John Fetterman is about to ruin a conservative talking point

[Sympthsical]

One of the things we often see in Democratic primaries is this line: "I'd love to nominate someone more liberal, but they just can't get elected statewide. That's why we must put forth more moderate and Blue Dog candidates."

And that may be true in certain areas of the country.

However, Fetterman won his statewide election over the Republican 58.7% - 41.3%.

The early push by the power structures in the party to promote the more conservative candidate Conor Lamb seems to poke quite a few holes in this, "We'd really love a liberal, but . . ." angle of attack during this primary.

So now something else will need be found. And boy howdy, it's already starting. We're going to enjoy months of creative attacks on liberalism. Because, you know, reasons. I'm sure we'll be told why we have to opt for the more conservative candidate when the more liberal one is perfectly capable of winning.

[Maraya1969]

1. Liberal candidates have a lot more to offer. Especialy since the GQP have done

NOTHING for the American people, (except the uber wealthy)

Tout everything the Dems have done to make life better for the average American.

[gab13by13]

2. Not only is Fetterman capable of winning

he is more likely to win IMO. Conor Lamb is a fantastic candidate but Fetterman brings enthusiasm, plus he will definitely get votes from Republicans.

I hope this isn't another attempt to start a moderate v liberal argument to divide us. Voters like me will decide, that's the way it should be.

[Sympthsical]

3. Yeah, I'm not dissing Lamb at all

He did a great job at what we needed him to do - win in a difficult district.

But the "We can't nominate a very liberal person, because they'll never win the general," line we always see isn't going to wash in this race.

And since the intraparty attacks on Fetterman are already starting, I figured I'd toss this out there.

[rogue emissary]

8. Not dissing him??? You called him the "more conservative" candidate.

[Sympthsical]

9. He objectively is

I don't see the problem in stating a simple truth. It was a selling point when he ran in his district. Remember, he wouldn't vote for Pelosi as Speaker, and everyone said, "Well, he has to do that."

[rogue emissary]

10. That doesn't make him conservative.

Their were a lot of progressive that voted against Pelosi. Do they lose their progressive label?

[CrackityJones75]

31. The comment wasn't calling him conservative

It was just stating that he was mote conservative than fetterman.

[lapucelle]

37. How so?

Candidate A:


-------------------------------------------------------------------

Candidate B:


--------------------------------------------------------------------

from OnTheIssues.org

https://www.ontheissues.org/

[CrackityJones75]

40. How so what?

I was addressing the content of the message.

I don’t know of one is more conservative than the other or not but I don’t think the person was calling him A conservative.

[lapucelle]

41. Nor does he seem to be "mo[r]e conservative than [F]etterman". N/T

[George II]

4. In Pennsylvania the candidates for Governor and Lieutenant Governor run coupled, like President....

....and Vice President.

He didn't win 58.7% - 41.3%, Tom Wolf did. In his statewide primary, Fetterman only got 37.5% of the votes.

[peggysue2]

7. Which is why I'm eager to see some new polling, George

As well as getting a feel for demographic breakdowns. I need to hear and watch Fetterman vs Lamb performing on the campaign trail. In the end, I'll vote for whomever gets the Democratic nomination.

It's all about who has the best shot to win bc this seat could be pivotal in determining control of the Senate.

Both these candidates are experienced and qualified. It remains to be seen who can appeal to the largest number of voters statewide.

Let the contest begin!

[Deminpenn]

11. In Pennsylvania, the candidates for gov and ltgov

run separetely in the primaries, then they run as a ticket in the Nov general election. Fetterman indeed won the ltgov primary by a large margin over the sitting ltgov Mike Stack, who had ethical problems, but also was based in NE Philadelphia, a significant voting bloc.

FTR. Wolf/Fetterman beat their Trumper opponents by 17-18 pts.

Further, I will point out that in the 2008 primary, Bernie Sanders beat Hillary Clinton in all the "red" counties in Pennsylvania. She won because she carried the big, traditionally Dem areas. We have a closed primary system here in Pennsylvania. The Sanders D voters in the R strongholds show that those D primary voters are perfectly willing to support a social and economic liberal like Sanders against an establishment one as Clinton was. That bodes well for Fetterman, who, btw, has visited all 67 counties during his tour to discuss making marijuana legal. The most effective way to get votes is still face-to-face meetings. The marijuana discussions have allowed Fetterman to do that, the other candidates not so much.

Maybe you should actually to listen Fetterman speak sometime. He is pragmatic and sensible.

[George II]

18. Yes, I know they run in separate primaries. Fetterman got 37.5%, slightly more than 1/3.....

...in the Lt. Gov. primary. Stack finished 4th behind Fetterman and two other candidates. No doubt his ethical problems did him in.

When Fetterman first announced, I liked what he said. So I signed up for his emails and sent him a donation early in his campaign. But the more I saw and the more I heard, the less I liked.

I think you meant the 2016 primary? Yes, Hillary Clinton won the most populated counties - actually 18 of the top 20 in the state. That might bode well for Lamb, and the fact that he defeated the incumbent in a red district also bodes well for him.

I guess we'll see how it all shakes out in May.

[Eyeball_Kid]

5. It's that slippery slide to socialism, don't you know?

All you terrified folks, gather round! Reject Social Security! Reject the ACA! Reject subsidies for the poor! Close all public schools! Let them all rot in the name of... what... TAX-FREE (socialism for the rich) CORPORATISM!

America CAN'T AFFORD "promoting the general welfare", even if it is in the Preamble. There are too many tax giveaways to afford anything for people who aren't millionaires and beyond. So to hell with them all. If you can't pull your own weight, you get plowed under. CAPISCE?

[live love laugh]

42. ✔️+

[modrepub]

6. Typically in PA

there are multiple Democratic candidates in the SE part of the state and a single one out in the SW part of the state. Lamb and Fetterman are both from the SW. Don't be surprised if neither of them can get a plurality from the base out there to win the nomination outright.

Of course this opens the door for a single candidate from the SE to get the nomination (Kenyatta). I'd be worried under this scenario. Candidates from Philly probably won't do well in most other parts of PA (yea, it can be a racial thing but the hatred most people in this state feel for Philly is palpable).

Whoever the Senate candidate is, they will have to do well with moderate Republicans in SE PA to overcome the Republican lean in this state.

[AZLD4Candidate]

14. We from Upstate NY feel the same way for anyone living south of Interstate 84.

Except for that odious Stefanik's district (which might be split up), Staten Island (which no one cares about) and parts of Suffolk County, lucky the rest of the State is solidly blue. When Rochester and Buffalo, which were Republican strongholds, turned blue.

[George II]

23. Just short of 1/3 of the Congressional Districts are republican (8 of 27) and three are....

...."south of Interstate 84", and of the 10 north they're split evenly between Democrats and republicans - 5 each.

I wouldn't count Staten Island out, either - one of the more likely redistrict proposals will put more of Brooklyn in that district, making it lean more toward the Democratic side. That, and hopefully no silly slogans from outside the district, could get Max Rose elected again.

[lapucelle]

38. I care about Staten Island.

I grew up there. My children were born there. I spent 18 years as volunteer working to elect Democrats on Staten Island.

I'll be phone banking during the general helping Max Rose to win back his congressional seat.

[Poiuyt]

12. I always wonder why Democratic candidates can't be too liberal, but Republican

candidates fall all over themselves claiming to be the most conservative in the field.

Despite the Trump years, the Overton Window is still moving to the right.

[AZLD4Candidate]

13. All-in wit Big John! I love Big John!

[Escurumbele]

15. I believe the "liberal" must be turned into "progressive", and when a republican comes along

to trash the "progressive", he/she must be reminded that one of the most progressive president this country has ever had was a republican, Teddy Roosevelt, reason why this country surged under his presidency.

The republican party, discounting Roosevelt, has always stand for greed, grift, dishonesty, racism, war, and all the disgraces that have landed upon the USA, but they are good at propaganda and messaging, even when they project, most people do not understand they are projecting, and thus believe all the crap they say. Democrats need to get better at marketing, which is the bottom line of it all.

[Poiuyt]

16. I love John Fetterman

He looks like he should be acting in a Vin Diesel movie.

[IronLionZion]

17. Some liberals don't like that he pulled a gun on an innocent black fellow

which might ironically gain him some votes from conservatives. Other than that one racist incident, his record looks pretty good.

[Sugarcoated]

20. The guy had a facemask on

coat and long pants. Fetterman couldn't tell what the guy's race was.

[The Polack MSgt]

19. I believe that a Fetterman primary victory would doom us in PA

Democrats can't win anywhere without the AA vote. Obviously, Fetterman does not have those votes

And as far as cross over white votes go?

Every white voter who likes that he pulled a gun on an unarmed black man is voting Republican no matter what

So that's no help, and BTW that story is a way more conservative narrative than any Connor Lamp anecdote you'll ever find

[left-of-center2012]

28. "Fetterman skips forum with Black clergy, drawing criticism"

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1074&pid=15839

Included in link:
"Fetterman's getting a lot of complaints for avoiding events"

"For Black community leaders, Fetterman's absence from a public forum meant they didn’t get to ask about a 2013 incident in which he held a Black jogger at gunpoint."
Rev. Waller, the Enon Tabernacle pastor, said “The ones that wanted to be there were there,” he said. “My father used to tell me 80 percent of ‘can’t do’ is ‘don’t want to.’”

Rev. Mark Tyler of Mother Bethel African Methodist Episcopal Church said he personally appealed to Mr. Fetterman’s campaign to reconsider attending the clergy event, adding that the 2013 incident was something several people wanted to hear about.
“You can’t win Pennsylvania as a Democrat without significant turnout from Black people in Pennsylvania,”

Mr. Fetterman’s campaign also canceled on a December forum organized by the group Indivisible Narberth and Beyond, which said his campaign hasn’t responded to requests to reschedule. “We’ve reached out several times and it does not appear he’s available,” said Stacey Vernallis, a co-lead of Progress PA.

[The Polack MSgt]

35. I'm from SW Pennsylvania - Conner is the choice of my (Admittedly limited) social group

Which includes one of my HS friends' cousins, aunts, uncles and friends.

Grew up in a mine, mill & coke plant area which became onr of the very few towns with actual black folks in Pennsylvania coal country

They know Fetterman, and the most politically engaged tell me they'll vote for him if they HAVE to.

The AA people in that conversation younger than me though?

Universally they say "Fuck that guy"

[Sugarcoated]

25. Fetterman was front and center

very vocal, out there when Don and his cons were spouting "stop the steal" crap and fascist PA republicans were attempting to cancel our votes. We saw how John had our back, that he is a fighter for hard working Pennsylvanians. The trump steal campaign actually benefitted Fetterman and Shapiro giving them name recognition in the state

[dsp3000]

21. I've said it before- Fetterman is unique, he has those "blue collar" creds. Image is everything!

He is a "straight talker", has a blue collar look, attractive wife, and for us liberals, great policies. for people who don't pay attention like those of us on these message boards, the first 3 points will be enough to win them over.

Look at Trump at the BEGINNING of 2016. who cares about substantive policies when you're a "straight talker"?

[Sugarcoated]

26. Liberal sells with the right messenger

[Stinky The Clown]

24. To those pushing for Lamb: If voters want "conservative" they will vote for the actual conservative

Also, I seem to recall Conor Lamb had a tough time winning in his own district.

Fetterman is the real deal and can/has won statewide. No one needs a gentler flavor of "conservative" in this race.

[left-of-center2012]

27. Lamb won in a district Trump carried

That means Lamb got GOP votes.

[Stinky The Clown]

29. Would that happen in Philadelphia? In Pittsburg?

[Stinky The Clown]

39. Careful. Some of that venom might go where you don't intend.

Your reply felt overwrought and very personal toward me.

[brooklynite]

32. Why is picking mainstream Democrats a "conservative talking point"?

As for Fetterman's electoral record, I remain unimpressed at someone who won his Statewide PRIMARY with 37.5% of the vote, and vote his Statewide ELECTION with pretty much the same vote as the Democratic GOVERNOR Tom Wolf.

[George II]

36. In Pennsylvania the Governor and Lt. Governor run at a team, like President and VP. Those were....

....Wolf votes, not Fetterman votes.

However, he WAS Mayor of the bustling metropolis of Braddock for 15 years! Not mentioned often is the fact that during the time he was mayor the population dropped from about 2600 to 1800.

[brooklynite]

33. John Fetterman ran for Senate in 2016...he got 19.5% in the Dem Primary

Sometimes voters have a different opinion about who they want for STATE offices and FEDERAL ones.