General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsThe whole world should be worried by the 'siege of Ottawa'. This is about much more...
Link to tweet
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/feb/08/ottawa-truckers-protest-anti-vaxx-canada
No paywall
https://archive.fo/9xxSy
What the truck is going on in Canada? No offence to Ottawa, but its not the most exciting place in the world. Over the past couple of weeks, however, the Canadian capital has been embroiled in drama: hundreds of truckers, ostensibly protesting against vaccine mandates, have brought the city to a standstill. Members of the so-called Freedom Truck Convoy have been blaring horns, desecrating war memorials and setting off fireworks. Residents are being driven to distraction. The police chief has called the situation a siege; the Ontario premier called it an occupation. On Monday, the citys mayor, Jim Watson, declared a state of emergency.
Theres a lot going on in the world right now. If youre not Canadian, then the protest in Ottawa might not be top of your list of things to worry about. But Im afraid you should be worried. You should certainly be paying attention. Whats unfolding in Ottawa is not a grassroots protest that has spontaneously erupted out of the frustration of local lorry drivers. Rather, its an astroturfed movement one that creates an impression of widespread grassroots support where little exists funded by a global network of highly organised far-right groups and amplified by Facebooks misinformation machine. The drama may be centred in Canada, but what is unfolding has repercussions for us all.
Thats a big claim, so let me break it down. Well start with the Canadian lorry drivers. The people protesting against vaccine mandates, it cant be stressed enough, are by no means representative of the Canadian haulage industry as a whole. Just 10% of cross-border drivers refused the jabs, according to the Canadian Trucking Alliance (CTA), meaning that from 15 January they can no longer cross back into Canada without quarantine. The CTA, along with other major industry organisations, has disavowed the protest. The protesters dont represent the vast majority of lorry drivers, nor are they representative of public sentiment towards vaccines in Canada a country where 84% of the population, children included, have received at least one vaccine dose. They are, as Justin Trudeau has said, a small fringe.
They may be a fringe minority, but that doesnt mean you should (as Trudeau seems to be doing) downplay or dismiss them. For one, they have a lot of powerful supporters. The usual crowd of rightwing politicians in the US, including Donald Trump and Ted Cruz, have been cheering them on. They have also been getting millions of dollars in funding across crowdfunding sites from international donors.
*snip*
dameatball
(7,380 posts)AllTooEasy
(1,260 posts)If right or left wingers protest this way in DC, they better arrive with a police escort. I'm from (southeast) DC. I know. These truckers would get hurt, seriously hurt, if they are lucky, and not primarily by the cops. Pro-choice, pro-life, pro-vax, anti-vax, socialists, capitalists, it doesn't matter. The locals won't put up with this, and they are armed. Try blocking the bridges that connect DC to Virginia, preventing Virginians (less gun control) from going to work. Or even worse, from going home after work! I don't advocate violence. I'm just predicting the future. DMV folks live high-stress, high cost of living, feeling-unappreciated, "had it up to hear" lifestyles. That's why I left. The local, state (MD & VA), and federal policing forces aren't very nice either, especially when someone impedes progress or the government's functions.
dameatball
(7,380 posts)it takes to organize or foment a demonstration, a blockade, a march...whatever. How many might show up. How far will they go.
I have no doubt that in a real confrontation these people would be removed pretty quickly. But I also think that there are those who just want to see how far things will go and learn what they can expect in the future.
Every type of act like this is a dress rehearsal for something else.
It started a long time ago.
NullTuples
(6,017 posts)The BLM protests should have made it quite clear that law enforcement reaction to "protesters" can be quite variable.
Lovie777
(11,992 posts)and you know who will be victim when that happens.
moondust
(19,917 posts)(Posted in another thread but it probably belongs here.)
"Free" societies are at a disadvantage when it comes to looking out for the public good. Antivaxxers, antimaskers, juvenile trucker protests, etc., were all probably predictable after years of greedy Republicans and wingnuts in other countries making "big gubment" the enemy. Laws are for suckers! Then came the lawless Orange Pig to drive them over the edge.
China and other totalitarian states don't have these problems. The strongman just orders everybody to do something and they do it OR ELSE! PERIOD!!!
Almost two centuries after recognition of the tragedy of the commons and I'm not sure who wins.
Volaris
(10,260 posts)This is why President Jr acknowledged it would have been easier if he had been a straight up dictator instead of just merely The President.
Sorry, republican fuckheads, you're still answerable to We The People. I know you dont like that much, but...welcome to Democracy.
2naSalit
(86,071 posts)moondust
(19,917 posts)Inherit a half billion dollars and you can start your own company and be the dictator who calls all the shots OR ELSE! Easy peasy!
There are no doubt exceptions but in general private business owners are not so well suited to serving in democratic governments because they're not accustomed to doing things democratically. Orange Pig and family were a deeply regrettable example of such unsuitability.
Volaris
(10,260 posts)certainot
(9,090 posts)just doing a little smart polling about that
Initech
(99,915 posts)Many of these people will be collecting their Herman Cain Awards in due time.
dalton99a
(81,084 posts)Another reason why you should take the Ottawa protests seriously? Thanks to the wonders of modern technology, fringe groups can have an outsize influence. Im sure youve heard of troll farms: organised groups that weaponise social media to spread misinformation, promote division and influence public opinion. Get this: in the long run-up to the 2020 US elections, Facebooks most popular pages for Christian and Black American content were being run by eastern European troll farms. According to an internal Facebook report written in late 2019 and leaked to MIT Technology Review, troll farms were reaching 140 million users every month. Three-quarters of these users had never followed any of the pages: theyd had the content thrust upon them by Facebooks engagement-hungry content-recommendation system.
Our platform has given the largest voice in the African American community to a handful of bad actors, who, based on their media production practices, have never had an interaction with an African American, wrote the reports author, a former senior-level data scientist at Facebook. Instead of users choosing to receive content from these actors, it is our platform that is choosing to give [these troll farms] an enormous reach.
After that report was leaked in September, Facebook made a lot of noises about how it was aggressively cracking down on troll farms. Has it followed through on these promises? Meta Platforms, Facebooks owner, said on Monday that it had removed dozens of scam pages associated with the convoy protest from Facebook; however, there are still a huge number of recently created pages supporting the hauliers, with suspiciously large numbers of followers. Meanwhile, on Telegram, a social network favoured by the right, people across the world are urging each other to replicate the tactics in Canada in their home towns. Canada may not be on the brink of civil war, but what is happening in Ottawa is one small front in a global information war. And the baddies, Im afraid to say, are winning.
crickets
(25,896 posts)Meta's toxic algorithms, refusal to take responsibility for consistent banning of bot farm pages, and refusal to responsibly police fringe content are a menace to society at large.
Irish_Dem
(45,657 posts)And showing how people raised in democracies look stupid and ridiculous?
erronis
(14,955 posts)And autocracy usually means one strong man in the rule. Sometimes a plutocracy but the the rule leads to a single point of failure.
PXR-5
(522 posts)The Democrats in the capital cities better have a plan in place when the MAGAT caravan comes home to roost. Preferably with tear gas and rubber bullets, since that is how they treated protestors here in Minneapolis that refused to disperse.
Mysterian
(4,524 posts)Russia has found many useful and eager tools in their efforts to destroy Western democratic civilization.
lagomorph777
(30,613 posts)Putin's filthy hands are all over this crap.
GaYellowDawg
(4,443 posts)Have the police pretend that these protestors are BLM. Beat, tear gas, and rubber bullet these people and they'll shut the hell up and stay home.
Justice matters.
(6,874 posts)AllTooEasy
(1,260 posts)Thats a weak excuse. Give the protesters 24 hours, and then come out firing. The problem isnt the protestors, but the weak response.
Justice matters.
(6,874 posts)instead of doing nothing, they installed blocks of concrete stoppers on the streets leading to the provincial parliament buildings so when the truckers reached the city, they couldn't drive anywhere close to them: The streets were blocked! So they turned away and went home.
Ottawa was in no way prepared at all. They should have done the same.
calimary
(80,700 posts)ironflange
(7,781 posts)Lots of tickets handed out!
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/calgary-convoy-vehicle-protest-1.6343110
Scrivener7
(50,774 posts)Police said in a release that due to the heightened emotions around this and other demonstrations, and due to safety concerns for both law enforcement and members of the community, they will not always issue tickets at the time of an alleged offence.
In Ottawa they seem to be thinking safety in numbers and no one can get at them. Do you know if this is the policy there too?
L. Coyote
(51,129 posts)Watch how fast they scurry home if their expensive vehicles are threatened.
Justice matters.
(6,874 posts)L. Coyote
(51,129 posts)Bev54
(9,963 posts)crowd funding site but I am not sure if they are seeing the same amount of funds coming through. I am disgusted that so many Canadians have been so easily duped into supporting this Bullshit, we are supposed to be smarter than this. I hope whatever they decide to do it, they get this shut down very soon. So many people say Trudeau should meet and negotiate with them, that is just a real stupid idea, they are terrorists and never should we negotiate with terrorists.
Justice matters.
(6,874 posts)Mostly Alberta & Saskatchwan.
Bev54
(9,963 posts)Alberta truckers are having their own little tantrum at the Coutts border crossing, most of them have already gone home but a few remain. Yes they are redneck here, in Alberta and more than a little stupid but I don't think they make up the majority of truckers in Ottawa.
Scrivener7
(50,774 posts)pocketed by the organizers.
no_hypocrisy
(45,785 posts)In any case, are their employers on board to losing money for goods not being hauled and delivered?
TheRealNorth
(9,435 posts)And were independent contractors. Which means if some fat cats are giving them money to block traffic in Ottowa rather than haul goods, they are not losing anything.
2naSalit
(86,071 posts)Long as they can make their payments.
Bev54
(9,963 posts)because they cannot go across the border.
Tommy Carcetti
(43,085 posts)With my guess being that it's to sow discord in certain countries and distract them, while another certain country primes the pump for potential imperialistic moves.
Response to Nevilledog (Original post)
tenderfoot This message was self-deleted by its author.
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)Big question: How many more people will be alarmed into realizing things are going too far?
Look at those thousands of trumpist "patriots" who proudly walked to the Capitol on January 6 -- they were not our typical Americans. But, when they realized violence was happening at the Capitol, just heard the roar of the mob without seeing, MOST of them either turned and left altogether or drew back and watched from a safe distance. (Imagine coming hundreds of miles and then being surprised at what they were part of!)
So if that's the way this group reacted, if there's more civil disruption a lot more people should become alarmed by it. Even among those who see themselves on the same side or didn't know what to think, as well as those who didn't approve but also didn't take it seriously.
For all the complaining and divisions, one thing that the vast majority of us have in common is that we have a whole lot to protect, and to lose. In reality, we have it damned good.
G_j
(40,366 posts)are very unhappy.
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)caught by surprise by these hooligans, Canada should be able to continue to uphold standards for the neighborhood.
Mr. Evil
(2,749 posts)money talks. Hire tow truck drivers and bulldozer and other heavy equipment operators and pay them 5x what they normally make for a haul or demolition. Then push this pile of soon-to-be trash out of the way. Then send the bill to whoever funded it and the drivers that abandoned their vehicles there. Anything that can be salvaged shall be sold at auction.
Haggard Celine
(16,820 posts)Confiscate those trucks and sell them at a discount. If they have any cargo, take that as well. We'll see if they think it was worth all that.
LoisB
(7,079 posts)ticket them daily for traffic violations.
Fiendish Thingy
(15,369 posts)Then, after the protest, seize their vehicles one by one.
LoisB
(7,079 posts)2naSalit
(86,071 posts)LoisB
(7,079 posts)nt
Caliman73
(11,694 posts)My suggestion is to find out who is funding them and start hitting those people with negative press. If it is the Mercers, then boycott their products, or the Koch family, or Adelson, or whoever.
As the author said, this is not grassroots.
Let them throw their tantrum and ONLY arrest, if they become a threat to immediate safety. Over reaction by Law Enforcement or the Government also gives them what they want.
Block their money, block their supplies, and flood the airwaves with information about who is actually funding this "grassroots" movement.
wiggs
(7,788 posts)world...a continuation of concentration of power and wealth into the hands of fewer and fewer oligarchs.
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)Many different people are innocently drawn to populist rhetoric, but the movements are mostly strongly motivated and energized by aggressive antagonism and resentment. That's what makes them populist, dangerous by definition, and why populism has been used by viciously unscrupulous leaders to destroy and take over so many governments.
Populist don't even care much what replaces what they're eager to destroy. It's a defining characteristic. Oh, they say they do because it's obligatory to pretend to an ideology. But destroyers are neither idealists nor builders; give them a mob to join and they won't ask questions, much less read fine print no populist leader like tRump, Putin, Hitler or any other would ever be stupid enough to admit to. The Kochs hired agents to create and run the populist Tea Party movement to serve them.
wiggs
(7,788 posts)has been the realization that there are a LOT of people interested in destruction, in harming others, in eliminating institutions, in denying progress, in 'getting over' on their neighbors, in ruining public discourse.
There are a lot of them...but I think they are being used by others, much smaller in number, who DO have a plan for what the country should look like.
And...i've never understood how rump could be considered a populist...seems the opposite to me.
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)Fiendish Thingy
(15,369 posts)A handful of First Nations people block a logging road to stop the cutting down of old growth forest? RCMP is out in full force to protect the corporations interests with Swift, sometimes violent responses.
Thousands of fascists want to impose their will on the majority of citizens who support the government public health measures? Ottawa police throw their hands up, shrug and claim they are helpless, as does Ford.
But dont worry, Trudeau has firmly scolded these rapscallions, so let that be a lesson to them all.
BlueWavePsych
(2,634 posts)Deputy Chief Steve Bell told reporters Tuesday that 25 per cent of the more than 400 trucks occupying the downtown core have children living inside.
Its something that greatly concerns us, he said. From the risk of carbon monoxide and fumes, the noise levels were concerned about cold, were concerned about access to sanitation, the ability to shower.
Bell said its something police need to address, and theyre having discussions with the Childrens Aid Society about what steps to take.
https://ottawa.ctvnews.ca/about-100-convoy-trucks-in-downtown-ottawa-have-children-living-inside-police-1.5772103
Police have a tough job. Can't go in guns blazing.
2naSalit
(86,071 posts)Augiedog
(2,541 posts)Bev54
(9,963 posts)yobrault1
(93 posts)it has been so stressful living in this city, regardless of age, gender, race or income level. My neighbors are fed up and today we learn that the Ottawa Police posted then deleted a tweet calling the convoy a "host nation" and then posted an apology from the convoy. WHAT THE F IS HAPPENING IN THIS WORLD WHEN A GROUP OF PPL REGARDLESS OF THE COLOR OF THEIR SKIN CAN OCCUPY A CITY AND YOU AS LAW ENFORCEMENT TRY TO SPIN WHAT THEY ARE DOING FOR THEM?!!!!!!
I can't even.
Bev54
(9,963 posts)He seems a bit wimpy and unimpressive. It is time to get Trudeau and Ford together to come up with a way to tackle this situation. How do you see the Police chief?
Lucky Luciano
(11,242 posts)Bev54
(9,963 posts)and at the very moment he was giving his update, the media was showing live video of fuel being brought in right in front of the police and nobody was doing anything.
roamer65
(36,739 posts)No Ottawa or local address, no sales or service.
Starve them out.
Also setup checkpoints to stop the import of said items.
Alice Kramden
(2,157 posts)More and more emboldened.
PortTack
(32,606 posts)Also, read the comment section where ppl living in Ottowa chime in
Dirty Socialist
(3,248 posts)Sounds like a good plan
IbogaProject
(2,694 posts)This is deliberate. It is to shift attention to how protective the vaccine and especially the booster were against the recent surge. The protective effects are dramatic and convincing. So now the narrative is changing and they will attempt to claim victory as the restrictions are lifted. The science is stacking up n95 and kf94 are both protective enough for a vaccinated individual that we can now leave the uncompliant to their fate for now. This may or may not be correct but the best scientific estimates are to end the restrictions as the risk to the fully vaccinated and boosted is low. It's problematic as the elderly and immune compromised will still be at risk. Another problem is the hospitals and ER will still be overloaded. The right wing media has to shift topics and distract from their support against the vaccine mandates. And they are now poised to claim victory as the mask mandates drops to further move on.
Docreed2003
(16,817 posts)That's why the rw nutters like Rand Paul have been all over Fox News spewing support for this crap....make no mistake, it's coming to a city near you soon.
malaise
(267,842 posts)Rec
SheltieLover
(57,073 posts)randr
(12,408 posts)should start tossing bags of shit out their windows.
meadowlander
(4,358 posts)empedocles
(15,751 posts)The Jungle 1
(4,552 posts)If you don't trust science then just stay home and die.
Stick a air compressor hose down your pie hole if you have trouble breathing.
I am out of compassion for these wack jobs. The tank is empty.
Joinfortmill
(14,247 posts)Looking at you FB or is it META?