As bad as things may look for Ukraine,

[Mr.Bill]

Imagine how it would be if Trump was still president right now.

[Eliot Rosewater]

1. I do wonder why the murderous dictator putin (not gonna capitalize his name or trump's)

didnt do this while his stooge was in power, though.

[True Dough]

3. I think it was deliberately timed

to make Obama (Crimea) and Biden (Ukraine) look powerless. It gives ReThugs an opening to claim that those two Dem presidents have mishandled things while trumpettes go around spewing about how his relations with Russia kept things placid.

[Lars39]

12. I've already heard that from

a fox watching BIL.

[Stinky The Clown]

13. I think you're right on that point

[Mr.Bill]

4. I guess the only reason for that

would be they thought they had a lock of some sort on Trump getting a second term. I think Trump was going to hand Putin Ukraine and who knows what else.

What we are seeing is Plan B.

[herding cats]

7. I think it's for the chaos factor.

Doing this then, while it would have been easier to an extent, wouldn't have had the impact it does now. Now he can call out one of his greatest adversaries (the USA) as being an instigator of his actions. He can use an old enemy of the Cold War era to attempt to rally his people behind his actions.

He can exploit the fringe right in the USA rallying around him and help deepen the divide here as well. Putin's been playing a very long game in all of this and Trump, his Russian ties and his obvious stupidity in falling for their petting his ego, we're all just one step in his plans.

[Eliot Rosewater]

8. He has to be dealt with, WITH EXTREME actions.

Or he will walk all over everybody.

fuck that

[herding cats]

11. FWIW, I agree.

I think Europe, by a vast majority, sees this the same way.

It's such a horrific violation of treaties and human rights taking place before all our eyes.

[PortTack]

2. Oh you are so right! I don't even want to think about it!

[spooky3]

5. Great minds think alike

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=16380663

[peggysue2]

6. I think we can safely say . . .

Ukraine would be gleefully, vindictively tossed to the wolves. Zelenskyy had the audacity to pushback against the Former Guy. We all know what that means: I'll pay you back x10.

And then, NATO cooperation and/or unity?? No chance. If it still existed, that is.

Putin's Grand Plan was short circuited in 2020.

Thank God we have President Biden in office.

[NCjack]

9. Anti-ship missiles, anti-tank rockets, sniper rifles, IEDs.

Crying Russian mothers. Until Putin's government crashes.

[underpants]

10. It was planned regardless of who won POTUS. Putin had to think Trump would be re-elected.

It has happened in my lifetime but name recognition alone gives an incumbent at least a head start. Frankly you have to have a pretty perfect storm (+/-) to beat a sitting POTUS.

Putin wanted to do this regardless. If Trump was POTUS he’d have gotten a double whammy of a greatly weakened NATO because Trump wouldn’t have worked with them. With Biden in, it makes him look bad.

It didn’t matter. Putin wanted Ukraine and he knew there really isn’t much anyone can do to stop him. The richest man in the world (probably) with a military of that size and absolutely no check on power or opposition can do pretty much anything he wants.