This is far and away the best statement I've seen on the Will Smith/Chris Rock brouhaha . . .

[markpkessinger]

Posted on Facebook:

Father Nathan Monk

A few years back, I found a lump in my chest. When I decided to talk about what was happening publicly, it was terrifying. Somehow that made it real. A friend of mine reached out to me right after that because her cancer had just come back, and she was starting chemo again. She was losing her hair for the second time. We met for drinks to talk about it. She told me about how she didn’t feel beautiful anymore. About how she wasn’t sure she could do this again. “Maybe it’s time to just check out.” Before I could even respond, an acquaintance of ours walks up and says, “Hey, baldy!” And rubbed her head.
We both laughed. It wasn’t funny.

I suppose we laughed because that’s what a lot of us do in uncomfortable situations where we don’t know how to stand up for ourselves.

A few weeks later, right before I got my test results, I was out with Tashina and some friends. They were trying to cheer me up and convince me everything would be okay. A friend of ours walked up and made a joke about how he would probably come to my funeral if the cancer got me. Then he said, “if for nothing else to hit on your newly single wife.”

In both of these situations, I saw red. My heart was pounding outside of my chest. I could feel my hands turning into a fist. I wanted to do something violent.

I didn’t.

But the feeling was there. There have been countless situations where people have made jokes at someone else’s expense that made me want to react. Sometimes I’ve stood up against those people with words. Sometimes I’ve sat silently with fear or anger.

Tonight, as I watched Will Smith go through those range of emotions, I felt a lot of empathy. He laughed at the joke that wasn’t funny. I’ve been there. He made a choice that I can understand, even if I don’t think it was the right choice. I think it would have been better if he had used his words instead of his fist. I think it would have made a bigger impact if he had found just the exact right words to say, but he didn’t.

However, I think if we are all honest with ourselves, we’ve had moments where that’s what we wanted to do, even if we didn’t.

Jada has been open about her health struggles for a long time now. It’s been part of the public discourse, and the joke Chris Rock made was in poor taste. It was ableist and cruel. It was the definition of punching down, and that makes it not a joke but bullying.
As I’ve watched some of the public discourse happening, I think there are a lot of things at play here all at once.

First, two things can be wrong at the same time. Will Smiths' reaction was wrong, but so was Chris Rock’s joke. We can’t lose sight of how wrong what Chris said was just because his wrong was met with another wrong.

When that acquaintance made that joke to my friend, my fear was that she would think this was the final justification for her to choose to no longer life here with us anymore. That was what we were discussing, and then she was met with a cruel joke. At that moment, I was so angry. I made a different choice than Will did at that moment. But we have no idea the conversations that have happened privately between them. Life is not always easy.

I also think racism is playing a huge part in this. I’ve seen so many comments that have made me cringe. You could see it on Denzel Washington’s face; you could see it in Tyler Perry’s reaction, and in the words of Diddy. They knew instantly how public perception was going to be. And I’m seeing it in many of the comments.

I’ve also seen a lot of comments justifying hatred toward Will and Jada because they are open about the non-monogamous structure of their relationship. As if that has anything to do with this? How consenting adults construct their relationship is none of anyone's business. It certainly doesn’t justify cruelty.

Ultimately, they are famous, and people love to imagine that with fame comes entitlement to their existence. But they are just human beings dealing with pain like everyone else.

I wish Will had just used his words, but he didn’t. He will have to deal with the consequences of that, just as Chris must face the consequences of his cruel joke. But I’m really sad to see some of the exterior conversations happening around this unfortunate situation. I think everyone should take a real step back and realize how cringe it is when you use phrases like, “he should have acted like a professional.” Professionalism has been weaponized against the Black community for a long time. I’ve seen folks make commentary about what Jada should do to conceal her baldness. Let me tell you, right now, Black women's hair has been weaponized too. So let’s just not.

Two wrongs happened tonight.

Chris Rock made a cruel and ableist joke.

Will Smith chose hands instead of words.

But one wouldn’t have happened without the other. Be mindful that even though Jada and Will are rich and powerful and will likely never hear your words about them. But someone you love who is struggling with their body does near you. They hear you loud and clear. And maybe it’s time the whole world gets a metaphorical slap to the face as a reminder that punching down is never okay.

In moments like this, I’m reminded of the Terry Pratchett quote, “Satire is meant to ridicule power. If you are laughing at people who are hurting, it's not satire; it's bullying.”

[SCantiGOP]

1. Great post

Love the quote at the end.

[PCIntern]

2. Yes. A great post...

I would agree with you that hitting him for making that crack about your wife was not a very good idea and you did well not to do so. What I personally would’ve said to him was: it’s funny you should mention that, I was going to stop up and see your wife last night but I was half a buck short.

I’ve found that very effective for stopping assholes in their tracks.

[FirstLight]

3. I read both of their apologies and they were both spot on

I also see a racist spin to this on my social media... friends who are black are respecting the man's defense of his wife in a tasteless situation. My white friends however, are saying that No violence is acceptable... so yeah...

It's been an interesting thing to watch unfold and I am onboard with the OP's post 100%

[wanda4rafi]

25. How many "black people" do you know? Are they friends or casual acquaitances?you serious?

Do you take a poll of their views every time some black person in the media is suspected of bad behavior? Or are you just tossing out some strange generalization?

[FirstLight]

42. um, no

[Demsrule86]

45. Considering the number of Black people in jail- and the fact they are a minority in the population-

this shows that they sure as hell need support and are likely being railroaded or being given disproportionate unduly harsh sentences...seriously your post is just plain awful. You compare Will Smith with OJ Simpson, Bill Cosby and Michael Jackson? I would like to remind you that OJ Simpson was found not guilty due in large part to racist cops and Michael Jackson was never charged.

[uponit7771]

53. Please delete this racist assed post. "We" aren't all supporting WS stupidity and you've seen

... no factual polling of the black community as a whole supporting the people you typed.

Please, leave this bullshit for freeperville

[pbmus]

4. "'G.I. Jane 2,' can't wait to see it."

causes machoman to physically abuse a comedian....????

I will never watch machoman again in anything, and thank god i didnt see his latest bs movie

[Demsrule86]

46. I like Will Smith...and he made a mistake while defending his wife. I don't care about that.

And GI Jane referred to Jada's Alopecia. It wasn't funny and was just as bad as Trump's attack on the mentally disabled. You are free of course to do as you please.

[FakeNoose]

5. Wow this is powerful

Well done!

[Demovictory9]

6. Great post

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

7. Thank you for that.

As someone whose two sons both have alopecia areata universalis, meaning the most extreme form of alopecia, in which ALL hair is lost -- they have no eyebrows, eyelashes, any body hair, and have never had to shave -- I tend to see baldness as simply some other aspect of the human condition, like having straight or curly hair, blue or brown eyes, pale or dark skin. Hair or no hair.

Something else that's important here, although I have zero idea if it's true for Mrs. Smith, the reason so many Black women have hair loss is because of what they do to and with their hair. Yes, I am ascribing a certain amount of blame. Sort of like smoking and lung cancer. Extensive sunbathing (for pale skinned people) and skin cancer. Responsibility needs to be acknowledged.

Alopecia areata is an autoimmune disorder that causes hair loss. If your hair loss is because you use harsh chemicals, or braid your hair too tightly, it's completely different. My sons have the auto immune version.

[Demsrule86]

47. It has been well known for years that Jada has Alopecia....and harsh chemicals while causing

hair loss does not cause this disease. But of course, blame the Black Woman-why? Your post seems to imply that Jada and other black women using 'harsh chemicals' are to blame for what is a disease.

[LakeArenal]

8. Very eloquent.

As I said less so, I have wanted to punch Chris Rock for less.

To me not much different than trump making cracks about a disabled man.

Finally, so sexist. Who the eff cares about a woman’s hair anyway. If a woman shaves her head it might just be a personal choice.

Man bun okay, female shaved head not?

[gldstwmn]

58. I think Ayanna Pressley is beautiful. Further as a woman with long, thick hair

I am so sick of having to care for it and highlight it. It's expensive too. I wish I could chop it all of but my vanity simply will not let me.

[fishwax]

9. this post offers an empathetic reading of Smith's response. It's also possible to read Rock's joke

more empathetically and generously. The general reaction has been that this joke was abelist and cruel. But that assumes a particular intent on Rock's part that I'm not sure we can say with certainty was there. I'm not defending the joke, which clearly didn't land in a spirit of kindness for Jada. But I don't think we should jump to the conclusion that he was making fun of her for her lack of hair. We could just as easily (as long as we're choosing empathy) assume that he was saying, to a woman who has been public about her struggle with alopecia and her decision to shave her head: you are (as Demi Moore was when she made that film) a powerful woman in Hollywood, and you (as Demi did in that film) absolutely rock that look, and you wear your power well (which is what that film was about). In other words, it could have been intended as an empowering and affirming joke. (He didn't compare her to Telly Savalas or to Sinead O'Connor or to some figure who would render her lack of hair ridiculous. He compared her to Demi Moore kicking ass in GI Jane.) We'll never really know what was coming next, because Will Smith made it about him. And the fact that Jada didn't take it that way means that it was clearly a misstep as far as comedy goes. But whether it was one of calibration or intent I don't feel comfortable saying with certainty. I'd rather not assume the worst of either of the figures involved. But that's just me.

[pbmus]

12. BINGO....

[MaryMagdaline]

14. Fishwax I appreciate much of what you are saying but i think Chris Rock

Is a bit fixated on black women’s hair. He did a whole documentary on it. First, he exposes the billion dollar business that arises out of wigs, braiding and extensions and then reveals the secrecy surrounding black women’s hair.

In the documentary, he interviews Al Sharpton about HIS hair, but when he goes for Al’s wife - “Are you allowed to touch your wife’s hair?” Sharpton turns the tables and responds “The question is, is my wife allowed to touch MY hair?” I believe Reverend AL felt he was being goaded into criticizing black women’s hair, with emphasis on frivolity of black women, and Reverend Al was not having it. I believe he saw the questioning by CR as an attack on black women. I was drawing the same conclusion. Chris Rock can say some powerfully true things (his rant on the total lack of Latino employment in the movie industry is EPIC) but he suffers from a weeee bit of misogyny (“I don’t condone what OJ did but I UNDERSTAND it” comprised an entire standup routine by CR.) He couldn’t make Jada Pinkett look frivolous, so he went after her looks. Hurtful. Especially in an industry that punishes people for lack of standard (ie, white) beauty. Hair is a thing black women have always had to defend themselves on. For a black man in particular to attack a black woman for her hair? Just unforgivable. I don’t condone Will Smith for what he did to Chris Rock, but I UNDERSTAND it.

[uponit7771]

34. Regardless of the fixation assuming the attempt at comparing to strong women is malicious is

... jumping the gun at the least.

I have aphasia from an accident and end up talking just like Biden sometimes but if my voice changed and someone compared my speaking to Morgan Freeman post accident I don't think I'd slap the shit out of them.

[MaryMagdaline]

40. Understood. I agree that violence is not the answer.

My reptilian self sometimes is not in line with my stated values.

[Jedi Guy]

60. If only I could sound like Morgan Freeman. Or even better, James Earl Jones or Ving Rhames!

I don't have a squeaky voice or anything, but those guys... one of them is the vocal equivalent of melted butter, while the latter two would sound like absolute badasses when reading their shopping lists.

[ms liberty]

15. This. It's what I've thought all along. n/t

[Skittles]

16. I honestly don't think Chris intended anything ugly

and Will Smith, he is just a fucking asshole

[Demsrule86]

48. Look I saw the thing about Black women's hair ...part of it anyway. And I think Chris Rock

is a misogynist...not the first time he attacks a woman with his so-called humor. I don't find him funny at all. And while I don't think one should hit a person, I understand why Will Smith did.

[Skittles]

52. alrighty then

[BlackSkimmer]

59. Yep. Will Smith is exactly that.

Speaking as a one time fan.

[Orrex]

17. Excellent.

[calimary]

20. I just learned a new word!

Ableism
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Ableism (/ˈeɪbəlɪzəm/; also known as ablism, disablism (British English), anapirophobia, anapirism, and disability discrimination) is discrimination and social prejudice against people with disabilities and/or people who are perceived to be disabled. Ableism characterizes people as defined by their disabilities and inferior to the non-disabled.[1] On this basis, people are assigned or denied certain perceived abilities, skills, or character orientations.

Although ableism and disablism are both terms which describe disability discrimination, the emphasis for each of these terms is slightly different. Ableism is discrimination in favor of non-disabled people. Disablism is discrimination against disabled people.[2]

There are stereotypes which are either associated with disability in general, or they are associated with specific impairments or chronic health conditions (for instance the presumption that all disabled people want to be cured, the presumption that wheelchair users also have an intellectual disability, or the presumption that blind people have some special form of insight).[3] These stereotypes, in turn, serve as a justification for discriminatory practices, and reinforce discriminatory attitudes and behaviors toward people who are disabled.[4] Labeling affects people when it limits their options for action or changes their identity.[5]

In ableist societies, the disabled life is considered less worth living, or the disabled people less valuable, even sometimes expendable. The eugenics movement of the early 20th century is considered an expression of widespread ableism.[citation needed]

Ableism can also be better understood by reading literature which is written and published by those who experience disability and ableism first-hand. Disability studies is an academic discipline which is also beneficial when non-disabled people pursue it in order to gain a better understanding of ableism.[

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ableism

[Quixote1818]

22. Yes, the scenario you brought up TOTALLY crossed my mind as well. It's not like Demi Moore

is some kind of homely, undesirable women and her character was a character who was very strong.

[uponit7771]

33. ***THANK YOU!!!*** Jada was compared to a beautiful badass shero and Will went caveman

[Demsrule86]

49. No she wasn't. And I wish you would stop saying this because it is not true...it was about her

being bald due to a disease. And I think Chris Rock is a bully and a misogynist...yeah I watched his shtick on Black women's hair...some of it. He is nauseating.

[uponit7771]

51. So GI Jane and Demi Moore were not badass sheros of the 90s?! Thx in advance for your input

I'm with the poster above he compared Smith to Aunt Ester that would be sooooo fucked up but he didn't.

[dixiechiken1]

10. "...we've had moments where that's what we wanted to do, even if we didn't."

And therein lies the difference, doesn't it?

Nope, Will Smith was WRONG. He reacted with violence to someone else's words. Maybe words that were dumb and insensitive, but they were words.

And then, after WS slaps CR, his son, Jaden, tweeted: "That's How We Do It."

So, that's the example Will's father set for him and now it seems it's the example he's setting for his son.

[calimary]

27. That's my main worry, too.

If Will smith had just scowled and then met Chris Rock backstage to sort this out NON-physically, that would be one thing.

Dumb joke, pushing the limits (which is what Chris Rock is well-known for doing), and it would have fallen flat. But Will Smith blew it up into a big deal, and now it's gritted teeth and grimaces all over Hollywood, plus lots of editorials from everywhere.

It reminds me of the best words-to-the-wise from the off-duty CHP officer who moonlighted as a driving instructor:

"DON'T ATTRACT ATTENTION TO YOURSELF."

Dang it if he didn't repeat that about 15 times per session, and with good reason, as I later figured out. He was trying to illustrate why speeders get pulled over: the cops notice them because they stand out from everybody else obeying the speed limit. Or - don't act like an idiot if you don't want to have to pay for it in some way, because everybody else around you couldn't help noticing how much you were acting like an idiot! If you have to stand out, do so for something GREAT you did, NOT because you acted like an idiot!

That advice has served me well for decades!

And for folks like Will Smith, it could have saved him embarrassment and hassle and misunderstanding and awkward moments having to face the Academy board and others elsewhere. This "joke" would have gone away and been forgotten a few seconds after Chris Rock had uttered it, and only he would have looked bad to many observers and critics. Now, Will Smith looks bad, too. To some, he looks worse, because he chose violence. And it hijacked the whole Oscar show. Nobody's gonna remember that he won an Oscar. Nobody's gonna remember much else about that telecast, either. What they're all gonna remember, as long as there are Oscar shows, was how Will Smith erupted at Chris Rock.

[uponit7771]

35. omg, their son is rail thin and somehow thinks physical violence is "doing it" ?! Jus damn !!

[MaryMagdaline]

11. Excellent post!

[Mr.Bill]

13. If Will and Jada had simply stood up and walked out of the room,

only one person would have had to write an apology today.

[calimary]

28. Exactly.

[uponit7771]

36. THIS !!!! ☝🏾☝🏾☝🏾

[Uncle Joe]

19. Kicked and recommended.

Thanks for the thread markpkessinger.

[Bobstandard]

21. I don't have room to give a shit

-

[Quixote1818]

23. I think it wasn't the joke that upset Smith so much. I think he has a lot of inner turmoil

he is dealing with and seeing her reaction AFTER he was laughing at the joke caused him to feel guilty and unworthy and so he took out his shame on Chris Rock to redeem himself in front of his wife.

[Mr.Bill]

29. I don't think he was exactly sober, either.

Either drunk, or some kind of medication.

[Quixote1818]

32. Agree. That had crossed my mind.

I bet few people there are very sober.

[uponit7771]

37. +1,

[MustLoveBeagles]

24. K&R

[NullTuples]

26. "...that makes it not a joke but bullying"

And there has been so much bullying lately.

We have an entire political party supported by a bit under half the voters that has formalized bullying into its party platform.

They bully anyone with a uterus - not to take their lunch money, but to take their bodily autonomy.

We have 21 state governments that choose to use their power to bully trans children for being different - and now their families & doctors, too.

We have a nation of cops who bully Black men for sport and entertainment.

Republicans spent the last 6 years bullying anyone who wasn't white, wasn't cis, wasn't het, wasn't abled, wasn't Christian enough.

Since Obama's second term, they've bullied the rest of Congress as well as our entire legal system & system of governance.

We had a President who won based on his promise that his followers could be as bullies as much as he was.

For the last two years we've had a third of the populous, backed by Constitutional Sheriffs, GOP lawmakers and religious leaders, bully everyone who wanted to stay safe from COVID.

And for the most part the response to all these things has been somewhere between milquetoast and a stern "tut-tut".

I'll be honest.

I enjoyed finally seeing someone stand up to a bully.

[SpankMe]

30. Bullshit

It's alopecia, not life-ending cancer. Chris Rock is an edgy comedian, and this joke isn't close to being his edgiest or most offensive. He gets a pass given the context of the joke, the venue, his genre and need for Hollywood people to have thick skin in the presence of a top comedian.

Will Smith going to all the trouble to get out of his chair, strike Chris Rock in the face, and scream like a fucking 8th grader "don't you dare say my wife's name" is toxic masculinity at it's finest. How quaint, defending your wife's honor by assaulting a guy who made a joke about her hair style. Are we civilized or not?

I won't say that Rock's joke shouldn't raise an eyebrow and garner a little Twitter criticism. But Smith's Neanderthal behavior turned Rock into a hero and muddled a discussion of what is or isn't a sacred cow when forceful comedians go up against truly public figures.

[uponit7771]

38. +1, WS Wife got compared to a beautiful badass shero and he went caveman NOT because he didn't

... think it was funny but because he had to redeem himself for laughing at Rocks joke in the first place !!!

[markpkessinger]

43. It may not be "life-ending cancer" . . .

. . . but that doesn't mean it isn't a medical condition that causesw emotional pain to the person suffering from it. You are the definition of the "bully" described in the last paragraph of my OP!

[Demsrule86]

50. Rock will not be viewed as a hero. I already disliked him and now just more so. He is a bully.

[Solomon]

55. Thanks for saying this because this is what I see. Those that don't like Chris Rock are blaming him

for the incident. And there's plenty of reason for certain people not to like Chris Rock. He's always been brutally effective in addressing racism in his comedy routines.

I don't think the joke was funny, but I don't think it was so bad as to justify Will Smith's stupid action. But then again, I don't dislike Chris Rock like you do. I don't dislike Will Smith either, but he was clearly wrong.

[Demsrule86]

57. I don't like him and find that he is a bully who uses his so called comedy to hurt people and

as for racism...I watched some of Rock's attacks on Black women's hair on video...if a white person did that it would be called racism for sure...I don't know what you call it when a Black man does something like this...misogyny I guess.

[Solomon]

62. Yes, you've made it very obvious that you don't like Chris Rock.

[USALiberal]

65. +1000

[Torchlight]

66. lol ok nt

[USALiberal]

67. My stalker!!!

[Duncan Grant]

31. Will Smith was allowed to remain at the event.

I suggest we frame this without the celebrity privilege.

If a member of the tech crew or any non-industry person stormed the stage, assaulted a presenter, returned to their seat and continued to scream expletives — they would have been restrained, removed, arrested and universally condemned. Will Smith deserved the same consequences for his actions. There is no context that excuses his violence, it’s unacceptable. To say otherwise is to be complicit in the assault on a presenter at the ceremony.

I won’t accommodate Will Smith’s (or anyone else’s) violence by making exemptions for their deranged self-directed code of honor.

[uponit7771]

39. +1, Stern and another comedian are up in arms at people defending Smith claiming that's why

... Trump, Cosby and Weinstein have gotten away with their law breakin; people twisting themselves in knots trying to justify their positive image of flawed people breaking the law.

[Mr. Ected]

41. I remarked to my wife last night that had this been a movie and Smith had defended his wife's honor

By clocking the antagonist, the very crowd that is lambasting him today would have risen to their feet and clapped.

Maybe I'm wrong, but I've seen enough "damsel in distress" movies to imagine it.

[Demsrule86]

44. Excellent post. And I completely agree.

[payingattention]

54. Punching Down is Never Okay

Thank-you for a cogent re-ordering of accountability. I don't understand why Chris Rock's initial ableist and misogynistic punch hasn't garnered more outrage. I don't understand why we're not talking about the toxic masculinity of using ones platform to make a verbal punch to a woman based on her appearance. Even if it weren't the Oscars and she didn't have a painful medical condition, this is a virulent form of bullying that our culture glosses over. I also think the act of pitting two black men against each other in the media arena is reminiscent of a past this country should aim to grow beyond. Instead I would hope we could direct this "slap in the face" toward the hurtfulness that is culturally embedded.

[gopiscrap]

56. welcome to DU

[Jedi Guy]

61. I don't think I agree with that quote from Pratchett in this context.

If Chris Rock was doing a set somewhere and picked some random woman in the crowd who was bald and tore into her, then sure, the quote would apply. He has all the power in that dynamic by any measure, while she has next to none, comparatively speaking. That would be the definition of punching down.

But that's not what happened here. Jada Pinkett Smith is a Hollywood star, and while she may not be a household name, she is famous. Even people who may not know her through her work in films will probably know her as Will Smith's wife. We can argue all day over whether that's right or wrong, but it's a fact nonetheless. She is known and she has clout in Hollywood, perhaps more so than Rock himself. He's primarily a comedian rather than a movie star.

I don't think the joke was particularly clever or funny, but neither do I think it was intended to wound her. I'm not Chris Rock, though, and I didn't have a window into his head when he dropped that joke, so I don't and can't know that for sure. In any case, though, Rock punched on the same level and might have punched up, depending on what criteria you want to use.

[markpkessinger]

63. I don't think it matters whether he intended to wound Jada Smith or not . . .

. . . Look, when a person has a medical condition, it should be entirely up to that person as to whether, when and where he or she wishes to draw public attention to it. By making that choice for Jada Smith, Chris Rock took that agency away from her, which he had no right to do, even IF he thought he intended his comparison as a compliment. As Rep. Ayanna Pressley (who also has alopecia) stated in a Tweet, "Our bodies are not public domain. They are not a line in a joke—especially when the transformation is not of our choosing."

[Jedi Guy]

64. Certainly his intent matters, as does his awareness of her condition or lack thereof.

If he knew and intended to wound her, he's an asshole. If he knew and intended it as a joking compliment, he's a well-intentioned fool. If he didn't know and intended to wound her, he's back to being an asshole. If he didn't know and intended it as light ribbing of a fellow celebrity, that makes him a comedian doing a roast at the Oscars. It has been reported that he didn't know.

As a thought experiment, let's say that she didn't have alopecia, and that Rock had made the exact same joke, provoking the exact same responses from her and her husband. What would your opinion of the incident be in that scenario?