The invasion of Ukraine is in progress

[iemanja]

Putin has ordered "peacekeepers" to Dobras. https://democraticunderground.com/100216379263

https://news.sky.com/story/ukraine-live-updates-satellite-images-show-new-russia-deployments-as-biden-and-putin-summit-mooted-12541713?postid=3395115

I don't want to see one more post insisting Putin isn't going to invade. He's already done it.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/putin-orders-russian-peacekeepers-to-eastern-ukraines-two-breakaway-regions/ar-AAU8ASd?ocid=BingNewsSearch

MOSCOW (Reuters) - President Vladimir Putin ordered his defence ministry to despatch Russian peacekeepers to eastern Ukraine's two breakaway regions, according to a decree published early on Tuesday after he said Moscow would recognise their independence.

After stoking the shelling in the region, he now pretends they are "independent," when in fact he has annexed them.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2022/02/21/russia-ukraine-updates/

Russian President Vladimir Putin on Monday formally recognized the independence of two breakaway regions in eastern Ukraine, a move that Russia could use to justify an attack in those areas.

Putin signed a decree recognizing the areas and an agreement of cooperation with the heads of the two regions: Denis Pushilin of the Donetsk People’s Republic and Leonid Pasechnik of the Luhansk People’s Republic.

The move prompted a chorus of condemnation from world leaders, with some vowing sanctions.

White House press secretary Jen Psaki said President Biden would issue an executive order prohibiting U.S. investment and trade in the breakaway regions. European Commission President Ursula von der Leyen called Putin’s recognition of the breakaway territories a “blatant violation” of international law and said the bloc would “react with unity, firmness and with determination in solidarity with Ukraine.” French President Emmanuel Macron called the declaration a “violation of the sovereignty of Ukraine” and called for an emergency meeting of the United Nations Security Council, echoing Ukraine’s request from earlier in the day.

[underpants]

1. Mmmmh

Just mmmh ☹️

[maxsolomon]

2. Welp, if that's all he wants out of this, Ukraine will count themselves lucky.

Of course, he'll send his little green men in somewhere else to start this process again.

[sunonmars]

3. Its not all he wants, he'll keep going and going, piece by piece.

[maxsolomon]

6. As I said.

He'll send his Little Green Men in to another province.

[live love laugh]

52. ✔️+

As soon as they take the Ukraine they’ll encroach on the next border.

[iemanja]

4. Exactly

This is just the start. Actually a continuation of Crimea.

[KPN]

10. Exactly on your actually just a continuation.

Crimea was simply a start.

[uponit7771]

5. Yep

[HUAJIAO]

9. He wants a hell of a lot more than Ukraine.

Think all the territory of the Soviet Union.

[KPN]

11. Until we stop him, that is absolutely right.

[SoonerPride]

58. Why would you expect we will stop him?

The United States will not go to war with Russia even if they occupy the entirety of Ukraine.

[KPN]

59. Sloppy post on my part. Yeah, I agree with you ... which is the point I thought my post was

making -- but apparently not. Putin's just going to continue rolling until the west comes to that realization and acts in unity on it.

[maxsolomon]

18. Luhansk & Donetsk are not all of Ukraine.

He will not recover the Baltic States. They are in NATO.

[BlueIdaho]

23. How do you eat an elephant

One bite at a time. Same goes for Ukraine.

[TomSlick]

25. That's what people said about the Czech Sudetenland in 1938.

The world has seen this movie before. We know where this leads.

[maxsolomon]

36. Did no one read what I wrote?

Welp, if that's all he wants out of this, Ukraine will count themselves lucky.

IF. I wrote IF. And then I wrote it probably won't be:

Of course, he'll send his little green men in somewhere else to start this process again.

[TomSlick]

40. Yes, I did.

Ukraine should not consider itself "lucky" if Putin only seizes part of its country. There is no "if." Putin has made it clear that he intends to re-establish the Soviet empire. This is only the first step.

This is not a nuanced issue. The choice is between stopping an aggressive dictator while we still can or allowing him free rein.

[maxsolomon]

47. In comparison to a devastating war that kills 10s of 1000s

or a protracted guerilla campaign, or end of the Ukrainian state, yes, losing Luhansk & Donetsk is better. Ukraine had already effectively lost them years ago when Putin's Little Green Men began his "separatist" war.

I understand what Putin's ambitions are. He is 69; whether he can complete his revanchist project in the next 15 years is debatable. He won't retake the Baltic states. He won't reconstitute the Russian Empire entirely. He will keep pushing at Ukraine; we agree on that. They're a thumb in his eye.

Everything is nuanced.

[TomSlick]

48. I appreciate the clarification that it is your position

that Ukraine should accept the invasion and annexation of its territory to avoid war.

Putin has made it clear that he seeks the reconstitution of the Russian Empire. I see no reason that we should not take him at his word. Any ability to see nuance will disappear when Putin invades the Baltic states or Poland or Romania. Ukraine is Putin's test case. If he can conquer Ukraine, Putin will move on to the next neighbor and the next and the next.

[iemanja]

49. He just referred to Ukraine as a colony

an illegitimate state guilty of genocide, he said. That's pretext for war, as is the BS in the breakaway regions. He is invading the Ukraine as we speak. It's time for people to face reality.

[Sneederbunk]

7. Probably wants to reoccupy the Baltic countries.

[wnylib]

19. 1930s all over again.

Last edited Mon Feb 21, 2022, 08:11 PM - Edit history (1)

Putin is "rescuing" ethnic Russians in other countries as he seeks lebensraum (German for living space).

[ShazzieB]

22. It's all so depressingly familiar.

[wnylib]

24. Which is why Europe is so concerned.

Deja vu for them. And us.

[TomSlick]

26. Exactly.

Putin means to reestablish the Soviet empire. Ukraine is just the start.

If the west does not stand up to Putin now, he will eventually attack a NATO member and there will be war.

[Dave says]

34. The risk of world war is real

If not an outright global shooting war, then tremendous, ongoing turmoil.

This is not good.

[dwayneb]

45. Agree with Dave

Absolutely there is a risk of a more widespread war. Particularly if Xi has Putin's back.

https://www.france24.com/en/asia-pacific/20220204-putin-unveils-new-gas-deal-with-china-s-xi-as-moscow-locks-horns-with-the-west

[live love laugh]

53. Do these fuckers and their ideologies ever die?

Damn you would think we’ve moved on. Just like I thought America had.

My bad.

[maxsolomon]

37. Since they're in NATO, that is unlikely.

We are obligated to defend them militarily now.

[gab13by13]

8. There are no peacekeepers in Ukraine, 0

Russian troops but let's not use Russian propaganda by calling them peacekeepers.

[iemanja]

32. that's why I used quotation marks

Of course they are troops with no interest in peace.

[roamer65]

12. Putin will push the Ukrainian lines.

Then claim some other false flag bullshit and push farther into Ukraine.

It’s going to be a slow motion invasion.

[Roc2020]

13. And Putin chose right after

the Olympics, the gesture of World peace to fully threaten WW111. That's as hard a middle finger as it gets to the West.

[Lucky Luciano]

20. I actually called this. I said all bets will be off after the Olympics as a courtesy to Xi.

https://www.democraticunderground.com/100216325698#post4

[Roc2020]

57. yes you did.

[ancianita]

14. Pisses in Ukraine's face and calls it peacekeeping rain.

[Martin68]

15. Putin's plan is to take Ukraine apart a piece at a time.

[MacKasey]

16. Biden should say tonight that Ukraine is part of NATO

[BlackSkimmer]

35. But it's not.

[Efilroft Sul]

17. Same shit, different Sudetenland.

[gab13by13]

21. Yup.

[TomSlick]

27. Exactly.

The world has seen this before. If we allow Putin to eat away at Ukraine, war is inevitable.

It is time to declare Russia a pariah state and cut it off from the world economy. It is all we have left to avoid war.

[dwayneb]

44. Putin and Xi could weather any storm

One of the most ominous recent developments was the agreement between Putin and Xi. If China has agreed to help offset the effects of sanctions, we are in a world of hurt.

[TomSlick]

46. Nevertheless. If the most forceful sanctions are not imposed,

Putin will attack more and more countries. Xi will take any sign of weakness by the west as leave to invade Taiwan and other neighboring countries.

We stand on the brink. If Putin is not stopped now, war in Europe is inevitable.

Now is the time to take the most severe economic sanctions. Putin and the oligarchs must be made to feel personal pain. The Russian people must be made to understand the consequences of Putin's aggression.

[Captain Zero]

50. Kick all Russians who aren't US Citizens out of the US. Now

Including their embassy.

[TomSlick]

51. All is a hard word.

That would include Russian expats that have fled here to get away from Putin. I also see nothing to be gained by closing the Russian embassy. If and when Putin wants to talk, there needs to be a way for Putin to do so.

What I propose is freezing assets in the US that belong to Russian companies and citizens who are not permanent US residents. The US, in cooperation with our western allies, must cut off Russia from the world banking and economic system, including the embargo of all Russian imports and exports.

[Shanti Shanti Shanti]

28. Yep, filling up my tanks, grocery shopping tomorrow, ayep

Shit gonna happen

[iemanja]

30. I stocked up today

but mainly because of a coming snowstorm.

[Shanti Shanti Shanti]

33. Its 75 here in FL, I just wanna go out and do stuff, ayep

[uponit7771]

54. Unnn, the "sanctions" are just on the two UKR provinces no all of Russia.

[Shanti Shanti Shanti]

56. Tell that to a volatile market, instability everywhere, this is just the start, anything can happen

[Cheezoholic]

29. Not that it matters much

But if Russian boots cross into the disputed regions its the first "open" violation of the Minsk protocols by Russia proper. While those treaties were about as solid as wet toilet paper, the Russian army marching into the the disputed areas would be the first direct violation by either Ukraine or Russia I believe. Its always been wishy washy with "Ukrainian Loyalists" and "Russian Separatists" being the "official" groups that have been fighting over the last 8 years. Both sides have obviously been directly supported by the 2 major countries, but boots on the ground would be a direct violation of the "no foreign mercenaries" clause of Minsk II. While the US wasnt involved in that negotiation it could empower Germany and France to immediately sanction Russia for violating the deal they brokered and oversaw (not too well I might add).

[bahboo]

31. put the hammer down on him right now....

severe sanctions, and make it hurt. He'll never stop...

[dwayneb]

43. Sanctions IMO will not stop Putin

He knows exactly what is coming and he is prepared to make the Russian people pay that price. The man isn't stupid.

[uponit7771]

55. +1, he has a year of rainy day funds that's it. We lay the hammer down they're broke ...

... and feeling it in 6 months, its the rest of the EU who doesn't want the economic mess because they bet tying their economies to Putin would stop his bullshit.

I didn't with Japan in the 40s and it wont with any other nation with bat shit crazy leaders

[brooklynite]

38. "Invasion" is such an ugly word...

I'm sure you meant "liberation of the oppressed masses yearning for freedom and comradeship with their Russian brothers".

[iemanja]

39. Da

That's what I meant.

[Hav]

42. Given that some DUers

excused the initial aggression as legitimate concerns and protecting Russia's borders, they might just as well believe that as well.

[dwayneb]

41. So predictable and Fox News is supporting Putin all the way

Effectively, Fox News could be considered an extension of TASS. Without exaggeration. And their millions of viewers are lapping it up.

I don't think people yet understand where this can go. Putin has aspirations that go far beyond the acquisition of Ukraine.