Who Do Americans Think Should Pay for College?

[Celerity]

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/02/21/opinion/22cottom-student-loan-debt.html

https://archive.fo/NY4hs



Ten years ago, the idea that policies like student loan debt forgiveness or free two-year college would soon be debated in mainstream national politics would have sounded ridiculous. I was writing my first book on higher education during that time, and as I traveled across the country and occasionally abroad to talk about college in America, I got two questions every time: “Why don’t people worried about student loans just get a job to pay their tuition?” and “Why shouldn’t private for-profit companies make money on college when Harvard does the same thing?” These questions were driven by folk economics: People had filled a lot of gaps in their understanding about the mechanics of debt and tuition with a simplified view of how college works. Neither of these questions suggested the sea change that was coming.

The rise of student loan debt upended everything. It is over $1.7 trillion now, the largest debt class of any asset other than mortgages. And, not to be cute, but you can live in a house. You cannot live in a degree. To say that these are different kinds of debts is an understatement, as sociologist Louise Seamster told me recently when we talked for The Ezra Klein podcast.

A few years ago, I sat with Brian Powell, professor of sociology at Indiana University, on a panel about higher education and inequality. He presented in-progress findings about how higher education should be financed. Now he and his colleague Natasha Quadlin, of UCLA, have written a book about what Americans think about paying for college. The book “Who Should Pay?” reports on a nationally-representative survey of Americans’ ideas about the ideal mix of government, family and student responsibility for the cost of higher education. This is important because public opinion shapes agendas, as Brian pointed out when we talked just ahead of the book’s release — it arguably matters more how people think college works than how it actually does. And much of the media discourse about the details of higher education funding — such as how endowments work or even how student loans work — far overestimates the general public’s understanding.

Three data stories emerge from Powell and Quadlin’s book. We overestimate how much people know or care about higher education finance or university conflict. Quadlin and Powell’s survey data suggests that, by and large, Americans still value college, even if they are increasingly confused about why it costs so much. To the issue of cost, younger adults and racial minorities (including Asian American, Latinx, and African Americans) understand college as a collective value that should have a more equal distribution of cost between families, students and governments. And, finally, I was struck by a null finding: Despite being the primary beneficiaries of higher education for decades now, women viewed the responsibility of paying for college pretty much the same way as men.

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[LonePirate]

1. Tuition at trade schools, public universities and community colleges should be free.

Society and governments both benefit from a more educated workforce. States or even the federal government should pick up the tuition and books tab here.

[MichMan]

2. If the government is paying people's tuition...

What is preventing colleges from charging even more exorbitant amounts than they are now ?

The problem I see is that not all public universities charge the same amount now. Why won't they all raise the prices? Students won't care because they aren't paying it. In fact the opposite may be true.

The more expensive the tuition, the perception will be that you are getting more generous benefits for your tax dollar. While an education isn't the same as a car, imagine a scenario where everyone is entitled to a free car every 5 years. Why would anyone choose a Nissan Leaf, if they could get a electric luxury Porsche instead ?

Seems like the government would have to take over the public university system and make everyone a federal employee at government pay grades to make this happen.

[LonePirate]

3. Public colleges wouldn't charge tuition so there is nothing to raise, unless you mean for foreigners

Granted admissions standards may need to change for some public schools but you can't raise the price of something the government says should have no price.

[MichMan]

4. Just wave a magic wand and everything is free ?

No employee wages and benefits, no costs to operate the facility and maintain the property? Utilities, overhead and all other expenses all zero?

[LonePirate]

5. Funding is shifted from students to governments or other means, hence the public angle.

[MichMan]

9. How would this work?

College "A" charges $10,000 a year tuition. College "A" offers a good college education, but isn't very well known outside of it's own geographical area.

College "B" charges $20,000 per year tuition. College "B" has a much larger campus, higher paid professors, a major sports program, state of the art student facilities, and a much more extensive list of majors. College "B" has a national name that everyone recognizes and a prestigious reputation. A degree from "B" is considered much more prestigious and desirable.

Student decides they would rather attend College "B" (who wouldn't!) and the government pays the $20k cost directly. College "A" gets their normal $10k from the government for those students who settle for going there.

The administrators of College "A" look at this and decide "Why not raise our tuition to $20k per year too? We could upgrade all our programs and build a new football stadium like the one at "B". Then, College "B" tells the government that they will need to raise their tuition to $25k per year, due to faculty raises, and new extensive building projects. Students don't give a hoot because it isn't costing them a dime either way.

Or...... government tells College "B" they are only getting $10k per year like "A", so they better slash budgets, lay off employees and close some of their facilities and become more like "A"

Or.... we tell students, you only get $10k a year, the rest is your problem. At that point it becomes an expanded Pell Grant program and not "free" college for all.

[LonePirate]

10. I'm not sure you understand how government mandated price controls on tuition would work.

College A in your example may try to negotiate a higher rate with the government if the government didn't already mandate the tuition rates, which would be the case for these public universities. Private universities would not be part of this free tuition hypothetical.

[MichMan]

11. So all colleges charge the same amount of tuition regardless ?

Podunk College gets the same amount per student as let's say a Penn State.

You are correct, that I don't understand how government tuition controls would work, because there has been no legislation proposed that addresses free college for all that defines how it would be controlled. On top of that, up to now, all K-12 and college education has all been run and managed by local and state governmental entities, so there isn't any prior template to go by

[brooklynite]

15. So public universities become part of the State Government?

Does the State Government get to decide on programs, teaching syllabi, hiring and tenure?

[MichMan]

17. Some are suggesting they be taken over by the Federal government

I just don't see how that could happen. Does everyone become a Federal employee?

[Demsrule86]

8. Money would be given to the school by the government in order to run it and yet I believe prices

would go up.

[former9thward]

6. If tuition were free even more people would be going just to be going than now.

Right now universities are full of students who don't know what to do after high school and they have been told over and over again "you need to get a college education". No you do not. To do most jobs you do not need a four year degree. Universities are treated like a four -five- six year vacation before some adult responsibilities.

[LonePirate]

7. So what if people attend for four or five or six years? They are still learning skills.

Using that time to decide what they want to do with their lives and making the assessment that they do or do not need additional education for it is a valuable skill in itself. Still, free tuition should not be determined by the demand side of the equation, be it jobs requiring college educations which may not be necessary or students wanting more education for whatever reason.

Frankly, I am a little surprised there are people on this website who think we should not find ways to enable more people to acquire an education, regardless of why they are doing so.

[former9thward]

12. I suspect it has been awhile since you have been on a college campus....

[Ex Lurker]

13. Because taxpayers are paying fot it

Universal free college, and especially the concept of financing the lifestyles of perpetual students is a quick route to political irrelevance for anyone who proposes it. The only way this will work, and the only way it does work in countries with free college, is to drastically restrict who is eligible for admission. You're assessed somewhere around middle school, you're put on a university track or a trade school track, and very few will deviate from it.

[ChoppinBroccoli]

14. People Are Making This Entirely Too Difficult

You know how most people got a free education for the first 12 years they went to school? Just make that 16. Fund public colleges just like you fund public schools. Why do people want to make this so difficult?

And for all the people who insist it can't work, look at pretty much every other developed nation in the world. They seem to make it work just fine. To me, this just seems like the exact same argument against single-payer healthcare all over again. People want to find all the problems and point those out, insisting it won't work, all the while ignoring the fact that it DOES work everywhere else in the world.

[brooklynite]

16. "pretty much every other developed nation in the world" doesn't send every person to college.

[MichMan]

18. All K-12 education is done on the local and state levels, not federal

Nearly all the funding comes from state and local property and sales taxes