, which is costly.

Guns, Gas Prices and Benghizi are the conservatives rally call.

All of which is BS.

Who in the heck is going to take guns from all Americans? Stupid Thought!

Who controls the gas prices? Oil Cartels and Wall Street... " CONSERVATIVES "

Benghizi? Republicans who refused to fund our Embassy in Benghizi.... and got the Benghizi Yellow Tails to protect it.

So, rural America is not a lost cause, just in states that have more cows than people!

[AdamGG]

194. Seriously, America was forged in Boston and Philadelphia and the immigrant slums of NY

Rural America has mostly just been along for the ride.

Every right winger loves to post color coded US maps of which counties voted Republican in Presidential elections. The fact that these self-righteous nitwits always sidestep is that squirrels and pine cones and tumbleweeds don't vote, people do. And, the majority of the American people live in and around cities. That's where our greatest advances are usually made.

[BumRushDaShow]

200. The response to the "color coded maps" should be the reality

[Abolishinist]

196. I'm tired of this mythical 'Dems need to reach out to rural America' bullshit.

I have to agree. I grew up in the 1950's in a mid-western 'city' of around 350,000. At the time, when all of my extended family lived in the more 'rural' areas, having nothing else as a basis of comparison I had this feeling of being, I don't know, better attuned or something. It was only later when I visited places like NYC and Chicago that I realized I was no doubt the same to their culture as my rural kinfolk were at the time to me. Too many years ago to remember, but I don't think I thought of myself as better per se, just different.

But this changed, circa 2010, with social media. I didn't experience it first hand... I'm not one who attempts to remain close to cousins etc, but a few close friends told me of aunts/uncles/cousins, all from small towns, who were posting racist/homophobic rants on their Facebook accounts. All of them cut their family ties at some point, checking out of FB because of this.

Long story short, sad but true, I believe you are for the most part spot on. These folks HAVE NO intention of even attempting to reconcile their differences with their urban counterparts. Zero, zilch, nada, no way. They spend their time devising plans to cut the urban centers off from food, water and electricity. It's an all out 'war' for them, wanting to "Take America Back", whatever that means.

[Roisin Ni Fiachra]

198. I'm a lifetime rural America dweller, and as dawg is my witness,

I'm here to tell you that listening to the stupid of rural America will do nothing for ya except make your brain hurt from the illogical, fact free heap of illogical stupid spewed by the RW inhabitants of rural red America.

[Kaleva]

201. TFG got just under 45% of the vote in Genesee County where Flint is

Your comment:

"Maybe rural America should come over and share a few pitchers of water with a Flint Michigan Family."

Overall, TFG got 43% of his vote in MI in 2020 from counties Biden won.

[librechik]

210. The hidden assumption is that rural Murikkka is too damn dumb and irrational

to carry on a fair conversation.

I can't argue with that. And I have to add malicious.

[Diablo del sol]

231. Agree but I don't believe it is just a rural issue

It is a media framing issue.

Remember Joe "the plumber" the media always focuses on people who parrot RW talking points.

I live in Orange County, in 2016 it went blue. Now it was mentioned it went blue on numerous outlets, but never once did I see any media outlet interview anyone on the flip from R to D. The second to last largest top 10 populated county flipped. Hell, the OC was called "Behind the Orange Curtain into the 90's, but nada. (FYI, in 2020 the last big one flipped too)

Then prior to the election in 2018 I watched MSNBC do on the street interviews in front of UC Irvine. Basically talked to three or four kids who weren't very interested in the election. Most didn't know who Katie Porter was, so the conclusion of the 'liberal' talking head on MSNBC was that there just didn't seem much interest in the election so it didn't seem likely that Porter would flip the seat.

Knowing the area well I immediately noticed something. They were interviewing kids at a bus stop right in front of the school. Now it could be that they weren't allowed on campus. Thus the choice of this location. But here is the deal, those kids were all taking a bus to school, at a minimum a 30 minute trip, more likely closer to an hour. (Yes SoCal traffic is horrible) These kids to a person were likely all first generation immigrants. Worked their asses off to get into a school with a low acceptance rate. Likely spent two hours on a bus each school day, and likely had a job. Yes Katie Porter was a Prof at the school but a Law Prof. How the hell were these kids who were working their butts off supposed to have time to focus on a House of Rep election.

The kicker, assuming they could interview on campus, they could have walked up a half dozen stairs, walked about 20 yards, and been at a cross of two major walkways with access to a much better sample of students. If they weren't allowed, they were literally right below a foot bridge to the University, where kids who live off campus use to get to the school. That doesn't work, drive a half mile down the road, make a turn and get access to kids who walk in from the Dorms.

Point being, they couldn't have found a better spot to find kids who weren't interested in the House race unless they went to the library at midnight on the week of Finals. If fit the narrative they wanted to push, and that is the point. The media is always focused on finding your everyday Joe/Jane that fits their narrative.

[orleans]

233. great post. saw it from this link

https://www.democraticunderground.com/100216135232

[brooklynite]

235. " Is rural America the only ones that have a story to tell? "

Of course not; but you’re framing this as Rural VS Urban. That there are two irreconcilable theories of living that cannot both be addressed by a Democratic candidate. That is the flaw in this “the hell with rural voters” thinking.

Democrats cannot be successful with only urban voters, as much as some folks here pine for a “real” Democrat who would inspire non-voters to come out of the woodwork. We need to find a way to message our economic, health care and education policies in a way that also appeals to SOME rural voters to supplement the voters we already have.

[maxrandb]

236. I am not saying "the hell with rural America"

I am saying that maybe, just one time, the media should go to urban America and ask them "why the Retrumplican Party is so 'out of touch' with urban America".

They sure as hell go to rural America thousands of times to ask why "Dems are so 'out of touch' with rural America".

My point that the entire "reach out" to voters, has become nothing but a one-way street, where Dems are chastised and advised on being "out of touch" with a rural subset of voters, but Retrumplicans are never chastised and advised on being "out of touch" with urban Americans.

[brooklynite]

237. I don't CARE if the Republicans are out of touch with urban voters...

I CARE about winning more elections. We've locked up the urban vote and the safe Blue States. If we want to be more successful, we need to poach seats and offices from less urban and more Red areas.

[maxrandb]

238. Yes, and one way to do that

would be to show that urban America has many of the same issues and problems that rural America has.

If Americans saw urban voter "Focus Groups" in the same number we see rural voter "Focus Groups", maybe enough of a percentage of rural voters would see the similarities, that we all know are there, to poach some of those seats.

Right now, all we see is one side being asked to understand and empathize.

[brooklynite]

239. We can't control what the media does. We CAN control what the Party and its candidates do.

[maxrandb]

240. We can't control what the media does?

Can we at least hold them to account?

If we had just had some sustained boycotts and pressure campaigns on Hate Radio, we may have as many as 300-400 less radio stations pumping 24/7 anti-Democrat, anti-Democratic, pro-Retrumplican propaganda 365 days a year.

300-400 less Hate Radio stations would equal about 30-40 less Retrumplican House seats, and 5-7 less Retrumplican Senators.

But yeah, you're right. We shouldn't do ANYTHING about the most influential medium in our society.

If they want to just show Focus Group, after Focus Group, after Focus Group chastising Democrats as being "out of touch" with real "Murika", I guess all we can do is work harder.

[brooklynite]

241. I've shared my thoughts with Party leadership on messaging...

...please share your thoughts as to how you're going to boycott and pressure "hate radio".

[maxrandb]

242. Well, it starts with monitoring it and tracking it

Then, maybe you go to the 84 universities that have their sports broadcast on hate radio affiliates and ask if they are comfortable with their universities being affiliated with such hate. You could also go to some of the professional teams.

I for one, would love to play Lebron James the Rush Limbaugh "ditty" Barack the Magic Negro, and just ask him if he was aware this was being played on the same stations that broadcast his Lakers and Cavaliers games?

I am not an expert, but that's could be a start.

We need to do our best to make corporations and radio affiliates understand that hatred, racism, misogyny and authoritarianism is not profitable.

Like every journey, it starts with a single step.

[brooklynite]

243. IOW, its somebody else's job to organize.

In the meantime, I'll focus on getting as many suburban and rural votes as we can.